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I have a few wonderments I was hoping people might have input on. I looked about for answers but either it wasn't there or it was buried under pages and pages of content.
1. Druid using wild shape with a higher than +5 BAB. Does the character get iterate attacks when wild shaped? In particular if in dire lion form would the character get bite bite claw claw or is the character restricted. Also if the shape is a dire wolf with only a bite attack can that character get iterate bites?
2. page 73 of the mythic handbook has a monk deflecting arrows into targets. The mythic snatch arrows only lets me catch a ranged weapon and use it as a melee weapon. Is there a way to make this image an in game option or does anyone have an idea on how to do something similar. Lastly do you think this feat does match the image using the arrows as a melee improvised weapon.
3. If my wild shape gives a free with attack affect (trip,grab,etc) is that usable if I hit with an attack of opportunity.
4. what are dc's for wild shape abilities based on? casting stat or physical stat? (poison, whirlwind, vortex etc) I found evidence that suggested that its casting stat but its not clear.
5. last question can you up size an animal with wild shape or can you only use animals of the right category? Can I take my dire wolf to huge or am I at best stuck with large dire wolf with powerful shape at best?
I appreciate the time guys,
Kechara
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1. Druid using wild shape with a higher than +5 BAB. Does the character get iterate attacks when wild shaped? In particular if in dire lion form would the character get bite bite claw claw or is the character restricted. Also if the shape is a dire wolf with only a bite attack can that character get iterate bites?
No iterative attacks, you use the rules for natural attacks. If you take the form of something that uses weapons, then you can get iterative attacks with the weapon (e.g. a Dire Ape wielding a greatsword).
2. page 73 of the mythic handbook has a monk deflecting arrows into targets. The mythic snatch arrows only lets me catch a ranged weapon and use it as a melee weapon. Is there a way to make this image an in game option or does anyone have an idea on how to do something similar. Lastly do you think this feat does match the image using the arrows as a melee improvised weapon.
Don't know. Mythic is beyond my pay grade.
3. If my wild shape gives a free with attack affect (trip,grab,etc) is that usable if I hit with an attack of opportunity.
Same rules for natural attacks. If a Wolf gets a trip with it's bite, you do too.
4. what are dc's for wild shape abilities based on? casting stat or physical stat? (poison, whirlwind, vortex etc) I found evidence that suggested that its casting stat but its not clear.
Not sure. With polymorph "SPELLS" the DC is equal to your DC with the polymorph spell. With Wildshape, I didn't see anything. Should check the FAQ.
5. last question can you up size an animal with wild shape or can you only use animals of the right category? Can I take my dire wolf to huge or am I at best stuck with large dire wolf with powerful shape at best?
No, you must select a standard animal and are stuck with its size (RAW). Some GMs will allow you to fill in gaps for thematic reasons (houserule time). For example, if you're playing a Boar Shaman, there are no Boars at certain sizes, but I've seen GMs fill in the gaps using the Giant Template, so that the PC has various sized Boars at every size.
1. Druid using wild shape with a higher than +5 BAB. Does the character get iterate attacks when wild shaped? In particular if in dire lion form would the character get bite bite claw claw or is the character restricted. Also if the shape is a dire wolf with only a bite attack can that character get iterate bites?
No iterative attacks, you use the rules for natural attacks. If you take the form of something that uses weapons, then you can get iterative attacks with the weapon (e.g. a Dire Ape wielding a greatsword).
1ouch that really seems to water down some animal forms once you start getting iterate attacks. I may see if my GM will house rule this for forms without multi attack.
2 looking at it again I think the image indicates that the character is using the arrows as improvised weapons and it just looks like he is throwing them since they break on use.
3 that makes up for the natural attack hampering iterate attacks a little but not a ton.
4I'll check the faq but I think this falls into the category of easy to get the gm to see reason and let it be off physical stats. Especially the elemental ones that are str based.
