RPG Superstar 2014 Top 16
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@Cartmanbeck: A couple of your bards have illegal level 1 feats. Also, Chelish Diva is probably a better tank than Arcane Duelist since they get medium and heavy armor casting earlier.
Wow, you're totally right. I'll have to rework them for first level. Those feats are all ones they'd want at 3rd level though for sure.
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1. If you want them to have fun, then give them a class with endless possibilities.
Imagine a team of rogues, the flanking combat and all skills :)
2. Or a Wizard Guild (à la Fairy Tail). Their stats, schools and spells can create huge differences among them.
3. The circus is in town! - all bards with different performances and spells. This is a great class for out of combat encounters.
4. Rangers all the way! - many skills and +1bab so they can actually draw their weapon while moving^. Great for in and out of combat.
5. The Druids - all with their specific companion and preferred spells.
6. A sorcerer family would work the same, but with less skillranks.
Any team with one class need to have:
-A Tank (feat=toughness)
-An Attacker/dps (power attack/TWF/PBS+Rapid shot)
-A Face (no specific feat but requires Cha and class skills)
-A Healer? (cure light wounds)
-A Disabler+Controller (requires spellcasting)
Since 1 in the team will be the disabler/controller, the class needs to be able to cast spells!
A wand of cure light wounds can be used by most spellcasters, rogues and Rangers, which would grant the team the ability to heal properly.
The face has the simplest requirement, pick up traits to get class skills where your class might lack.
The attacker would earn most on having a martial class with +1 BAB, but rogues would work well with their sneak attack at level 1.
The tank requires the feat toughness and preferably high Hit Dice.
Since all martial classes can't be controllers, they are thrown out of the spotlight.
Since sorcerers are like wizards with less skillranks, they are also thrown out of the spotlight
Wizards have very low Hit dice (d6) and thereby make questionable tanks. - but still remains interesting.
Druids have decent Hit Dice (d8), a very strong animal companion, spells and 4 skill ranks, so they defenately stay interesting.
Bards remain interesting with their Hit Dice (d8), full knowledge proficiency and 6skill ranks.
So the 3 winners are;
1. Druids / Bards
2. Wizards
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It's a school. the characters would start as children. A BIG part of spontaneous casters is that their powers are innate, thus no need for an education. It's really a premise thing, not a role thing.Just out of curiosity, why no Sorcerers, Summoners, or Bards? They are CHA based Spontaneous casters instead of Int Based Prepared, but they share much of the same roles and skills, and they are all arcane casters.
I've also got a write-up of a magical school (limited to wizards, witches & maguss). Never really thought about just one class.
I would argue that Sorcerers, Summoners, and Bards could also benefit from schooling. Their powers may be innate, but they still need to learn how to harness and control them. The curriculum for spontaneous and prepared casters would different, but it could make for some interesting social tensions within the school. The spontaneous casters would be the "jocks" and prepared casters the "nerds".
I would argue that Sorcerers, Summoners, and Bards could also benefit from schooling. Their powers may be innate, but they still need to learn how to harness and control them. The curriculum for spontaneous and prepared casters would different, but it could make for some interesting social tensions within the school. The spontaneous casters would be the "jocks" and prepared casters the "nerds".It's a school. the characters would start as children. A BIG part of spontaneous casters is that their powers are innate, thus no need for an education. It's really a premise thing, not a role thing.Just out of curiosity, why no Sorcerers, Summoners, or Bards? They are CHA based Spontaneous casters instead of Int Based Prepared, but they share much of the same roles and skills, and they are all arcane casters.
I've also got a write-up of a magical school (limited to wizards, witches & maguss). Never really thought about just one class.
That... is not a dynamic I would want to try to reproduce. For personal reasons. There's some things that... just no.
I'll rethink spontaneous, but I'm still on the side of not including them.
Oh, and definitly no summoners. I'm just not fond of summoners, they are so finicky for players & GMs.
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The spontaneous casters would be the "jocks" and prepared casters the "nerds".
Both sides could have a dismissive (or envious!) view of the other.
