Alright, so I'd like to poll some of you folks smarter than me on some of your Ideas for a cool Free Hand Fighter. I'm planning out a young "Naive" swordsman guy whom revers Cayden Cailean and hopes to one day take the Test of the Starstone himself. (Probably not literally :P) The main reason I ask is because it seems like most of the discussion on the class is pretty old at this point and I was curious what new options might be viable. So far I've thought that a dip into Shadowdancer or into Monk (Many Styles) (maybe both?) are beneficial, I'd like for him to use a Bastard Sword (with Exotic Proficiency), this is kind of a matter of fluff and aesthetic that I want to capture, so I don't really want to budge on it. I'm not specifically looking for a way to min/max, more cool ideas. I'm pretty sure mostly everyone else in the campaign I'm about to start is going to be a new player so I'm using this as an opportunity to try something new myself.
Also, I had a question, even though I said I don't specifically want to min/max I would like to get the most out of what I end up with, and I was wondering if anyone has a graceful way to scale Singleton.
At any rate, I appreciate any advice you all can give, thanks! ^_^
How attached to the bastard sword are you? If you instead use an aldori dueling sword you could build towards the swordlord prestige class.
As a point of Cayden pride, I think he'll actually end up being a priest of Cayden (as much as one can be a priest of Cayden at least) I would rather keep it. Maybe go further into monk and try and get the most out of Elemental Fist (with snake Style, and for Versatilty when it comes to varying DR's) from many styles by going into two weapon fighting and unarmed feat lines.
But for the sake of discussion I'd gladly hear your thoughts on the Sword Lord prestige, I'm not entirely against being convinced.
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Unless your game permits otherwise, Monks have to be Lawful, and Cayden Cailean is Chaotic. If this is an Organized Play thing, Monk levels are out of the question. On the other hand, though plenty of home games would permit fighters to worship a deity of a totally different alignment, it would be far, far rarer to permit someone to be a priest of any sort of a god further than one step from their alignment (that much is in RAW, after all, and if I'm not mistaken, has been since 1st Edition).
Regarding "Cayden pride" His favored weapon is the rapier, not the bastard sword - not that that should stop you from using the bastard sword, but you ought to know.
Why not just take the fighter class straight up the whole way through? The class has seen many impressive high-level goodies added by 3.75 Edition, and since you're bothering to commit to a single weapon of choice anyways, you have all that much more reason to look forward to the class's 20th-level ability.
If I'm not mistaken, you can take a lot of the Style Feats from Ultimate Combat without bothering with monk levels.
Yeah, I was aware of Cayden's own choice of weapon, but he's a laid back kind of guy that I think will overlook it. As for the priest thing though, I hadn't even connected the dots (I was just thinking about the features without the rules, silly me) about that in relation to the Forced Monk alignment so thanks for bringing that to my attention. A lot of times while making a character it helps just as much to know what you can't do as what you can! ^_^
I guess my question now is, do you think it worth trying to capitalize on Unarmed, or is that spreading my self thinner than I ought? Or I guess, the deeper question is, where can I get a spot of versatility, or should I even worry about it?
Martial Artist monk archetype can be non-lawful iirc.
Random Cayden related stuff:
Urban Barbarian
Drunken Brute Barbarian, and drunken-style Rage Powers
Chevalier mini prestige class
Do you actually mean the Free Hand Fighter archetype? Or just the concept of using a one-handed weapon only and no shield.
I do mean that archetype, but if there are other options to consider, for just one weapon and no shield I'd love to know what they are. I'm going to look into the Urban Barbarian now, I love having options to consider, thanks!
Ooo, right off the bat the Chevalier seems to capture the air of young bravado, thanks for pointing it out to me!
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Given that the Martial Artist sets a precedent for non-Lawful Monks, see if you can beg your DM to permit a non-Lawful Drunken Master.
Given that I'm already going to try and convince him to give me a Wayfinder as an heirloom rather than the free single masterwork item, I'm not sure how much I want to push other things. (I'm thinking it's a stretch, but nothing Ventured, yeah? It's an Inner Sea setting by the way.
I appreciate the suggestion all the same though, I haven't worked with him before so I'm not sure how amenable he is yet, haha.
Unless your game permits otherwise, Monks have to be Lawful, and Cayden Cailean is Chaotic.Monks only have to be lawful to take levels in Monk. Monks do not need to be lawful to use their abilities.
