Alchemists and Crafting

[Selvaxri]

So, i'm running Strange Aeons and i have a player who has a Promethean Alchemist and wants to be the party crafter- namely making Golems. Until then, he wants to craft weapons and armor for the party. [We just started book 2]

Is there any rules i should be aware of, in regards to crafting such items. my main concern is the Alchemist's formulae book counting as a "source of spell x" when/if he wants to craft wondrous items- like belts and headbands, et al.

he's already crunched numbers in regards to the cost and time.

Thanks

[Joey Cote]

My understanding from the FAQ is that alchemist's are not considered actual spell casters and thus cannot gain the regular craft item feats. If the class gives it to them specifically (like the brew potion or promethean disciple feat) then they can use that feat, but that doesn't qualify them for other feats. There is the feat Master Craftsman that would allow him to get those feats but Master Craftsman requires you to pick one crafting skill to apply it to when you choose it. So he could take Master Craftsman for weaponsmithing, then take Craft Arms and Armor, but only be able to make weapons that weaponsmithing covers but wouldn't be able to make magic armor without also taking the feat Master Craftsman again applying it to armor.

https://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fn#v5748eaic9qdH

Having said that, it's your game. You want to let the player craft magic items, then just let him take the feats. Treat his alchemist level as his caster level. If he doesn't have a formula that matches the spell required he can use the +5 to the DC rule to get around the requirement. But you probably shouldn't allow them to craft items like wands or staves which would give him access to all kinds of spell casting.

[avr]

There's a discovery for using their extracts to craft items, material mastery. It makes the penalty for not having the spell -2 instead of -5 if they have the extract of the same name available. Without that (or promethean disciple) their extracts just don't count as spells at all when crafting magic items.

[Nyerkh]

Up to you.

Normally, by the books : he can't, as he's simply not a spellcaster.
His version of Brew Potion and the Promethean discovery are specific exceptions allowing him to use alchemy to meet the spellcasting part of the requirements.
Master Craftsman is a work around for one specific type of objects - and you can only ever that once. Not that it's all that great.

It's a home game, so if you want to allow it you could.
Maybe at the cost of discoveries, for consistency's sake ? Or yo7 could just ignore the "Alchemy is not spellcasting" rule and be done with it
From then, you get the same issues crafting always has. Takes time and a few feats, but tailored magic items for otherwise half the price is not a negligible shift.
It's probably fine ? But the decision is yours here, as we're in houserules territory.

Edit : Oh damn, ninja'd by a much better answer.
So yeah, turns out the Material Mastery discovery is a thing, and it solves the crafting issues.
Maybe.
I'm not sure you'd meet the requirements for actually taking the crafting feats, weirdly enough. Something to look into.

[Joey Cote]

avr wrote:

There's a discovery for using their extracts to craft items, material mastery. It makes the penalty for not having the spell -2 instead of -5 if they have the extract of the same name available. Without that (or promethean disciple) their extracts just don't count as spells at all when crafting magic items.

That is an interesting feat but just to be clear for the OP, it still doesn't make alchemists casters so they still wouldn't qualify for the craft magic item feats.

[Lelomenia]

Joey Cote wrote:

avr wrote:

There's a discovery for using their extracts to craft items, material mastery. It makes the penalty for not having the spell -2 instead of -5 if they have the extract of the same name available. Without that (or promethean disciple) their extracts just don't count as spells at all when crafting magic items.

That is an interesting feat but just to be clear for the OP, it still doesn't make alchemists casters so they still wouldn't qualify for the craft magic item feats.

it’s not exactly what he posted; it actually lets you substitute an extract of the same level and school to turn the -5 into a -2. Which from my read of this thread is essentially a prone shooter capability (or the opposite, I guess). I guess maybe the Promethean can use it.

[Diego Rossi]

AoN wrote:

Spell Knowledge (Cohorts and Companions pg. 13): Your studies into how all things are interconnected have taught you to cast a very limited number of spells. Select a single spell from the sorcerer/wizard spell list that is at least 2 levels lower than your highest-level extract known. You can prepare and cast this spell as an arcane spell. Preparing the spell uses up an extract slot 1 level higher than the spell’s level. Your caster level is equal to your alchemist level, and your save DCs and concentration checks are Intelligence-based. You’re considered to have this spell on your spell list for purposes of prerequisites, spell completion items, and spell trigger items.

It gives you a caster level, and it not for a spell-like ability, so this FAQ doesn't apply.

Quote:

Item Creation Feats: Does having a caster level from a spell-like ability meet the caster level prerequisite for selecting an item creation feat?

No.

Technically it should be enough to take the crafting feats.