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I've often contemplated trying out a Wizard class. Every time I "do the math", they seem too underpowered when compared to Sorcerers and the new Arcanist class.
The only advantages I see are:
* They gain higher level spells at one class level sooner.
* They can use a Metamagic spell slot without the increase of casting time (but so can an Arcanist). I've also never chose a Metamagic feat because I have so few spell slots and loathe to give a precious higher level one for a Metamagic spell.
* They get an extra spell slot for their school of specialization (but take penalties for opposition school).
I've looked at the archetypes and none seem to be appealing enough to actually create the character.
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The main advantage to the Wizard are in my opinion these things:
- Fast spell progression
- Can prepare whatever he needs for the day(shared by the Arcanist)
- With a feat Opposition research you only have one school of magic that is expensive to cast.
- More spells than the Arcanist per day(when specialized)
The higher level spells is pretty solid. Don't underestimate that.
Metamagic can be very good. If you refuse to use it that's your own lookout.
You're almost always going to know many more spells than a sorcerer. You can prepare more different spells than an arcanist, which can be handy or a trap depending on your smarts (not the characters'.)
There are some very nice arcane discoveries. No other class can get these.
You should seldom need to prepare spells from all eight schools of magic if there is any sort of focus to your character anyway.
Really, the wizard is noticeably more powerful than a sorcerer and about on a par with an arcanist.
They also get school powers, which range from awesome to meh.
The Scryer school makes you eligible for Early Entry Eldritch Knight, but that's only of interest if you want to go down that route.
Ultimately it's a matter of playstyle; if you like to be able to spam your spells play a soreror. If you like to have the one spell that every situation demands, play a Wizard; if you like a bit of both play an Arcanist.
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I forgot to add, this would be for PFS play so Item Creation is a non-starter. But, the other things you guys are noting make sense.
I really got to restart thinking about a good Wizard build. One possibility I've been mulling over is an Illusionist. You don't see that much in PFS play and I wonder if I can come up with one that could really help turn the tide in various scenarios.
Don't underestimate the bonus feats (and arcane discoveries.) Extra metamagic is very awesome.
I forgot to add, this would be for PFS play so Item Creation is a non-starter. But, the other things you guys are noting make sense.
I really got to restart thinking about a good Wizard build. One possibility I've been mulling over is an Illusionist. You don't see that much in PFS play and I wonder if I can come up with one that could really help turn the tide in various scenarios.
I don't know if it's PFS legal but the Arcane Discovery Resilient illusions can give you some insane save DCs.
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I don't know if it's PFS legal but the Arcane Discovery Resilient illusions can give you some insane save DCs.I forgot to add, this would be for PFS play so Item Creation is a non-starter. But, the other things you guys are noting make sense.
I really got to restart thinking about a good Wizard build. One possibility I've been mulling over is an Illusionist. You don't see that much in PFS play and I wonder if I can come up with one that could really help turn the tide in various scenarios.
WOW...that looks like a cool book (Pathfinder Player Companion: Magical Marketplace) where that feat comes from. And, it looks like it's PFS legal. Yet another book I need to add to my wish list.
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I forgot to add, this would be for PFS play so Item Creation is a non-starter. But, the other things you guys are noting make sense.
Actually, you can enchant an arcane bond item in PFS. It's the only way to get around the no-crafing rule, and it allows you to cast any spell in your spellbook without preparation.
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As someone who played an oracle in a home game where there was also a wizard in the party I can state that having a level more of spells is really good and not having it can make you very jealous and unhappy. Levels 3, 5, 7, 9, and 11 are 5/11ths of your career in PFS, and those are the levels you want to be a prepared caster instead of a spontaneous one.
All three of the classes you mentioned are really powerful, I'm not gonna sit here and tell you that Arcanists or Sorcerers are weak. Wizard is going to reward system mastery and punish a lack of it more than any other class in the game. In PFS Wizards get Spell Focus instead of Scribe Scroll as a bonus feat, and that is a major upgrade. Nonhuman wizards can pull off human wizard shenanigans and human wizards can pull off some crazy stuff.
The messageboards can make the class seem to be really powerful, but they assume a lot of system mastery. They also assume that you will be fine not being great at low level for the payoff of being great at mid and high level. There is more parity in PFS as they retire you around the point where full casters start to pull away from everyone else.
I don't know if it's PFS legal but the Arcane Discovery Resilient illusions can give you some insane save DCs.
An ability that comes online at level 9 is not going to be particularly relevant for PFS.
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There seems to be a theme here about "System Mastery" for a Wizard. I've been playing for about a year and a half and I must admit that I'm not quite the power gamer for figuring out all the ins-and-outs of various classes. Can someone enlighten me as to some powerful ways the Wizard can really "master" a table?
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There seems to be a theme here about "System Mastery" for a Wizard. I've been playing for about a year and a half and I must admit that I'm not quite the power gamer for figuring out all the ins-and-outs of various classes. Can someone enlighten me as to some powerful ways the Wizard can really "master" a table?
Two characters are both specialized in say Illusion. They are given the job to enter an area known to harbor many undead creatures.