So, the first couple of levels are taken as Monk; at which point the character realizes a lawful lifestyle is a load of crap. He then switches to neutral, starts partying in the name of Cayden, and beats down anyone that causes trouble with a flurry of mugs to the face.
Haha, that's quite a convenient work around, if I do end up going that route I may make use of it! If we weren't starting at level one it would make for great backstory too! Something along the lines of; "... he found his faith in Drink amongst friends rather than the monastic teachings..." Alas.
Sadly heirloom weapon no longer gives you the actual weapon, you still have to pay for it. Might make your argument to convince him a fair deal harder.
As for the bastard sword, Go for it! You stated that this isnt supposed to be pure optimization so let yourself have that bit of flair!
A free hand fighters Weapon Training progresses slower than normal (every 6 levels) so gloves of dueling will help out lots (assuming they are allowed).
If, for however reason you are allowed to use MOMS, look at going panther/snake style to make your off hand particularly deadly (and attack OFTEN) or the traditional crane/turtle style, Especially since you cannot wear medium or heavy armour your AC tends to be lower. Panther style can be easily attained even without monk dips.
Your AC will struggle since you will have light armour max and will most likely have middling Dex so you can focus on str. You can remedy this by going combat expertise, dodge, and/or crane style. If you did go a dip in monk, that would help your AC out as well (but you risk going into MAD territory).
A different idea all together is to Cha fighting! Use Cha to bluff in combat, do performance combat, terrify your foes easier access to eldritch heritage. It can be loads of fun and a very different play style. It probably wont work to well with levels in monk, but a level dip in Thug (rogue) makes it quite the terrifying prospect. There are plenty of good ideas to go off of in this thread and this thread. Best still it is quite thematically appropriate!
There was a great guide for a swordlord build that you might want to check out for good ideas as well :) Its one of my favorites.
Well thats what I got right now, let me think some more and figure out what I can come up with :)
Huh. Just had an idea... a free hand fighter (possibly with monk dip) That runs around attacking with his bastard sword in one hand (with vital strike!) and provoking lots of AOOs with his erratic movement and getting retaliatory strikes and AOOs of his own with panther and/or snake styles!
You wouldnt even need TWF as you would only attack with standard attacks and lots of AOOs (usually).
High wis would grant you plenty of panther strikes, higher AC (monk), higher will save (a fighters bane), higher precepton, higher sense motive and you could even nab wisdom in the flesh for a good skill. Medium/high dex would grant you decent AC, good amount of AOOs for snake style and a bit of initiative.
I like the idea a lot!
2 levels monk, X free hand fighter.
traits: heirloom weapon (bastard sword), wis in the flesh (or something for sense motive)(Mizu ki hikari rebel for bonus unarmed strike damage)
Feats: snake style, combat reflexes, panther style
lvl 2. snake fang
lvl 3. panther claw, power attack (first level fighter)
Go from there :D
at level 1 you could 1 hand/2 hand your bastard sword, flurry with your empty fist, sense motive instead of AC for a swift, provoke an attack to get an attack for a swift and have a few AOOs in reserve.
At level 2 you would add extra AOOs on every miss and an extra attack on one of the misses if you wanted.
level 3 you would be able to run around provoking crazy amounts of AOOs and get the same amounts of attacks, get extra AOOs off any misses and a free one then do your regular attack after that... I like this build :)
after that you can grab vital strike around 5/6 if you want as you probably wont be full attacking all that often, some time down the road get gloves of dueling, brawling on your armour, possibly an AOMF or greater magic fang cast on you, a monks robe, or if you want something funny, giant fist gauntlets and push everybody around chaotically >:D
Or just up your bastard sword and have fun with it :)
Really you would have lots of feats coming up that you could do a few different things if you so chose. Maybe try for lightning stance and just run around like crazy!? How about racial heritage: Goblin and get roll with it? Now you can get kicked around and strike people as you fly!! Ohh the ideas this gives....
Did I mention that I really like this build?
Not to hijack the thread... but why are you suggesting Snake instead of Crane? Crane Wings automatically deflects a melee without an action vs. Snake making a Sense Motive check your new AC for melee and ranged? Is it the feat prereqs for Crane? The piercing or not fighting defensively?
thanks
Hmmm. Mostly its for snake fang. Making free AOOs every time someone misses me in nice. Factor in a decent dex, high wis to AC, light armour and they should be missing quite a bit, especially on iterative attacks or TWF. Aside from that, the other options that snake style grants you are good as that. Options. Sense motive instead of AC for that big hit, extra attack attached to that AOO if you want to, and it even gives you something to do outside of combat (sense motive) and its a good one. The fact that panther style gets its own pool of AOOs and you should be able to get plenty of them. Add in a combat maneuver like tripping or bull rushing or shield bashing (if you had a shield) and you could conceivably add more while debuffing at the same time.
