1) Druid wildshaped into a huge animal doing lots of damage. Opponent tried to use spell Reduce Person to bring the size down (reducing strength and damage dice) so not as much of a threat.
Is druid's type still a humanoid so that the spell can effect him?
Can reduce person be used offensively like this?
2) Arcanist has the discovery to act in the surprise round with a bonus to initiative for 3 rounds. But someone said it takes an action to activate the ability. So it will never come into play unless the caster thinks he might be surprised in the next 3 rounds and activates the ability just before the surprise actually occurs. Is this correct?
3) Magus was using his arcane pool to augment his melee weapon. Wanted to put both flame and shock on it to up the damage by 2d6. Is this allowed?
4) Caster PC and familiar with share spells. Can the familiar use a buff wand on itself (from safety) and have the effect take place on the caster PC?
5) Can cure light wounds (specifically from a wand) be used to damage a haunt?
Thanks for you help.
1) Druid wildshaped into a huge animal doing lots of damage. Opponent tried to use spell Reduce Person to bring the size down (reducing strength and damage dice) so not as much of a threat.
Is druid's type still a humanoid so that the spell can effect him?
Can reduce person be used offensively like this?2) Arcanist has the discovery to act in the surprise round with a bonus to initiative for 3 rounds. But someone said it takes an action to activate the ability. So it will never come into play unless the caster thinks he might be surprised in the next 3 rounds and activates the ability just before the surprise actually occurs. Is this correct?
3) Magus was using his arcane pool to augment his melee weapon. Wanted to put both flame and shock on it to up the damage by 2d6. Is this allowed?
4) Caster PC and familiar with share spells. Can the familiar use a buff wand on itself (from safety) and have the effect take place on the caster PC?
5) Can cure light wounds (specifically from a wand) be used to damage a haunt?
Thanks for you help.
1. "You can only be affected by one polymorph spell at a time. If a new polymorph spell is cast on you (or you activate a polymorph effect, such as wild shape), you can decide whether or not to allow it to affect you, taking the place of the old spell. In addition, other spells that change your size have no effect on you while you are under the effects of a polymorph spell."
-Taken from the polymorph section. I was not aware of this rule, but I would assume it is a way to mitigate turning into a bear, and having your allies enlarge you to deal massive damage.As far as targeting works, you are still considered humanoid.
"While these spells make you appear to be the creature, granting you a +10 bonus on Disguise skill checks, they do not grant you all of the abilities and powers of the creature. "
So you are effectively what looks like to be a Bear, or what have you, buy you aren't effectively a bear.
2. I wish I knew what ability that was. But similarly, there is a spell called, "anticipate peril" which grants you a heft bonus to initiative when cast. Also keep in mind that surprise round does not always mean "getting ambushed" as players, they can also do the "ambushing".
3.he can do that. To do it effectively you need to start with a +1 weapon. Then Add flame to it. Then add another +1. Then Add Frost. Also its a swift action to do this... so 1 a turn. so... 3 turns to get this online?
4.No. You can share spells with the Familiar, but a familiar can not share spells with you. Also, most familiars lack the proper mechanics to use wands. (they Do not have opposable thumbs, they can't Physcially speak the command word, and they dont physically have a spell list either) Although some familiars might be more adept at these different requirements.
5."On the surprise round in which a haunt manifests, positive energy applied to the haunt (via channeled energy, cure spells, and the like) can damage the haunt’s hit points (a haunt never gains a Will save to lessen the damage done by such effects, and attacks that require a successful attack roll to work must strike AC 10 in order to affect the haunt and not merely the physical structure it inhabits). Unless the haunt has an unusual weakness, no other form of attack can reduce its hit points. If the haunt is reduced to 0 hit points by positive energy, it is neutralized— if this occurs before the haunt takes its action at initiative rank 10, its effect does not occur."
Taken from the haunt page. I am not familiar with haunts, but this seems to indicate that a wand of CLW can damage a haunt.
"3.he can do that. To do it effectively you need to start with a +1 weapon. Then Add flame to it. Then add another +1. Then Add Frost. Also its a swift action to do this... so 1 a turn. so... 3 turns to get this online?"
If the magus has a high enough level, he can add ,with a swift action, +1, Frost and Flame in the same round.
