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I know I'm being melodramatic, but I'll just add in that I'm super not happy that my 9th level guy isn't allowed to be grandfathered in. The new archetype doesn't do it for me. I know it's similar, but it's different enough in exactly the wrong ways that it doesn't work for me anymore. I guess I'll just see what else I can rebuild it into at this point. He'll probably just sit on the shelf indefinitely.
Signed ~unhappy customer.
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My LoreWarden 13 is not particularly likely to see play again so I may just not bother updating him.
My Lore Warden 2/Time Oracle 5 is going to suffer from the lost feat, but her 7th level was toughness so I guess I just lost 7hp instead.
Also the loss of appraise as a class skill on her is annoying.
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Same with my URog 5/LW 2. Probably will have to either give up combat reflexes or lose a die of sneak attack. The loss of the skill points will hurt too. Maybe best to just retrain out of fighter entirely and just take more Rogue levels to keep the sneak attack. Will end up losing Combat Expertise AND Combat Reflexes but keep the sneak attack and gain a 8 skill points.
What did I miss, I mean I kind of saw this coming but when did it become official?
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The following character options have received updates since they appeared in earlier publications, and characters must use these updated versions (pending the Pathfinder Rules Document update): brand of conformity, brand of hobbling, brand of tracking, Eagle Knight dress uniform, enlightened bloodrager, golden eagle epaulets, Golden Legionnaire, hellknight barding, lore warden, mammoth hide, Mounted Blade, Pathfinder savant, Qadiran horselord, Ritual Mask, shackle, Steel Falcon, talonstrike sword, Tribal Hunter, Tribal Scars, and wayfinder resonance. Earlier sources in which these rules originally appeared remain a legal source for accessing these updated character options.
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My Lore Warden 7 will probably be retired with this change. As a feat heavy whip/maneuver character the Lore Warden / Martial Master combo was what enabled the build and the changes remove what she was getting out of Lore Warden (+1 feat and large scaling bonus to flat CMB). I could go with Mutagen Warrior to partially make up the lost CMB but I would lose both the scholastic feel of the character and the skill points which let me actually do things out of combat rather than offer suggestions and hope other people could follow through on them.
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My 6th-level Gamin-weidling Lore Warden is also very sad about this change.
I have to admit that the Adventurer's Guide in general makes me kinda grouchy. Given how it was described, I was looking forward to it. But all the reprints, and all the incompatible reprints....
Is the lesson that we should never get too attached to a PFS character that isn't PFS Core?
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Can someone explain all the frustration of the update? I don't have a Lore Warden, but looking at the two versions, all you lose is an admit-ably not small bonus to cmd/b. Am I missing something?
They also lose their second level bonus feat. Their combat expertise is reduced to pseudo combat expertise until level 6. (and appraise as a class skill)
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Lore Warden had 2 really strong uses:
1: 2 level dip:
In addition to the fighter bonus feats at level 1 & 2, you traded bravery and medium/heavy/shield proficiency for extra skill points and combat expertise.
2: Maneuvers. Lore Wardens got a very strong scaling bonus on CMB checks/CMD. Very nice for characters who wanted the versatility to reliably make different kinds of combat maneuvers or who just wanted high CMB #s.
The update makes them lose 1.5 feats at level 2 (although they get the second half of Combat Expertise back at level 6 and a +0.5 AC bonus at level 10)
It also reduces their CMB bonus in half and limits it to chosen maneuvers that scale up and choose new maneuvers just like the brawler.
Contributor
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Depending on how fast you play and how long you intend to play the character, it might not be an issue. The PRD is several years behind in content, and the AR seems quite clear that the new version won't be required until it's up there. You might be able to finish your character's arc before this is even an issue in the slightest.
As for me... I might play my lore warden after all. I just need to make it to level 3 before the PRD updates. ^_^
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I played the Lore Warden because I really liked the idea. I always felt too constrained with the 2 skill points a fighter gets. I liked the idea of a fighter who also cared about knowledge; it seemed very Pathfinder.
The new Lore Warden has you trade in (a) Armor training and (b) your second level feat for a delayed feat, and a specific delayed feat (Combat Expertise) that a lot of people think is a particularly weak. This is not really a good deal. As is the pattern with a lot of these things, when they get nerfed, they get supernerfed. (This is probably not as egregious as taking the Vial of Efficacious Medicine, which was a pretty good deal at 750gp, and making it into something that is so ridiculously overpriced as to be a joke at 7,500gp. But, still.)
I may just rebuild my Lore Warden into a Ranger. (Would that be legal under the "retraining when nerfed" rules? This is a major change to the archetype, and should trigger a lot of legal rebuilding.) I lose lots of knowledge skills as class skills, which is very sad, but at least I still have all the skill points without having to over-nerf a class that few people consider one of the most powerful classes (i.e. the Fighter).
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I may just rebuild my Lore Warden into a Ranger. (Would that be legal under the "retraining when nerfed" rules? This is a major change to the archetype, and should trigger a lot of legal rebuilding.) I lose lots of knowledge skills as class skills, which is very sad, but at least I still have all the skill points without having to over-nerf a class that few people consider one of the most powerful classes (i.e. the Fighter).
Sorry, Ambrus, your brainchild of having a fighter that can do more than fight is no longer legal to participate in Society events. Nice try, though!
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Venture-Captain, Massachusetts—Boston Metro
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Cautiously hidden alternative lest it TOO be nerfed because Fighters apparently can't have nice things that allow them to participate in more phases of a given game/scenario:
An archetype so bad that they wrote another one that does the same thing better. I don't recommend buying Villain Codex solely for the archetype but still its clear that there is an upgraded Tactician in the book.
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I played the Lore Warden because I really liked the idea. I always felt too constrained with the 2 skill points a fighter gets. I liked the idea of a fighter who also cared about knowledge; it seemed very Pathfinder.
The new Lore Warden has you trade in (a) Armor training and (b) your second level feat for a delayed feat, and a specific delayed feat (Combat Expertise) that a lot of people think is a particularly weak. This is not really a good deal. As is the pattern with a lot of these things, when they get nerfed, they get supernerfed. (This is probably not as egregious as taking the Vial of Efficacious Medicine, which was a pretty good deal at 750gp, and making it into something that is so ridiculously overpriced as to be a joke at 7,500gp. But, still.)
I may just rebuild my Lore Warden into a Ranger. (Would that be legal under the "retraining when nerfed" rules? This is a major change to the archetype, and should trigger a lot of legal rebuilding.) I lose lots of knowledge skills as class skills, which is very sad, but at least I still have all the skill points without having to over-nerf a class that few people consider one of the most powerful classes (i.e. the Fighter).
The Armiger introduced in this book by contrast is pretty decent for this as long as by knowledge you mean: Knowledge Planes and Dungeoneering.