The spontaneous caster might feel that they have an elite or special bloodline, or that they are functioning purely on talent. They might regard a prepared caster as someone who has to stay up all night studying until their eyes bleed just to be able to match what they have as an inherent birthright, or they might be envious of how the wizard has mastered through study what comes naturally to them, and can, with a bit of preparation, come at a problem with an all new toolset of spells, tailored for the situation, while the prepared caster is stuck trying to find situations where his very small toolset of spells known can be applied (or falling back on wands and scrolls, to make up for his lack of broader knowledge).
The prepared caster might be jealous of how the sorcerers innate spellcasting abilities seem to 'come so easily' and without the same sort of hard work and apprenticeship that a wizard goes through (despite it costing the exact same amount of exp to go up a level, for either class, and it technically requiring no less 'work' for either). He might also be dismissive of how the sorcerer is 'stuck' with a smallish list of spells known, and can only sporadically modify or swap out a spell known for a new one, considering themselves the 'masters' of a craft, while the spontaneous casters are just dabblers in something they'll never truly understand, and while magic is a tool to the prepared caster, they might regard the spontaneous caster as more a witless tool of the magic itself, pouring itself into the world through these spontaneous casters who don't really understand the forces they are meddling with.
So, either side could consider themselves the better, or inferior, or 'different, but equal' of the other, depending on the individual, and perhaps colored by regional / setting / racial / cultural biases.
(For instance, in a more Tolkein-ish or Feist-ian classical fantasy setting, elves might be innately magical, and natural sorcerers, and regard races who don't have 'magic in their blood,' reading spells out of books, like children needing a primer, as stunted or incomplete somehow. A race that has mastered wizardry, and is constantly developing new spells and magical techniques might similarly regard a race of natural sorcerers as some sort of stuck-in-the-past 'magical mutants' who can only channel the same old effects in the same old ways, while it's the wizards who are changing the world, and developing new techniques, and truly *understanding* the forces they wield, while the sorcerous races are little more than magical beasts, maybe innately capable of some magical tricks, but frozen and static and incapable of doing something totally new from day to day.)
Where this sort of divide could play into setting assumptions, is in how it interacts with class and status and rulership.
In the real world, the ruling classes have been bloodlines, carefully breeding amongst themselves, which would very much lend itself to sorcerous families (with their high charismas and magical powers) insinuating themselves into a ruling caste, and eventually, all 'noble' families having some perks built into their bloodline, with children lacking the spontaneous 'blooding' to allow them to function as sorcerers (or, more useful in a political life, bards) perhaps getting that other advantage of the noble families, a vastly superior *education,* with wizardly schooling becoming fallback position for noble brats who lack the 'blood' for spontaneous casting, so that even the least 'noble-blooded' of noble children, lacking in any sorcerous potential, would still be able to 'prove their bloodright' by casting a spell or two (even if its learned from a spellbook)...
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I've heard a party of Seven Samurai is pretty neat, but Seven Gunslingers would be magnificent.At some point the seven gunslingers should come across the seven samurai, just so the samurai could call them a poor mans remake.
Ahh NICE! I see what you did there.
(For those not in the know, Akira Kurosawa made the movie Seven Samurai, and it was remade as The Magnificent Seven in the states)
We're playing an all wizard kingmaker now. We're going with the rune lords theme.
Many, many moons ago during the 2nd edition era I managed to make it to a GenCon and take part in an interesting one shot adventure. All 6 characters were identical... a Fighter/Magic-User/Cleric... elf I think, but I am not sure. How did they vary? Alignment... LG, NG, CG, LN, N, CN. Lucky me, I got to play the CN part. That single session taught me alot about the good and bad parts of the alignment system, and how players approached it.
Need to make an all-Witch group and call the campaign 'Golarion Horror Story: Coven.'