And it pairs well with panther procing plenty of AOO itself.
Crane style only adds extra AC, deflecting an attack every round and a single AOO.
I dunno I guess its offense vs defence. The sense motive out of combat cinches it for me personally.
Edit: I forgot about the piercing aspect. I guess that just adds another small layer of versitility.
I think I like the bull rush idea most. Get sent flying in a barfight and send EVERYBODY flying :)
Are you aware of the Super Genius Games Guide to the Talented Fighter?
It basically splits up all the fighter archetypes into talents you can mix and match. This is particularly good for the Free Hand fighter because you can add in some of the basic options for free handers, and some of the better options from say the mobile fighter. You could, using these rules make a free hand fighter that is almost as good as the more optimal attack methods (2handing or two weapon fighting)
Alright, so I'd like to poll some of you folks smarter than me on some of your Ideas for a cool Free Hand Fighter. I'm planning out a young "Naive" swordsman guy whom revers Cayden Cailean and hopes to one day take the Test of the Starstone himself. (Probably not literally :P) The main reason I ask is because it seems like most of the discussion on the class is pretty old at this point and I was curious what new options might be viable. So far I've thought that a dip into Shadowdancer or into Monk (Many Styles) (maybe both?) are beneficial, I'd like for him to use a Bastard Sword (with Exotic Proficiency), this is kind of a matter of fluff and aesthetic that I want to capture, so I don't really want to budge on it. I'm not specifically looking for a way to min/max, more cool ideas. I'm pretty sure mostly everyone else in the campaign I'm about to start is going to be a new player so I'm using this as an opportunity to try something new myself.
Also, I had a question, even though I said I don't specifically want to min/max I would like to get the most out of what I end up with, and I was wondering if anyone has a graceful way to scale Singleton.
At any rate, I appreciate any advice you all can give, thanks! ^_^
Well two points straight off:
1) The Free Hand Fighter is practically MADE for the Crane Style feat chain. It requires a hand free, he has one as a requirement. Same is true of the duelist class which spins off the Free Hand Fighter beautifully.2) Why a bastard sword? Yes, it's big and has d10 damage dice. So what? The real damage comes from static bonuses and threat ranges. You want an exotic weapon, take the katana, falcatta, or Aldori dueling sword. In fact with the latter you can finesse and go duelist...
Alright, so I'd like to poll some of you folks smarter than me on some of your Ideas for a cool Free Hand Fighter. I'm planning out a young "Naive" swordsman guy whom revers Cayden Cailean and hopes to one day take the Test of the Starstone himself. (Probably not literally :P) The main reason I ask is because it seems like most of the discussion on the class is pretty old at this point and I was curious what new options might be viable. So far I've thought that a dip into Shadowdancer or into Monk (Many Styles) (maybe both?) are beneficial, I'd like for him to use a Bastard Sword (with Exotic Proficiency), this is kind of a matter of fluff and aesthetic that I want to capture, so I don't really want to budge on it. I'm not specifically looking for a way to min/max, more cool ideas. I'm pretty sure mostly everyone else in the campaign I'm about to start is going to be a new player so I'm using this as an opportunity to try something new myself.
Also, I had a question, even though I said I don't specifically want to min/max I would like to get the most out of what I end up with, and I was wondering if anyone has a graceful way to scale Singleton.
At any rate, I appreciate any advice you all can give, thanks! ^_^
Well two points straight off:
1) The Free Hand Fighter is practically MADE for the Crane Style feat chain. It requires a hand free, he has one as a requirement. Same is true of the duelist class which spins off the Free Hand Fighter beautifully.2) Why a bastard sword? Yes, it's big and has d10 damage dice. So what? The real damage comes from static bonuses and threat ranges. You want an exotic weapon, take the katana, falcatta, or Aldori dueling sword. In fact with the latter you can finesse and go duelist...
The bastard sword is a reason of fluff and fun, as I said.
A different idea all together is to Cha fighting! Use Cha to bluff in combat, do performance combat, terrify your foes easier access to eldritch heritage. It can be loads of fun and a very different play style. It probably wont work to well with levels in monk, but a level dip in Thug (rogue) makes it quite the terrifying prospect. There are plenty of good ideas to go off of in this thread and this thread. Best still it is quite thematically appropriate!
