Are there rules anywhere for converting NPCs?


Rules Questions


As the subject says, are there rules, spells, etc for an NPC to convert another NPC from one alignment and faith to another alignment and faith?

(I'm aware of a helm of opposite alignment, but that's not what I'm after.)


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Why you would need/want "rules"?, this fall under pure roleplay.

Grand Lodge

NPC converting an NPC? Why yes, it is called GM Fiat. Basically, if you/the story need an NPC to act against his normal alignment or change their religion, they do. Whether they keep with the new alignment or deity is again a matter of story.

If you need actual numbers, I would suggest Diplomacy vs wisdom check(modified heavily by you, ie +3 per alignment step: LG->CE is a +12)


Nicos wrote:
Why you would need/want "rules"?, this fall under pure roleplay.

Seconded.

The Exchange

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I'm not aware of one. Personally, I use unassisted 'rule of drama' like Nicos and Zhayne. But here's a rough idea you can develop if your table needs a system.

The GM can assign the potential convert Devotion Points (faith) and Principle Points (alignment) - or whatever naming system works for you. They'd work a bit like hit points: the missionary has to degrade the target's store of Devotion and Principle before conversion is possible. I'd probably suggest allowing one Diplomacy check per day (either against a Hard DC or made as an opposed roll vs. the subject's Knowledge (religion)) to take away 1-2 points at a time... while actually demonstrating the benefits of the faith/alignment would be worth more than words. The potential convert can regain Devotion or Principle if subjected to contrary opinions or witness to contradictions or failures of your philosophy. That's why cults build compounds.

Obviously, some subjects would have more Devotion and Principle than others. Practically all religiously inclined paladins, the most devoted priests, and other extremely pious characters could have the max of, oh, say 100 Devotion pts, and you have to whittle them all down while trying to avoid having anything counteract your efforts. Ordinary 'holy days only' followers might only have 20 or 30 points. Reaching 0 would produce an apathetic theist with no real beliefs: at that point you need to add Devotion before they've really converted. (An anti-theist should not be assumed to have 0 Devotion: they still have Devotion, just not to a god.)

Principle would work similarly, except that some beings would have "-" in Principle just as some have "-" in Constitution. Animals, mindless creatures, aligned outsiders and undead are 'stuck' and shall not be swayed. Note that while 0 Principle points would probably mean a temporary alignment of True Neutral, folks who are True Neutral could have as much or as little Principle as anybody else.

If you break down one but not the other, you've got an apostate (old faith, new alignment) who isn't on your side yet but won't be accepted by prior allies - or a hypocrite (new faith, old alignment) who pays lip service to your faith without actually understanding the moral viewpoint required. Obviously neither is desirable... except to the GM, who will love it.


Pathfinder Lost Omens Subscriber

the only thing i can feel like this kind of rule supports is the kind of thing i love doing in warhammer 40k, and that is corrupting everybody. why do you need NPCs specifically?

in warhammer you have social combat, which uses willpower for health, charisma or something for attack. i haven't played it for a while, but after you win the battle instead of the opponent being unconscious on the ground, he'll be emotionally distant, but easily suggestible. having found just the right words to make him angry but not push over into actual combat, or saddened/brooding due to some words that destroyed his ego.


Check out the free Wrath of the Righteous Player's Guide. It has rules for redeeming from evil to good.

Nothing for falling or converting religions though.

Grand Lodge

ericthecleric wrote:

As the subject says, are there rules, spells, etc for an NPC to convert another NPC from one alignment and faith to another alignment and faith?

(I'm aware of a helm of opposite alignment, but that's not what I'm after.)

Download the free campaign guide to Wrath of the Righteous. That should give you some starting material.


Thanks for the replies!

Silver Crusade RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16

Champions of Purity has an entire section, starting on page 18, on redemption and has rules for such.

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