Sword of the Mage - Clarification Needed!

[Jagster87]

Hi again,

So one of my players is playing a wizard with the Sword Binder archetype. This archetype grants the wizard an ability called "Sword of the Mage," and we are both a little confused as to how that ability interacts with certain spells.

All the PCs are at 10th level by this point, so the wizard's ability allows them to do the following:

"At 8th level, when a sword binder casts a ranged touch spell or activates this ability to cast a touch spell through it, he can send his bound sword to deliver the spell and strike the target in one motion. Rather than a touch attack, he makes a ranged attack with the sword. If the sword hits, it deals normal weapon damage for hand of the apprentice and the spell automatically hits that target. If the sword misses, the spell lingers on the weapon and the sword binder can attempt to deliver the spell again by activating this ability as a standard action. If the sword binder drops or sheaths the weapon with the spell’s charge still held, the charge dissipates to no effect."

So with that in mind, how would this ability work with spells such as Scorching Ray? Would it require a single attack roll and all rays are used up against that single target? Or would it require multiple attack rolls, thus consuming more than a single daily use of the ability?

How about with spells such as Chill Touch, that hold multiple charges? My gut tells me that with this spell, a single use of the ability, would discharge a single charge (1d6 neg. energy damage plus 1 STR damage) per use of the ability instead of all of them. Otherwise at 10th level it would be discharging 10 charges of Chill Touch for 10d6 damage plus 10 STR damage in a single attack roll used by the ability.

I'd appreciate any thoughts and inputs on this that may clarify things for me and my player. Thank you in advance for your consideration :)

[Curghann]

From my accounting this spell does not interact at all with spells like scorching Ray.

Scorching Ray is not a "Range: Touch" spell (as written) which is what is intended for this ability to work with.

[Jagster87]

Curghann wrote:

From my accounting this spell does not interact at all with spells like scorching Ray.

Scorching Ray is not a "Range: Touch" spell (as written) which is what is intended for this ability to work with.

Hmm, that's a fair point. Given, Scorching Ray does say that it requires a ranged touch attack, so I'm not sure whether it is so black and white or not. That's why I need help in figuring it out :)

Thanks for the input nonetheless!

[Diego Rossi]

Jagster87 wrote:

Curghann wrote:

From my accounting this spell does not interact at all with spells like scorching Ray.

Scorching Ray is not a "Range: Touch" spell (as written) which is what is intended for this ability to work with.

Hmm, that's a fair point. Given, Scorching Ray does say that it requires a ranged touch attack, so I'm not sure whether it is so black and white or not. That's why I need help in figuring it out :)

Thanks for the input nonetheless!

Scorching Ray requiring a touch attack to hit is irrelevant. The spell isn't a ranged touch attack or a touch attack. The effect of the spell is a ray, then you aim the ray making a ranged touch attack.

You can read the FAQs about scorching ray, acid arrow and so on. Those spells create a weapon like effect. Most of the time that effect hit against touch armor class, but that don't make them touch or ranged touch spells.

about chill touch: each touch with the affected appendage deliver 1 charge, dealing 1d6 negative damage and 1 point of strength damage. Using Sword of the Mage don't change that. So the wizard will still deal only 1d6 negative damage and 1 point of strength damage with each attack. The ability allow 1 attack each round and expend one use with each attack, so your gut feeling is right.

[Slyph]

My question is if you use the swords crit range with this? It does not seem to have the wording that a magus has(spellstrike). At level 8 when you hit with your sword you automatically hit with the spell meaning that maybe you cannot crit with the spell at all when hitting with the sword as well. It makes sense if you just deliver the spell with the sword you crit on a 20 like a normal spell but when hitting automatically with the sword contact im not sure the language allows for a crit with the spell.

[Lelomenia]

Curghann wrote:

From my accounting this spell does not interact at all with spells like scorching Ray.

Scorching Ray is not a "Range: Touch" spell (as written) which is what is intended for this ability to work with.

the ability says it works for “ranged touch” spells, not “touch range” or “range: touch” (in addition to “ranged touch” spells, it says it also works for “touch spells”).

[Claxon]

The full ability text is as follows:

From D20PFSRD wrote:

Sword of the Mage (Su)

A sword binder can send his bound sword to strike his foes. He gains the hand of the apprentice ability of the universalist school, but can use that ability only with his bound sword. His range with the ability is close (25 feet + 5 feet per 2 wizard levels he possesses), and he can use it a number of times per day equal to 3 + his Intelligence modifier + 1/2 his level.

At 5th level, whenever the sword binder casts a spell with a range of touch from the wizard spell list, he can use his bonded sword to deliver the touch attack, including expending a daily use of hand of the apprentice to make the touch attack at range. This occurs as part of the same action as casting the spell. He gains all the attack bonuses that apply to his sword (including enhancement bonuses and relevant feats), but does not add his sword’s damage or effects to the touch spell.

At 8th level, when a sword binder casts a ranged touch spell or activates this ability to cast a touch spell through it, he can send his bound sword to deliver the spell and strike the target in one motion. Rather than a touch attack, he makes a ranged attack with the sword. If the sword hits, it deals normal weapon damage for hand of the apprentice and the spell automatically hits that target. If the sword misses, the spell lingers on the weapon and the sword binder can attempt to deliver the spell again by activating this ability as a standard action. If the sword binder drops or sheaths the weapon with the spell’s charge still held, the charge dissipates to no effect.

This ability replaces arcane school and bonus school spell slots.

Clearly the ability is differentiating between touch spell and ranged touch spells, because it grant you the ability to do ranged touch spells at level 8.

Even though these things seem similar, a spell with a range of touch means you have to touch them with your hand. A ranged touch attack spell means you attack them at range, against touch AC. Unfortunately they're worded too similarly.

[nikzig]

is the attack from the sword a touch or ranged touch? my player is saying the sword will ignore cover and shooting into melee penalties when delivering a shocking grasp with the sword. please help.