[PFS] How to make a certain type of Eldritch Knight


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Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

I've got a strong itch to play an Eldritch Knight as my next PFS character.

Specifically, I want this PC to carry a nonmagical sword, using magic weapon to get past DR/magic in the early levels and then later keep greater magic weapon (probably extended via rod) running during the adventuring day.

Additionally, I've already played an armored EK, so this time I want to wear no armor at all; I'll rely on mage armor and the occasional shield (and some non-armor AC items) for a little bit of AC, but eventually rely primarily on defensive buffs (mirror image, etc) and HP to survive being in the front lines.

Part of the appeal of going this route is that I won't be spending all my cash on weapon and armor upgrades, letting me explore all those fun and interesting little items that never quite make it into the budget.

So with that goal in mind, how should I do this?

My first thought is a DEX/INT-based tiefling or dual-talent human who uses Dervish Dance, but I'm open to other ideas as well.

Oh, and this will be a Diviner for early access to EK, so keep that in mind when making suggestions.

Thanks!

Silver Crusade

Of course Crane Style comes to mind. Remember that style feats are combat feats...you don't technically have to take monk levels to use the feat chain.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

@Brad - Would that be in addition to or in place of Dervish Dance? Because if you mean in addition, then I'm looking at eating up a lot of feats: Weapon Finesse, Dervish Dance, Dodge, Improved Unarmed Strike, and Crane Style. If you're meaning for me to defend myself by actually deflecting incoming attacks, then add Crane Wing to the list. That's six feats just to get the fighting style online (and a BAB +5 requirement).

Even with a fighter bonus feat and an EK bonus feat, that means I'm not really doing my thing until 7th level. Yikes.

Silver Crusade

Yeah...Dervish Dance or Crane Style, not both.
Crane Style and Crane Riposte with a Sansetsukon is a great combo.
Or the full chain with a 9 section whip.

Depends which route you wanna go.


have you thought about adding a level of monk for defense
or being an aasimar, they get daylight as a spell like ability, should qualify you early for EK.

or angel blooded assimar makes a great sorceror/ fighter EK but EK doesn't really help Sorceror bloodline

what about arcane strike feat, or big game hunter and death or glory.

are you wanting to two-weapon fight?

If you are looking to do damage, why a finesse build? trying to cut down on MAD

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Thausauron wrote:
have you thought about adding a level of monk for defense

By default I'm starting an entire spell level behind, just for being an EK. Adding another martial level is a huge cost; one I'm not willing to pay.

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or being an aasimar, they get daylight as a spell like ability, should qualify you early for EK.

That would free up my school choice, but at the cost of not getting racial boosts to any relevant stats at all. Probably not worth it.

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what about arcane strike feat,

Naturally. :)

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or big game hunter and death or glory.

What do they contribute to the goal?

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are you wanting to two-weapon fight?

Given the need of a free hand for spellcasting, probably not.

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If you are looking to do damage, why a finesse build? trying to cut down on MAD

Yep; trying to balance STR (for melee power), DEX (for AC, init, etc), CON (for survivability), and INT (for spells) is pretty rough. Going Finesse mitigates that, and DDance helps keep that from costing me too much damage.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Revisiting this concept, I wonder if the feat cost for Dervish Dance is nastier than the stat cost of going STR-based. Here's a different idea:

Human (dual-talented):

STR 17 (15+2) <-- Bump at 4th
DEX 14
CON 14
INT 17 (15+2) <-- Bump at 8th
WIS 10
CHA 07

First level gets to be fighter instead of wizard since I don't need to get a feat at exactly 2nd.

Traits would be Magical Knack (obviously) and... something else. Reactionary? Fate's Favored (for +1 AC on the eventual jingasa)?

First feat would be Toughness, as I don't get more than 1-2 FCBs ever and my AC is never going to be particularly high.

