| 4 people marked this as FAQ candidate. |
Regarding the Control Water spell ... I'm trying to get a better understanding of the first application - 'Lower Water'. It's in regard to this quote here:
"When cast on water elementals and other water-based creatures, this spell acts as a slow spell (Will negates)."
Which implies specific targeting and doesn't seem to mesh with the area component of the spell. Unless, the text relates to water elementals or water-based creatures that are *WITHIN* the spells area of effect.
So how exactly do you effect creatures of this type with the Slow-effect?
Given the specific wording, I would bet that it's like the slow spell, and that all water elementals and/or water-based creatures in the area are affected.
You see, I would rule that it becomes a targeted effect if you want to cast it on a water elemental. That just makes more intuitive sense to me, given the wording.
I'm not aware of any rule that gives precedent to either interpretation, but the AoE one is probably slightly more correct - maybe.
I disagree.
Here's the first line in the Slow spell:
An affected creature moves and attacks at a drastically slowed rate.
That description alone details that the spell affects one creature, and one creature only.
But, given that the spell's Target refers to One creature/level, all within a specific distance from each other, this would be extrapolated to mean all creatures affected by the area determined by the spell's caster.
Additionally, the spell's description refers to an Area that you affect, which is 10XCL by 10XCL by 2XCL. In other words, a giant cube. Considering the minimum spell level is 4, which means CL 7, you're looking at 70X70X14 (presumably, 70 feet wide by 70 feet long by 14 feet tall). It might be overpowered, but because of its limited target affection (and the factor that it's 1 spell level higher) means it's about on-par with Slow, which affects multiple creatures.
However, the Slow spell has a target line that reads:
Targets one creature/level, no two of which can be more than 30 ft. apart
"When cast on water elementals and other water-based creatures, this spell acts as a slow spell (Will negates)."
Yeah, this text is a mess. Because the area/targeting weirdness also doesn't address a more complex situation, where, let's say for example ... the Lower Water application is being cast on a volume of water that also contains 4 Water Elementals.
In this unique case, does the water lower ... *AND* ... do the Elementals all get targeted?
Plus, if being cast on legal creatures where Control Water acts as a Slow spell, I assume it's SR=No instead of the Slow spell's SR=YES.
I'd say that it only refers to the effect of the slow spell and not the casting and targeting.
Sure, but that's because the related spell has its own rules for casting and targeting, it's an Area of Effect.
@ GinoA: I already said that it has a Target line, and that is grounds for it affecting multiple creatures.
My point there was that you can't just refer to text and assume it targets only one creature; especially when the Slow spell text presumes a single creature (and only a single creature) is being targeted by the spell.
That being said, I don't see what the big deal is. How often do people fight them? I've only seen them in one encounter in all the time I've played this game, and quite frankly, if I had this spell, I'd actually have bothered to fight them, since I wouldn't have to worry about drowning to death.
My concern is properly interpreting Paizo's RAW. In aquatic-themed campaigns, this spell becomes a powerful option for spellcasters. Especially where there's anti-ship combat. But also because water elementals and water-based creatures are way more common.
I'm going to FAQ this rules-issue. As I don't see any definitive iron-clad interpretation of how the Slow'ing component of the spell actually works.
I may even post this inquiry over at James Jacobs' thread.
Owner - D20 Hobbies
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"When cast on water elementals and other water-based creatures, this spell acts as a slow spell (Will negates)."
Cast it in an area OR cast it on a water elemental.
If you cast it on an area containing water elementals, treat them as humans.
If you cast it on a specific water elemental, treat it as slowed.
That is my RAW. Your GM may have a different RAW, ask them.
I'm worried now. In leveled mutations I sometimes say treat A as B. What I mean is treat A as B in any way not otherwise said in the text at hand.
In other words use what is referred to, to fill in the blanks.
The primary spell takes precedence over the secondary spell.