Looking at our fighter, enjoing his adamantine +3 full plate, I was wondering: if your goal as a player is to get as much AC as possible, how far can you get while still on relatively low level? And so, after a bit of skimming, I came up with this buld.
Race: Tengu or Undine
Class: Druid 11/Monk 1
Stats: Wis>Dex>Everything else. Assuming standart pointbuy, base 15 Wis 15 Dex. Adding racial and level bonuses, we get 18 Wis 18 Dex.
Feats: Natural Caster, Heavy Armor Proficiency, Dodge.
Armor: Wild Darkwood full plate.
Shield: Wild Darkwood large shield.
Ring: Ring of Protection +3.
Belt of Incredible Dexterity +6.
Headband of Inspired Wisdom +6. As you can see, I placed a cap of +3 enhancement bonus on items to keep with levels. Also, most of these items you can craft yourself.
Spells: Wild shape into Large Air Elemental, Barkskin, Ironwood.
Let's count!
Base AC = 10
Wild shape natural armor => +4 AC
18+6+4 Dex => +9 AC
18+6 Wis => +6 AC
Full plate => +9 AC
Shield => +2 AC
RoP => +3 AC
Barkskin => +4 AC
Dodge => +1 AC
Size => -1 AC
Total AC = 47! And 25 touch AC! And that's not a limit!
Now just try and hit me, foe! *Foe casts lightning bolt* Oh well...
EDIT: well, I was wrong. According to http://paizo.com/paizo/faq/v5748nruor1fm#v5748eaic9tl1 you can't gain both monk's and wild armor bonuses.
you can't get the monks wis to AC bonus if you wear armor.
Without the Wild Quality on armor, you do not retain the AC bonus while wild shaped. +1 Wild armor costs 16,000 gp.
Also, a druid wearing metal armor loses his druid abilities, including his ability to cast spells or wild shape.
And it's questionable about whether you would retain your monk wisdom bonus to AC since you're technically wearing armor, even when wild shaped (assuming you don't wear metal armor) since your still getting the benefit of armor. As a GM I would rule you cannot benefit from the armor and retain the monk bonus to AC.
Without the Wild Quality on armor, you do not retain the AC bonus while wild shaped.
Also, a druid wearing metal armor loses his druid abilities.
And it's questionable about whether you would retain your monk wisdom bonus to AC since you're technically wearing armor.
It's not questionable any more, there's a FAQ that says you count as still wearing the armor always. so Wild Armor still count as wearing armor when wildshaped, so the monk's bonus wont work.
Yup, that's why I listed wild armor and shield. At lvl 9 druid you can craft wild items yourself.
The thing about wild is that you do not wear it while wild shaped. It simply gives you AC bonus while melded in your body. You do not gain armor check or other penalties.
It's not questionable any more, there's a FAQ that says you count as still wearing the armor always. so Wild Armor still count as wearing armor when wildshaped, so the monk's bonus wont work.Without the Wild Quality on armor, you do not retain the AC bonus while wild shaped.
Also, a druid wearing metal armor loses his druid abilities.
And it's questionable about whether you would retain your monk wisdom bonus to AC since you're technically wearing armor.
Excellent
Yup, that's why I listed wild armor and shield. At lvl 9 druid you can craft wild items yourself.
The thing about wild is that you do not wear it while wild shaped. It simply gives you AC bonus while melded in your body. You do not gain armor check or other penalties.
I did miss those items.
However, you cannot have darkwood full plate, as full plate isn't a wooden item or mostly wooden item. You would have to use Dragonhide.
And as far as your second comment, see the FAQ ChessPwn cited.
[Q
It's not questionable any more, there's a FAQ that says you count as still wearing the armor always. so Wild Armor still count as wearing armor when wildshaped, so the monk's bonus wont work.Without the Wild Quality on armor, you do not retain the AC bonus while wild shaped.
Also, a druid wearing metal armor loses his druid abilities.
And it's questionable about whether you would retain your monk wisdom bonus to AC since you're technically wearing armor.