My fighter bonus feat... I might take Dodge (so that with mage armor, my AC is 17 instead of 16) with the intent of later retraining it once non-AC defensive buffs are more readily available. In either case, it would probably end up as Improved Initiative; it's just a matter of whether or not it starts there. :)

At 3rd, probably Weapon Focus. EK1 bonus feat is maybe Power Attack? Or maybe EK1 is Weapon Focus, 3rd is something non-combat (maybe something casting-related?), and 5th is Power Attack?

I dunno. Need some help on feat progressions.


What about being a standard Aasimar and progress as a Sohei Monk 1 / Wildblooded Empyreal Sorcerer 1 / Eldrich Knight 10?

Early entry because of the Aasimar Spell-like ability and you get nice bonuses like wisdom to AC and being able to flurry with a monk weapon (a temple sword probably). If you will have access to a guided weapon it can become a completely SAD build too, only needing a high Wisdom.

The first lvl free mounted combat feat might inspire you to have a mount. It can be done with Animal Ally for a total of three feats.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

XMorsX wrote:

What about being a standard Aasimar and progress as a Sohei Monk 1 / Wildblooded Empyreal Sorcerer 1 / Eldrich Knight 10?

Early entry because of the Aasimar Spell-like ability and you get nice bonuses like wisdom to AC and being able to flurry with a monk weapon (a temple sword probably). If you will have access to a guided weapon it can become a completely SAD build too, only needing a high Wisdom.

The first lvl free mounted combat feat might inspire you to have a mount. It can be done with Animal Ally for a total of three feats.

I don't like Sorc in EK because of the spell progression; even as a wizard, I'm getting 2nd-level spells at 5th instead of 3rd. Instead waiting until halfway through my career to cast anything better than magic missile is just too painful.

Also, if memory serves, guided is not available.


Jiggy wrote:
XMorsX wrote:

What about being a standard Aasimar and progress as a Sohei Monk 1 / Wildblooded Empyreal Sorcerer 1 / Eldrich Knight 10?

Early entry because of the Aasimar Spell-like ability and you get nice bonuses like wisdom to AC and being able to flurry with a monk weapon (a temple sword probably). If you will have access to a guided weapon it can become a completely SAD build too, only needing a high Wisdom.

The first lvl free mounted combat feat might inspire you to have a mount. It can be done with Animal Ally for a total of three feats.

I don't like Sorc in EK because of the spell progression; even as a wizard, I'm getting 2nd-level spells at 5th instead of 3rd. Instead waiting until halfway through my career to cast anything better than magic missile is just too painful.

Also, if memory serves, guided is not available.

In PFS guided is not available, that is true.

It is a way to have great AC without wearing armor, especially if you go Dex based.

You will still have 2nd lvl spells by lvl 6. It is just one lvl difference with the wizard and you also enjoy the freedom of spontaneous casting.

It is a convenient way to get rid of the armor while keeping the mechanical benefits.

You could start with (after racial modifiers):

STR 17
DEX 14
CON 14
INT 7
WIS 16
CHA 9

This way you can have 15 AC before mage armor at lvl 1 and flurry with a temple sword. Or go for a moms / sohei for a dex build:

STR 7
DEX 17
CON 14
INT 10
WIS 16
CHA 9

16 AC at first lvl, take agile maneuvers and imrpoved grapple as you monk bonus feat in order to have something to do until you take Dervish Dance.

In both cases you take Improved Unarmed Strike for easy access to the Crane Style feat tree. With the lack of armor it becomes even more useful.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

That is not even the same type of character. No thanks.


Jiggy wrote:
That is not even the same type of character. No thanks.

Same to what?

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

The build I posted right before your post.


It's not an Eldritch Knight but Kensi Magus sounds like what you are looking for. Canny defense+high dex= good unarmored AC, choose an exotic weapon and you've got a good story reason for keeping it through your whole career (even better if its wyroot). Arcane pool helps keep up your weapon bonuses. Spell comabt gives you extra action economy which is great at low levels. Your BAB should be about the same since you're not mixing in the wizard levels. Your spell casting is a bit weaker but it's not too bad since you'll never reach the higher level spells in PFS anyways. If you think of all your spell combat spells as quickened you're actually ahead of other spell casters.


