brawling armor?

[Merm7th]

Can brawling be applied to mithral breastplate?

The brawling ability can be applied only to light armor.

Breastplate is medium and "Most mithral armors are one category lighter than normal for purposes of movement and other limitations...medium armors are treated as light..." Does other limitations include the limitation of what abilities it can be given?

[Deadmanwalking]

That would not work, no. It's not light armor, it just counts as it for some specific purposes.

Celestial Armor, however, would qualify, since it's actually and explicitly light armor.

[Chess Pwn]

This is a very good question. I believe you can. I recommend you add your voice to the thread here in hopes for getting a FAQ for it.

[graystone]

Deadmanwalking wrote:

That would not work, no. It's not light armor, it just counts as it for some specific purposes.

I'm not sure how that equates to a no. The question is if one of the things it "counts as light" for is the enchant. I haven't yet seen anything that proves the answer is an unequivocal yes or no. It's a definite maybe from my perspective.

[Zwordsman]

Mithral specifies it counts as lower level for "Most mithral armors are one category lighter than normal for purposes of movement and other limitations"

Brawling sounds like it should work fine with it. Brawler has a limitation for light armour only, that is a limiation.
obviously not what the mithral was written in mind with (as core) but, it looks like it was written so open ended specifically for all the later effects like this one.

So. Stick me in the "it should work" camp. For what its worth.
though realistically it's solid gray area, but in my opinion more evidence implying it works than implying it won't.

[Deadmanwalking]

Zwordsman wrote:

Mithral specifies it counts as lower level for "Most mithral armors are one category lighter than normal for purposes of movement and other limitations"

Brawling sounds like it should work fine with it. Brawler has a limitation for light armour only, that is a limiation.
obviously not what the mithral was written in mind with (as core) but, it looks like it was written so open ended specifically for all the later effects like this one.

Eh...by that logic, Light Armor Proficiency should work with it, too, since Proficiencies and the need for them are a limitation, too. And yet, that pretty explicitly doesn't work.

If you need Medium Armor Proficiency to wear it without penalty, I don't think you can put 'light armor only' enhancements on it. Elven Chain and Celestial Armor really are light armor in all ways, but a Mithral Breastplate just isn't.

[Merm7th]

Deadmanwalking wrote:

Zwordsman wrote:

Mithral specifies it counts as lower level for "Most mithral armors are one category lighter than normal for purposes of movement and other limitations"

Brawling sounds like it should work fine with it. Brawler has a limitation for light armour only, that is a limiation.
obviously not what the mithral was written in mind with (as core) but, it looks like it was written so open ended specifically for all the later effects like this one.

Eh...by that logic, Light Armor Proficiency should work with it, too, since Proficiencies and the need for them are a limitation, too. And yet, that pretty explicitly doesn't work.

If you need Medium Armor Proficiency to wear it without penalty, I don't think you can put 'light armor only' enhancements on it. Elven Chain and Celestial Armor really are light armor in all ways, but a Mithral Breastplate just isn't.

Sorry I didn't put the full description for mithral. It didn't seem relevant at the time. Mithral counts as one category lighter for movement and other limitations, but specifically states "This decrease does not apply to proficiency in wearing the armor". Elven chain states "This armor is treated, in all ways, like light armor, including when determining proficiency," specifically calling out proficiency.

The problem is the limitations or "some specific purposes" as you put it, are not defined. Is an ability only working on light armor a limitation or does an ability function as if it were a proficiency?

[Skylancer4]

Is mithril breastplate on any random treasure table? If it is listed as medium or light, you would have your answer.

[Nefreet]

We just had this discussion last month, actually (as Chess Pwn linked above).

In that thread, I typed up a quick list of some of the cans and cannots of Mithral armor (HERE), which Mark Seifter, one of the current Designers, unofficially confirmed (HERE).

There are obviously some ppl that disagree, so take that list with a grain of salt. Talk to your GM if this is for a home game, and go with the more conservative approach if this is for PFS.

[DarkPhoenixx]

Nefreet wrote:

We just had this discussion last month, actually (as Chess Pwn linked above).

In that thread, I typed up a quick list of some of the cans and cannots of Mithral armor (HERE), which Mark Seifter, one of the current Designers, unofficially confirmed (HERE).

There are obviously some ppl that disagree, so take that list with a grain of salt. Talk to your GM if this is for a home game, and go with the more conservative approach if this is for PFS.

And i thought i have this deja vu feeling.

[Chess Pwn]

Deadmanwalking wrote:

Zwordsman wrote:

Mithral specifies it counts as lower level for "Most mithral armors are one category lighter than normal for purposes of movement and other limitations"

Brawling sounds like it should work fine with it. Brawler has a limitation for light armour only, that is a limiation.
obviously not what the mithral was written in mind with (as core) but, it looks like it was written so open ended specifically for all the later effects like this one.

Eh...by that logic, Light Armor Proficiency should work with it, too, since Proficiencies and the need for them are a limitation, too. And yet, that pretty explicitly doesn't work.

If you need Medium Armor Proficiency to wear it without penalty, I don't think you can put 'light armor only' enhancements on it. Elven Chain and Celestial Armor really are light armor in all ways, but a Mithral Breastplate just isn't.

The only reason proficiency doesn't work is that it's listed as an actual exception to the general, "treated as lighter." If it didn't list that exception then you wouldn't need the heavier proficiency. Since there are no other exceptions or rules to govern future exceptions of what doesn't count then everything counts as one lighter. So no armor trait, but yes brawling.