| 1 person marked this as FAQ candidate. |
How does enlarge person work with the brute vigilante?
I believe that it works to make you huge in vigilante form as the largeness is an EX ability.
Also that if you change your identity during the spell it persists and enlarges both of the forms appropriately.
But I just want to make sure that others agree with this.
I don't have Ultimate Intrigue, but the FAQ about size increases not stacking makes no mention of ability type, so you probably don't get to be Huge.
Hmm... good point. But I'm curious where the general rule that size increases wouldn't stack. Because enlarge person just says it doesn't stack with magical size increases, but brute isn't magical. Which means perhaps they would stack.
It is arguable that a lot of the Vigilante's abilities are magical, are on labeled as ex to give them protection against things like an antimagic field.
Hmm... good point. But I'm curious where the general rule that size increases wouldn't stack. Because enlarge person just says it doesn't stack with magical size increases, but brute isn't magical. Which means perhaps they would stack.
As per the rules on size changes, size changes do not stack, so if you have multiple size changing effects (for instance an effect that increases your size by one step and another that increases your size by two steps), only the largest applies. The same is true of effective size increases (which includes “deal damage as if they were one size category larger than they actually are,” “your damage die type increases by one step,” and similar language). They don’t stack with each other, just take the biggest one. However, you can have one of each and they do work together (for example, enlarge person increasing your actual size to Large and a bashing shield increasing your shield’s effective size by two steps, for a total of 2d6 damage).
While the example given is two magical effects, the actual rules material never says "magical," just "effects."
See but it says, "As per the rules on size changes" and I'm curious where these size changing rules are.
Like it seems the rule is that you can't because the FAQ doesn't say that the source or type matters. So that's what I'm going to run with. But I'm curious if I'm missing some general rules about size changing.
Oh, gotcha. Dunno, I've never been sure what that clause refers to. :-/
In the magic section:
"In addition, other spells that change your size have no effect on you while you are under the effects of a polymorph spell."
I agree that the FAQ could use clarification that it applies equally to non-magical size changes.
In the magic section:
"In addition, other spells that change your size have no effect on you while you are under the effects of a polymorph spell."I agree that the FAQ could use clarification that it applies equally to non-magical size changes.
I believe this rule for the most part comes from the exact wording from Enlarge Person which says "Multiple magical effects that increase size do not stack."
And most other effects that cause it mention that or say "as per enlarge person" and generally they're supernatural/spell-like at that point (like titan mauler's titanic rage).
In this rare case its EX and makes no mention of emulating other abilities.
So i feel like there's a very strong argument here to say it would stack, and not to mention the whole "must make a will save or continue fighting against allies/bystanders" which is pretty hefty considering it STARTS at minimum 20 DC, making the big angry thing bigger can possibly be a nasty outcome for all parties involved.
A similar question could be asked of the eidolon and his size evolutions. Or what about some animal companions that change size as they level.
A similar question could be asked of the eidolon and his size evolutions. Or what about some animal companions that change size as they level.
I don't think that question ever arises because enlarge person and similar enlarge effects say "humanoid" requiring the humanoid subtype, Eidolons. I could be wrong and there's something that lets you get past this limitation. That said those size are also EX and make no mention of emulating a spell.
And for animal companions there is "Animal Growth" which i think exists entirely for animal companions and to my knowledge does work when they get their level size adjustments because its a base/permanent adjustment rather than magical/otherwise. (yet another example of "Multiple magical effects that increase size do not stack." comes from this spell as well specifically calling out spells).
The share spells feature lets you target companions with spells like enlarge person.
The animal companions and eidolon's Base size changes. They are a large/huge creature by default now. So enlargement magic would work on them. Just like how an enlarged giant goes huge or bigger.
Eidolon Size change can get a little weird though. What if you use Evolution Surge to give the Large(ex) evolution to your eidolon? Does it still stack with Enlarge Person?
Eidolon Size change can get a little weird though. What if you use Evolution Surge to give the Large(ex) evolution to your eidolon? Does it still stack with Enlarge Person?
I would assume it would, because technically the magic isn't the enlarge effect, the extraordinary ability granted by it is and to my knowledge it wouldn't change Large(ex) into Large(Sp).