Jiggy wrote:
The build I posted right before your post.

Yes it is. You are talking about a standard EK, I am presenting an alternative better suited for the armorless EK.

Of course if you do not like it, the standard EK still works.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Okay, let me be more clear about my goals:

I'm building an EK, not a magus or an inquisitor or bard or whatever else.
I'm using diviner wizard for my casting class.
I intend to not wear armor.

I'm interested in suggestions on going STR vs DEX, exact stat spreads, feat choices, opposition schools, and other details that don't contradict that base.

Sorry if I wasn't clear on that before.


Jiggy wrote:

Okay, let me be more clear about my goals:

I'm building an EK, not a magus or an inquisitor or bard or whatever else.
I'm using diviner wizard for my casting class.
I intend to not wear armor.

I'm interested in suggestions on going STR vs DEX, exact stat spreads, feat choices, opposition schools, and other details that don't contradict that base.

Sorry if I wasn't clear on that before.

Focusing on being unarmored is probably a death sentence in the first few levels. You won't have the spells or the durations to buff up enough and you won't have the hit points to survive long. Once you get to higher levels where you can extend your buffs and afford some magic gear you may be better off, but it's gonna be hell getting to that point. But if you're set on doing it here's some things I would think about:

A. Using Ranger as the martial- go natural weapon and take 2 levels to pick up claws. Go half orc and pick up a bite- now you've got 3 attacks all at your highest BAB. You could go strength to get better damage or all the attacks are able to be finessed so you can go dex and count on arcane strike and magic weapon to help the damage out while getting some AC.

B. Distance. Reach weapon- maybe even the whip line. If you can keep distance your lack of armor is less important.

Alternately if you're not focused on being a melee fighter grabbing a bow allows you to be unarmored and not worry about your HP.

C. Skirmisher- Dodge-mobility-spring attack. Use expeditious retreat or longstrider or boots to up your mobility and spring in and out of range to keep safe. You'll one have one attack a round so you'll need to do everything to buff it. high strength, enlarge person, two handed weapon, lead blade, and probably barbarian as your martial class for the rage rounds. Since it's PFS and you're not hitting high levels this should be a viable build. at higher levels you'll never do enough to make up for the lost iterative attacks.

D. Styles-Crane Style lets you lower the penalty for fighting defensively, Snake style lets you use sense motive as AC for 1 attack per round. both give you additional options for counter attacks. you can run both if you dip master of many styles. Add in threatening defender and combat expertise and you should be getting +6 to ac plus deflecting one hit and the ability to use sense motive for one attack around. of course be spending this much on defense your offense is going to suck.

E. Magus. Yeah you don't want a magus, but think of it as your martial class. A couple of extra 1st level spells and the ability to cast them while full attacking. True strike, Enlarge person and Shield are all great choices and with pearls of power you can do it several times a day. You're still too squishy but at least you don't take as long to buff up and get in the fight.

After typing that out I'd probably recommend C or A as your best bet.


Jiggy: I built an EK for PFS recently and had these same various questions you did.

Eventually I decided on something a little weird. (Link is to lvl 2 version, playing Dragon's Demand but built via PFS rules)

Dwarven Ranger (Trapper) 1 / Wizard (Diviner) 1 / EK X

Means I've got good saves, good HP and access to a nice reach weapon.

I'm wearing armor at the moment but plan on switching over to just Mage Armor ~ lvl 5 when I start getting second level spells.

I think the magic weapon is worth keeping as an EK, make it your weapon bond and only pay half price to enhance it.

Character Summary:
I have Full BAB -1.
I have Trapfinding
Will have max ranks in Disable Device, Perception, Sense Motive & Survival (undecided on extra skills from eventual int item)
Darkvision 60
Stonecunning
Huge Saves vs spells
Full Spellcasting -2 levels
Favored Enemy: Human[spoiler]
Strong Reach Weapon

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Pirate Rob wrote:
Jiggy: I built an EK for PFS recently and had these same various questions you did.

