Goblin Squad Member
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I cannot claim that I read all posts, responses and counter-responses on these forums but it seems to me that the majority of this community feels negative about pvp.
I certainly understand the view of people wishing to travel safely through the River Kingdoms, explore or trade, build settlements and live in peace free of any fighting. This dream could only happen on a pve server and we know this is not possible. PHO will offer a variety of tools to help with that dream but without strong support from the armies (pvp players) your area will be overtaken by others. Forum declarations will always lose to reality in game.
Territorial control is the main attraction of this game for larger crowds. Ability to form alliances, pacts, coalitions to enforce your law, taxes, control resources - this is what drives the community in EVE Online. Believe or not it will also drive the community here.
We all want PHO to succeed but without thousands, tens of thousands more backers this game will in the long run die because of financial problems. When costs are greater than income you fire staff members to lower your costs, slowing work and implementation of new futures and it's a downward spiral from there.
PHOs current support has been drawn mostly from Pathfinder fans, D&D 3.5 Edition ruleset etc. From the numbers on Landrush you all can see it's not enough. We need to extend our hand and show through the Alpha/Beta phase that Pathfinder online is a fun and dynamic game and not a clone of WURM pve server.
This is not the only game currently under development which will offer similar futures, RvR Camelot Unchained comes to mind, with similar Alpha and approx. release dates. Some might argue that PHO is a completely different type of game, but I believe on the current gaming market with so many new sandbox/themepark games incoming in 2015 we need all the help we can get...
So my fellow PHO backers, embrace the possibility of daily pvp, fighting for control of the towers and skirmishes with your neighbors - get ready for it because wanted or not, pvp is the major part of Pathfinder Online.
Augir
Mystical Awakening
DEYS/KDS guild
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Goblin Squad Member
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... it seems to me that the majority of this community feels negative about pvp.
Really? The "majority of the community"? I would think most of us already have embraced the PvP. Sure, there will be a lot of folks who are concerned about rampant random killing ruining their fun - it looks to me like Ryan has been pretty consistent in trying to attract those people to PFO, and in trying to convince them his plans for constraining that random killing are going to be effective.
A type?
You sure about that Nihimon? I can point you to a certain Accord that wants to try and avoid PvP
Actually, our main focus is on making sure to play mammoth riders and join a mammoth-centric Company when mammoths are inevitably released. We actually have very little focus on PvP or the lack thereof. I don't know why you would think we would.
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Goblin Squad Member
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You sure about that Nihimon? I can point you to a certain Accord that wants to try and avoid PvPI don't think you can. I think they just want to have a firm grip on the "Meaningful PvP" part, and maybe do their best to ensure that meaningful is a meaningful term.
So... Technically their meaningful PvP is going to be "enforced" to their rules? Just making sure I understand you correctly because what I find meaningful PvP might be different from others.
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Goblin Squad Member
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"Meaningful PVP" is going to be defined primarily by Goblinworks, and they'll be modifying their rules, controls, and interventions until "meaningful" means what they want it to mean. It's such a central focus of their game design that I've little doubt we'll be offered no input into the definition of that term until it's pretty well locked down.
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Goblin Squad Member
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So... Technically their meaningful PvP is going to be "enforced" to their rules?
Yep. I'm the sole arbiter of what qualifies as "meaningful PvP" and "positive gameplay". I have unconstrained authority to impose any punishment on any signatory who deviates from my ideals. And by signing the Roseblood Accord, all parties have irrevocably agreed to subjugate themselves to my whims. There's no escape clause - all their Settlement are belong to me.
That's really the only way we can "enforce" anything, so that has to be how it's set up, right? Since we've made it so clear it's a binding contract with enforceable terms...
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Goblin Squad Member
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Glad I didn't sign anything... just pointing it out since it will mean I will now have a bullseye painted on my back...Nah, the RBA is a positive gameplay agreement, not an alliance capable of seeking out painted targets.
Unless a group gives most of the server a reason too, and there are a couple groups out there that will.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Unless a group gives most of the server a reason too, and there are a couple groups out there that will.Glad I didn't sign anything... just pointing it out since it will mean I will now have a bullseye painted on my back...Nah, the RBA is a positive gameplay agreement, not an alliance capable of seeking out painted targets.
What groups are you referring to?
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Goblin Squad Member
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They don't have any more power to enforce the accord than other people do to violate it. As far as I can see, the accord is about people agreeing to police themselves, and to various extents, to back each other up in that, not any attempt to impose it on others. Of course, their settlements will have a certain amount of authority to set laws, but that is still an unknown.
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Goblin Squad Member
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Be recorded for quality assurance purposes... The truth shall set you free...
That's all the snappy catchphrases I can muster while multi-tasking. =)
From my alma mater, there is a second clause to that phrase. The full statement is:
The truth shall set you free, but you must PAY for it.
The issue is that if you don't want to pvp, you shouldn't have to. You should still have danger and likely avoid running in the middle of a battle field, but you should be able to do other things. It shouldn't be like OK GET ON YOUR PVP CHARS.
The issue is balance. If the game is gonna be about control, then it will be controlled. I was hoping due to the fact that it was named Pathfinder Online that it would allow for some immersion and societal roles.
I mean, ideally, the best settlement would have great non-combat players and great combat players. To the point that 20 pvpers in a settlement would lose to 10 pvpers and 10 non-combat focused players (just a random number example.) Someone has to make the weapons, etc... if the strong get all of the resources, then the game is going to be just like every other sandbox which... why would you be excited?
That's what I feel people are missing. If you can't go into a game and say I'll never PVP and make a difference... even to the point of being more important or as important as a good pvp character then it's not realistic.
For me, sure, I'd pvp, but I am also interested in non combat things. I'm just saying from the 'other side.' I don't think anyone is against the existence of pvp, but some probably don't want to be sucked into it when they are trying to do other things. Anything non-pvp is not pve, by the way. Crafting would be pvp if you were putting out better weapons for you guys.
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Goblin Squad Member
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PHO :)
yes, I shouldn't write this post before my first cup of coffee...
Anyway if I may quote from previous response - what qualifies as "meaningful PvP" and "positive gameplay"? Community here like everywhere else is divided on answer to this question. Large majority of current backers will aim toward making pvp meaningful as possible. Yes there will be raids on your settlement, caravans or attacks on single miner or hunter-gatherer - it's a part of the game and not griefing. Like Nihimon mentioned earlier there will be mechanics in game to prevent that. Reason behind those activities will be most likely loot and not something malicious.
I run out of time, Elder Scrolls are calling :) I will check this thread later.