Ah, I missed that. Sorry then)
It's not questionable any more, there's a FAQ that says you count as still wearing the armor always. so Wild Armor still count as wearing armor when wildshaped, so the monk's bonus wont work.Without the Wild Quality on armor, you do not retain the AC bonus while wild shaped.
Also, a druid wearing metal armor loses his druid abilities.
And it's questionable about whether you would retain your monk wisdom bonus to AC since you're technically wearing armor.
Excellent
Yup, that's why I listed wild armor and shield. At lvl 9 druid you can craft wild items yourself.
The thing about wild is that you do not wear it while wild shaped. It simply gives you AC bonus while melded in your body. You do not gain armor check or other penalties.
I did miss those items.
However, you cannot have darkwood full plate, as full plate isn't a wooden item or mostly wooden item. You would have to use Dragonhide.
And as far as your second comment, see the FAQ ChessPwn cited.
Well, you can craft Darkwood full plate. Nothing prevents you from doing that) But to make it actually work as a full plate, you need an Ironwood spell.
Yes it does:
Darkwood: This rare magic wood is as hard as normal wood but very light. Any wooden or mostly wooden item (such as a bow or spear) made from darkwood is considered a masterwork item and weighs only half as much as a normal wooden item of that type. Items not normally made of wood or only partially of wood (such as a battleaxe or a mace) either cannot be made from darkwood or do not gain any special benefit from being made of darkwood. The armor check penalty of a darkwood shield is lessened by 2 compared to an ordinary shield of its type. To determine the price of a darkwood item, use the original weight but add 10 gp per pound to the price of a masterwork version of that item.
Now, if you use wood shape on some wood, and then use ironwood on it, you could make wooden full plate.
But this isn't permanent, and couldn't be enchanted with the Wild quality.
Like I said, the easy answer is Dragonhide.
Yes it does:
Darkwood: This rare magic wood is as hard as normal wood but very light. Any wooden or mostly wooden item (such as a bow or spear) made from darkwood is considered a masterwork item and weighs only half as much as a normal wooden item of that type. Items not normally made of wood or only partially of wood (such as a battleaxe or a mace) either cannot be made from darkwood or do not gain any special benefit from being made of darkwood. The armor check penalty of a darkwood shield is lessened by 2 compared to an ordinary shield of its type. To determine the price of a darkwood item, use the original weight but add 10 gp per pound to the price of a masterwork version of that item.Now, if you use wood shape on some wood, and then use ironwood on it, you could make wooden full plate.
But this isn't permanent, and couldn't be enchanted with the Wild quality.
Well, with my initial point totally crushed, let's discuss this. Why can't I enchant wooden armor with Wild quality?
Also, may dex bonus isn't increased by Darkwood or Dragonhide. Which is something I forget before hand. So the max dex bonus of full plate is 1. Which means your dex to AC is capped at 1.
I thought this has been a viable casterzilla for a while now, I know I have seen it online. I congratulate anyone figuring out how to min max Druids like this though. Pathfinder has a lot more fun combinations than 3.5, and the change to wilds gape changes how things work.
Imagine this if you changed into a deminuitive hummingbird of doom though. You get size bonus to AC (+6 DEX, +1 natural armor, +4 size bonus to AC)
I thought of that as well, but decided too keep it more realistic since in real combat you would rather use Large Elemental body then tiny birdie, wouldn't you)
For tiny birdies I have another trick though) If you use call lightning spell, then change into something really stealthy, you can chnnel full duration without being seen. Yup, lvl 5 druid delivers 30d6 lighning damage without getting a single hit in return. Truly Nature's Retribution.
Well, with my initial point totally crushed, let's discuss this. Why can't I enchant wooden armor with Wild quality?
So, "wooden full plate" isn't actually armor without the use of ironwood. Now according to ironwood you can use wood shape or the appropriate wooden craft related skill to fashion "armor". Then you use ironwood on it.
Ironwood last one day per level, in this case 12 days.
You can craft up to 1000 gp per day worth of stuff. +1 Wild armor costs 16,000 gp. Meaning it requires 16 days to craft. Your armor then reverts to non-armor before you can finish crafting it.