Actually, I'm about to hit 12th level for the first time in my PFS career, and it's with my existing Eldritch Knight. :D

It was actually the playing of that character that made me curious to try this one. Compared to "the original", some things have changed:
• Dual-talent human exists
• Diviners can get in early, for better BAB
• Magical Knack is legal
I've played multiple high-AC characters, and it eats up about 95% of your wealth. So basically, I'm looking to play the same fundamental idea, but replacing the weapon and armor budget-sinks with magic.

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I think the magic weapon is worth keeping as an EK, make it your weapon bond and only pay half price to enhance it.

I dunno about you, but I dislike the idea of my spellcasting ability being able to be disarmed. Also, there are situations where you might want to cast a spell without having to draw a weapon first. :/

Grand Lodge

Jiggy wrote:
I dunno about you, but I dislike the idea of my spellcasting ability being able to be disarmed. Also, there are situations where you might want to cast a spell without having to draw a weapon first. ://

That's what concentration checks are for.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Yeah, but those are hard! It's DC 20+level. With a DC 21 for a 1st-level spell, I don't have even a coin-flip chance until 6th-7th level.


I wouldn't bother with AC gear, you've got mage armor as a base and then things like blur and mirror image which are really strong.

I just find the half price weapon too good to pass up, even with the drawbacks. (Note you can cast spells without the bond it's just a DC 20+ spell level concentration check)

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Pirate Rob wrote:
I wouldn't bother with AC gear, you've got mage armor as a base and then things like blur and mirror image which are really strong.

That's the plan, though a few AC items that apply to touch at a reasonable price will probably still make their way into the build.

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I just find the half price weapon too good to pass up, even with the drawbacks.

Half price isn't as good as 30gp. ;) I've got an 11th-level EK and a 9th-level melee cleric who use GMW on their non-masterwork cold iron longswords, and I'm very happy with it. :D


I do definitely think Martial Class 1/ Wizard (Diviner 1) / EK is the way to go.

The other answers to your questions depend on some fundamental questions about your character including how you plan on dealing with monsters. (Multiple answers are likely)

Save or die spells?
Buffs?
Power Attack?
Combat Manuevers
Summoning?
Defenses and outlasting?

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Pirate Rob wrote:
I do definitely think Martial Class 1/ Wizard (Diviner 1) / EK is the way to go.

I'm actually thinking a 2nd level of wizard, as well. Doesn't interrupt BAB, gets me another spell slot early, gives me a usable duration on send senses, and gives me +1 Will. Downside is (assuming FCB) -1 HP, but seems like a winner overall.

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The other answers to your questions depend on some fundamental questions about your character including how you plan on dealing with monsters. (Multiple answers are likely)

Save or die spells?

Seldom, but in the toolbox.

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Buffs?

Some; primarily mage armor and defensive illusions. Possibly heroism unless I oppose Enchantment.

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Power Attack?

Likely. As in, 78% likely.

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Combat Manuevers

Unlikely, except perhaps for the odd true strike bull rush.

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Summoning?

Nope.

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Defenses and outlasting?

Unlikely.

Shadow Lodge

Would you be opposed to Silken Ceremonial armor? Because although it is armor, it is cheap armor you can get at level one and it looks like a robe, so it wouldn't be sacrificing concept. It would help for when you can't buff up before combat, or when you get surprised.

As for the Martial level, I'd go with a level of fighter at second for the bonus feat, so you could get dervish dance at level 2. You could even play a fighter at first level, then change out to wizard1/fighter1 before 2nd with the free rebuild at first level. Then later on you could get greater weapon focus and weapon specialization.

