Penalties for a Lost Hand

[David C Smith]

Hello everyone,

I have been looking through various sourcebooks to find an answer to the following question:

What penalties does a character incur when loosing a hand?
Are the penalties worse if it is the character's main hand as opposed to his off-hand?

Any information would be greatly appreciated.

Thanks,

David

[RainyDayNinja]

IIRC, the Skulls & Shackles Player's Guide has a table for all kinds of missing body parts, and the penalties they give. It's free to download, but I don't have it on me since I'm at work.

[eakratz]

According to the Skull and Shackles Player's Handbook, loss of a hand results in not being able to use two-handed items.

[Lincoln Hills]

Though I haven't seen it in PF rulebooks, there was a small set of rules in the Olden Days for 'damage to a specific body part'. I had to look it up once when a trap (in a module Gygax wrote, not me) aged a character's hand 1000 years...

To summarize the old rules in case you wish to grandfather them in: actions that must take both hands (such as wielding a greatsword) are impossible; actions in which two hands are ordinarily assumed to be in use (such as Disable Device checks) suffer a -2 penalty. Note that shields that are strapped to an arm rather than held in a hand can still be anchored to the stub.

If I recall correctly, attacking using your non-dominant hand inflicts a hefty -4 penalty. Alternately - a fun little bit of gaming the rules - the character can start using armor spikes or a spiked shield as his/her weapon of choice, and take no attack penalty. They don't do much damage, but they do more damage than missing with a good weapon.

[David C Smith]

Thank you Rainy Day, that is exactly what I was looking for.

[Cerberus Seven]

You could use the variant rules for Called Shots to the hand.

Called Shots wrote:

Hands include most extremities used for fine manipulation. Called shots to the hand are tricky (–5 penalty).

Called Shot: For 1d4 rounds, any attack rolls, damage rolls, ability checks, or skill checks made using the wounded hand take a –2 penalty, including attack and damage rolls with two-handed weapons. In addition, the target takes a –4 penalty to its CMD to resist disarm attempts, and drops its weapon (if any) on an attack roll result of a natural 1.

Critical Called Shot: A critical hit to the hand deals 1d4 points of Dexterity damage. In addition, the target drops anything it is holding in that hand unless it succeeds at a Reflex saving throw. Items held in two hands aren’t dropped, but the target still loses its grip with the injured hand. The target also suffers the effects of a called shot to the hand for 1d4 minutes.

Debilitating Blow: A debilitating blow deals 1d6 points of Dexterity damage. The blow renders the hand useless until healed unless the target succeeds at a Reflex saving throw. If the saving throw fails by 5 or more, the hand is severed or otherwise mangled such that only regeneration or similar effects can repair it. Regardless of the result of the saving throw, anything held in the wounded hand is automatically dropped, even items held in two or more hands. The target also suffers the effects of a called shot to the hand (if the hand remains usable) for 2d6 minutes.

[Zhayne]

Since losing a body part is a house rule, the penalties they get are a house rule.

[Ipslore the Red]

Zhayne wrote:

Since losing a body part is a house rule, the penalties they get are a house rule.

A shame you didn't bother to read the earlier posts about the Skulls & Shackles Player Handbook.

[Lincoln Hills]

Well, then, an optional rule.

Although I haven't seen those tables and can't help wondering just how much territory they cover...

Hermes Conrad: What's that you're hackin' off? Is it my torso? It is! My precious torso!

[Vamptastic]

If you attack someone with your severed stump, is that an unarmed attack? If you specialize in unarmed attacks, do you still get bonuses for it? Can you make grapple attacks with two arm stumps, via RAW?

[Alex Cunningham]

My character lost his arm a few levels ago. My GM (quite generously, I think) assessed the following penalties:
- the PC can no longer use two-handed items/weapons
- the PC takes a -2 to STR
- the PC will suffer circumstantial penalties to activities that require both arms (like climbing or swimming)

[Kazaan]

Vamptastic wrote:

If you attack someone with your severed stump, is that an unarmed attack? If you specialize in unarmed attacks, do you still get bonuses for it? Can you make grapple attacks with two arm stumps, via RAW?

1) Is a severed stump an unarmed strike: Yes.

2) If you have bonuses towards unarmed strikes, do they count: Yes.
3) Can you make a grapple combat maneuver if you have no hands: Yes, but you take -4 on the check on top of any other penalties adjudicated for being hand-less.

[ShadowcatX]

On a side note, outside of the context of two weapon fighting, off hand and main hand have no distinction in the rules. Inside the context of two weapon fighting, you can switch off hand and main hand from round to round.

[lemeres]

Alex Cunningham wrote:

My character lost his arm a few levels ago. My GM (quite generously, I think) assessed the following penalties:

- the PC can no longer use two-handed items/weapons
- the PC takes a -2 to STR
- the PC will suffer circumstantial penalties to activities that require both arms (like climbing or swimming)

The -2 to strength thing is what I don't get with a lot of these kinds of rulings. I mean, if a character went around carrying one handed weapon like a long sword or a light weapon like a short sword, how would it ever make a difference? They were only using one hand anyway.

Also, what about monks? They can just go about kicking everything, so why the negative there?

[Ipslore the Red]

lemeres wrote:

Alex Cunningham wrote:

My character lost his arm a few levels ago. My GM (quite generously, I think) assessed the following penalties:

- the PC can no longer use two-handed items/weapons
- the PC takes a -2 to STR
- the PC will suffer circumstantial penalties to activities that require both arms (like climbing or swimming)

The -2 to strength thing is what I don't get with a lot of these kinds of rulings. I mean, if a character went around carrying one handed weapon like a long sword or a light weapon like a short sword, how would it ever make a difference? They were only using one hand anyway.

Also, what about monks? They can just go about kicking everything, so why the negative there?

The same reason that wearing nothing but a breastplate offers protection to your entire body unless you use the optional called shots rule. Abstraction. You lost some muscle mass, therefore you are weaker.