What happens to a Con - and Cha 0 creature?


Rules Questions


Are they unconscious or dead?


Dead, unless they have hitpoints from another source than Charisma - then they're unconscious.


Since Con has been reduced to 0, they're dead.


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They're unconscious AND dead.

Which, admittedly, is a redundancy.

Liberty's Edge

Con isn't reduced to 0 in this case, it is -, which generally means not alive, and if they are undead means they determine hp off charisma. I'm not sure what the actual rule would be, is there an actual method of doing this?

A creature with a 0 charisma score isn't self aware to my knowledge, so I'd probably leave it at that.


BillyGoat wrote:
Since Con has been reduced to 0, they're dead.

Con - is not the same thing as Con 0.

By RAW, only reducing Constitution to 0 causes death. Charisma is never mentioned. Whether or not an undead creature with a Con - dies at Charisma 0 depends on how you interpret the following:

Quote:
No Constitution score. Undead use their Charisma score in place of their Constitution score when calculating hit points, Fortitude saves, and any special ability that relies on Constitution (such as when calculating a breath weapon's DC).


They're unconscious. That's what happens when you hit 0 CHA.

If we're talking about Undead, CHA doesn't replace their CON score. They use their CHA score instead of CON when calculating hit points, saves and special abilities, but that's it.

Now if the CHA damage reduces their hit points below zero, then they're dead.

If we're talking about Constructs, well, they're immune to CHA damage, so nothing happens.


Undead are immune to ability damage. It'd have to be drained. Regardless, the rules are silent on this scenario. Taking the "only assume with what the rules DO say" approach, I would think they would be unconscious until their damage healed naturally if they have an intelligence score. Unintelligent undead would remain unconscious until healed by some other source.


Buri wrote:
Undead are immune to ability damage. It'd have to be drained.

Incorrect. Undead are totally immune to ability drain. They are only immune to ability damage to their physical ability scores - undead can still take ability damage to their mental scores, and Charisma is a mental score.


Yup. Had that backwards. Charisma 0 is still unconscious. Unintelligent undead don't heal naturally though so they'd still have to be healed from an outside source. Intelligent would be back in a couple days max due to double healing rates from "total" bed rest.


Oh.

I thought he meant 'Con-and-Cha 0'. I thought the - was a hyphen, not a negative/not applicable symbol.

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