Learning the game

[jeremiah dodson 812]

I play with a decent sized group of very experienced gamers, with three of us trading off DMing as campaigns end, and for the last four or five years we have been playing almost exclusively Pathfinder and yet after all this time only half of us have bothered to learn the rules of Pathfinder. Has anyone else ran into this? What did you do to encourage all your players to fully understand game mechanics?

[Dastis]

This is pretty much normal sadly. You can lead a horse to what, but you can't make them drink. Sadly if the players don't want to learn rules they wont.

I just make sure my players know they have to be able to play their character. and that rulings need to happen when we are not in session if at all possible. Sometimes I give a mini tutorial mid session on a particular mechanic when it comes into play as honestly many of them I have to reread when I'm designing the encounters. Also whenever I have a player that wants to learn more about the game system I will happily explain whatever it is their interested in after or before a session. Typically I find a way to let the others learn about this which encourages them to do it themselves. Most of my current group has been groomed for about 3 years as such and everyone but the current newbie is fairly proficient now. I try to encourage other players when I am a player however it doesn't work nearly as well.

[Sigfred]

@Jeremiah... Well the easiest way I have learned to get players to learn the rules is to make an exciting story line that drives them to want to learn a system more.

For instance I made a "anti magic" campaign that made players explore how to survive in a world with limited magic and no casters.

Another one I came up with was a gestalt campaign. (If you don't know what it is basically it is you level two classes at the same time and that all the bonuses and minuses of both) A strange power struck the area causing unusual powers in people to appear and your band is trying to understand while trying to protect the population from the overpowered minions that also obtained these powers. Lots of moving parts that make players think and learn them all to be effective

I would say, "Hey guys what kind of story do you want?" or well you have been playing together for 4/5 years so you should have an idea of what they like. Use that throw in a twist and make it exciting so they want to learn.

I hope these ideas help. Sadly you will always have the, "What do I roll" player but even those players with the right character sheet can do well.

[Derek Dalton]

Honestly I'd rather have a player not know the rules then one who learns the rules just to cheat. You can get both and the first are not the problem. Had a couple of players who made their characters so interesting it didn't matter that they didn't know the game hardly at all. They added to the game enough that we ignored the fact they didn't know the game as well as most of us did.
The problem players are those that learn the rules just to cheat. These players are a problem because they often do not bring anything to the table except problems. It's one thing to misread a rule or something it happens. It's another when you know you are cheating and still do it. They are the players that whine the most when things don't go their way.

[Rerednaw]

Actually what is the concern with not learning the rules? Does the player take a very long time when it is his turn? Does the game stop because of the need to look up the rules or the player does't know which die to roll? Is he playing a class with spells/pets and he doesn't have stat blocks or spell descriptions?

Are the other GMs getting burned out because the other players won't learn the rules and won't step up to give the other GMs a break from running?

It would help us provide more tailored advice if we knew a bit more about the nature of the conflict. :