What is the class for this character?

[666bender]

I plan on playing a toon the have no memories of the young age.
The character will slowly learn that she is part of an experiment planned by Tzuriel - war from the four horse man- one of many children he created .
They are meant to kill each other - much like the immortal movie "there can be only one...."
Technicalities :
Books = phb, advance, combat, magic only . Archetypes are seldom approved. No inqusitor allowed.
20 points buy, VERY low magic world.

As a master of war - I plan on holding melle ofc and can't tank cha too much cause I plan on leading armies ....

Classes: fighter is a obvious one that comes to mind, especially one that take many manuvers.
Oracle of battle/metal or war priest also logical.
Cavalier is the last thing I can think of.
Paladins are no-no - I hate lawful good.

So - what class you suggest ? What dip if any ? Prestige ?

[Gilfalas]

Antipaladin

[Rynjin]

B-B-Barbarian.

[blackbloodtroll]

Toon?

[Der Origami Mann]

666bender wrote:

So - what class you suggest ? What dip if any ? Prestige ?

CLASS

Barbarian (Wild Rager/Drunken Brute+Invulnerable Rager/Urban Rager+Invulnerable Rager)
Lame Oracle (Battle/Life)

PRESTIGE CLASS
Rage Prophet or Dragon Disciple

DIP
Unbreakable Fighter
Dragon Disciple

[Dekalinder]

Oracle of battle to me seems the most logical. Inquisitor is a close second.

[Benchak the Nightstalker]

Antipaladin is a good choice, since Szuriel herself is an ex-paladin.

BTW, Szuriel is a she, not a he. There's an article about her in part 5 of Reign of Winter, if you want to read more.

[chaoseffect]

It's a shame you're not open to more resources because the Soul Drinker prestige seems fitting. At least 2 levels of that plus Two Weapon Fighter Ranger, plus someday getting Conductive weapons... negative levels everywhere.

Antipaladin is only really good if you and your party are embracing the whole EVILLLLLLLLLLL thing, otherwise it's pretty bleh because you get to kiss your Smite goodbye.

I'd say one level of Dual Cursed Oracle with Lame advancing and then Barbarian all the way.

[Stabbald]

blackbloodtroll wrote:

Toon?

It's a fail term people use in World of Warcraft to refer to their characters because they look vaguely like cartoon characters.

It makes no sense in that game, and it makes even less sense in this one.

[Shimesen]

Stabbald wrote:

blackbloodtroll wrote:

Toon?

It's a fail term people use in World of Warcraft to refer to their characters because they look vaguely like cartoon characters.

It makes no sense in that game, and it makes even less sense in this one.

The term was around LONG before WoW came about within the mmo community and isn't really fail. Its shorthand for character just like lol is shorthand for "haha that's funny".

[blackbloodtroll]

Pathfinder is not an MMO.

[Ximen Bao]

blackbloodtroll wrote:

Pathfinder is not an MMO.

At least until Goblinworks gets done doing their thing.

[blackbloodtroll]

The Tabletop Roleplaying Game, Pathfinder, is not a MMO.

There may be a future MMO, based on the Tabletop Roleplaying Game, Pathfinder, but the Tabletop Roleplaying Game, Pathfinder, will still continue to be, not a MMO.

[Ximen Bao]

The Pedantry Police are satisfied.

You're free to go, citizen.

[Lamontius]

my first thought when seeing 'toon' was oh here we go I wonder if BBT has posted in here yet

but yeah Barbarian all the way, OP

[blackbloodtroll]

Gaining experience is not EV training, and PCs with a higher point buy don't have higher IVs.

[Rynjin]

blackbloodtroll wrote:

Gaining experience is not EV training, and PCs with a higher point buy don't have higher IVs.

Pokemon level up via EXP too, just an FYI.

I don't see why you care so much, really. It's a term. It's easy to understand.

[blackbloodtroll]

Yet, they disallow my profanity.

[I Hate Nickelback]

blackbloodtroll wrote:

Yet, they disallow my profanity.

That's because profanity doesn't make a difference. Wait a sec...

[Rynjin]

blackbloodtroll wrote:

Yet, they disallow my profanity.

Well, children aren't offended by the word "Toon".

Which is sad because that means I can't call it childish to be offended by it.

;)

[blackbloodtroll]

I just like to keep the two separate.

[Rynjin]

blackbloodtroll wrote:

I just like to keep the two separate.

Segregationist.

[Jason Rice]

I would actually say monk. I know A LOT of people would disagree on these boards, but in a low magic setting, getting magic armor and weapons would be a problem. However, its much less of a problem for a class that doesn't need armor or weapons. Monk.

[blackbloodtroll]

Rynjin wrote:

blackbloodtroll wrote:

I just like to keep the two separate.

Segregationist.