Not to mention you will have wasted the money.
Also, even if you succeeded in somehow crafting it before time ran out, when time ran out it would cease to be armor and lose it's magical properties. Leaving you still out the gold you had used to craft it.
Well, with my initial point totally crushed, let's discuss this. Why can't I enchant wooden armor with Wild quality?So, "wooden full plate" isn't actually armor without the use of ironwood. Now according to ironwood you can use wood shape or the appropriate wooden craft related skill to fashion "armor". Then you use ironwood on it.
Ironwood last one day per level, in this case 12 days.
You can craft up to 1000 gp per day worth of stuff. +1 Wild armor costs 16,000 gp. Meaning it requires 16 days to craft. Your armor then reverts to non-armor before you can finish crafting it.
First, you can alwawys reapply Ironwood before previous ends. Second, wooden armor itself is wearable even without Ironwood (according to spell Transmute Metal to Wood), but has -2 AC. So I think there is no problem applying Wild to it.
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If you are going to go Druid/Monk you don't need to go Wild Armor. You can grab Bracers of Armor and either put them on after wild shape or talk your GM into letting it work in wild shape since the intention was mundane armor bonuses and not the magic ones. (Can't in PFS but home games it makes sense)
Level 12, consider Undine/Tengu/Plumekith Aasimar
Monk 1/Druid 11
Assuming 20 pt buy go S 8, D 20 C 14 I 12 W 18 Ch 8 w/ lvl adjustments at 12
At 12, +4 Headband of Wisdom, +6 Belt of Dex, Bracers of Armor 4 (or potion/wand of mage armor)
Grab Ring of Protection, Jingasa, Dusty Rose Ioun Stone, Dodge (bonus feat from Monk)
UMD skill for Wand of Shield
Lvl 12 your base AC = 32 (10 Base, 8 Dex, 6 Wis, 4 Armor, 1 Dodge, 1 Insight, 1 Luck, 1 Deflection)
Now add Wild Shape into a Medium Air Elemental (+3 Natural Armor, + 4 Dex) AC = 37
Or Diminutive Bird (+6 Dex, + 1 Na, +4 Size) AC = 40
Add Barkskin + Magical Knack or Menhir Savant for +5 Natural Armor for Air Elemental AC = 42, Bird = 45
Add Shield (from Ioun Stone even in bird form) Air Elemental AC = 46, Bird = 49
First, you can alwawys reapply Ironwood before previous ends. Second, wooden armor itself is wearable even without Ironwood (according to spell Transmute Metal to Wood), but has -2 AC. So I think there is no problem applying Wild to it.
Hmmm, I had thought there was something about the target line in Ironwood that prevented it being reapplied, but it doesn't appear so.
Regardless, a single casting of dispel could get rid of ironwood and then you are left with non-armor on.
As for transmute metal to wood...We don't have general rules that say you can make full plate from wood. We have a specific instance where it says metal armors that get hit by this specific spell take a -2 penalty to the armor bonus they grant, which is not the same thing. I would hesitate to make a precedent that says you can make any armor out of wood, but that it just has the AC reduced by 2, because that's not anywhere in the rules for crafting (that I could find).
Anyways, all of this is relatively moot, as in the beginning I said you could make the darn thing from Dragonhide. Which is the simplest solution without having to worry about casting spells to maintain your armor.
You could also buy stoneplate.
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Oread Monk 1 / Synthesist 11
Self:
Due to synthesist replacing my physical stats, I can dump them to get 20 Wis then pump it to 23. Use Oread favored class bonus on synthesist. Buy +6 Wisdom item, +6 Dex item, +3 Ring of Protection, Dusty Rose Ioun Stone, Jingasa. Take Combat Expertise, and Crane Ripose (and pre-req's). Cast Mage Armor, Shield, Barkskin, Haste, Reduce Person and Blood Armor.
Eidolon: Using a Serpentine base form. Taking Improved Natural Armor evolution 3 times as per errata. Taking the Improved Natural Armor feat 5 times. Take Improved Ability Score (Dex) evolution 3 times assuming same errata as Improved natural armor. Stat up Dex twice. Rest of evolution points don't matter.