Or you could go with a sohei level for Wisdom to AC and free IUS and Dodge so you could go with Crane Style line with relative ease. Of course, you sacrifice a point of BAB, some HP, and make yourself MAD if you want to use the wisdom.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

ArmouredMonk13 wrote:
Would you be opposed to Silken Ceremonial armor? Because although it is armor, it is cheap armor you can get at level one and it looks like a robe, so it wouldn't be sacrificing concept.

But to have a relevant armor bonus with it, I have to sink money into it, which is the opposite of the goal.

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It would help for when you can't buff up before combat, or when you get surprised.

Mage armor isn't exactly a "buff up before combat" thing. Also, diviners don't get surprised.

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As for the Martial level, I'd go with a level of fighter at second for the bonus feat, so you could get dervish dance at level 2. You could even play a fighter at first level, then change out to wizard1/fighter1 before 2nd with the free rebuild at first level.

I already have credits up to 2.0, so no worries on the order. If I credit him up to 3rd before playing him, I could even take DD at 3rd and keep the fighter level at 1st for the HP.

Of course, that's all assuming I don't go the STR route that I posted a little ways up.

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Then later on you could get greater weapon focus and weapon specialization.

Indeed, very possible. My current EK has WpnSpec.

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Or you could go with a sohei level for Wisdom to AC and free IUS and Dodge so you could go with Crane Style line with relative ease. Of course, you sacrifice a point of BAB, some HP, and make yourself MAD if you want to use the wisdom.

Not to mention that actually using Crane Style means that I can't hit anything; at least not until I have the whole line. :/


How about a sohei monk and empyreal sorcerer? That way wisdom is your casting attribute and its a little less MAD than a wizard with intelligence for the casting attribute.


If you do plan to go with a dex build, I'd go Dex/Int Tiefling. I believe at least one of the Tiefling SLA's covers the PrC requirement, which would open up Transmutation school as a possibility. The bonuses to stats are worth considering.

With that said, I think a Dex build is too feat heavy to work. I think Dex will remain relevant (early AC, Reflex, Ranged Touch, Initiative) so you'll probably want 12-14 in it, but the double feat tax is a big deal for gish builds.

I spent a long time wrestling with stat figures, and I think the dual-talented human array you gave is probably the best one possible. I couldn't come up with anything better, anyway.

For feats, I'd go:
1-W1: Toughness
2-W2 (Play these levels as a ranged touch Wizard, or GM credit)
3-F1: Power Attack, Improved Initiative
4-EK1: Weapon Focus
5-EK2: Combat Casting
6-EK3
7-EK4: Weapon Specialization

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

the suggestion for silken ceremonial armor may not be a bad one... there's no ASF% and it doesn't have to cost money- you use the same solution as your weapon, just memorize a couple of magic vestments/greater magic vestments to keep it working.

another option is to just take a level of sohei for your martial class... yes you lose 1 BAB (unless you're flurrying) but you also gain Wis to AC which will help you some even if its only a +1, you get the best possible bump to saves, and you are always armed but never have to worry about having a free hand to cast... (i know you don't want to play a sorcerer, but there's no reason you couldn't build this way as a sohei/diviner)

a third option would be barb 2/scarred witch doctor 5/EK... this is, from a casting standpoint, the least optimized option (no early entry unless you go vanilla aasimar, which has no stat synergy) but it could be kind of awesome... start with fey foundling, take lesser celestial totem as your rage power and pick up raging vitality-> totally ignore your AC; you'll have tons of hp and every heal you get will also restore +2hp/die and +CL hps... just make sure to pick hexes that don't rely on DCs or a scaling level component (take the CLW one for a self heal, and remember you have all the cures on your spell list). lol.

Silver Crusade

@Jiggy - I've been working out a very very similar EK build. I lean toward the strength build, to leave feats for other things.

I know you are already a fan of reach weapons. Were you planning on using a reach weapon with this character?

I like the efficiency of using Greater Magic Weapon for armament. It does seem you'll occasionally be caught out without most buffs, though. Diviner acts in surprise round, but you might have options better than a self-buff. At a minimum you want Magic Weapon, Mage Armor, and Shield, which is two rounds of buffing more than is practical in a surprise situation.