I could randomly insert Pokemon and Fantasy Football terms, along with some Legalize, into every discussion of Pathfinder.

That would be cool, right?

[I Hate Nickelback]

Mr. Rice makes a good point. And it's for (almost) the same reason I recommend antipaladin: fiendish boon will limit your need for magic weapons.

[John Kerpan]

Cum meam sententiam clarissime explicare velim, semper utor verba non intellecta ab omnibus amicis.

[blackbloodtroll]

Qui consideratam callidus est.

[Pan]

Lamontius wrote:

my first thought when seeing 'toon' was oh here we go I wonder if BBT has posted in here yet

but yeah Barbarian all the way, OP

Mine was "Hama is gonna freak."

on topic: I am going to go against the grain and suggest Ranger too. You get favored enemies/terrain and combat style feats plus good skills. You can flavor the Ranger in many ways.

[666bender]

back to the topic:
first thanks for the advice.

so, to sum the options:

cavalier: riding the mount like a knight, bodyguard order of the dragon - party tank.

ranger: maybe even a level dip into shadow dancer, a sneaker skirmish that focus on strike & move, high stealth, mobility. a special forces.

monk: since i prefer not to be lawful - than martial artist is an options - and not a bad one. the 1 issue i see here is REALLY low AC, with 1d8 HP and no DR - problams in staying alive ?

barbarian : big DR war monger, less skills more tanky-tank.

oracle: battle or metal. a versitle front liner that can also cast spells, minor heal, buff and hold a line.

rage prophet, more oracle > barbarian , taking many powers and feats that allow once in a rage thing - with lame curse.

nice ideas, all work.

since the off game is just as important as combats - i think i like :
ranger (with shadowdancer) / oracle / rage prophet the most.
(unless you tell me rage prophet really suck)

[Der Origami Mann]

666bender wrote:

since the off game is just as important as combats - i think i like :

ranger (with shadowdancer) / oracle / rage prophet the most.
(unless you tell me rage prophet really suck)

Rage prophet is only a good option for a barbarian that wants ragecicle through the lame oracle and getting spells, too.

Here is a thread about Rage-Prophets that dont suck

If you don´t want a half-ork, take the half-elf (if you can take the half-drwo with two favored classes, acces to paragon surge, wizzard spells through the ancient lorekeeper and take the favored class option for more spells known ("Add one spell known from the oracle spell list. This spell must be at least one level below the highest spell level the oracle can cast.").

I think a Half-Drow would be excellent for the flavour of your background-storry and you can later take (a dip in) Pain taster PrC, too.

[Major_Blackhart]

The only good DR in the Barbarian is Invulnerable Rager.
If you're going Rage Prophet, via Barb/Oracle, there are two archtypes that I would consider as big ones.
Obviously, the first one is Invulnerable Rager.
However, the other is Armored Hulk. Not a lot of folks like the Armored Hulk that much, but personally I love him, especially for a Rage Prophet.
He already has proficiency with Heavy Armor and all martial weapons, which is what a lot of battle oracles go for when they become one. Therefore, you don't need to waste a revelation or a feat just to get heavy armor proficiency.
Second, he gets some major movement bonuses when IN heavy armor. At level 2, he can move 5 feet faster than normal in med. and heavy armor, up to max speed. So, for a normal character, that means 25 ft.
At level 5, your speed is now faster than your race by +10 feet. This applies while wearing heavy armor, but not carrying a heavy load. This is essentially a fast movement that works with full plate.
Stick with it to level 6, and you get a +2 to your AC against critical confirmation rolls. This is potentially HUGE.
Oracle, lame curse.
At early levels this will slow you down like crazy. However, by character level 10, you will NEVER be slowed by armor. This is awesome. That means you essentially have in full plate a 30 feet land speed. How? Base speed of 20 thanks to Lame, combined wiht the +10 in armored hulk. 30 baby. Now, normally people would say you get a +10 in other barbarian classes, Fast Movement. However, that's impeded by medium and heavy armor. The armored hulk's Improved Armored Swiftness isn't.
If you take one of two mysteries, metal or battle, you are assured a place in the halls of awesomeness.
Metal mystery opens you up to Dance of the Blades, which increase your base speed by 10 feet further, meaning that with Lame curse and Armored Hulk, in heavy armor, you have a speed of 40 friggin feet. 40 FT!! How nuts is that?
Battle Mystery, for movement purposes, you can get Surprising Charge, meaning up to 3x per day, as an immediate action, you can MOVE up to your speed. Battle mystery is extremely combat focused however, unlike Metal which branches out into other stuff. That means you get stuff like warsight, which is essential for initiative rolls, etc.