This sounds like it might work well, since I've had the distinct feeling that I'll end up as the face of the group. As to those who suggested Eldritch Heritage, would Abyssal be the bloodline to go with for that (for the STR at Improved)?
Ooo, here's a question, the DM is giving us a free masterwork (sorry I didn't clarify that earlier), even though Heirloom Weapon usually specifies a standard weapon could I use the masterwork one I'm already getting as said heirloom weapon. And am I allowed to choose an exotic with Heirloom weapon int he first place?
As a human would it be worth saccing skilled and the bonus feat for Dual Talent, which is an additional +2 to one ability score? Sorry to contradict myself about min/maxing... it's just hard not to think about numbers when they're staring you in the face. lol
Assuming you are getting your masterwork weapon at the same time you get the trait, I see no reason why not. Yes you can choose an exotic weapon with heirloom weapon, thats kinda its whole point :)
As for which bloodline, I would probably suggest orc over abyssal due to touch of rage being more useful in general than claws would. If its a fluff reason, go for the abyssal! They arnt that different.
Two other options to go rather than abyssal/orc would be rakshasa or imperious. They are more out of combat orientated but if you are the party face, being able to bluff through magical detection could be huge. Later on the ability to either read minds (allowing for phenomenal insight on what to say in a particular situation) or cloak your thoughts from those who would pry is nice. If it actually got to that level, at will alter self is increadably potent.
Imperious adds some nice skills as class skills and adds your cha mod to them (probably pretty high if you are doing cha fighting). This one would mostly be just for a short game.
Welcome to Charisma fighting!
Edit: As for Dual talent, the extra +2 could be quite useful especially if you manage to get 2 stats pretty high, but I figure for a Cha fighter, getting all the skill points you can would take greater precedent. You could then use the bonus feat for focused study if you plan on going into eldritch heritage early and get the free bonus feats later. Or just use it to get your main schick going quicker. In this case I dont think dual talent is better (sometimes it is!).
Also just checked, bluff and diplomacy are not class skills so you would probably want to pick them up elsewhere, either a trait, imperious bloodline or a dip in thug for the frightening effect (and massive extra skills!).
Well barring the group falling apart it is intended for 1-20. With such a High Cha would it be worth it to try and pick up Sneak Attack?
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At least until such time as they introduce Elf/Gnome/godsknowwhatelse Bloodlines, I call bullshit on the idea that orcish heritage, of all things, could lead to sorcerous power, and would not take it for that reason alone - especially since OP clearly cares about more than just mechanical optimization.
How about Destined, Fey, or one of the Genie Bloodlines? They'd could all fit your character.
At the very least take a look at the Sword Saint Samurai Archetype, which gives up the Mount for a vicious Iaijutsu Strike. I do think the parameters for its use are too restrictive, I would not call it unreasonable to bargain for edits that make it more generally useful (applicable to targets who haven't been Challenged, standard rather than full-round action, permit it to be combined with a full attack but only apply the bonus damage to the first attack whether it hits or not, etc.).
Pick up sneak attack? How so? Do you mean by going rogue? Fighting Via feinting would allow you to get off more sneak attacks but I would not suggest going any deeper in rogue as this is a free hand fighter after all!
Yeah, that's exactly what I meant. If not going very far in, I'm gonna guess that 1d6 sneak attack damge by itself wouldn't be worth it and I would be better off with a deeper dip somewhere else, or none at all.
Yeah, I saw that. And it is one of the options I'm considering. I gotta say I've certainly got lots of ideas now, it's a little overwhelming but I'm enjoying the discussion!
Dang pazo ate my post...
I would suggest against going deeper in rogue. The only multiclassing I would suggest would be a single level of thug, a single level of cavalier or none at all. Just stick with fighter :)
The sword saint archetype is awful :( Pity as I really like the flavour :(
You are almost better going any other archetype and ditching the mount somewhere (have a feast!). That said, a dip in cavalier for the cockatrice order is good. Standard action dazzling display is loads better than a full round action.
Just noticed silver tongued racial trait. It might be worth it as a replacement for skilled. Might. Changing attitudes by 3 is really nice.
Dont forget to take Racial heritage: Damphir for natural charmer! That thing is potent.