Suggestion: You might consider carrying some cheap gear to help in the event of surprise. For example, you could wear silk armor, which applies even if you don't have mage armor.

Have you considered also loading up with some sort of special trick? E.g. Be immune to fire and immolate in fire, or blast foes with a Rimed Chilling (Burning) Hands for extra AoOs, or something like that? Not a 'one trick pony', but an extra trick? Those sorts of things often require planning at build time. That sort of thing would help compensate for the missing wizard levels ...

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Magda Luckbender wrote:
I know you are already a fan of reach weapons. Were you planning on using a reach weapon with this character?

Actually, I don't use reach weapons very much, as I much more enjoy the mental image of a sword-user. This one will probably be a scimitar.

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I like the efficiency of using Greater Magic Weapon for armament. It does seem you'll occasionally be caught out without most buffs, though. Diviner acts in surprise round, but you might have options better than a self-buff. At a minimum you want Magic Weapon, Mage Armor, and Shield, which is two rounds of buffing more than is practical in a surprise situation.

Mage armor isn't something I'm casting when combat starts; I'll already have it up. (At early levels, I'll carry scrolls for when I expect trouble, until I can eventually Extend it to 8+ hours/day.)

Shield is a round-one buff before I have enough illusions. It eventually gets replaced by blur/mirror image; that's the only combat round I spend buffing.
At early levels, magic weapon is on a scroll in case of DR, in the same way any prepared martial carries an oil of it. That's eventually replaced by having an Extended GMW running all day.

My current EK begins each combat deciding whether he should start with an offensive spell or wade into melee. If the latter, he casts a single defensive buff (in his case, shield) and he's set. This EK would have the same M.O., but with illusions instead of shield.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

nate lange wrote:
the suggestion for silken ceremonial armor may not be a bad one... there's no ASF% and it doesn't have to cost money- you use the same solution as your weapon, just memorize a couple of magic vestments/greater magic vestments to keep it working.

That's a cleric spell, I'm afraid. Also, it accomplishes the same thing as mage armor except less effective and as a higher level spell.

RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

wow... i'm an idiot.

i totally forgot that was just cleric/inquisitor (and how slow the progression was)- you can tell how often i use that spell.


Try the tactician fighter at first. It may not get you the bonus feat, and a second level dip in it doesn't hurt. You lose heavy armor proficiency and your first level bonus feat for a small bunch of extra skill points. It gives you proficiency in the armored kilt thingy that has no arcane spell failure so it's overall not too shabby. If you dip a second level you get a bonus to initiative which is always good.


Forget dervish dance, save yourself a feat and just put agile on your weapon. You'll be using your spell to get additional +'s so it's a minor cash expenditure. You're a wizard to start, so you will always be effective.

Leave str at 10. Crank up Dex. Take combat reflexes. I'd recommend using a reach weapon, but you say you don't want to use one (I'd reconsider). Go Piranha Strike (which counts as Power Attack), then Cornugon Smash. Put Cruel on your weapon if you ever can afford too (+3 enchant is rough in PFS) and you'll be debuffing pretty hard every hit.

Get the ring that gives you a +2 shield bonus, save yourself an action buffing - anything to reduce the rounds you need to buff is a good thing. Extend rod etc. If you've played an EK to 12, you know mostly what you need.

Also look at early entry to EK through SLA's.


There is a guy at my local doing something similar, except more so.

Str build with a bastard sword. He actually dumped dex. Pumped his con a bit higher. Just assumed he would get hit if targeted and found ways to survive getting hit.

I think his martial level was barbarian and his arcane might have sage or empyreal sorc. It definitely wasn't charisma sorc and I didn't think it was wizard. But maybe he just always picked the same few spells.

For the first few levels he used cheap armor and spells with no somatic component. Primarily used a str comp bow at low levels. Then once he was up to 2nd level buff spells, he ditched the armor and started wading into melee.

