Wizard with Experimental Spellcaster feat

[Melvin the Mediocre]

If a wizard takes the Experimental Caster feat, can they add word of power to their spell book either when the level up or by copying them from a scroll or another's spell book? Or is their only method of adding words of power by taking the feat multiple times? Here are some relavant rules:

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Whenever witches, wizards, or magi gain another level in their respective classes, they add 2 additional words to their spellbook or familiar, of any level they can cast. They can add new effect or meta words to their spellbooks or familiars for the same time and cost as it would take to add a spell of the same level.

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Experimental Spellcaster

Special: You can take this feat multiple times. Each additional time you select this feat, add two effect or meta words to your spellbook, familiar, or list of spells known.

[ShadowcatX]

Unless you are specifically a word caster the only method of gaining words is spending your feats on them.

[Melvin the Mediocre]

ShadowcatX wrote:

Unless you are specifically a word caster the only method of gaining words is spending your feats on them.

Is that your interpretation, or is there something official?

I'm uncertain because it does say words can be added to a spell book just as spells, that is directly under word casters.

On the other hand, word casters have the same type of feat as an experimental caster called Extra Word:

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Magi, Witches, and Wizards: ... Whenever witches, wizards, or magi gain another level in their respective classes, they add 2 additional words to their spellbook ... can add new effect or meta words to their spellbooks or familiars for the same time and cost as it would take to add a spell of the same level.

Quote:

Extra Word

You have uncovered a new word of power.
Prerequisites: Caster level 1st, ability to cast wordspells, see Special.
Benefit: Add one effect word from your class's word list to your list of words known. This is in addition to the number of words normally gained at each level in your class...,snip>

[Mirrel the Marvelous]

That's only for Wizards that have chosen to cast Wordspells instead of regular Spells at character creation.

[partyrico]

Words can be added the same way that spells can:

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They can add new effect or meta words to their spellbooks or familiars for the same time and cost as it would take to add a spell of the same level.

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Spells Copied from Another's Spellbook or a Scroll: A wizard can also add a spell to his book whenever he encounters one on a magic scroll or in another wizard's spellbook. No matter what the spell's source, the wizard must first decipher the magical writing (see Arcane Magical Writings). Next, he must spend 1 hour studying the spell. At the end of the hour, he must make a Spellcraft check (DC 15 + spell's level). A wizard who has specialized in a school of spells gains a +2 bonus on the Spellcraft check if the new spell is from his specialty school. If the check succeeds, the wizard understands the spell and can copy it into his spellbook (see Writing a New Spell into a Spellbook). The process leaves a spellbook that was copied from unharmed, but a spell successfully copied from a magic scroll disappears from the parchment.

If the check fails, the wizard cannot understand or copy the spell. He cannot attempt to learn or copy that spell again until one week has passed. If the spell was from a scroll, a failed Spellcraft check does not cause the spell to vanish.

In most cases, wizards charge a fee for the privilege of copying spells from their spellbooks. This fee is usually equal to half the cost to write the spell into a spellbook (see Writing a New Spell into a Spellbook). Rare and unique spells might cost significantly more.

[LazarX]

Experimental Spellcasters get their initial helping of words from the feat. They can only get additional words by investing feat slots in Extra Word.

[Melvin the Mediocre]

It doesn't look like there is a hard cut ruling on this, leaving it in the league of DM's call.

Having given it some thought, I think allowing wizards with the feat to add WoP to their book just like spells is the better approach.

Lets say a wizard takes the feat at 5th level and chooses Servitor III. By level 9 they are likely going to want Servitor V, but if the DM does not allow them to choose/buy/research new words, then they will likely want to retrain that feat. The DM may allow them to retrain to change the word, or may only allow them to retrain to replace that feat.

So if they loose the feat, the word of power is still in their spell book but they can no longer use understand or prepare it (a hair silly, but acceptable.)

Now if the wizard still wants Serv V, then they retake the feat as their 9th level feat and choose the new spell. So what happens to the first word they wrote in their spell book? They can still no longer use that word of power, but they can some how understand the newer, more powerful word? It gets silly.

On another topic, having the feat only allow the use one effect word means that the player can not really experiment with the words of power as he can never combine two effects into one spell. That means someone who wants to try the system out must fully commit to playing a WoP. That can be a bigger or lesser issue depending on each gaming group.

Now to be fair, allowing casters to cherry pick from both spell lists and words of power lists for one feat is quite powerful. I can see why DM's may want to limit it to a single word per feat.

I expect the biggest boon will be allowing wizards to summon as standard action w/o sacrificing the breadth of all the published spells. Since sacred summons and rapis summoner (and the summoner class) all have the same action economy, I see the feat as strictly better than some, but not game breaking.

[ShadowcatX]

If you're the DM, you can do whatever you want. If you want to follow the rules the only way to gain word spells, unless you are in fact a word caster, is to take the feat.

Just as a side note, are you going to allow a cleric who is not a word caster to have access to both ALL cleric spells and all cleric word spells, or is the exemption you're putting in only going to be for wizards?

[blahpers]

Non-word casters cannot a word caster cannot add word spells to their spellbooks for the same reason that word casters cannot add non-word spells to their spellbooks. The two are intended to be separate approaches, and feats represent the difficulty in crossing the two disciplines.

[Melvin the Mediocre]

ShadowcatX wrote:

If you're the DM, you can do whatever you want. If you want to follow the rules the only way to gain word spells, unless you are in fact a word caster, is to take the feat.

Can you quote that rule? Thats what i am really after. All I see are surrounding rules from which one must make an interpretation.

[ShadowcatX]

Melvin the Mediocre wrote:

ShadowcatX wrote:

If you're the DM, you can do whatever you want. If you want to follow the rules the only way to gain word spells, unless you are in fact a word caster, is to take the feat.

Can you quote that rule? Thats what i am really after. All I see are surrounding rules from which one must make an interpretation.

No, but really I don't feel the need to either. I have explained how it works, others have explained how it works, and every one of us are telling you the same thing. Do it however you want, or do it by the rules, it doesn't matter, just don't confuse the two.