From the PRD: At 1st level, a magus can expend 1 point from his arcane pool as a swift action to grant any weapon he is holding a +1 enhancement bonus for 1 minute. For every four levels beyond 1st, the weapon gains another +1 enhancement bonus, to a maximum of +5 at 17th level. These bonuses can be added to the weapon, stacking with existing weapon enhancement to a maximum of +5. Multiple uses of this ability do not stack with themselves.
[url]http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/ultimateMagic/spellcasters/magus.html#Ar cane-Pool[/url]
"3.he can do that. To do it effectively you need to start with a +1 weapon. Then Add flame to it. Then add another +1. Then Add Frost. Also its a swift action to do this... so 1 a turn. so... 3 turns to get this online?"
If the magus has a high enough level, he can add ,with a swift action, +1, Frost and Flame in the same round.
From the PRD: At 1st level, a magus can expend 1 point from his arcane pool as a swift action to grant any weapon he is holding a +1 enhancement bonus for 1 minute. For every four levels beyond 1st, the weapon gains another +1 enhancement bonus, to a maximum of +5 at 17th level. These bonuses can be added to the weapon, stacking with existing weapon enhancement to a maximum of +5. Multiple uses of this ability do not stack with themselves.
[url]http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/ultimateMagic/spellcasters/magus.html#Ar cane-Pool[/url]
Thanks for the clarification! I don't usually delve too much into the magus class and frankly its a cool concept, but I find it a bit overwhelming.
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2. Guessing it is the School Understanding (Divination) arcanist exploit. It is a swift action to activate. Unless you house rule otherwise, it's not very effective. As mentioned above, the bonus to initiate might be nice if your party is doing the ambushing. But, the "always acts in surprise round" portion is almost never going to happen.
I might let them use the action/spend their point to act even though they shouldn't be able to, but that would be your rules adjustment.
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"3.he can do that. To do it effectively you need to start with a +1 weapon. Then Add flame to it. Then add another +1. Then Add Frost. Also its a swift action to do this... so 1 a turn. so... 3 turns to get this online?"
If the magus has a high enough level, he can add ,with a swift action, +1, Frost and Flame in the same round.
From the PRD: At 1st level, a magus can expend 1 point from his arcane pool as a swift action to grant any weapon he is holding a +1 enhancement bonus for 1 minute. For every four levels beyond 1st, the weapon gains another +1 enhancement bonus, to a maximum of +5 at 17th level. These bonuses can be added to the weapon, stacking with existing weapon enhancement to a maximum of +5. Multiple uses of this ability do not stack with themselves.
[url]http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/ultimateMagic/spellcasters/magus.html#Ar cane-Pool[/url]
Not quite. Here is the write up for Arcane Pool. If the weapon is magical already, the Magus can do a swift action and add them to the weapon at the same time.
Arcane Pool (Su): At 1st level, the magus gains a reservoir of mystical arcane energy that he can draw upon to fuel his powers and enhance his weapon. This arcane pool has a number of points equal to 1/2 his magus level (minimum 1) + his Intelligence modifier. The pool refreshes once per day when the magus prepares his spells.
At 1st level, a magus can expend 1 point from his arcane pool as a swift action to grant any weapon he is holding a +1 enhancement bonus for 1 minute. For every four levels beyond 1st, the weapon gains another +1 enhancement bonus, to a maximum of +5 at 17th level. These bonuses can be added to the weapon, stacking with existing weapon enhancement to a maximum of +5. Multiple uses of this ability do not stack with themselves.
At 5th level, these bonuses can be used to add any of the following weapon properties: dancing, flaming, flaming burst, frost, icy burst, keen, shock, shocking burst, speed, or vorpal. Adding these properties consumes an amount of bonus equal to the property's base price modifier (see the Magic Weapon Special Ability Descriptions). These properties are added to any the weapon already has, but duplicates do not stack. If the weapon is not magical, at least a +1 enhancement bonus must be added before any other properties can be added. These bonuses and properties are decided when the arcane pool point is spent and cannot be changed until the next time the magus uses this ability. These bonuses do not function if the weapon is wielded by anyone other than the magus.
A magus can only enhance one weapon in this way at one time. If he uses this ability again, the first use immediately ends.
"3.he can do that. To do it effectively you need to start with a +1 weapon. Then Add flame to it. Then add another +1. Then Add Frost. Also its a swift action to do this... so 1 a turn. so... 3 turns to get this online?"
If the magus has a high enough level, he can add ,with a swift action, +1, Frost and Flame in the same round.