AC: 10
+ 9 (wis)
+ 3 (expertise)
+ 1 (dodge)
+ 4 (Mage Armor)
+ 4 (Shield)
+ 5 (fighting defensively with Crane)
+ 5 (Blood Armor)
+ 1 (Ioun)
+ 4 (Barkskin)
+ 1 (haste)
+ 1 (reduce person size)
+ 12 (dex (16 base + 4 progression + 2 stat up + 6 item + 6 evolution))
+ 3 (ring of protection)
+ 23 (natural armor (+ 2 base + 5 feat + 6 evolution + 8 progression + 2 favored class))
+ 1 (Jingasa)
= 87 AC, 47 touch.
Edit: upon friends suggestion I have a bit more optimization that might allow me to break 100 AC.
A Viking with Beast Totem and Guarded Stance can pretty easily get his AC into the 40s by 12th level. Fully buffed and using Shield Wall my 12th level viking has a 47. With Crane Style and Combat Expertise I guess that could be 55, but I had other plans for that PC's feats. That same PC's AC gets as low as 35 when he's flat footed, so it isn't like he's "invincible", especially since it is a Mythic game.
@Taenia - If you're pushing your AC into the potentially controversial range I think you're probably better off just getting an ally to cast Mage Armor than asking for a custom magic item to boost your AC.
@erik542 - It is a minor point, but I'm not sure if Blood Armor and Mage Armor would stack. The AC is well into the "overkill" range against most foes anyhow. The touch AC is very impressive though, and I wonder what your monstrosity's CMD would be.
First, you can alwawys reapply Ironwood before previous ends. Second, wooden armor itself is wearable even without Ironwood (according to spell Transmute Metal to Wood), but has -2 AC. So I think there is no problem applying Wild to it.Hmmm, I had thought there was something about the target line in Ironwood that prevented it being reapplied, but it doesn't appear so.
Regardless, a single casting of dispel could get rid of ironwood and then you are left with non-armor on.
As for transmute metal to wood...We don't have general rules that say you can make full plate from wood. We have a specific instance where it says metal armors that get hit by this specific spell take a -2 penalty to the armor bonus they grant, which is not the same thing. I would hesitate to make a precedent that says you can make any armor out of wood, but that it just has the AC reduced by 2, because that's not anywhere in the rules for crafting (that I could find).
Anyways, all of this is relatively moot, as in the beginning I said you could make the darn thing from Dragonhide. Which is the simplest solution without having to worry about casting spells to maintain your armor.
You could also buy stoneplate.
You really, really dislike the idea of wooden armor for some reason, don't you?
Here's a trick for you:
1) Buy a metal fullplate.
2) Cast Transmute Metal To Wood on that sucker. Note the instantaneous duration.
Bam! Rules-legal enchantable wooden armor right there. It kind of sucks, for being wooden though. Refer to step 3-4.
3) Cast Ironwood on it.
4) Re-apply as neccesary.
If someone hits you with dispel magic, you've still got wooden full-plate.
You really, really dislike the idea of wooden armor for some reason, don't you?
Here's a trick for you:
1) Buy a metal fullplate.
2) Cast Transmute Metal To Wood on that sucker. Note the instantaneous duration.Bam! Rules-legal enchantable wooden armor right there. It kind of sucks, for being wooden though. Refer to step 3-4.
3) Cast Ironwood on it.
4) Re-apply as neccesary.If someone hits you with dispel magic, you've still got wooden full-plate.
No, I don't dislike the idea. It's simply not rules legal in an easy way.
You have to go through a lot of hoops or shenanigans to make it work (casting high(er) level spells). A fighter without outside help could not go and purchase functional wooden full plate armor if he wanted. It's not a matter or disliking or liking. It's simply a matter or the game doesn't have any normal rules for making normally metal armor from wood except for convoluted uses of spells. And that does piss me off, that we have to look to spells to create general rules for the game, which is not how the game should be designed.