|
So, I did a search and could not find a topic about this, though I know its been mentioned several times in other threads. Multiattack's requirement is that you have three or more natural weapons, and so players cannot usually take it. However, you can use magic to satisfy feat requirements, such as a belt of strength giving you enough strength to take power attack, and If you ever take off the belt, you temporarily lose the effects of the feat until you put it back on again. So, could you take multiattack if you practice enough with say, polymorph effects, or as a druid who can wild shape? My thought is that you could, but you would lose the effects of the feat any time that you do not satisfy the requirements, aka three or more natural attacks. So if you took it, you could not use it say, if you were using your bite as a secondary with your sword, but if you polymorph into leopard, you would be able to use the feat for as long as you satisfy the requirements.
Thoughts on this both RAW and not?
There is no general rule to support this. Its not game breaking, just not specifically allowed. Unless its PFS I would just ask the GM if they allow it.
I usually treat feats like this: anyone can get any feat, but you only benefit from it if you fulfill the prerequisites.
So you can take Power Attack with 12 STR, but if you don't have a Belt of Strength, you can't use it. You can even get Power Attack with 3 STR, but you'd need some shenanigans to benefit it from it.
Same would apply to Multiattack.
If a Lizardfolk with that feat for a tail attack wanted it, he'd qualify for it all times because he'd have two claw, a bite and a tail attack. If a polymorph specialist wanted it, I'd allow it too, but only benefitting when he has three natural attacks.
So yeah, basically what you said.
Most of the following feats apply specifically to monsters, although some player characters might qualify for them (particularly Craft Construct).
Some feats have prerequisites. Your character must have the indicated ability score, class feature, feat, skill, base attack bonus, or other quality designated in order to select or use that feat. A character can gain a feat at the same level at which he gains the prerequisite.
A character can't use a feat if he loses a prerequisite, but he does not lose the feat itself. If, at a later time, he regains the lost prerequisite, he immediately regains full use of the feat that prerequisite enables.
There are absolutely no restrictions on taking any feats other than those imposed by your GM or campaign organiser (such as PFS), as long as you meet the pre-requisites you can take it. It really doesn't matter where the feat is printed.
Similarly the rules don't really care (for the most part, I'm sure there is an exception somewhere) HOW you meet the pre-reqs, just as long as you do. If you lose the pre-req you are unable to use the feat until the pre-reqs are met. This is explicitly spelled out.
|
How about a Tiefling brawler with the Maw alternate race trait. The alternate trait is a bite attack while a brawler's unarmed strike counts as manufactured and natural weapon. At 2nd level the Brawler can do a brawler's fury with two unarmed attacks and the bite as the third natural weapon, and therefore secondary attack.
Prerequisites: Three or more natural attacks.
It won't work, you need 3+ natural attacks.
A brawler’s unarmed strike is treated as both a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of spells and effects that modify either manufactured weapons or natural weapons.
This doesn't make a Brawler unarmed strikes natural attacks, it allows to use spells and abilities that enhance natural attacks on unarmed strikes.
Also “ A brawler with natural weapons can’t use such weapons as part of brawler’s flurry, nor can she make natural weapon attacks in addition to her brawler’s flurry attacks.” This rule explicitly forbids your example. If you want a better example a Tengu with the Claw Attack alternate racial trait gains a pair of claw attacks in addition to their racial bite attack and so meets the prerequisite of 3 natural attacks needed to take the feat. There are more than a few race/class/feat/trait combinations that will net you 3 or more natural attacks even at 1st level.
How about a Tiefling brawler with the Maw alternate race trait.
I have to ask here: Why do you even want Multiattack on a Brawler? What do you think the feat does for such a character?
Don't forget that Multiattack only affects secondary attacks. You can have Bite, Claw, and Gore, which would qualify you for the feat, but it would be useless since those attacks are all primary and thus full BAB. Frankly, if you only have one secondary natural attack, you probably don't have to bother with Multiattack.