The low levels were rough for him to survive. Even now, he has to be careful. If something big manages to full attack him without or through the buffs, his hit points drop very rapidly. So he has to be very ready to withdraw.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Cubic Prism wrote:
Forget dervish dance, save yourself a feat and just put agile on your weapon. You'll be using your spell to get additional +'s so it's a minor cash expenditure.

8,300gp is not a "minor cash expenditure", especially when a large part of the point of this character is to see what happens when I'm not spending money on my weapons/armor.

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I'd recommend using a reach weapon, but you say you don't want to use one (I'd reconsider).

For me, a big part of the fun of any character is establishing a mental image I like, which in this case has no room for a reach weapon. If I wreck that mental image, I won't have fun playing the character.

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Go Piranha Strike (which counts as Power Attack), then Cornugon Smash.

Where in the world are you getting the idea that Piranha Strike "counts as Power Attack"?

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Put Cruel on your weapon if you ever can afford too (+3 enchant is rough in PFS) and you'll be debuffing pretty hard every hit.

Yeah, for about my last two sessions or so. :/

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Get the ring that gives you a +2 shield bonus, save yourself an action buffing - anything to reduce the rounds you need to buff is a good thing. Extend rod etc. If you've played an EK to 12, you know mostly what you need.

The plan is to not use shield bonuses with this one. My single round of buffing will be an illusion for a miss chance (or similar effect). I'm not dropping all my cash on that stupid ring of force shield; if I wanted to spend money on a shield bonus (I don't), I'd just get a mithral buckler.

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Also look at early entry to EK through SLA's.

Yes, this is going to be a scrying diviner.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

haruhiko88 wrote:
Try the tactician fighter at first. It may not get you the bonus feat, and a second level dip in it doesn't hurt. You lose heavy armor proficiency and your first level bonus feat for a small bunch of extra skill points. It gives you proficiency in the armored kilt thingy that has no arcane spell failure so it's overall not too shabby. If you dip a second level you get a bonus to initiative which is always good.

I was actually thinking of Lore Warden; if memory serves, I keep my bonus feat at 1st but also get a couple extra skill ranks.

Also, I'm pretty sure armored kilts aren't legal in PFS.


http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats -> Scroll down for P.Strike, says: Gain Power Attack with light weapons. Not sure if it's intended to equal Power Attack for feat pre-reqs, but I've seen it used that way.

8,300 isn't bad and worth spending to gain a feat IMO. Seems like you're all set and know what you want to do.


I like this Jiggy. I love dex-builds, love gishes, and I understand your whole "reduce cost" mentality. Works more easily with a cleric (since they get magic vestment & shield of faith) but lets stick to what you want. I'll post some ideas tonight.

Edit: I would probably go with the "shadowcaster" archetype (unsure if OK for PFS) since it gives bonus spell slots (instead of poorly scaling familiar or a risky arcane bond) & you wont suffer from the lost bonus feats.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Cubic Prism wrote:
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/feats/combat-feats -> Scroll down for P.Strike, says: Gain Power Attack with light weapons. Not sure if it's intended to equal Power Attack for feat pre-reqs, but I've seen it used that way.

Table entries for feats are shorthand; it's summarizing that it provides an effect comparable to Power Attack. If you read the actual feat description, you'll see nothing to indicate that it "counts as Power Attack" for any purposes.

You might also check the sourcebook to see whether "Gain Power Attack with light weapons" is even something that was actually published, or was written by one of the fans who contributes to the SRD. It wouldn't be the first time that one of their contributors wrote something themselves and attributed it to Paizo. But again, even if that's what it says in a feat table published by Paizo, the actual feat text trumps it because the table is just shorthand.

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8,300 isn't bad and worth spending to gain a feat IMO. Seems like you're all set and know what you want to do.

For an 11-level career, 8,300 seems a bit steep. Also, going STR saves me both feats instead of just the second one. I'm definitely leaning that direction at the moment.

