THE CHAKRAM
The chakram is a metal disc, or quoit, designed as a throwing weapon. Traditionally, the chakram is a flat metal ring with a sharp outer edge sized between five and twelve inches in diameter. The ‘wheels’ were thrown in a manner similar to frisbees, and could cut deep into unarmored opponents at long range.
The word ‘chakram’ comes from Sanskrit and means, roughly, ’wheel’. The earliest references come from the Indian epics of Mahabharata and Ramayana. The Sudarshana Chakram, or ‘file wheel’ was the legendary artifact of the Hindu god, Vishnu.
Indian Sikhs used smaller Chakram in their armies, who used it as effective weapons, ornate decoration, and as a symbol of national pride.
Chakram
Weapon Prof. Damage Range Price Weight Group Properties
War Quoit +3 1d4 5/10 8gp 1lb. Light Blade Light thrown
Chota Chakram +2 1d2 15/30 10gp 1lb. Chakram Light thrown, returnable
Sadhana Chakram +2 1d4 15/30 15gp 2lb. Chakram Light thrown, returnable
Bara Chakram +2 1d6 15/30 20gp 3lb. Chakram Heavy thrown, returnable
Visala Chakram +2 1d8 15/30 35gp 3lb. Chakram Heavy thrown, returnable
War Quoit: This weapon was used in Ireland and various places in Europe through the Dark and Middle Ages. It was a small metal ring, typically sized between 6 and 8 inches in diameter. Functionally, the main differences between the war quoit and the chakram is that the latter was often more ornate, and designed as an air-foil, where the traditional ‘war quoit’ was flattened brass. The result was a shorter-ranged weapon, almost always kept to a small size.
Chota Chakram: The smallest commonly found Charkams were light, and somewhat limited in penetration. Often, the smallest of chakram (at around six inches in diameter) were the least ornately decorated, but used in large quantities by Sikh footmen. Sikh warriors would wear several of these weapons on their ‘off’ arm, so that they could throw them in rapid succession.
Sadhana Chakram: The common chakram for those who specifically train in the weapon, the sadhana chakram (or medium chakram) is usually decorated (often with the nation of the army to which its wielder belongs) and spans around eight inches in diameter.
Bara Chakram: The ‘large charkam’, as can be expected, is simply a chakram sized to up to ten inches in diameter. It does more damage, but the weight of the weapon begins to be a detriment to its overall range. Some chakram of this size may have a ‘handle’ in the center of the ‘wheel’, which can be used to allow the chakram to be used as melee weapon as well. A chakram used in this way acts as a large dagger.
Visala Chakram: The largest, and most rare of the Charkram is the ‘great wheel’. These are almost always ornately decorated and usually found only in the hands of those who have mastered the weapon completely. The Visala Chakram, at nearly a foot in diameter, begins to push the weight limits of the weapons’ overall design. Like the smaller charkam, these can be also equipped with a ‘handle’ within the wheel. A visala chakram used in this way acts as an oversized dagger or short-sword for purposes of melee attacks and damage.
The Returnable Property: The weapon is designed to be thrown but returned to the user once an attack is made. For the weapon to return, the user MUST be proficient with the type of weapon. Also, the attack must either hit, or not miss by more than four points on the attack roll. If all the conditions are met, the weapon automatically is caught by the user at the end of the combat round.
It finally showed! Nearly a fargin' HOUR LATER...
Still, comments encouraged.
Seems interesting. Where do you place them in terms of proficiency groups? Ie, are these Simple, Martial, or Superior weapons?
Returnable seems interesting, but it might be better to have it return on a miss if the roll is above a threshold (like 5). That'll ease the calculations going on, and give less info on the monster's exact defense. Also, maybe add something about how a magical one ALWAYS returns, no matter what, just so no one imagines any kind of conflict here. :)
David Marks wrote: Seems interesting. Where do you place them in terms of proficiency groups? Ie, are these Simple, Martial, or Superior weapons? Drat! You noticed! Actually I went back and forth on this. I would imagine that they would be considered 'Superior' (except the Quoit) most of the time.. but if a campain with decidedly Eastern themes? Martial.
