hey all, i just leveled up in the ROTRL campagin ( now level 7) and am an assortment of classes ( each level basically a different class) and i went down the bodyguard feat tree. now, with the way my party is set up ( tank, rogue, healer, ranger, and mage) i want to be right next to the person i want so i can aid another them to make sure either the attack misses them or i get hit instead. but because of this, our rogue cannot get her Sneak attack off, but while browsing through the classes, i saw the summoners eidolon.
now, the way i see it, the eidolon, to me, is just a way around for me to be in 2 places at once, so the rouge can flank, and i can tank. now, because its gonna be a single level dip, i need to optimise this eidolon to be the best darn hardest thing to hit, which, i would love to hear some suggestions from you.
what i have so far is:
a small eidolon, -4 str -2 con +2 dex +1 size ac
aquatic: Str 12, Dex 16, Con 13, Int 7, Wis 10, Cha 11
evolutions:
Improved natural armor
Ability score increase (dex+2)
Feat:
leaning towards dodge but willing to take antagonize
here is how its gonna work flank, full defense or fight defensively, and that's it. if he does get hit, life link ability kicks in and i take the damage, so the -2 con from small size wont affect me at all since it will only have a max of 10 hp anyways.
so 20, 24 with mage armor, 28 from shield, 30 from fighting defensivly
10(dex+5 size+1 Nat Armor +4 mage armor+4 shield+4)
his damage is gonna be crap though, 1d3-1 but meh, worth it to help the rouge get off her +426 sneak attack.
anything you want to add in? or another class i should level in instead of this to help it out?
7 levels and 7 different classes did I read that correctly?
Pan wrote: 7 levels and 7 different classes did I read that correctly? paladinx2 levels (for charisma to saves), gunslinger, (warpriest, bloodrager, slayer) from the advanced class guide *gm ok* and now leveling into summoner for the flanking
I predict the thread will not stay on topic for long. We once had a 3E player with 4 classes for a 7th level character. He suffered from being almost useless. But I'm helping to fulfill my first prediction.
I believe you cannot threaten when you go full defensive, and as such, can't provide a flanking circumstance, but I could be wrong.
I'm guessing you want small aquatic for DEX and armor class, but I think you'd be better off with a medium serpentine in the long run. But perhaps you'll want to look at an archetype, like master summoner or broodmaster instead since you're summon monster ability will be just as useful, if not more so, when you only have 1 level of summoner.
If you haven't dumped CHA, you could also use the summon monster SLA once the eidolon gets (inevitably) killed for the day. Summoner works fairly well for a dip like this since the SLA's summoned creatures last for minutes/level, so your meatbags could theoretically last the whole fight (ha...no). With just a CHA of 10, that means you can help the rogue out like this 3 more times per day.
And since you have paladin levels, I'll assume you have a positive CHA modifier, so that might well be 5 times per day. Heck, the eidolon is more of an accessory at that point.
lemeres wrote: If you haven't dumped CHA, you could also use the summon monster SLA once the eidolon gets (inevitably) killed for the day. Summoner works fairly well for a dip like this since the SLA's summoned creatures last for minutes/level, so your meatbags could theoretically last the whole fight (ha...no). With just a CHA of 10, that means you can help the rogue out like this 3 more times per day.
And since you have paladin levels, I'll assume you have a positive CHA modifier, so that might well be 5 times per day. Heck, the eidolon is more of an accessory at that point.
summoning monsters is a spell like ability and a FAQ states that spell likes coming from an arcane class, counts as an arcane spell, so they have the arcane chance failure ( 85% for me, full plate and tower shield)
i was thinking druid but as soon as i do, i lose everything from it because, of metal armor. this is probably going to be the only arcane class i dip into, so it might be good if we get caught offguard when camping. and dont have my armor on.
but in no way is this charachter optimised, fun as heck and tons of options to chose from, but not optimised. a.k.a, the meat shield.
The rogue can SA without flanking, but he might have to rebuild the character.
mimimi wrote: summoning monsters is a spell like ability and a FAQ states that spell likes coming from an arcane class, counts as an arcane spell, so they have the arcane chance failure ( 85% for me, full plate and tower shield) Yeah, arcane spell failure would be a problem...if SLAs had somatic components. Or really any components at all.
Core Rule Book wrote: Spell-Like Abilities (Sp)
Usually, a spell-like ability works just like the spell of that name. A spell-like ability has no verbal, somatic, or material component, nor does it require a focus. The user activates it mentally. Armor never affects a spell-like ability's use, even if the ability resembles an arcane spell with a somatic component.