Monster feats were introduced in Pathfinder RPG Bestiary, though without a separate tag (all feats in Bestiary are monster feats except Craft Construct). Most of these feats apply specifically to monsters and might grant abilities that could be disruptive in the hands of PCs, although with the GM's permission PCs can take one of these feats if they meet the prerequisites.
The wording in Horror Adventures is extremely vague. It gives a warning that these abilities might be disruptive in the hands a PC but does not explicitly state they cannot be taken. But at the same time, it states the players can take them with the GM’s permission. Since the GM is the one deciding what sources are available to the PC technically any feat requires GM’s approval.
The OP question was not really about the ability of a PC to take a monster feat. It was if he could use spells or wildshape to meet the prerequisite of 3 or more natural attacks. I see no reason that a druid or other polymorph specialist could not take this feat. He would only gain the benefit of the feat when in a form with 3 or more natural attacks.
How about a Tiefling brawler with the Maw alternate race trait.I have to ask here: Why do you even want Multiattack on a Brawler? What do you think the feat does for such a character?
To gain additional natural attacks at only -2 (instead of -5) on attack rolls when using Brawler's Flurry with unarmed attacks/close weapons/monk weapons? For instance, flurry with a spiked heavy shield held in one hand plus bite plus claw (using the hand not holding the shield).
Multiattack is often a useful feat when mixing manufactured weapon/unarmed strikes with natural weapon attacks. The natural attacks still only add 1/2 Str mod to damage when treated as secondary natural attacks, but they are more likely to hit.
A tiefling with the Maw or Claw (Maw) alternate trait would still need to pick up two other natural attacks (possibly a two level dip in ranger or slayer for Natural Weapon combat style to qualify for Aspect of the Beast/Claws of the Beast); a more straightforward route would be the Maw or Claw (Claws) alternate trait and the Deadly Horns feat, which could be taken by a tiefling brawler at 1st level.
To gain additional natural attacks at only -2 (instead of -5) on attack rolls when using Brawler's Flurry with unarmed attacks/close weapons/monk weapons? For instance, flurry with a spiked heavy shield held in one hand plus bite plus claw (using the hand not holding the shield).
You can't actually do that.
A brawler with natural weapons can’t use such weapons as part of brawler’s flurry, nor can she make natural weapon attacks in addition to her brawler’s flurry attacks.
It's been a while since I've actually played PF1. I forgot about that restriction.
For non-flurry combat, since monk has the same limitation, Multiattack is still a useful feat for characters with natural attacks that also use weapons.
To gain additional natural attacks at only -2 (instead of -5) on attack rolls when using Brawler's Flurry with unarmed attacks/close weapons/monk weapons? For instance, flurry with a spiked heavy shield held in one hand plus bite plus claw (using the hand not holding the shield).
Multiattack is often a useful feat when mixing manufactured weapon/unarmed strikes with natural weapon attacks. The natural attacks still only add 1/2 Str mod to damage when treated as secondary natural attacks, but they are more likely to hit.
No no, I get that. But what you describe, if it did work, would just be so weak that I wondered whether Markus Nobis though the feat did more than that.
On a side note, a spiked heavy shield would flurry with a -4 penalty.
I think there's a feat that lets a monk flurry with natural weapons. Don't remember what it is though.
|
I think there's a feat that lets a monk flurry with natural weapons. Don't remember what it is though.
Feral Combat Training, though it only allows flurrying with one of your natural weapons.
FCT only adds the natural weapon to the list of what you can flurry with, it doesn't grant any additional attacks over a regular flurry. Since almost everyone who's looking into natural weapons does so to get additional attacks, for the topic of combining natural weapons and Flurry, FCT virtually never helps with what people want.
FCB also only works for Monks, not for anyone else including Brawlers.
There is a build with FCT, where you flurry with a natural attack of unusually high base damage, something usually obtained via polymorphing. It's really a Druid build, not a Monk build, though.