More... wrote: Returnable seems interesting, but it might be better to have it return on a miss if the roll is above a threshold (like 5). That'll ease the calculations going on, and give less info on the monster's exact defense. Actually that's probably not a bad idea, though it's a bit inverted from what I wanted to model. If a '5' were to hit, for instance, would a '4' count as a drop instead of a return?
More... wrote: Also, maybe add something about how a magical one ALWAYS returns, no matter what, just so no one imagines any kind of conflict here. :) Well, I didn't want to say 'all magical Chakram auto-return', even though it would PROBABLY be true.. I can imagine SOMEONE making one that didn't JUST to argue with me. :P
vance wrote:
Drat! You noticed! Actually I went back and forth on this. I would imagine that they would be considered 'Superior' (except the Quoit) most of the time.. but if a campain with decidedly Eastern themes? Martial. How about this solution: They're considered Martial, but if you don't hail from a region where they are common, you need to spend X amount of time training with them to learn how to use them (that time being days or weeks, vary to taste).
vance wrote:
Actually that's probably not a bad idea, though it's a bit inverted from what I wanted to model. If a '5' were to hit, for instance, would a '4' count as a drop instead of a return?
Well, I was thinking of the natural roll, just to be clear. But I'd say, if a roll of 4 (or one under whatever you settle the "not-returning thresthold" at) still hit, say it doesn't return anyway. Makes life more interesting. ;)
vance wrote:
Well, I didn't want to say 'all magical Chakram auto-return', even though it would PROBABLY be true.. I can imagine SOMEONE making one that didn't JUST to argue with me. :P
Check your magic items chapter in the PHB bud. All magical thrown weapons return to you now. ;)
David Marks wrote: How about this solution: They're considered Martial, but if you don't hail from a region where they are common, you need to spend X amount of time training with them to learn how to use them (that time being days or weeks, vary to taste). That's not a bad idea for simplicity's sake. Let me chew on that one for a bit? (Admittedly, the D&D rules as are don't think too heaviy on the idea of 'exotic' weapons.)
David Marks wrote: Well, I was thinking of the natural roll, just to be clear. But I'd say, if a roll of 4 (or one under whatever you settle the "not-returning thresthold" at) still hit, say it doesn't return anyway. Makes life more interesting. ;) Then the player with the high-level Xena clone KILLS the DM...
David Marks wrote: Check your magic items chapter in the PHB bud. All magical thrown weapons return to you now. ;) Maybe, but you KNOW, the moment I declare an absolute...
vance wrote:
Then the player with the high-level Xena clone KILLS the DM...
That too, makes life interesting! :P
vance wrote:
Maybe, but you KNOW, the moment I declare an absolute...
Lol, fair enough, but at least state that the clause about not-returning does not overrule the general property of magical throwing weapons ... uh ... return-y-ness. You can make a non-returning one if you want, but enchanting one of these should, in general, ensure its return. (Absolutes = bad, generalizations = generally ok) ;)
David Marks wrote: Lol, fair enough, but at least state that the clause about not-returning does not overrule the general property of magical throwing weapons ... uh ... return-y-ness. You can make a non-returning one if you want, but enchanting one of these should, in general, ensure its return. (Absolutes = bad, generalizations = generally ok) ;) "If the weapon has a magical property which causes the weapon to automatically return when thrown, ignore this rule." ?
I wrote a longish article on Indian weapons for KQ, but WB didn't pick it up. I did a lot of research. The Sikhs would carry a bunch of them around on their conical turbans. When they needed to drop the hammer, they would grab one, twirl it around one finger, and toss it. As I recall, they were accurate from up to about 80 paces.
jocundthejolly wrote: I wrote a longish article on Indian weapons for KQ, but WB didn't pick it up. I did a lot of research. The Sikhs would carry a bunch of them around on their conical turbans. When they needed to drop the hammer, they would grab one, twirl it around one finger, and toss it. As I recall, they were accurate from up to about 80 paces. Yeah, they could be extremely effective (the smaller ones), particularly in the hands of a skilled Sikh. When researching the original article, a lot of the videos I discovered were impressive.
vance wrote:
"If the weapon has a magical property which causes the weapon to automatically return when thrown, ignore this rule." ?
Yeah, more or less. All magical properties cause thrown weapons to return when thrown in 4E though. :)
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