Where are the Kings?

[leo1925]

Recently i read a bunch of pathfinder novels and i noticed that there are quite a few queens mentioned without ever mentioning the king.
We have Queen Galfrey of Mendev, we have Queen Abrogail II, we have/had Queen Ileosa of Korvosa, we have Queen Elvanna of Irrisen, we have Queen Telandia Edasseril of Kyonin. I am sure there are others as i am sure that there are kings here and there but my questions is still where are the the kings?

[LazarX]

I spotted three of them over this manger.

[Archpaladin Zousha]

Queen Galfrey rules on her own, and her position is due to military acumen rather than hereditary power.

Queen Ileosa had her husband murdered. So he's out.

Irrisen is a matriarchy, so there ARE no kings there.

And Queen Telandia, I have no clue. Presumably the elven monarchy is equal-opportunity in regards to gender.

As for kings, there IS King-Regent Noleski Surtova in Brevoy, King Irovetti of Pitax, the Gorilla King in the Mwangi Expanse, the four Linnorm Kings (Ingimundr the Unruly, White Estrid (yes, she's a king), Opir Eightfingers, and Sveinn Blood-Eagle), High King Borogrim the Hale in the Five Kings Mountains, and Ruby Prince Khemet III (he's Pharaoh, so he's a king despite his official title).

[LazarX]

Archpaladin Zousha wrote:

And Queen Telandia, I have no clue. Presumably the elven monarchy is equal-opportunity in regards to gender.

In "Elves of Golarion" it was written that her consort was assassinated over a century ago and she has refused any courtship offers since then. She apparently is looking for a male to father her children, but not marriage. Right now, her closest companion is her hawk familliar.

[Irnk, Dead-Eye's Prodigal]

Also Taldor is ruled by a King. I don't recall his name at the moment & they use a different title (Grand Prince or some-such)...

Stavian! Grand Prince Stavian something-or-other I'm pretty sure.

[TerminalArtiste]

Queen Telandia is single.

[Archpaladin Zousha]

Irnk, Dead-Eye's Prodigal wrote:

Also Taldor is ruled by a King. I don't recall his name at the moment & they use a different title (Grand Prince or some-such)...

Stavian! Grand Prince Stavian something-or-other I'm pretty sure.

Forgot about him, though that's because I viewed him more as an "emperor" than as a king. It's also why I don't count Her Infernal Majestrix Abrogail II Thrune as a queen, though that IS her technical rank, because she's more of an empress.

[Jessica Price]

leo1925 wrote:

Recently i read a bunch of pathfinder novels and i noticed that there are quite a few queens mentioned without ever mentioning the king.

We have Queen Galfrey of Mendev, we have Queen Abrogail II, we have/had Queen Ileosa of Korvosa, we have Queen Elvanna of Irrisen, we have Queen Telandia Edasseril of Kyonin. I am sure there are others as i am sure that there are kings here and there but my questions is still where are the the kings?

Hmm, I recall doing a quick check a few months back and finding that only about 20% of our heads of state are female, so my question was the opposite.

[Alleran]

I grabbed my copy of the Inner Sea World Guide and did a quick check on the "Ruler" section for the various locales (I'll leave an in-depth look at each individual ruler to somebody else; this is just a broad overview of the ISWG). I came up with:

Male: Gyr (Absalom), Codwin I (Andoran), Noleski Surtova (Brevoy; King-Regent), Kelldor (Druma), Goss (Galt), Geb (Geb), Hedvend VI (Isger), Kharswan (Jalmeray), Ulthun II (Lastwall), Ingimundr (Linnorm Kings; King), Opir (Linnorm Kings; King), Kuldor (Mammoth Lords), Markwin (Molthune), Weslen Gavirk (Nirmathas), Kevoth-Kul (Numeria), Khemet III (Osirion), Xerbystes II (Qadira), Malduoni (Rahadoum), Razmir (Razmiran), Utilinus (Sargava), Kerdak Bonefist (Shackles; Hurricane King), Stavian III (Taldor), Aduard Ordranti (Ustalav)
Female: Abrogail II (Cheliax; Queen), Arazni (Geb day-to-day; Harlot Queen), Elvanna (Irrisen; Queen), Telandia (Kyonin; Queen), White Estrid (Linnorm Kings; King), Trietta Ricia (Mana Wastes), Jakalyn (Mediogalti), Galfrey (Mendev; Queen)
Various: Belkzen, Five Kings Mountains, Katapesh, Nex, Nidal, River Kingdoms, Thuvia

There are also a couple of areas (e.g. Darklands, Sodden Lands) that aren't listed as possessing a ruler, but as you narrow it down to individual places within those areas they'd start to divide and the numbers go up (e.g. the River Kingdoms or the Mwangi Expanse). Where a ruler is marked as a king, or variant of a king (e.g. King-Regent), I've included it. For Geb, Arazni isn't listed as the ruler, but since the entry does say that he leaves basically all the regular running of the place to her, I decided to include her (and she is the Harlot Queen).