As the great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, great, grand scion of Baba Yaga, I would like to endorse this message.
off the top of my head an all-bard party might be
-archaeologist bard (buffs himself, DPS, trap duty w/ trap finder trait)
-court bard (debuffs enemies instead of buffing allies, controller)
-vanilla bard (buffs allies, all-rounder)
-arcane duelist or dawnflower dervish bard (tank? i'm rather unfamiliar with these archetypes)
also consider:
-"bard who is totally not a sensei/4 winds/qinggong monk seriously i have no idea what you're talking about im totally a bard now shut up before i punch you" (just because)
unsure who the '5th ranger' would be without stepping on anyone's toes too harshly, but all of them have control spells, healing, buffs/debuffs out the wazoo, all of them are Faces, and don't even get me started on skills.
if dipping were allowed, things like lore oracle would be amazing (cha to AC/reflex, cha to knowledge instead of int, various rerolls to knowledge), as would paladin (cha to saves/damage/ac/etc.) if it didnt mess with party alignment too badly.
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I've been kicking around an idea for a one-shot where all the player characters are the same class.
What classes possess the versatility to make a premise like this work? Can you make a well-rounded party using a single class?
What kind of stories could be told? Wizards at a magic school? Bards at a music festival? Rogues breaking out of prison?
Has anyone attempted anything like this?
I've done it with all sorcerers (half were sylvan sorcerers) - and I have heard of others doing all summoners and all oracles.
Accursed Halls in thornkeep is an interesting game to do that way.
Bard would be neat, given the amount of archetypes. Inquisitor would work, too, since you've got the ability for each to cover different things. Alternatively Oracle, but that will have some issues with skills (though not as bad as, say, a cleric party). Though I'd still say Bard or Inquisitor. Druid could work too, but I'm not sure I'd recommend it. You'll want at least 3/4 BAB, with some way to increase it, for your Combat character (assuming they'll at least try to cover the standard roles), You'll want at least 4 Skills/level with INT not being a dump-stat, and you'd want preferably 6+, so you can cover skills effectively (4 would be alright, but you'd need everyone to make a point to not overlap too much; 6 will prevent that need). You'll want someone who can heal, and give some buffs, and you'll want some utility casting. And lastly, you'll want to make sure that there is variation in how the class can be built, such that, even with the same class name, the characters will be able to be distinct in how they play out.
Overall, this all screams Bard or Inquisitor, and a couple other classes which could work in a pinch, but wouldn't do it nearly as well.
I've been kicking around an idea for a one-shot where all the player characters are the same class.
What classes possess the versatility to make a premise like this work? Can you make a well-rounded party using a single class?
What kind of stories could be told? Wizards at a magic school? Bards at a music festival? Rogues breaking out of prison?
Has anyone attempted anything like this?
Our table has a Theieves guild game. Almost all the characters are Rogues or at least stealthy in nature. I kind of look at the group like the Mission Impossible or the Italian Job were you have a group of thieves each with a set of skills. We have no healing other than wands and potions.
The stealthing can be pretty exciting and the battles are a quick with all the sneak attacks going around.
Stories are pretty easy as the guild can give you a mission. That works well enough for a one shot and you can always throw in twists and turns.
Have fun Lair Master!
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This would be hilarious in so many ways, if a team of 5 played the same class with one another. It makes me think of all of those "team" fighting shows, like Power Rangers, or Robin Hood Men in Tights(certain fight scenes).
I'm going to suggest this to my DM for a goof around campaign one day.
All I can see going through my mind is 5 Monks cartwheeling around the battlefield.
I think Its still in the play test but Vigilante is perfect for this. you have one class that grants you 4 options that each deliver a different combat style. Avenger is a great martial, Stalker is your Rogue, Warlock is your Arcane guy and Zealot is your divine. despite this they all share the secret identity aspect so you could play this as a group of heroes trying to gain information by day and kick butt by night.
Kineticist would work for this! Each element has its own strengths and weaknesses, and some even include buffing and/or healing. I especially think this could be really fun because there is apparently (I don't have the book myself yet) a Teamwork Feat that lets Kineticists make compound blasts together with each other's elements!
I think Its still in the play test but Vigilante is perfect for this.
Vigilante doesn't count because this is the ONLY way you could justify anyone playing a Vigilante, and was designed for it. Vigilante isn't a class, it's an optional additional ruleset and/or roleplaying decision pretending to be a class, just like Chelish Diva and especially Celebrity are roleplaying decisions pretending to be archetypes.