adding lower level "spells known"

[Dingleberry]

I know a spontaneous spellcaster can always use "spells per day" slots to cast lower level spells (e.g., using a 3rd-level slot to cast a 2nd-level spell), but can a spontaneous caster choose to fill a higher level "spells known" slot with a lower level spell? (e.g., using a 3rd-level "spells known" slot to learn a 2nd-level spell)?

[James Risner]

Ask your GM.

There is no rule to allow this normally.

[Kalridian]

I have always ruled yes, based on the fact that for example the sorcerer favoured class bonus gives free choice below the highest available level.

I don't have any rules quotes in this but I don't see any reason for disallowing it, neither crunch nor fluff wise.

[GM Rednal]

There are, however, Pages of Spell Knowledge. These give you access to additional spells, and are probably a better choice than reducing your number of higher-level spells known.

[Fromper]

There's also the Expanded Arcana feat from APG, which will give you two extra spells known that are lower level than your current max level known.

[MeanMutton]

I'm a huge fan of the Human favored class bonus (also usable by Half-Elves and Half-Orcs): Add one spell known from the sorcerer spell list. This spell must be at least one level below the highest spell level the sorcerer can cast.

Once you get to fourth level and can start casting 2nd level spells, this will dramatically expand your spell repertoire.

[Ridiculon]

you can use downtime to research spells from your spell list, although now that i look at it you still need a source

[Fromper]

Yeah, human favored class bonus is the best bet, if you want to be human. In fact, it's a good argument as to why human is the best race for most spontaneous classes. But it's still the boring choice.

I have two sorcerers in PFS, one human and one gnome. The human has taken that favored class bonus every level since 4th, to get level 1+ spells known. The gnome might take Expanded Arcana as a feat at level 9, though he's not quite there yet.

[DM_Blake]

Ridiculon wrote:

you can use downtime to research spells from your spell list, although now that i look at it you still need a source

No, you can't.

Those downtime spell research rules let you do two possible things:

1. Make up a new spell that doesn't exist. Maybe you want a spell that transforms gemstones into rotten eggs. So you spend downtime researching this spell, make your rolls, and now this Transmute Gems to Rotten Eggs spell exists. Note: this spell is now on your "class list" but you don't automatically "know" this spell yet - see below.

2. Add a spell to your "class list" that doesn't exist there. Maybe you're an inquisitor who wants to be able to cast Fireball, but it's not on the inquisitor "class list". So you research it and add it to your "class list" but you don't actually "know" this spell yet - see below.

Regardless of which option you chose above, your "class list" of spells available to YOU (other members of your class who didn't do this research cannot benefit from it) has increased. But that does not mean you automatically know the spell. If you're a wizard (or similar class) you can add this spell to your spellbook following the usual rules (there is a cost in time and money to do this). If you're a divine caster, you can prepare it in the morning like any other spell. If you're a spontaneous caster (like sorcerer or inquisitor), you MUST pick this as one of your "spells known" before you can begin using it.

In short, doing the downtime spell research simply adds a spell that you MIGHT know, once you follow your existing class rules to get access to it.

[kinevon]

MeanMutton wrote:

I'm a huge fan of the Human favored class bonus (also usable by Half-Elves and Half-Orcs): Add one spell known from the sorcerer spell list. This spell must be at least one level below the highest spell level the sorcerer can cast.

Once you get to fourth level and can start casting 2nd level spells, this will dramatically expand your spell repertoire.

Believe me, having extra cantrips available can still be a huge benefit. The right cantrip at the right time can break things, too.