Comes out, then, as 23 male rulers, 8 female rulers, and 7 that have multiple rulers (e.g. Nex has the Three and Nine, with the Three having one male, one female and one pech). Noleski Surtova, Ingimundr, Opir and Kerdak Bonefist are kings or some variant thereof. One of the rulers of Five Kings Mountains is High King Borogrim. Most of the female rulers I counted have a "Queen" title, while the male ones tend to vary.

[leo1925]

Thank you all, it seems that i was mislead. It just seems that the pathfinder tales take place mostly where happens to be a queen.

[rknop]

LazarX wrote:

She apparently is looking for a male to father her children, but not marriage. Right now, her closest companion is her hawk familliar.

...makes me wonder what the kids would look like.

[Zhangar]

The misconception might be a result of the queens having notably bigger roles in the setting. Queens Galfrey, Edasseril, Ileosa, and Elvanna all have direct roles in adventure paths - the former two as allies, the latter two as the BBEG.

While Queen Abrogail II hasn't directly appear in an AP, she rules the main Evil Empire of the setting, and so many adventurers have had to face her forces, while a decent number of adventurers (the Cheliax PFS faction, some Hellknights, etc.) are actually loyal to her. House Thrune is a big deal.

On the other hand, the Linnorm King Sven Blood-Eagle, and King Irovetti of Pitax, are the only current male rulers I'm aware of actually having an important role in an AP. And both them "merely" rule city-states, rather than nations.

So there're a lot more kings, but they haven't been as important to the setting.

Edit: And I guess there's the Jade Regent, but he's an usurper, not the ruler! =P

[leo1925]

Zhangar wrote:

Edit: And I guess there's the Jade Regent, but he's an usurper, not the ruler! =P

And the players are trying to put a queen on the throne.

[Paladin of Baha-who?]

Bonefist is a key part of the Skulls and shackles AP.

[LazarX]

rknop wrote:

LazarX wrote:

She apparently is looking for a male to father her children, but not marriage. Right now, her closest companion is her hawk familliar.

...makes me wonder what the kids would look like.

Oh just stop it right now and get your head out of that gutter. She flies with her familiar for the 15 minutes of free time she gets per day, she doesn't mate with it!

[LazarX]

leo1925 wrote:

Zhangar wrote:

Edit: And I guess there's the Jade Regent, but he's an usurper, not the ruler! =P

And the players are trying to put a queen on the throne.

The proper term is Shogun.

[Zhangar]

LazarX wrote:

leo1925 wrote:

Zhangar wrote:

Edit: And I guess there's the Jade Regent, but he's an usurper, not the ruler! =P

And the players are trying to put a queen on the throne.

The proper term is Shogun.

As applied to who? The Jade Regent?

A shogun's more a supreme commander than anything. Granted, the shoguns were rulers in fact because they held the actual power while acting in the emperor's name.

Now, the Jade Regent could very easily act as a shogun if the Emperor was still around - at which point he'd be telling the Emperor "today you are going to authorize me to do _____, ____, and ____." The Emperor wouldn't be in any position to say no, and his existence would give the Jade Regent both a veneer of legitimacy and a very important hostage.

Possibly Irrelevant Historical Aside:

In a real world example, the Chinese warlord Cao Cao did something very similar by becoming Prime Minister of the Han Dynasty back in 200ish AD. The Han dynasty was on the brink of collapse, and Cao Cao propped it up for about 20-something years by ruling China in the Han Emperor's name. Cao Cao reaped a huge political advantage by acting in the name of the rightful rulership rather than overthrowing the ruler.

Cao Cao's heir, Cao Pi, promptly dethroned the emperor and claimed the title for himself. Which led to Cao Cao's two biggest rivals, Liu Bei and Sun Quan, declaring themselves emperor in turn and causing the actual start of the Three Kingdoms period, a 60 year civil war. Cao Cao had understood the value of a puppet emperor. Cao Pi did not, and Cao Pi's grandchildren would become puppet emperors in turn as the Sima clan rose to power.

However, the Jade Regent is ruling in place of the "missing" Emperor. He's ruling in his own name, rather than acting on the authority of an allegedly cooperative and approving emperor. So I'd be reluctant to identify the Regent as Minkai's shogun, since he's actually seized a higher position for himself.

Re: Queen Edasseril - actually, she could turn her hawk into an elf as easily as she turns herself into a hawk. More relevantly, the elf queen really isn't doing well if the only person she feels understands her is her familiar. Because of COURSE her familiar understands her - it's a familiar, it's an extension of her in the first place!

[Paladin of Baha-who?]

I don't think familiars are considered to be extensions of their masters. Empowered by, yes. Made into something more than an ordinary animal, certainly -- but they are their own people, albeit with their being very closely tied to their master.

[leo1925]

Because i am playing in Jade Regent (book 6), the official story the Jade Regent has told everyone is that

Jade Regent spoiler:

the emperor (you know, the one he killed) is hiding/praying/fortifying in the shrine island where you can talk to the previous emperors of Minkai, the reason he retreated there is to protect himself and the last of the royal line from "whatever" tried to kill the 5 royal families. And that he is now ruling until he returns from his retreat.