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williamoak wrote:
Edit: I would probably go with the "shadowcaster" archetype (unsure if OK for PFS)

What's it in?


Jiggy wrote:
williamoak wrote:
Edit: I would probably go with the "shadowcaster" archetype (unsure if OK for PFS)
What's it in?

It's from inner sea magic.

http://www.d20pfsrd.com/classes/core-classes/wizard/archetypes/paizo---wiza rd-archetypes/shadowcaster


Str build is better IMO. Look at Eldritch Heritage: Orc. Get some nat ac, bonus str, immunity to fear and darkvision.

Dark Archive

Lore Warden or Unarmed Fighter are better fighter setups (the former just gives you 2 skill points if you're not wearing armor; the latter gives you Unarmed Fighting and a style feat without qualifying).

Warpriest would probably be my favorite entry for you though. The blessings can do a nice variety of things; you get a free weapon focus in your weapon of choice (which you'd take anyway to get Weapon Specialization), and a few 1st level spells to make it through life. Desna gives you an always-available freedom of movement add, which can be really nice for an ability off of a 1st level character. Half-Orc with Fate's Favored and a tattoo (+2 saves, and +2 to hit/damage off of a 1st level Divine Favor; in addition to +2 to will saves, making Will Saves Redic) seems quite strong.

And Arcane bond is always the answer; bond a ring or cloak and make it more powerful, so you gain extra money for this build :).

Half-Orc Warpriest of Desna 1 / Scryer 1/EK 3

Str: 7
Int: 14
Wis: 14
Dex: 19 (20)
Con: 14
Chr: 7

Traits: Fate's Favored, Magic Knack

1) Weapon Focus (Scimitar), Weapon Finessee
2) Spell Focus (Conjuration?)
3) Dervish Dance, Arcane Strike
5) Weapon Specialization (Scimitar)
7) Pirranah Strike, ?
9) Improved Critical (Scimitar)

Something like that

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Thalin wrote:
Warpriest would probably be my favorite entry for you though.

I didn't realize they were proficient in all martial weapons.

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And Arcane bond is always the answer; bond a ring or cloak and make it more powerful, so you gain extra money for this build :).

Er, you can't bond a cloak...

Quote:

Half-Orc Warpriest of Desna 1 / Scryer 1/EK 3

Str: 7
Int: 14
Wis: 14
Dex: 19 (20)
Con: 14
Chr: 7

Traits: Fate's Favored, Magic Knack

1) Weapon Focus (Scimitar), Weapon Finessee
2) Spell Focus (Conjuration?)
3) Dervish Dance, Arcane Strike
5) Weapon Specialization (Scimitar)
7) Pirranah Strike, ?
9) Improved Critical (Scimitar)

Something like that

Can't get WeaponSpec at 5th with that build; it requires Ftr4, which you don't have until 6th, so you can get it at 7th.

Also, Piranha Strike doesn't work with Dervish Dance, because scimitars are not light weapons.

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Here's kind of what I'm looking at right now:

Human (dual-talented)

STR 17
DEX 14
CON 14
INT 17
WIS 10
CHA 07

Fighter (Lore Warden)1/Wizard (Divination [Scrying])2/Eldritch Knight X

Traits: Magical Knack, ????? (Either Clever Wordplay [Diplomacy] or Fate's Favored, or maybe Reactionary.)

Feats:
HD1: Toughness
Ftr1: Dodge
HD3: Weapon Focus (scimitar)
EK1: Power Attack
HD5: Arcane Strike
HD7: ?????
EK5: Weapon Spec (scimitar)
HD9: Improved Critical (scimitar)
HD11: Quicken Spell

Suggestions on trait or feat selections?


Maybe try to fit iron will somewhere (or indomitable faith)? I know will is the strong wizard save, but eldritch knight wont boost it, and with 10 wis you are going to be at risk.

Grand Lodge RPG Superstar 2012 Top 32

Yeah, I was thinking about maybe Iron Will.

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