The Sorcerer will have to rely on the limited number of spells she got that are not mind-affecting.Where as a Wizard who has invested in just a few more spells than those he gets per level and who has prepared for such a thing can swich out some of those spells for things that might prove usefull in such a situation.
So the mastery part is knowing what spells to prepare. And in particular in PFS being able to rearrange your prepared spells to fit your current party.
To have combo's ready for different situations so that you can tackle just about any situations.
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There seems to be a theme here about "System Mastery" for a Wizard. I've been playing for about a year and a half and I must admit that I'm not quite the power gamer for figuring out all the ins-and-outs of various classes. Can someone enlighten me as to some powerful ways the Wizard can really "master" a table?The sorcerer/wizard spell list can successfully answer basically every challenge the GM is capable of creating without breaking the rules of the game.
Sorcerers have to make do with how much of it they KNOW, which is usually pretty good.
The wizard, however, can learn enough of it that a sufficiently crafty wizard player is nearly unstoppable. Magic contains most of the broken super-combos in the game, and the wizard gets to all that stuff first, but you won't see your average blaster-caster pulling it off. However, you can observe how a wizard can one day be the damage king, hurling fireballs with various nasty tricks attached at frost giants and the like for massive damage (and later on, stun-locking them to death with his Dazing Spells), while other days the wizard can be the master of craftily evading your enemies, scouting ahead with their familiar or divination spells, turning invisible to fly around and make a plan to get the drop on or evade an encounter, and so on. Another day the Wizard is the master debuffer, hurling out spells that render the enemy pathetically unprepared to withstand the rest of the party's attacks and changing the battlefield for maximum advantages. And let's not get into what kinda stuff a wizard pulls off when his thoughts turn to summoning and binding...
A spontaneous caster can generally master one of those roles, but a canny wizard can master them all. The Arcanist can do similarly, although it does so slower and with fewer spell slots to work with.
I agree that sounds pretty damaging/powerful (and only if you really know what/how to prepare that stuff). However, in the case of PFS play (which is most what I do) it sounds like it might be difficult for a Wizard to quickly re-prepare to just the right spells as a scenario gets underway.
It really depends on the DM.
Although the number of times, that i have joined a group, and started out butt naked, without a spell book, has been often enough, that my First question is ? Do you allow level dips into Monk :-)
The main advantage, is no spell book to protect. No other class is teathered to an Item, like a Wizard. And one good failed save on a fireball, or a teleport into a acid lake. And (( Depending on DM )), you might be kissing that spell book goodbye.
The Cost to build a back up spell book / Rebuild a lost or destroyed spell book, and keeping your spell book save from Theft. (( every Rogue trying to make a buck, and every other wizard looking for new spell, is after it )).
Why i prefer Sorcerer..... with all the money you save buy not having a spell book... you can buy other magic items.
* They gain higher level spells at one class level sooner.
Yep, got it in one! Wait, was there more that needed to be examined? Of the strongest, most diverse and most interesting class feature in the game, "Spells," the wizard gets better (or even just cooler) ones the fastest.
I'm sold.
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I find that the theory-crafting loses part of its luster particularly with PFS as you often cannot just stop and divine your way into a perfect spell selection. These things are timed and there are often consequences for stalling.
Furthermore, some poster's ideas of battle field control (i.e. God-mode) can really slow play down quite a bit, so take that into account.
I have also seen in my area that wizard's do not, in PFS, change their spell selection as much as you would think.
I always encourage people to play what they like, and that is what I would say to you.
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I find that the theory-crafting loses part of its luster particularly with PFS as you often cannot just stop and divine your way into a perfect spell selection. These things are timed and there are often consequences for stalling.
Furthermore, some poster's ideas of battle field control (i.e. God-mode) can really slow play down quite a bit, so take that into account.
I have also seen in my area that wizard's do not, in PFS, change their spell selection as much as you would think.
I always encourage people to play what they like, and that is what I would say to you.
Any wizard can leave a spell slot empty and fill it in 15 minutes, or one minute with fast study. This is more than enough time to prepare a spell tailored to the situation.
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However, in the case of PFS play (which is most what I do) it sounds like it might be difficult for a Wizard to quickly re-prepare to just the right spells as a scenario gets underway.
There's huge variation between scenarios, although the it's rarely even mentioned as a thing.
Some scenarios you show up the table and are immediately in the thick of things, on a timer, with no time to prepare. Spontaneous casters do well in this case. I played one game where we heard 'Roll for Initiative' less than 30 seconds from start time. E.g. you learn you will be facing Undead, but there's a timer running so you can't prepare different spells and the Wizard who does Illusions & Enchantment is stuck with the wrong prepared spells. In this case those players with the system mastery to leave Open Spell Slots do well, because there's always time for a 15 minute break.
Other scenarios you have days or weeks before the first encounter, with lots of time to change it up. Some even give you a chance to divine what's ahead. Prepared casters have the edge here. For example, one session I played level 7 iconic Kyra and prepared lots of Summon Monster spells, which are not on her default list at all. This changed Kyra from a medico to a battlefield controller, just by swapping out spells.