Why are you going for eldritch heritage? The charisma requirement cuts into your budget for wisdom, which helps your worst save. You also only have so many feats, even as a fighter. You want either Crane or Turtle style (turtle combos better with other styles using style mastery if you're not dipping MoMS). You may want a maneuver feat chain. You probably want iron will and maybe improved iron will. You want the specialization chain, especially if you want to use a specific weapon for thematic reasons. In an ideal world you'd love to have some of the archery feats. Picking up a bloodline should be way down your to do list unless you're building for high level dpr.
I'm not committed to anything yet, it was suggested here though and I figure any idea is at least worth exploring.
Why are you going for eldritch heritage? The charisma requirement cuts into your budget for wisdom, which helps your worst save. You also only have so many feats, even as a fighter. You want either Crane or Turtle style (turtle combos better with other styles using style mastery if you're not dipping MoMS). You may want a maneuver feat chain. You probably want iron will and maybe improved iron will. You want the specialization chain, especially if you want to use a specific weapon for thematic reasons. In an ideal world you'd love to have some of the archery feats. Picking up a bloodline should be way down your to do list unless you're building for high level dpr.
The high wisdom would be for the snake/panther/crane style. High wisdom would help with increased AC (via monk), extra AOOs for panther, better snake fang defence, higher sense motive, higher preception ect.
The cha fighter would have higher cha instead of wis and would fight with feinting, bluffing, intimidating, demoralizing and performance combat. It would also do well as the party face outside of combat and would love as many skill points as possible. This one would take the eldritch heritage for something like orc/abyssal, rakshasa or imperious, often for more out of combat utility.
The two are different builds focusing on different stats.
I'd take the one level dip in cleric of Cayden. Take Travel for the +10' move, Agile Feet and Longstrider which are absolute gold dust with cherries and cream on top. Otherwise Chaos (the domain power is pretty good for 1st level) or Strength (Enlarge Person and the power is OK). You don't need a whole lot of Wisdom as you won't be casting offensive spells. And then of course you get to play with wands and scrolls, which is never a bad thing. And you get to take advantage of all those Personal buffs.
Is Cleric of Cayden actually a thing? :o I'm gonna think myself to death here. Answer me straight, since the more I think about it the more I can't decide. I don't want the Free Hand fighter to just be a thing about him that's kind of there. I feel like the best way to go about it would be to aim for the MoMS, because while the CHA Fighter actually does sound really cool I don't really see how it takes advantage of Free Hand Fighter.
Sorry if I'm being kind of a nuisance, I've actually gotta have the character ready by this Saturday and I'm just having a hard time. lol
So I just got a hold of the DM on Skype and he said he'd let me take Monk levels with no Alignment restriction, which obviously opens up my possibilities here.
Whatever you do, don't use Free Hand Fighter archetype. It's awful.
I agree w/ others; the only truly amazing "only for 1-handers" stuff in PF is Crane Wing and Dervish Dance, so I suggest doing both of those. If you do dip MoMS, you can get Crane Wing *and* Snake Fang, a match made in heaven. If doing so, though, I would use the bonus feat for Snake Fang (Snake Sidewind sucks to a ridiculous degree; plus...screw waiting till 9th level!) and acquire Crane Wing on your own merits. If you dipped MoMS for 2 levels and spaced them out properly, you could get Wing and Fang with each of those bonus feat, of course.
Never waste a MoMS bonus feat on the base style feat (ie, earn them on your own), that's like spending $100 on a pack of gum. The advantage is getting to take the latter feats early and w/o other pre-reqs; don't squander that.
Martial Versatility + Dervish Dance would let me rock my bastard sword and free up some of my 20 point buy to put more into dex as well, yeah?
Or perhaps I could make up my own Feat to try and get the same effect (which I'd run by the DM), maybe have Weapon finesse and Focus as a prereq, for the sake of losing something to gain something?
Please slap me if I'm on the wrong track entirely, or if this just sounds too silly to be feasible.
Oh and @GoboHorde, If you're still watching this thread I sent a PM to discuss some things further.
Martial Versatility + Dervish Dance would let me rock my bastard sword and free up some of my 20 point buy to put more into dex as well, yeah?
Ahhha! I like it! Ya that would be a fine work-around, pity you have to take a feat tax just to do it but at least its possible :)
As for performance combat not really doing much for the free hand fighter, well like StreamOfTheSky said, it really does suck... Having said that, you stated that you were playing with some newer people and that you wanted to use the archetype so I am trying to see what we can do despite it being bad and unsynergistic. Cha fighting doesnt really do anything for the archetype itself, but it can give you plenty to do outside of combat (which PS enjoys a lot of) and allow you to debuff/terrify foes in combat. Performance combat does not actually need to be used with a crowd around, there is the preforming combatant feat that allows you to use it at any combat.Relevant and correct stuff...