From there, you can roll right into Rage Prophet, and heal yourself like crazy while raging, something you'd normally never be able to do. If you also wanna be a close combat jerk, you can go the eldritch heritage feat tree and work towards Ork bloodline, getting +6 inherent strength boost AND a morale bonus to your attack and damage rolls. Your call tho. Personally, I think your character is by then plenty hardcore, and you'll want as many rage powers and revelations as you can get your grubby fingers on, so you'll want to spend feats on those honestly.

For Rage prophet, a lot of people like the Beast Totem rage power. Me? For flavor purposes, I LOVE spirit totem. Why? The spirits use your Charisma as a damage modifier. Plus, they add things like 20% miss chance to ranged and melee attacks that aren't adjacent to you and can attack enemies up to 15 feet away in ANY direction. That's against all enemies. Congratulations. You've just become a crowd controller.

And as a Rage Prophet, you can be particularly annoying to ghosts because you can seriously mess them up. How friggin awesome is that? Very awesome.

Race and feat trees? I'd say half-orc and sundering/destroyer's blessing are the best. Increases your rage thanks to barbarian favored class options so you have 18 rounds of rage by level 6 barbarian rather than 12, so it saves you a feat of Extra Rage rounds. Plus, with Destroyer's Blessing, every time you sunder something, you gain a round of rage back. That means with the Spell Sunder ability, you can literally sunder magic spells and items and regain rage rounds.

With weapons, you're going to prefer to focus on two handed, so the standard arms and armor are really what you're going after. I LOVE falchion, but that's mostly for flavor. You could do it just as well with Greatsword and Greataxe. Even something like a great club is a viable choice. You're not a critical kind of guy. You're a melee kind of guy with good spellcasting and a hell of a lot of other bonuses. This build has easily the chance of being one of the more fun options around. Plus, as a half-orc, you get all sorts of FUN options by way of feats, from the deathless tree, to the rage feats, to things like Tenacious Survivor.

[Imbicatus]

666bender wrote:

monk: since i prefer not to be lawful - than martial artist is an options - and not a bad one. the 1 issue i see here is REALLY low AC, with 1d8 HP and no DR - problams in staying alive ?

It depends on how you build it. If you go for a finesse based Monk, you can have very high AC by being DEX based with a high WIS. Damage will suffer, but you can get around that with feats and your Stunning fist DC will be very high so it will actually be useful. If you play a Dwarf you'll be able to boost Wis and Con, helping AC, and HP.

[Cap. Darling]

If you want a feeling of being raised by demons and having super natural powers in a low magic setting?
I think a´Synthesist(summoner) sound like a great choice unfortunally the class is kinda OP.

[soupturtle]

A monk in a low magic setting seems like a poor idea to me. Fighters like to have magic items to hit harder and take less damage. Monks need magic items to be able to hit and survive at all. Especially a dex based monk is incredibly dependent on an amulet of mighty fists, but a normal monk is very dependent on it as well. Non-dex based monks need several magic items to get even a passable AC (at the very least a wand of mage armor, but also things like a ring of protection).

On that same line of thinking, I would say the best melee characters in a low magic setting are things like a bladebound kensai magus (no need for magic weapons or armor) or a battle oracle (spells to mimic magic weapons and armor). Antipaladins also get some of the key cleric spells that do this, so that would be an excellent choice as well.

[DeathQuaker]

I like your cavalier idea the most for a war leader, since with tactician and the teamwork feats and such they are great marshals, and stand very well on their own in combat.

If you're gonna go rage prophet, I would just do the barb/oracle... too much multiclassing beyond that is really going to bork your spellcasting, and barb and oracle have enough skills you don't need the ranger dip to round that out.

If you go the ranger route, you will eventually get hide in plain sight, so reconsider the shadowdancer dip, unless you're planning to level shadowdancer enough to benefit from its other stuff like the shadow jump. But Ranger's HIPS is better than Shadowdancer's because it's Ex rather than Su, even if it's limited to certain terrain.

Personally I would go fighter with an Intimidate/Dazzling Display build since you don't want to dump Cha. If archetypes were allowed, you could use tactician from UCo to get more skills and have more of a "leadery" feel.

[666bender]

Imbicatus wrote:

666bender wrote:

monk: since i prefer not to be lawful - than martial artist is an options - and not a bad one. the 1 issue i see here is REALLY low AC, with 1d8 HP and no DR - problams in staying alive ?

It depends on how you build it. If you go for a finesse based Monk, you can have very high AC by being DEX based with a high WIS. Damage will suffer, but you can get around that with feats and your Stunning fist DC will be very high so it will actually be useful. If you play a Dwarf you'll be able to boost Wis and Con, helping AC, and HP.

Since no pirahna strike ( not core books)

The damage will be VERY low won't it ?
I guess a dex/wis monk works mostly as either martial artist to by bass DR at least or maneuver master to not do damage but at least do some de buffs