5hmmm that seems to be a good suggestion I also just got a hold of powerful shape and that seems to help out. I think there is a mythic version of the feat that allows use of the giant template. If not the Gm may allow it since I am not making full use of my size capabilties.
thanks captain zoom
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Folow-Up:
There is an FAQ for the APG that specifically deals with the lack of certain size animals for the Eagle Shaman. RAW it doesn't apply to the other Animal Shamans, but they have a similar problem. I think a good GM would take the FAQ to heart and do something similar for other Animal Shaman types.
Folow-Up:
There is an FAQ for the APG that specifically deals with the lack of certain size animals for the Eagle Shaman. RAW it doesn't apply to the other Animal Shamans, but they have a similar problem. I think a good GM would take the FAQ to heart and do something similar for other Animal Shaman types.
I looked at that and I think that can be brought into play.
I may have also found a solution to my iterate attack issue. I think I will be investing in vital strike at my earliest conveniece. I will have to talk to my GM first since my wolf wild shape form currently does 3d6 +8 so vital strike would put that at a VERY scary 6d6 +8 and that is before trying to talk him into the huge template idea which if it was allowed would take it to 4d6 +10 with vital strike getting up to 8d6 +10
holy bananas 8d6 at level 9 is crazy
As an addendum. If the shape in question only has 1 natural attack, it does indeed benefit from iteratives.
Do you have a site that shows this? I know my GM will want to see either way.
Thanks
Kenji
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As an addendum. If the shape in question only has 1 natural attack, it does indeed benefit from iteratives.
Per the PRD: "Natural Attacks: Attacks made with natural weapons, such as claws and bites, are melee attacks that can be made against any creature within your reach (usually 5 feet). These attacks are made using your full attack bonus and deal an amount of damage that depends on their type (plus your Strength modifier, as normal). You do not receive additional natural attacks for a high base attack bonus. Instead, you receive additional attack rolls for multiple limb and body parts capable of making the attack (as noted by the race or ability that grants the attacks). If you possess only one natural attack (such as a bite—two claw attacks do not qualify), you add 1–1/2 times your Strength bonus on damage rolls made with that attack."
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As an addendum. If the shape in question only has 1 natural attack, it does indeed benefit from iteratives.
That is incorrect. As Captain Zoom quoted, you never receive additional attacks due to BAB when using natural attacks.
If you only have 1 natural attack (not just taking only 1 natural attack, but possessing only 1 like a wolf with a bite) then you get 1.5 strength to damage. That is the only benefit single natural attacks get.
I have a question I'd Like to add to this.
As stated above, Creatures with only 1 Natural attack do not obtain additional attacks from high BAB.
I have a Animal Companion/Special Mount DIRE WOLF
Now for the ??
Since DIRE WOLVES only have the 1 Bite attack can they obtain more Natural Attacks by way of using feats like Weapon Proficiency(Natural Weapon: Claws)? Thus Allowing them to gain access to the Multiattack feat in the Monster Manual and progress up from there?
Due to my mount acquiring Additional HD from Special Mount and Animal Companion this would create an opportunity for my Dire Wolf to grow into a more fearsome predator. Rather than a Big Fluffy with 1 Bite.
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Nope, just like taking proficiency in great axe does not let my dwarf grow one.
What about feats like Improved Critical?? Will these work for a natural weapon?? Taking a Bite with a natural 20 x2 crit to a 19-20 x2 crit
Are there ways (ie feats, items or spells) to increase the Crit multipler (ie x2 to a x3 or x4)??
In my case I am doing the paladin/beastmaster Uber mount type build.
My Special Mount/Animal Companion will be a Dire Wolf and if I added it up wright (not going for the insane type uber) I should be able to have a Special Mount when I'm at Character Level 7 that will be a level 9 paly mount and a level 3 (9-6 for Dire Wolf) Animal Companion.
The base HD is 6d8(+6 X Con Mod) + 2 HD for AC + 4 HD for Paly = 12 HD
since base Dire Wolf is 6 HD I am adding 6 HD. My question here is can I use these xtra HD as Character Levels? Like 6HD Dire Wolf + 6 levels Rogue???