From the PRD: At 1st level, a magus can expend 1 point from his arcane pool as a swift action to grant any weapon he is holding a +1 enhancement bonus for 1 minute. For every four levels beyond 1st, the weapon gains another +1 enhancement bonus, to a maximum of +5 at 17th level. These bonuses can be added to the weapon, stacking with existing weapon enhancement to a maximum of +5. Multiple uses of this ability do not stack with themselves.
[url]http://paizo.com/pathfinderRPG/prd/ultimateMagic/spellcasters/magus.html#Ar cane-Pool[/url]
Not quite. Here is the write up for Arcane Pool. If the weapon is magical already, the Magus can do a swift action and add them to the weapon at the same time.
Arcane Pool (Su): At 1st level, the magus gains a reservoir of mystical arcane energy that he can draw upon to fuel his powers and enhance his weapon. This arcane pool has a number of points equal to 1/2 his magus level (minimum 1) + his Intelligence modifier. The pool refreshes once per day when the magus prepares his spells.
At 1st level, a magus can expend 1 point from his arcane pool as a swift action to grant any weapon he is holding a +1 enhancement bonus for 1 minute. For every four levels beyond 1st, the weapon gains another +1 enhancement bonus, to a maximum of +5 at 17th level. These bonuses can be added to the weapon, stacking with existing weapon enhancement to a maximum of +5. Multiple uses of this ability do not stack with themselves.
At 5th level, these bonuses can be used to add any of the following weapon properties: dancing, flaming, flaming burst, frost, icy burst, keen, shock, shocking burst, speed, or vorpal. Adding these...
So then, in order to add flame and shock He needs to be lv 9.
Lv1 +1 bonusLv5 Flaming
Lv9 Shock
this is considering he already has a +1 weapon.
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If he already has a +1 then he doesn't need to add the +1. So at lv5 you're able to add 2 levels of bonuses. flaming and shocking are each 1 level so at lv5 you can add both to your +1 weapon as 1 swift action.
If he already has a +1 then he doesn't need to add the +1. So at lv5 you're able to add 2 levels of bonuses. flaming and shocking are each 1 level so at lv5 you can add both to your +1 weapon as 1 swift action.
Just to clarify what Chess Pwn said. As long as a weapon has at least a +1 bonus you can add any number of abilities to it. You don't need to have +1 per ability. So a +1 weapon could have flaming, shocking, frost, corrosive. The only requirement is that the weapon have a +1 either because it is enchanted or you use an ability to add it.
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2 we need to know the ability if it is a Spell like ability then yes it will require a standard action. but i do find it funny the "a bonus for 3 rds bit" I know they have this all over the books with ability with bonus to init for number of rd, but the hard rules are once initiative is roll it is set in stone, the number hit the trash can, they mean nothing out side that 1 roll. It does not change while in play unless special actions are taken such as delay or reading. so really he has that bonus for the entire combat.
"but the hard rules are once initiative is roll it is set in stone, the number hit the trash can," Not at all. Ther eis a good number of abilities and effects that can change that number , so you keep it an modify it.
Initiative
At the start of a battle, each combatant makes an initiative check. An initiative check is a Dexterity check. Each character applies his or her Dexterity modifier to the roll, as well as other modifiers from feats, spells, and other effects. Characters act in order, counting down from the highest result to the lowest. In every round that follows, the characters act in the same order (unless a character takes an action that results in his or her initiative changing; see Special Initiative Actions).
i.e every round the character count from highest result to the lowest and act in that order. you get some effect that change your initiative number? Your position change.
2 we need to know the ability if it is a Spell like ability then yes it will require a standard action. but i do find it funny the "a bonus for 3 rds bit" I know they have this all over the books with ability with bonus to init for number of rd, but the hard rules are once initiative is roll it is set in stone, the number hit the trash can, they mean nothing out side that 1 roll. It does not change while in play unless special actions are taken such as delay or reading. so really he has that bonus for the entire combat.
"but the hard rules are once initiative is roll it is set in stone, the number hit the trash can," Not at all. Ther eis a good number of abilities and effects that can change that number , so you keep it an modify it.
i.e every round the character count from highest result to the lowest and act in that order. you get some effect that change your initiative number? Your position change.Initiative
At the start of a battle, each combatant makes an initiative check. An initiative check is a Dexterity check. Each character applies his or her Dexterity modifier to the roll, as well as other modifiers from feats, spells, and other effects. Characters act in order, counting down from the highest result to the lowest. In every round that follows, the characters act in the same order (unless a character takes an action that results in his or her initiative changing; see Special Initiative Actions).
