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So I've basically come down to 2 choices for what kind of weapon my character would use.
Assume the character in question is half-elf Bard with the ancestral arms racial trait btw.
So the starknife is really powerful but only in the hands of someone who is using the divine fighting technique to learn the way of the shooting star, and then using their 10th level versatile performance to to get the advanced technique.
With the star-knife itself having a X3 crit multiplier, and the feat in question making the bardic half breed borderline SAD.
A level 1-10 build in my head would look like this
Ancestral Arms(Starknife)
Divine Fighting Technique(Way of the Shooting Star)
Spellsong
Spell Focus(Enchantment) or Arcane Strike
Martial Focus
Ricochet Toss
Advanced Divine Fighting Technique(Way of the Shooting Star)
Now the Scorpion Whip is a very interesting beast
After confirmation on this Reddit thread
https://www.reddit.com/r/Pathfinder/comments/2l7269/scorpion_whip_fixed_for _pfs_and_eventually/
This weapon becomes a very reliable weapon that you can use at a relatively safe range. However it has the handicap of needing 2 exotic weapon proficiency to use to it's full potential, Making(Not counting mesmerist) half elf bards the only average bab class in the game that can naturally use it at level 1
But the trade off makes the whip mastery feats almost pointless, as you get a 15 ranged lethal melee weapon from the get go, thats fantastic.
A 1-10 build would go more like this.
Ancestral Arms(Scorpion Whip)
Weapon Finesse
Spellsong
Arcane Strike
Spell Focus(Enchantment)
Prodigy(Because I couldn't think of anything else)
In any case, between the starknife and the scorpion whip, which is the better weapon knowing the info provided?
what are you wanting to accomplish? whips usually try to go for strange builds that make use of it's range while a starknife is just for attacking with.
Personally I'd probably go the starknife, since it's one of the few classes that can pull it off well and if you're just wanting to attack with it.
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what are you wanting to accomplish? whips usually try to go for strange builds that make use of it's range while a starknife is just for attacking with.
Personally I'd probably go the starknife, since it's one of the few classes that can pull it off well and if you're just wanting to attack with it.
Fair enough and you're right what i just want is a reliable weapon i can fall back on when enchantment and sonic spells run out or flat out fail me.
Agree with Chess Pwn. Starknife for simple and reliable. It also gets better damage as you change the stat used for it. Then it also gives a ranged option.
The only way I'd suggest Scorpion Whip if you were trying something involving melee reach, like an aid another build.
Starknives have the added advantage of being able to claim proficiency with a trait so you declare you're from Varisia and keep your skill focus.
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Starknives have the added advantage of being able to claim proficiency with a trait so you declare you're from Varisia and keep your skill focus.
Oh that was the intention anyway, the character in question was supposedly picked up by a band of traveling varisian gypsies after her ordeal so it would certainly fit.
Ok this is what i came up with, and over all i like it.
Skill Focus(???)
Divine Fighting Technique(Way of the Shooting Star)
Spellsong
Arcane Strike or Steadfast Personality
Spell Focus(Enchantment)
Quick Draw
Adcanced Divine Fighting Technique(Way of the Shooting Star)
Discordant Voice
Greater Spell Focus(Enchantment)
But now Im not entirely sure about the 5th level feat
Should I got for More damage(Arcane Strike) More secured Will saves(Steadfast)
Or put quick draw at level 5 so i can go full whirlly dervish at level 9 (Two weapon fighting)
Theres also the eldritch heritage option on the table. So many options.
Steadfast Personality is great for dealing with Mind-affecting effects (the worst kind of Will Saves to deal with), but remember that you still suffer Wisdom penalties if you dumped it as an attribute. However, you do have the Good Will Save progression, so your situation isn't anywhere as bad as a fighter. Another important thing to note is that you can sacrifice your Skill Focus feat for Dual Minded, which is basically Iron Will+ (because you can also take Iron Will, and their effects stack).
Arcane Strike as a feat is meh. It's great if you don't have a Swift Action to burn each round, but by 13th level you'll need to every so often for your Performance rounds, or even for Quickened Buff spells (a Quicken Rod does wonders for a Bard, though you'll want Gloves of Storing to compensate for the hand-holding issues that may arise).
Keep in mind that I would not build Save/Suck feats into a Bard, due that by the endgame you'll have a much worse Save DC than what an enemy can expect to deal with, feats included. Your spells are much more suited for buffing allies (or yourself) and for utility (Shadowbard is freaking amazing for stacking Inspire Courage and Inspire Heroics simultaneously for boss fights). There are better things to spend your feats on, and for some of the options you're looking to take, they'd be great replacements for them. That isn't to say that you don't want to take Save/Suck spells (they have use against lesser enemies, and getting area versions of such spells is valuable), but that I wouldn't optimize towards it because Bards aren't a class that are meant to do that.
I'd instead suggest the following feat path:
1. Divine Fighting Technique: Desna's Shooting Star
3. Steadfast Personality
5. Spellsong/Lingering Performance
7. Spellsong/Lingering Performance
9. [Any]
11. Discordant Voice
You'll have a good amount of Will Saves (+4 minimum at 1st level, assuming no Wisdom dump), function at 1st level, and be able to contribute effectively in combat.
Personally, I'd delay Desna's Shooting Star to 2nd level (sacrificing the Versatile Performance for it) and take Lingering Performance (or Steadfast Personality) at 1st level instead, since you don't need to be a big combat fanatic at 1st level as a Bard; simply using a Crossbow may suffice until 2nd level. Spellsong is great for masking your spell effects you might cast on NPCs to coax information out of them and stuff, but I would wait until 5th/7th level to get it, simply because you'll have few spells at the levels you want to take it (even with a maximized Charisma), making its application significantly reduced at those levels in comparison.
The 9th level feat can be whatever you want. Arcane Strike is decent for added damage (which you can certainly use help with as a 3/4 BAB class). Extra Performance can help if you plan to use Spellsong a lot (which burns Performance rounds while you're performing). If you have modified Armor or Weapons via the Modification options, taking Armor/Weapon Adept might be worthwhile. Even simple things like Weapon Focus can be decent, since your to-hit is the biggest thing to shore up if you want to be relevant in combat, or Combat Casting for those instances where you may need to cast a spell in the heat of battle (and don't want to waste your turn by failing the check).
The Advanced Divine Fighting Technique seems good when you think you can hit an enemy up to 4 times with a single attack, but that takes your entire turn to do, and compared to using a Full Attack with Haste (which can get you 2-3 hits with optimized attack bonuses), you're doing more consistent damage without relying on a D4 to determine how well you hit compared to numerous rolls (meaning it's more of an average and less burst damage). There's a 25% chance you end up wasting a Full Round Action for a Standard Action result, almost as bad as spellcasters having Arcane Spell Failure ruining their entire turn by failing their spellcasting.
In short, it's a potential trap option, and I wouldn't recommend taking it as a feat. Even if you simply sacrifice your 10th level Versatile Performance to get it, I wouldn't do it. (You still can if you want, since Versatile Performance won't do you too much good by this level, but the options for it may be of value in comparison if you sink a lot of your skill points into said Perform skills.)
If you had the spare feats, Martial Focus into Ricochet Toss and picking up Point-Blank and Precise Shot would result in having a ranged option that lets you full attack from a safe distance every round without compromising damage. But that's four out of the 6 feats you get, and 5 of them are already ear-marked. Oh well.