So unless there is a specific FAQ that counters this (and I would love the link if there is), then you are fine. Send hundreds of hawks to their death as they serve as decoys to distract enemies while the rogue stabs them in the kidneys.
wraithstrike wrote: The rogue can SA without flanking, but he might have to rebuild the character. through feinting, yea but she is a tengu, and with a 2 handed ninja weapon ( i forget which one) she can 2claw 2 attack bite, each one, if they hit, deals +4d6
lemeres wrote: mimimi wrote: summoning monsters is a spell like ability and a FAQ states that spell likes coming from an arcane class, counts as an arcane spell, so they have the arcane chance failure ( 85% for me, full plate and tower shield) Yeah, arcane spell failure would be a problem...if SLAs had somatic components. Or really any components at all.
Core Rule Book wrote: Spell-Like Abilities (Sp)
Usually, a spell-like ability works just like the spell of that name. A spell-like ability has no verbal, somatic, or material component, nor does it require a focus. The user activates it mentally. Armor never affects a spell-like ability's use, even if the ability resembles an arcane spell with a somatic component.
So unless there is a specific FAQ that counters this (and I would love the link if there is), then you are fine. Send hundreds of hawks to their death as they serve as decoys to distract enemies while the rogue stabs them in the kidneys. my bad, i was thinking of this one. good catch too.
FAQ wrote: The same rule should apply for all creatures with spell-like abilities, including PC races: the creature's spell-like abilities are presumed to be the sorcerer/wizard versions. If the spell in question is not a sorcerer/wizard spell, then default to cleric, druid, bard, paladin, and ranger, in that order. Use the spell type (arcane or divine) of that class to determine whether the spell-like ability is arcane or divine.
Understandable mistake. Admittedly, the difference between arcane and divine is rather small for SLAs, so it would be natural to think it is only brought up due to the much more common problem of arcane spell failure.
Besides qualifying for things that need a specific kind of spell casting (I admit, I do like using this to get arcane strike on melee builds), the only other time I can think it might come up is because a creature has defense against one or the other. Essentially, it is the thing of theorycraft and fine print in bestiary entries.
Are you familiar with druid armor? There are 2 if you wanna go heavy armor route. Stoneplate (+9 AC, +1 Dex, -7 armor check) and lamellar stone(+8 AC, +0 Dex, -7 armor check) or for medium you can go lamellar horn (+5 AC, +3 Dex, -4 armor check). Then you can still cast summon nature's ally
zauriel56 wrote: Are you familiar with druid armor? There are 2 if you wanna go heavy armor route. Stoneplate (+9 AC, +1 Dex, -7 armor check) and lamellar stone(+8 AC, +0 Dex, -7 armor check) or for medium you can go lamellar horn (+5 AC, +3 Dex, -4 armor check). Then you can still cast summon nature's ally i am, but right now, we are in the middle of nowhere, and dont have the time to go all the way back to magnimar.
THe rogue can have the nature ally feat for an animal companion so he can use her own class features to deliever sneak attack. There is no need to hurt more your build.
Nicos wrote: THe rogue can have the nature ally feat for an animal companion so he can use her own class features to deliever sneak attack. There is no need to hurt more your build. dont understand why you all are saying that multiclassing like this is hurting it, i literally have an answer for everything...
Compare a 7th lvl Warpriest or a 7th lvl summoner to your character and you will see why reckless multiclassing is bad.
That being said, you multiclass martial classes and not spellcasters which hurt most. Still, unless you have a specific build in mind (which you don't) losing at the higher lvl features of your class is going to inevitabely make you weaker.
You are the tank, correct?
I would use the bodyguard feats to protect and stand next to ranged attackers. The rogue can get on the other side of the monster from you. Rogues should have more survivability than ranged so she should be fine.
Of course the ranged may not want to be that close to the action, which is usually the problem. I think this is the main failing of the bodyguard feats.
It also depends if the GM lets players control summoned creatures or not. The whole strategy would fail if the GM decides the summoned creature doesn't want to offtank but instead will "help" by attacking whatever is closest.
Maybe continue down gunslinger, and you and the rogue take teamwork feats. Or Pally and get more goodies.
Not sure if it's been mentioned, but taking so many level is so many classes is extremely not conducive to having an effective character. Taking a level or even two, of summoner for an eidolon is a terrible idea. The creaure only grows (gains more evolution points) if you take more levels in the class. In order for it to maintain its ability to be a credible combat threat it needs more Summoner levels.
In short, this is a terrible idea unless you're willing to retrain the levels you have and go straight Summoner.
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