No because of the part I bolded.
i.e every round after the first the characters act in the order they acted in in the first round.|
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Say for example that the character is 9th level Magus with a +1 weapon
As a swift action they can, for a minute
1. make it a +4 weapon
2. make it a +3 weapon with a +1 weapon property like Shocking
3. Make it a +2 weapon with up to 2 +1 properties or a +2 property
4. Leave it as a +1 but add up to 3 +1 properties like Keen, Shocking, and flaming for example.
If the Magus had the Ghost blade Magus Arcana, by adding an additional point from the pool at the time they make the selection, they can add ghost touch to the options but still has to use one of the bonus to add it.
If he already has a +1 then he doesn't need to add the +1. So at lv5 you're able to add 2 levels of bonuses. flaming and shocking are each 1 level so at lv5 you can add both to your +1 weapon as 1 swift action.Just to clarify what Chess Pwn said. As long as a weapon has at least a +1 bonus you can add any number of abilities to it. You don't need to have +1 per ability. So a +1 weapon could have flaming, shocking, frost, corrosive. The only requirement is that the weapon have a +1 either because it is enchanted or you use an ability to add it.
Oh, I didn't know that.
Just to clarify, what does the following line mean:
"Adding these properties consumes an amount of bonus equal to the property's base price modifier (see the Magic Weapon Special Ability Descriptions)"
Because I think that this means you need the individual +1 before adding the bonuses...
I hate dealing with magical weapon properties.
EDIT: nevermind, that just means that if you add a +2 ability then that takes up two of the +1 potential bonus.. Duh!
If he already has a +1 then he doesn't need to add the +1. So at lv5 you're able to add 2 levels of bonuses. flaming and shocking are each 1 level so at lv5 you can add both to your +1 weapon as 1 swift action.Just to clarify what Chess Pwn said. As long as a weapon has at least a +1 bonus you can add any number of abilities to it. You don't need to have +1 per ability. So a +1 weapon could have flaming, shocking, frost, corrosive. The only requirement is that the weapon have a +1 either because it is enchanted or you use an ability to add it.Oh, I didn't know that.
Just to clarify, what does the following line mean:
"Adding these properties consumes an amount of bonus equal to the property's base price modifier (see the Magic Weapon Special Ability Descriptions)"
Because I think that this means you need the individual +1 before adding the bonuses...
I hate dealing with magical weapon properties.
So let's say you are an 11th level paladin. Your divine bond allows you to add up to a +3 enhancement bonus to your weapon but special abilities such as flaming use up an amount of enhancement bonus equal to their properties base price mod. So if your paladin wants to add flaming to his weapon he has to use one + of his enhancement bonus to "pay" for the flaming ability. So he can put +2 enhancement and flaming on the sword. If he wants to put flaming and holy he can't because he must put +1 enhancement and then holy uses up another +2 so he has nothing left to pay for the cost of flaming. He can have any enhancement bonus and ability that adds up to +3 but has to have at least +1 enhancement.
I hope that makes sense and isn't as clear as mud :)
edit: and after all that you figured it out. Which is probably good since I didn't explain it very well anyway lol
1) Some thought that since reduce person is not a polymorph effect it would work.
2)
2. Guessing it is the School Understanding (Divination) arcanist exploit. It is a swift action to activate. Unless you house rule otherwise, it's not very effective. As mentioned above, the bonus to initiate might be nice if your party is doing the ambushing. But, the "always acts in surprise round" portion is almost never going to happen.
I might let them use the action/spend their point to act even though they shouldn't be able to, but that would be your rules adjustment.
That is the correct ability. The GM decided he could activate as an immediate action until it could be clarified.
3) Magus is 7th level and the weapon already has a +1 standard enhancement bonus. Most at the table didn't think you could add 2 elemental properties at the same time.
4) Improved familiar with wands, SLA's, hands, speech, and UMD. Didn't think it would work, but wanted to check.
5) Several said CLW wouldn't work since it isn't quite the same as channeled positive energy.
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1) Reduce Person is not a polymorph effect, but it is a size change and that means it doesn't work with polymorph effects. However, that is the only reason it doesn't work - Reduce Person can generally be used offensively since it doesn't specifically require a willing target (the target can make a Fort save to negate), and polymorph effects such as Wild Shape don't change your type, so the druid would still have been vulnerable to eg Charm Person.
