Ghoran Lich; Phylactery and Ghorus Seed.


Rules Questions


A question of interaction. A ghoran lich uses ghorus seed. What happens?


Dot.

Silver Crusade

Looks to me like the lich body dies, and you have a brand new body to inhabit. Basically a way around waiting for a new body to generate after dying.


Don't they come back to life if they use the seed? It's a way out of the lich template if so, because the new body isn't templated.


But its worth noting the one from the seed isnt the same individual, but a duplicate to replace the original. Its a new character thats nearly statistically identical.

Since it specifies healthy, the resulting likely wouldnt be a lich, but since they die.. would the phylactery be triggered?


A Ghoran Lich's seed would sprout a healthy non-lich Ghoran...then they would die and the phylactery would create them anew. Given the resources a Ghoran could create an ARMY of liches. Sounds like a campaign premise to me...


I'd assume the seed itself is infertile - the lich itself being undead. Either that or the seed is undead as well, growing a new lich body...


Xuldarinar wrote:
A question of interaction. A ghoran lich uses ghorus seed. What happens?

As an undead, you no longer have a usable seed. Your soul is bound to your phylactery, so if even if you did pop out something, it would just be another mass of corruption.


now THIS is an interesting thread.
Personally, because you put in so much effort to become a Lich i'd say that the template would transfer to the new seed.


Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
Xuldarinar wrote:
A question of interaction. A ghoran lich uses ghorus seed. What happens?
As an undead, you no longer have a usable seed. Your soul is bound to your phylactery, so if even if you did pop out something, it would just be another mass of corruption.

Thats an interesting point. While we could infer that the seed no longer would be usable, where does it say that would be the case?


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Xuldarinar wrote:
Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
Xuldarinar wrote:
A question of interaction. A ghoran lich uses ghorus seed. What happens?
As an undead, you no longer have a usable seed. Your soul is bound to your phylactery, so if even if you did pop out something, it would just be another mass of corruption.

Thats an interesting point. While we could infer that the seed no longer would be usable, where does it say that would be the case?

Obviously rules don't cover things like this. You have to make inferences from existing rules. Since a lich has it's soul stored in a phylactory, it obviously can't move into the seed. Even more importantly... the Ghoran's body is no longer living so one could argue that it could no more produce a seed than a zombie could become pregnant.


Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
Xuldarinar wrote:
Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
Xuldarinar wrote:
A question of interaction. A ghoran lich uses ghorus seed. What happens?
As an undead, you no longer have a usable seed. Your soul is bound to your phylactery, so if even if you did pop out something, it would just be another mass of corruption.

Thats an interesting point. While we could infer that the seed no longer would be usable, where does it say that would be the case?

Obviously rules don't cover things like this. You have to make inferences from existing rules. Since a lich has it's soul stored in a phylactory, it obviously can't move into the seed. Even more importantly... the Ghoran's body is no longer living so one could argue that it could no more produce a seed than a zombie could become pregnant.

At no point does it say this new Ghoran possesses the soul of the prior, only that the memory is passed on to the duplicate, encoded on the seed.

But i'll conceded that it is likely that the seed wouldn't be able to be produced. Undeath is a strange state.

Liberty's Edge

Drahliana Moonrunner wrote:
Even more importantly... the Ghoran's body is no longer living so one could argue that it could no more produce a seed than a zombie could become pregnant.

This is my general thinking as well... but one obvious exception is bugging me... dhampirs. If a vampire is 'alive' enough to sire biological offspring then it is possible that an undead Ghoran might be able to do so also.

PS: In any case, there is a delay of a few days between expulsion of the seed and death of the original body. What if a dying Ghoran became undead during that period?

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