Folow-Up:
There is an FAQ for the APG that specifically deals with the lack of certain size animals for the Eagle Shaman. RAW it doesn't apply to the other Animal Shamans, but they have a similar problem. I think a good GM would take the FAQ to heart and do something similar for other Animal Shaman types.
I looked at that and I think that can be brought into play.
I may have also found a solution to my iterate attack issue. I think I will be investing in vital strike at my earliest conveniece. I will have to talk to my GM first since my wolf wild shape form currently does 3d6 +8 so vital strike would put that at a VERY scary 6d6 +8 and that is before trying to talk him into the huge template idea which if it was allowed would take it to 4d6 +10 with vital strike getting up to 8d6 +10
holy bananas 8d6 at level 9 is crazy
If you think that is crazy you should check my build that does 27d6 at level 6 :p. Avg damage at lvl 8 is 262 damage a round
Is there a feat that grants sneak attack??
What book is vital strike in??
I think here is a teamwork feat that either grants sneak attack or 1d6 of damage when you are flanking.
Vital Strike is in the Core Rule Book.
I think here is a teamwork feat that either grants sneak attack or 1d6 of damage when you are flanking.
As an addendum. If the shape in question only has 1 natural attack, it does indeed benefit from iteratives.That is incorrect. As Captain Zoom quoted, you never receive additional attacks due to BAB when using natural attacks.
If you only have 1 natural attack (not just taking only 1 natural attack, but possessing only 1 like a wolf with a bite) then you get 1.5 strength to damage. That is the only benefit single natural attacks get.
I have a feeling he's thinking of an animal companion's Multiattack ability. "If it does not have the requisite three or more natural attacks, the animal companion instead gains a second attack with one of its natural weapons, albeit at a –5 penalty." It's one of the few ways to attack with a natural weapon more than once in a round. This, of course, doesn't help a shapechanged druid and it isn't directly based on BAB [though you do gain it when the companion gains +6 BAB].
Im not a shapechanger this is for my Paly special mount thats also an animal companion.
Captain Zoom is Correct, My Dire Wolf is a Dire Wolf not a Shapechanger so thats a moot point to me. But the fact i get multiattack as an Animal companion of 15-17 druid level(15-6=9 for Dire Wolf)
Multiattack (Combat)
This creature is particularly skilled at making attacks
with its natural weapons.
Prerequisite: Three or more natural attacks.
Benefit: The creature’s secondary attacks with natural
weapons take only a –2 penalty.
Normal: Without this feat, the creature’s secondary
attacks with natural weapons take a –5 penalty.
As stated before the Dire Wolf ONLY HAS 1 Natural Attack. Under Multiattack you must have 3 or more natural attacks. (ie Bite and 2 claws or bite, claw, tail)
Multiattack cannot be taken as a Dire Wolf
Once my Dire Wolf has reached the Prereq's for the Animal Companion to gain the Multiattack feat then I will be okay.
Multiattack: An animal companion gains Multiattack as a bonus feat if it has three or more natural attacks (see the Monster Manual for details on this feat) and does not already have that feat. If it does not have the requisite three or more natural attacks, the animal companion instead gains a second attack with its primary natural weapon, albeit at a –5 penalty.
by the time my character is level 8 my build should look like this
Human Race
Paladin 5
Human Paragon 1
Beastmaster 1
Prestige Ranger 1
Feats:
Flaw 1 - Track
Flaw 2 - Endurance
Human - 2 Weapon Fighting
1st - Skill Focus (Handle Animal)
3rd - Mounted Comabat
6th - Devoted Tracker
Now on to the Dire Wolf.
Base HD is 6d8
I want to make sure I have calculated the totals correct.
for Special Mount I count Paladin(5) + Beastmaster(1+3=4) + Prestige Ranger (1) = 10 then check chart
For Animal Companion I count Beastmaster (1+3=4) + Paladin (5) + Prestige Ranger (1) = 10 then check chart
Is this it or did I miss the calculations?