3) You can certainly have two energy properties on the same weapon, even opposing properties like Frost and Flaming.
This may be a house rule, but my group considers these properties to start active so the magus (or paladin etc) doesn't need additional standard actions to turn them on. Otherwise there's not much point.
4) Also, you cannot use Share Spells on a spell cast from a wand, because it doesn't count as "casting a spell" for purposes of special abilities.
Items as Spells: Does using a potion, scroll, staff, or wand count as "casting a spell" for purposes of feats and special abilities like Augment Summoning, Spell Focus, an evoker's ability to do extra damage with evocation spells, bloodline abilities, and so on?
No. Unless they specifically state otherwise, feats and abilities that modify spells you cast only affect actual spellcasting, not using magic items that emulate spellcasting or work like spellcasting.
5) The haunt rules read "positive energy applied to the haunt (via channeled energy, cure spells, and the like)" - channeled positive energy is a type of positive energy but not the only type that works on haunts.
what book is Haunts in? I ask because of
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/gamemastering/haunts
they don't actual list the source
It is from the GameMastery Guide. It is implied because of the section in the d20pfsrd website, but it could definitely be more clear.
I don't think anyone I know has ever used the "on Command" elemental damage properties to mean it takes a standard (or even any) action to activate. That was one of my primary intended methods to up the damage from my whip.
If they didn't want it to follow the rules they really need to put an exception in there. As it is, nothing in the rules would let you know that it's not supposed to be an action to turn on if it's off, but because it says command word we go to those rules that say you need a standard action to use command word. Would have been better if they had just said you can turn on or off the weapon at will.
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If they didn't want it to follow the rules they really need to put an exception in there. As it is, nothing in the rules would let you know that it's not supposed to be an action to turn on if it's off, but because it says command word we go to those rules that say you need a standard action to use command word. Would have been better if they had just said you can turn on or off the weapon at will.
I agree it's messy, but as far as I can tell, standard operating procedure is to have it "on, unless". When you run into an NPC with such a weapon, there's no mention in the tactics that he spends a round activating his weapon for example. And you can sheathe them while the flame is on, without harming the sheath.
The activation rules make much more sense in the context of other items where a default "off" state is the norm, but they didn't feel like writing another exception in. Not a great decision perhaps..
If it feels better to you, imagine that the magus "left the gas on" the previous time he added that property to his weapon.
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2) Arcanist has the discovery to act in the surprise round with a bonus to initiative for 3 rounds. But someone said it takes an action to activate the ability. So it will never come into play unless the caster thinks he might be surprised in the next 3 rounds and activates the ability just before the surprise actually occurs. Is this correct?
It's hard to say without knowing what ability he was using, but yeah. Could be useful if you have to cross a hallway where you suspect an ambush, but that's about it.
5) Can cure light wounds (specifically from a wand) be used to damage a haunt?
It's specifically permitted, though you might get questions about what to target with your spell. As opposed to Channelling the whole area indiscriminately. I'd say that any part of the area of effect of the haunt works for cure spells.
5) Can cure light wounds (specifically from a wand) be used to damage a haunt?It's specifically permitted, though you might get questions about what to target with your spell. As opposed to Channelling the whole area indiscriminately. I'd say that any part of the area of effect of the haunt works for cure spells.
Most of the example haunts I have read have clear indications of the manifestation, which is part of the "notice checks" for handling the surprise round. The haunt has an area as well. I am generally pretty free form as a game master because of the free form nature of haunts.
For example, if fear inducing haunt manifests as bleeding walls in the area, then the walls are all valid targets. That is pretty easy to adjudicate.
A more difficult example might be if the haunt manifests an ear-piercing scream from the portrait of matron of the wizard household who banished her wizard son for not being loyal to their cause. The area of affect subject to the haunt might be a larger area, but I might require the cure spell be applied directly to the portrait rather than just any wall or floor in the area subject to the scream. In such cases, though, I would not let the haunt trigger without someone being within reach of the "target" point of the haunt. If coherence demanded that the haunt's center and manifestation be centered in a way that is difficult to reach, I would consider that a modifier increasing the reward of the challenge of the haunt.
Channeling energy to blanket the area is the easy and sure way to get the source.
If you know that a haunt is in an area, then Detect Undead as well as the various Detect $ALIGNMENT are specifically noted as able to notice a haunt before manifestation. I would take this to allow a character a chance to pinpoint the area and range and point to apply a cure spell to do the most good, but that interpretation is getting into house rule territory.
