Spontaneous Alchemy? Huh?

[Pixie, the Leng Queen]

So... I never noticed this..

Scroll Down a little to below the archetypes

So.. I did not know they made this...

It seems.... weird.

What do you guys think? These seem cool or really a poor implementation?

[the secret fire]

It seems like a bunch of overly complicated, fumbly nonsense - on the level of later 3.5 splatbook rules. I'll give the devs credit for recognizing that the crafting of alchemical items, poisons and even potions is completely out of whack compared to the crafting of magical items. A simpler solution to bring the crafting times and prices for consumables down to a reasonable level would be preferred to this kludge.

[Dasrak]

the secret fire wrote:

A simpler solution to bring the crafting times and prices for consumables down to a reasonable level would be preferred to this kludge.

Agreed; these things just need a flat cost decrease, not complicated subsystems.

[logan grayble]

I like the Spontaneous Alchemy feat, I never make an Alchemist without it, even if it's a little complicated. As long as you're willing to make a few concessions when it comes to the availability of your components, you can make BUCKETS of Alchemist's Fire in your down time, I think 1 every standard if I remember correctly. And weapons like Fuse Bombs and fireworks take only a full-round to make.

[Ravingdork]

What's being discussed here? Why not provide a quote or a direct link?

[Rub-Eta]

Ravingdork wrote:

What's being discussed here? Why not provide a quote or a direct link?

The Spontaneous Alchemy rules published in the Alchemy Manual player companion. Can also be found here.

Personally, I really like the rules. Makes for fast creation of alchemical items (with the Instant Alchemy feat, we're looking at a standard action to create Alchemist's fire). And it's less confusing than the regular crafting rules.

[AntiDjinn]

It is a way to save a little time -- OK, a whole lotta time in many cases -- in exchange for a bunch of bookkeeping. You need to keep track of how many doses of urea, ruby of arsenic, myrrh, ginger extract, etc., you have on hand. In some cases you also need to track what lab equipment you have (did you break your retort, or leave it back in your home lab, or is it in your backpack?). If you have all the ingredients and all the paraphernalia then you can make some low level stuff without having to wait for a significant stretch of downtime.

My Alch will probably make some of the fireworks just for fun (and for sale if we go to Varisia) but most of the items will rapidly stop being worth whatever action it takes to deploy them. There is absolutely noting in the manual that is so powerful that you should really be rolling on a fumble table to see if you blow your lab up while making it.

[Zwordsman]

I like it.
I like that they included that with GM sanction Eschew Materials can allow you to ignore most if not all reagent tracking.

If only the Alchemical manuel had some way of making alchemy items more useful..

Like some sorta gloves that you could enchant like AOMF that applies to all those.
or ways to make hybrid funnel ones stay fine.

at low levels its so expensive. at higher levels when you can go with it, it doesn't have power.

[Trekkie90909]

They are discussing the Spontaneous Alchemy optional subsystem from Paizo's Alchemy Manual.

Which I'm only familiar with because I have a player who ragequit one of my games when I told him that's not how the standard rules work and decided against implementing after I'd read through it :P.

The system has high points and low points:

+
It allows the GM to really up the immersion factor by including a relatively short list of alchemical reagents for characters to find, gather, and barter for -- although this portion can be run independently from the faster creation time rules (I made a subsystem for this, which I think was part of my player's confusion)

It Speeds crafting times.

-
It specifically buffs one craft skill well out of proportion to other skills
It's more paperwork (if you're not into that)
A well spec'd Alchemist can abuse the rules and instant alchemy makes no sense within the context of the rules - which require you to have a full lab at your disposal (it's cheesy)

Overall the alchemy manual is great fluff, much of it is even decent mechanically, but the optional subsystem and many of the crunch aspects of the book fall far short of Paizo's normally high standards.