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On a more serious note, I'm having trouble figuring out what you're trying to do...
First, how do you get a Dire Wolf as a bonded mount? Dire Wolves are not on the list of animal companions. The Monstrous Mount feat lets you take a Worg, but doesn't list Dire Wolf. I don't see any feats on your list that might allow for a Dire Wolf. If you're going with a Dire Wolf under the "more exotic" mount option, it's still limited to the animal companion list, you can't just pick whatever powerful beastie you want.
Second, How does your level 8 character get a level 10 animal companion/mount? I calculate your AC/Mount's level as:
+5 for L5 Paladin
+0 for L1 Beastmaster (Beastmasters don't get an AC until Level 4, and then it's only a Level - 3, or put another way, a L1 AC)
+? for L1 "Human Paragon"
+? for L1 "Prestige Ranger"
I'm not familiar with the "Human Paragon" class. Are you referring to the 3rd party/Fan "Human Paragon" class on the Hypertext d20 SRD web-site? Or something else?
Likewise, I don't know what a "Prestige Ranger" is.
Subject to clarification on the Human Paragon and the Prestige Ranger, I only see a L5 Paladin Mount/AC, which can't be a Dire Wolf.
Hope this helps, if you can point me to those classes I never heard of, I can look them over and let you know if your calculation is correct.
I'm not familiar with the "Human Paragon" class. Are you referring to the 3rd party/Fan "Human Paragon" class on the Hypertext d20 SRD web-site? Or something else?Likewise, I don't know what a "Prestige Ranger" is.
Subject to clarification on the Human Paragon and the Prestige Ranger, I only see a L5 Paladin Mount/AC, which can't be a Dire Wolf.
It isn't 3rdparty. Well I guess it is, as it was written by WotC for D&D and not Pathfinder. Both the human paragon and prestige ranger are official D&D material, appearing in Unearthed Arcana.
Though being Open Content, someone could have made a Pathfinder conversion.
+0 for L1 Beastmaster (Beastmasters don't get an AC until Level 4, and then it's only a Level - 3, or put another way, a L1 AC)
There is a 3rd party beastmaster class. It grants an animal companion equal to your beastmaster level.
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I'm not familiar with the "Human Paragon" class. Are you referring to the 3rd party/Fan "Human Paragon" class on the Hypertext d20 SRD web-site? Or something else?Likewise, I don't know what a "Prestige Ranger" is.
Subject to clarification on the Human Paragon and the Prestige Ranger, I only see a L5 Paladin Mount/AC, which can't be a Dire Wolf.
It isn't 3rdparty. Well I guess it is, as it was written by WotC for D&D and not Pathfinder. Both the human paragon and prestige ranger are official D&D material, appearing in Unearthed Arcana.
Though being Open Content, someone could have made a Pathfinder conversion.
So, NOT Pathfinder.
This is the Pathfinder Rules forum. He should probably ask his question in the "Suggestions/House Rules/Homebrew" forum.
I'm basing this all off of 3-3.5 DND
Your animal companion can be your special mount as per Beastmaster. Beastmaster is level +3 stacks with all other classes that give AC/Mount.
I'm basing this all off of 3-3.5 DND
Your animal companion can be your special mount as per Beastmaster. Beastmaster is level +3 stacks with all other classes that give AC/Mount.
You are in the wrong place for that. The Rules Questions forum is for official Paizo products, not D&D. You want the D&D forum. At best, if trying to combine 3.X and Pathfinder, you could try the Suggestions/House Rules/Homebrew forum as Captain Zoom said.
If nothing else, you need to say where the material you are using comes from. There is a number of Beastmaster classes, and none of them I found have that +3 added to your level for an animal companion. (Edit: There we go. Complete Adventurer.)
I did a search for what I was needing an answer to. This thread pulled up. Most of my questions were answered. Except the last one. But now to go through all again. Thank you for pointing me in the right direction jeraa.
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