Does walking through a couple of examples like this help clarify using Cure spells with haunts?
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A more difficult example might be if the haunt manifests an ear-piercing scream from the portrait of matron of the wizard household who banished her wizard son for not being loyal to their cause. The area of affect subject to the haunt might be a larger area, but I might require the cure spell be applied directly to the portrait rather than just any wall or floor in the area subject to the scream. In such cases, though, I would not let the haunt trigger without someone being within reach of the "target" point of the haunt. If coherence demanded that the haunt's center and manifestation be centered in a way that is difficult to reach, I would consider that a modifier increasing the reward of the challenge of the haunt.
This seems like a good principle. Especially given that you only have a surprise round to preempt the haunt, it would be quite unfair if you had to both move and cast in it.
Tying trigger location and defusing location together seems fair; if the PCs aren't close enough to defuse the haunt they're also not close enough to trigger it.
When it does trigger, it could then affect a bigger area. Keeps things interesting for parties trying to maintain just the right distance to a scout to not hinder stealthing but be close enough to help if he finds someone :P
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I actual believe those things requiring standard action is intentional to add a bit of balance and make fights last longer and make them more challenging.
Except it doesn't make fights longer or more challenging, it just encourages characters to use abilities that don't need the extra activation:
so the 1d6 damage abilities are bad choices, better to pick keen, speed all the passive options or just increasing the bonus.
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In regards to the Divination School ability, the Arcanist acts as a 1st level Wizard with the ability a certain number of times per day, they can choose to bolster that ability as a Swift action. Though the ability to bolster has a specific action associated with it the base usage of the ability does not in the exploit description, this would presumably be because it doesn't alter the action required to use the base ability, which remains the same as it originally is, in this case, a non action as it is always on for a Wizard. That is how I would see the rules on it working at any rate.
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2 we need to know the ability if it is a Spell like ability then yes it will require a standard action. but i do find it funny the "a bonus for 3 rds bit" I know they have this all over the books with ability with bonus to init for number of rd, but the hard rules are once initiative is roll it is set in stone, the number hit the trash can, they mean nothing out side that 1 roll. It does not change while in play unless special actions are taken such as delay or reading. so really he has that bonus for the entire combat.
"but the hard rules are once initiative is roll it is set in stone, the number hit the trash can," Not at all. Ther eis a good number of abilities and effects that can change that number , so you keep it an modify it.
i.e every round the character count from highest result to the lowest and act in that order. you get some effect that change your initiative number? Your position change.Initiative
At the start of a battle, each combatant makes an initiative check. An initiative check is a Dexterity check. Each character applies his or her Dexterity modifier to the roll, as well as other modifiers from feats, spells, and other effects. Characters act in order, counting down from the highest result to the lowest. In every round that follows, the characters act in the same order (unless a character takes an action that results in his or her initiative changing; see Special Initiative Actions).
No because of the part I bolded.
i.e every round after the first the characters act in the order they acted in in the first round.
Yes, exactly for the part you border and the preceding phrase.
Characters act in order, counting down from the highest result to the lowest. In every round that follows, the characters act in the same order
You claim that the order is set in stone, but that text say that you act when your turn come, "counting down from the highest result to the lowest" and that the following turn you act in the same order, "counting down from the highest result to the lowest". That is how the order is defined. it don't say anywhere "throw away the numbers and don't use them anymore".
@ Diego Rossi read the whole thing, 1st sentence is telling at start of battle is the only time you make a check. Sentence two is telling you initiative check is any ability score check based on dex thus it is effected by thing that effect your dex score. Sentence 3 tell you how to do the math and preform the check. sentience 4 the 1st part you have bolded out tell you how to to determine order. stop end of rule or statement. the 4th sentence, new rule or statement which you only have the 1st part bolded tells you that every round after the 1st you follow that same order with 1 exception the part in () the character choose to change their initiative via the special actions. After the 1st round the numbers don't matter because there is only one way to change your initiative via the special actions delay or ready. This is all I am going to say on it as it belong in a separate thread.
You read it that way. I read it the other way.
My way of reading it work with a lot of abilities, your make them useless.Guess what is the right way to read it?
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If they didn't want it to follow the rules they really need to put an exception in there. As it is, nothing in the rules would let you know that it's not supposed to be an action to turn on if it's off, but because it says command word we go to those rules that say you need a standard action to use command word. Would have been better if they had just said you can turn on or off the weapon at will.
