Don't Unrogues get Rogue talents and Uncanny Dodge on their own?
You can't multiclass a class with its Alternate class though. So a Ninja/Rogue (Unchained or otherwise) is an illegal build.
Well, is this for home game or PFS? If the former, just ask your GM to houserule slashing grace, or to houserule multiclass uRogue/Ninja.
Ninja is a rogue archetype. Just go from ninja to unchained ninja.
Not true. Ninja is an alternate class, just like the Samurai and Antipaladin. They are more than an archetype but less than a base class. There're no archetypes for alternate classes, though they still count as their sister class for favored class bonuses.
Ninja is a rogue archetype. Just go from ninja to unchained ninja.Not true. Ninja is an alternate class, just like the Samurai and Antipaladin. They are more than an archetype but less than a base class. There're no archetypes for alternate classes, though they still count as their sister class for favored class bonuses.
Not quite. For one, Samurai has its own archetypes (Sword Saint is one, I think it has three total), and Alternate Classes can take any archetypes they still qualify for (For example, Ninjas can take the Scout archetype, losing Uncanny Dodge/Improved in the process). They can't take archetypes that trade out abilities they don't have, however, which leaves out the majority of Rogue archetypes (since the only thing generally traded is Trapfinding and Trap Sense, which Ninjas don't have).
Yes on level 4 ;)
So dipping into Unchained Rogue 3 Levels wouldn't be very helpful.I also noticed, that a rebuild with full 5 levels of Unchained Rogue would be difficult because the Rogue Talent "Ki Pool" is no longer on the Unchained Rogues Talent List.
It is not clear yet if this is an oversight or was left out on purpose.
Huh, so it is. Maybe because the Unchained Monk's Ki Pool was altered from the CRB Monk? That said, Ninja Trick is still there, so he could retrain all levels into UnRogue and get his Uncanny Dodge and Vanish just fine. If he really wants a ki pool, multiclass as an UnMonk/UnRogue.
You can get ki points via rogue.
But not Unchained Rogue, which is what he's after. So yeah, all I can think of is to go Unchained Monk for ki pool and Unchained Rogue for the rest. Only real restriction is you'd need to be of Lawful alignment. If you were Chaotic before, I would suggest some kind of personal code to adhere to.
Not quite. For one, Samurai has its own archetypes (Sword Saint is one, I think it has three total), and Alternate Classes can take any archetypes they still qualify for (For example, Ninjas can take the Scout archetype, losing Uncanny Dodge/Improved in the process). They can't take archetypes that trade out abilities they don't have, however, which leaves out the majority of Rogue archetypes (since the only thing generally traded is Trapfinding and Trap Sense, which Ninjas don't have).Ninja is a rogue archetype. Just go from ninja to unchained ninja.Not true. Ninja is an alternate class, just like the Samurai and Antipaladin. They are more than an archetype but less than a base class. There're no archetypes for alternate classes, though they still count as their sister class for favored class bonuses.
Actually we have nothing official that says alternate classes can take archetypes or FCB of the class they were based off of. The Boards thought you could since Jason had said that alternate classes were just big archetypes, but since then Mark has said that they aren't and that that's official. So as of now there are no rules regarding what alternate classes can and can't do. here is a thread hoping to get a FAQ for this.
There's also a balance reason for it not to work.
Ninjas are still perfectly viable, it's just that there's actually a reason to play a Urogue instead.
If you could get the best of both worlds it'd be too much.
No, it wouldn't. Ninja is better than Core Rogue, but still a pretty weak class. Giving it the UnRogue upgrades would still leave it very well balanced relative to the other classes.
There's also a balance reason for it not to work.
Ninjas are still perfectly viable, it's just that there's actually a reason to play a Urogue instead.
If you could get the best of both worlds it'd be too much.
Rogue's are optimally weak no matter how you mix/match them. Four levels of Unchained rogue into a ninja build won't change that.
Things just get... janky if you combine Rogue and Ninja levels in the same character. I seriously recommend asking the DM if you can just apply the Ninja archetype to Unchained Rogue.
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No, it wouldn't. Ninja is better than Core Rogue, but still a pretty weak class. Giving it the UnRogue upgrades would still leave it very well balanced relative to the other classes.There's also a balance reason for it not to work.
Ninjas are still perfectly viable, it's just that there's actually a reason to play a Urogue instead.
If you could get the best of both worlds it'd be too much.
For martials - both are reasonably solid and very playable. (The way the game is currently balanced, you can't compare to casters. Entirely different discussion.)
If you take all of the best things from Urogue and give it to ninja - there would again be no reason to play a rogue instead of a ninja.
No, it wouldn't. Ninja is better than Core Rogue, but still a pretty weak class. Giving it the UnRogue upgrades would still leave it very well balanced relative to the other classes.There's also a balance reason for it not to work.
Ninjas are still perfectly viable, it's just that there's actually a reason to play a Urogue instead.
If you could get the best of both worlds it'd be too much.
For martials - both are reasonably solid and very playable. (The way the game is currently balanced, you can't compare to casters. Entirely different discussion.)
If you take all of the best things from Urogue and give it to ninja - there would again be no reason to play a rogue instead of a ninja.
sure there would be. The archetypes that the ninja can't pick because it's already lost those features/ not wanting to lose those in the first place.
The whole alternate class thing comes to this:
If an alternate class is a super archetype, then you can compute the UNinga by applying the differences between Rogue/Ninja to URogue/Uninja. PFS said no UNinja. [I think]
If an alternate class is NOT a super archetype, then it can multiclass with URogue or Rogue. PF initially said you cannot multiclass with base class, then unchained came out and people wanted UNinja, but got no PF support.
Q: Is Mark a PFS ruler or a PF ruler? If PFS, then it does not make his rule a PF rule.
/cevah
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The whole alternate class thing comes to this:
If an alternate class is a super archetype, then you can compute the UNinga by applying the differences between Rogue/Ninja to URogue/Uninja. PFS said no UNinja. [I think]
Nope - because URogue is a separate class, and besides, they don't have a thing or two which Ninjas give up from regular rogues in order to be ninjas.
If an alternate class is NOT a super archetype, then it can multiclass with URogue or Rogue.
Nope - because it's been specifically said that you can't - not just in PFS.
The whole alternate class thing comes to this:
If an alternate class is a super archetype, then you can compute the UNinga by applying the differences between Rogue/Ninja to URogue/Uninja. PFS said no UNinja. [I think]
If an alternate class is NOT a super archetype, then it can multiclass with URogue or Rogue. PF initially said you cannot multiclass with base class, then unchained came out and people wanted UNinja, but got no PF support.
Q: Is Mark a PFS ruler or a PF ruler? If PFS, then it does not make his rule a PF rule./cevah
Mark is a PF guy.
PFS did say no, and they said it because the PF guys said no. All we know is that they aren't archetypes and that they can't multiclass with certain other class.