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So, I've built a dirty trick based character. I've mechanically maxed the character out. He can do between 2 and 4 dirty tricks a round. He can apply two conditions with each dirty trick attempt. He can dirty trick as an AoO. And at 8th level his bonus for dirty trick is over 20. Nice, right?
Unfortunately, now that I am hitting higher levels nearly everything I run into is immune to dirty tricks. At least, I've been having an awful lot of difficulty justifying my dirty tricks. And that's the real difficulty with dirty tricks. You can't just mechanically say you do it. You need to think of a way to justify to the GM that it works, and I'm having a hard time doing that.
How do you dirty trick an elemental? An incorporeal creature? An ooze? Can you sicken or shake an automaton? Can you do anything but entangle mindless creatures?
Help...........
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It sounds like you built a one-trick pony, and while Dirty Trick is a nice trick, you can't let it monopolize your character, otherwise you have situations like yours where you feel useless. Make sure you focus on a secondary combat style, like combat reflexes + reach, or power attack. Something that lets you stay viable when your trick doesn't work.
Also, if you really are 8th level at the moment, then you don't have a means by which you can inflict the Dazed condition, which stinks. (It requires Greater Dirty Trick, BAB +11, jonhl).
If it has eyes, you can blind it.
I'm curious to see your build btw. Four dirty tricks a round at 8th level doesn't sit in line with anything I managed when I was theorycrafting what dirty trick builds could accomplish.
To answer your question: Throw dirt at a water elemental to muddy it up (blind, sicken?), dirty burning items into a fire elemental for the same effect, you need a way to interact with incorporeals to dirty trick them, but if you have a ghost touch weapon you can deliver a hilt to the gut to sicken as they recall their corporeal life, throw soap into an ooze (many oozes are acidic) to sicken it, or throw potato starch in to thicken the ooze up and entangle it, blind an automaton by covering up its sensors or overloading it with a loud sound or bright light.
All normal tactics that deprive or overwhelm the senses should work on most creatures, even mindless ones.
Also, if you really are 8th level at the moment, then you don't have a means by which you can inflict the Dazed condition, which stinks. (It requires Greater Dirty Trick, BAB +11, jonhl).
Greater Dirty Trick only requires a BAB of +6. I believe you are thinking of Dirty Trick Master.
And you're right, he is pretty much a one trick pony. Started as a challenge to see if a Dirty Trick based character is viable. Answer so far: sort of. He has reach and combat reflexes. He can do a small amount of damage. I've used a nifty magic items and spell combo to make him a bit of a damage soak. So, he isn't useless when the dirty tricks don't work, but it would be nice if I could figure out ways to incorporate the dirty tricks into some of the more common critters I run into. Elementals are the big one. No real anatomy. Sorta amorphous. They pop up all the time and I've been unable to come up with a dirty trick that works on them.
If it has eyes, you can blind it.
How would you go about blinding an elemental? My efforts so far have been unsuccessful.
I'm curious to see your build btw. Four dirty tricks a round at 8th level doesn't sit in line with anything I managed when I was theorycrafting what dirty trick builds could accomplish.
It's mostly a combination of the Slayer Archetype Bounty Hunter, and the Monk Archetype Maneuver Master. The Bounty Hunter allows you to do a dirty trick in place of sneak attack damage when you hit a Studied Target. Maneuver Master allows you to add one extra maneuver to a full attack. The Kitsune Style line of feats allows you to apply two conditions for each dirty trick and to do a dirty trick as an AoO.
It's mostly a combination of the Slayer Archetype Bounty Hunter, and the Monk Archetype Maneuver Master. The Bounty Hunter allows you to do a dirty trick in place of sneak attack damage when you hit a Studied Target. Maneuver Master allows you to add one extra maneuver to a full attack. The Kitsune Style line of feats allows you to apply two conditions for each dirty trick and to do a dirty trick as an AoO.
Ah, that looked very impractical to me when I was trying to build a dirty trick character. My thoughts were: If you're already in place to unleash a full attack on an enemy that you have studied and can sneak attack, you're typically better off with the damage.
I'm glad to hear that its mostly working out though!
When it works, it's usually something like this:
1. Use the Maneuver Master bonus maneuver to do a dirty trick. I make my opponent blind & shaken.
Now that it's blind it's susceptible to sneak attack.
2. Make a sneak attack with my primary hand attack. This allows me to make the opponent my studied target with an immediate action.
3. Make an off had attack for damage, but perform a free dirty trick in place of the extra sneak damage. I usually use sicken and entangle.
The opponent now is at a -2 to armor class and losses its dex bonus or is at -4 to dex, whichever is worse. It's at -6 to attack and -4 to saving throws.
4. With my iterative I usually just trip the opponent and move on. Let the rogues have a field day.
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Also, if you really are 8th level at the moment, then you don't have a means by which you can inflict the Dazed condition, which stinks. (It requires Greater Dirty Trick, BAB +11, jonhl).Greater Dirty Trick only requires a BAB of +6. I believe you are thinking of Dirty Trick Master.
And you're right, he is pretty much a one trick pony. Started as a challenge to see if a Dirty Trick based character is viable. Answer so far: sort of. He has reach and combat reflexes. He can do a small amount of damage. I've used a nifty magic items and spell combo to make him a bit of a damage soak. So, he isn't useless when the dirty tricks don't work, but it would be nice if I could figure out ways to incorporate the dirty tricks into some of the more common critters I run into. Elementals are the big one. No real anatomy. Sorta amorphous. They pop up all the time and I've been unable to come up with a dirty trick that works on them.
If it has eyes, you can blind it.How would you go about blinding an elemental? My efforts so far have been unsuccessful.
I'm curious to see your build btw. Four dirty tricks a round at 8th level doesn't sit in line with anything I managed when I was theorycrafting what dirty trick builds could accomplish.It's mostly a combination of the Slayer Archetype Bounty Hunter, and the Monk Archetype Maneuver Master. The Bounty Hunter allows you to do a dirty trick in place of sneak attack damage when you hit a Studied Target. Maneuver Master allows you to add one extra maneuver to a full attack. The Kitsune Style line of feats allows you to apply two conditions for each dirty trick and to do a dirty trick as an AoO.
Ah. That makes more sense. Thanks for the correction, btw. I also built a dirty-trick specialist, but he was a Lore Warden Fighter, and I got to use those bonus feats to pick up some alternative options (Trip Feats), as well as getting a bit better natural damage/accuracy with weapon training. Dirty Tricks made really tough fights MUCH easier, but overall you need to have something to add to it, just like pretty much any combat maneuver.