So there are multiple ways to reduce Armor Check Penalties on armor, the question is do they all stack?
Masterwork armor is -1 ACP
Mithril is -3 ACP
there is a trait for -1 ACP
and the fighter class feature for reducing ACP
Do these all stack together? or do some of them override others?
Ah ok thank you
Armor ointment (alchemical item) can reduce your ACP by another -1, up to a max of -1!
Even useful for people with 0 ACP!
Yes, mithral, traits(there are 2 to my knowledge), and fighter reduction all stacks. Additionally there is a magic armor quality called Comfort that reduces it by one and stacks with the others. Its possible to hit 0 ACP and wear something without penalty, but ACP never goes above 0 and become beneficial.
Armor ointment (alchemical item) can reduce your ACP by another -1, up to a max of -1!
Even useful for people with 0 ACP!
How is it still useful for someone without an armor check penalty?
How is it still useful for someone without an armor check penalty?
Because it has a maximum of -1 ACP. So if you are wearing mithral chain shirt (ACP 0) and apply armor ointment to it, your ACP would now be -1.
This means that you would add +1 to all skill checks that are normally penalized by ACP. So +1 climb, swim, disable device, etc...
But on a number line reducing -4 acp to 0 then increasing it again with ointment would make it a +1 on the line?
But on a number line reducing -4 acp to 0 then increasing it again with ointment would make it a +1 on the line?
Already passed its minimum. It wouldn't have any effect. That's how I read it anyway. ACP stops at 0 as far I know. It wouldn't make much sense that you can do something better in your mithral breastplate because you put oil on it than just doing it shirtless.
Hm I see what you are saying. I guess it makes sense. Still, helps if your ACP is higher than -1 then :)
Oh ya, the ointment is still amazing. Thank you for letting me know about that. Although Mithril breastplate for a large creature will cost me an arm and a leg (Not including trying to put it on my cat!) with the ointment she would have no penalties wearing it!
Oh ya, the ointment is still amazing. Thank you for letting me know about that. Although Mithril breastplate for a large creature will cost me an arm and a leg (Not including trying to put it on my cat!) with the ointment she would have no penalties wearing it!
Minimum -1 would mean you couldn't use it to lower it to 0.
Right, which is why the great majority of people will go for mithral chain shirt barding. Affordable, and if you have a cat especially with max dex. You may still hit the max dex on a breastplate, it will be hard on a chain shirt.
Small cat as 23 if you keep it small. You'd have to resort to dark leaf if you ever increase its dexterity. Big cats on the other hand are good with a mithral chain shirt because its not likely they'll get above a 22 dex.
I'm baffled as to how a 3 star gm could think that you could get your ACP so low that it adds to those skills. That doesn't make a lick of sense.
Stars don't mean a person knows everything. Just that they DM a lot. Everyone makes mistakes. It also isn't a measure of how many or what books you own, nor how much you play out of society, nor how much you play from a player's perspective, etc. That's a talk for another day.
In other news, armor ointment looks nifty. Might help that guy in full plate jump or climb a rope...
there is a trait for -1 ACP
There are two traits of different types which can stack.
there is a trait for -1 ACPThere are two traits of different types which can stack.
Which ones? I only know of Armor Expert.
I thought trait bonuses didn't stack.
They don't.
Many traits grant a new type of bonus: a “trait” bonus. Trait bonuses do not stack—they're intended to give player characters a slight edge, not a secret backdoor way to focus all of a character's traits on one type of bonus and thus gain an unseemly advantage. It's certainly possible, for example, that somewhere down the line, a “Courageous” trait might be on the list of dwarf race traits, but just because this trait is on both the dwarf race traits list and the basic combat traits list doesn't mean you're any more brave if you choose both versions than if you choose only one.
However, the Armor Expert trait doesn't grant a trait bonus to anything. So if there is another trait that lowers ACP, then they should stack.
Armor Expert: You have worn armor as long as you can remember, either as part of your training to become a knight's squire or simply because you were seeking to emulate a hero. Your childhood armor wasn't the real thing as far as protection, but it did encumber you as much as real armor would have, and you've grown used to moving in such suits with relative grace. When you wear armor of any sort, reduce that suit's armor check penalty by 1, to a minimum check penalty of 0.
Which ones? I only know of Armor Expert.there is a trait for -1 ACPThere are two traits of different types which can stack.
Sargavan Guard
Source Inner Sea Primer pg. 19Requirement(s) Sargava
You served in the Sargavan Guard, either as a colonial sub-praetor or as a native Mwangi regular, and have grown accustomed to marching in hot temperatures while wearing armor. When you wear armor of any sort, reduce the armor check penalty by 1, to a minimum penalty of 0.
Just like Armour Expert, there's no indication that it's any sort of typed bonus, (It's not even a bonus really; just a penalty reduction) so they stack just fine.
I don't think its relevant in this case, but remember that you can only have 1 trait per trait type. This looks like a regional trait, cannot remember under what armour expert fell though, but it wasn't regional :P
Side Note:
Must admit another reason I love monks is in the cases where the heavy armour guys struggle to swim, climb or jump. The monk succeeds easily with just one rank in the skill. Did have a session where I struggled to swim (still haven't put a rank in it by level 3 for some reason!)