What JJ is saying is that you normally have the ability turned ON all the time, because: "Flaming: Upon command, a flaming weapon is sheathed in fire that deals an extra 1d6 points of fire damage on a successful hit. The fire does not harm the wielder. The effect remains until another command is given."
Equivalent text for the other abilities.It work badly with the paladin and magus abilities. A exception for activating the energy damage would be nice, but it is not necessary for the "standard" magical weapons.
For paladins, magi, duelist bards and so on it would be very useful. If you don't have it the best options for magi are to take the arcana or trait that extend the duration of the weapon enhancement and activate it in advance or chose different abilities.
our way :)
Nothing says that in following turns you count down from highest to lowest, it says you act in the same order as the first round. You quoted that part. I'm not sure how you're getting from, "first round do this, following rounds use the same order" to "first round do this, following rounds do this as well" otherwise they'd have just said, "every round do this."
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By the simple fact that it say how you determine the order. It is not "I have written a list of names in a order", it is "Characters act in order, counting down from the highest result to the lowest."
"In every round that follows, the characters act in the same order". Hos you determine the order? "counting down from the highest result to the lowest." Not reading the order in which the characters acted the last round.
Can you list off some of these abilities that you are alluding to that can be used after combat starts that change the rolled initiative number? I can't think of a single one off the top of my head. Readying/delaying changes the order when you act but doesn't interact with the number at all.
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Delay and Ready actually seem to specify that the number is what matters as they repeatedly refer to the result of the initiative check changing after using the actions.
When you delay, you voluntarily reduce your own initiative result for the rest of the combat. When your new, lower initiative count comes up later in the same round, you can act normally. You can specify this new initiative result or just wait until some time later in the round and act then, thus fixing your new initiative count at that point.
For the rest of the encounter, your initiative result is the count on which you took the readied action, and you act immediately ahead of the character whose action triggered your readied action
Also, perhaps pertinently;
Even if you can't take actions, you retain your initiative score for the duration of the encounter.
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Can you list off some of these abilities that you are alluding to that can be used after combat starts that change the rolled initiative number? I can't think of a single one off the top of my head. Readying/delaying changes the order when you act but doesn't interact with the number at all.
Anything that increase/decrease your initiative modifier.
Examples
Dexterity enhancements, dexterity damage (both cite initiative), dexterity drain,
I have never heard of anyone adjusting initiative order based on in-combat changes to Dex modifier, but I guess there's a first for everything.
That said I am pretty sure changing your dex modifier doesn't travel back in time and change your rolled initiative result, any more than getting bless cast on you in round 2 will change the result of an attack roll you missed on round 1.
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I have never heard of anyone adjusting initiative order based on in-combat changes to Dex modifier, but I guess there's a first for everything.
It is the most common example of something changing your modifier. From what I recall there are a few other effects that do that, but hunting them would require a lot of time.
I have never heard of anyone adjusting initiative order based on in-combat changes to Dex modifier, but I guess there's a first for everything.It is the most common example of something changing your modifier. From what I recall there are a few other effects that do that, but hunting them would require a lot of time.
The question wasn't changing the modifier, obviously your modifier can change, the question was changing initiative order after it's been set. Once you roll initiative, merely changing the modifier after the fact does nothing to change the original result, it only modifies future checks. If there aren't any abilities that explicitly change your order by changing the number in a specific way, then it doesn't matter if you track the number after it has been rolled or not.
The closest thing I can think of are some things that say they 'happen on initiative count 20 every round' or similar, and as long as they are inserted in the tracked turn order in the right place on round one it doesn't matter if you track relative numbers for those either.
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I'm pretty sure that later Dextery bonueses and penalties do nothing to your score after you have rolled, it's specifically called out as a Dexterity Check and once you have that result the only examples given of things might change it are the special actions Delay and Ready.
An initiative check is a Dexterity check. Each character applies his or her Dexterity modifier to the roll, as well as other modifiers from feats, spells, and other effects. Characters act in order, counting down from the highest result to the lowest.
I can't think of any other check where stat changes retroactively alter the result, if you take some Cha damage after a Diplomacy check you don't re-examine the result to see if you should change the creatures attitude for example, even though that attitude change is still currently in effect.
You could of course, choose just to use the order to no overall difference and if that's easier then more power to you, but RAW the Initiative section does seem to specify you should use the scores everyone rolled rather than simply a list of names.