I agree with pretty much everything with a few exceptions.
Power attack is good. pirana strike works just as good if you go the dervish bastard sword route.As for style feats, again, it depends on your style. Crane style undoubtedly adds loads more to your AC and overall defence (you can become nigh unhitable) and snapping turtle adds even more. These are GREAT defensive options, high AC, deflect 1 attack, grappling 2 handers, and 1 or 2 AOOs. Again great defensive.
Panther/snake is more OFFENSIVE. Using sense motive instead of AC is just an option, not the main trick. Snake fang is its main trick, granting AOOs every time someone misses you and an OPTION for yet another attack. Panther style grants you AOOs every time someone attacks you and pulls it from its own pool of AOO based on your wisdom. The fact that monks add their wis bonus to AC helps both sides equally. With this pairing you get AOOs every time someone attacks you, AOOs every time someone misses you, an extra attack as an OPTION, using sense motive instead of an attack as an OPTION, and naturally paves the way for a good sense motive/perception skills via snake style and a high wis, again allowing you to do something out side of combat. It is just more utility overall. Side note, there are times when sense motive instead of AC can be useful like if you lose some of your AC for whatever reason, against touch attacks, or if you ever get caught without your armour or somesuch. Panther style also be earned very early.
Crane/snake is a good combination of the two types and pretty good in of itself.
Good call about the style master, that is a great feat! Starting in snake style or crane style is a huge bonus.
Just a quick note.
If you do want to go the dervish bastard route do be aware of its prereqs.
You need to be at least lvl 2 fighter and have weapon finness for dervish dance.
You need to be at least lvl 4 fighter to get martial versatility.
This means that you would probably have to start as a fighter and get weapon finness lvl 1, D dance lvl 2 and martial versatility lvl 4 for the quickest full effect.
How effective are you then?
Lvl1. you can swing any weapon with your (probably dumped) Str or hit with a light weapon (you are still using str for damage)
Lvl2/3. you can swing your bastard sword with your str mods OR a scimitar with your good dex mods.
Lvl4. Now you can use your bastard sword to full effect :D If you are starting at lvl 1, this can be a long time of suck before you get your fun going :(
Also if you are going to design your own feat, just alter Dervish dance to work with the bastard sword when used 1 handed. you do loose out options and feats (3 of them!!) if you go this way. I would advise against homebrew feats, but if you feel confident you can ask your gm about it.
I'm fine with a bit of waiting before things get good, to be honest I'd rather be relevant in the long term than the short after all. ^_^ As a matter of Fluff I could even use a bow until my character "feels strong enough to wield his handed down weapon"or some such.
If that's the case, you're almost dishonoring your god by not taking the opportunity to be a Drunken Master. Almost.
I just looked and Drunken Master and Many Styles don't step on the same thing, but it would require a deeper dip into monk to take advantage of it, at least 3 or 5, but does that sound like fun and flavorful or what? It's starting to sound really neat.
Yeah, I could definitely see taking it to three to get the maximum bonus out of Singleton at 17 Fighter, and for occasional AoO immune 5 foot steps via drunk ki.
I really wouldn't call snake an "armed" style. The immediate action AC replacer is a poor subsitute for just having good AC for all attacks, and the main attraction of the style, Snake Fang, only delivers unarmed counter attacks (unlike Crane Riposte, which is any weapon).
Like I said, Snake/Crane is my favorite combo by far. But I'd never consider snake a good style if seeking to avoid unarmed strike use...
Is Cleric of Cayden actually a thing? :o
Well, yeah. It's a cleric. Spells and domains and stuff. Of Cayden Cailean. You know, him, the one you profess to follow.
The monk dips suggest that you want decent Wisdom, which is good for clerics. And if you have a hand free, that's quite useful for casting spells. You'll be getting a bit MAD, but that's a given with monks.
I'd probably leave the dip for a few levels depending on what Monk you're taking and what armour you wear; somewhere in the 5th-8th region. It also depends on what other PCs are in the party.
There's no need to be so snippety friend, for all I knew Cleric of Cayden was some 3rd party or campaign specific Archetype I had never heard o is all. ^_^
@Atarlost, so would I better off not worrying about Dex after all?
@Mudfoot, so Are you suggesting Fighter/Monk/Cleric? That sounds kind of cool but I just want to make sure we're on the same page. :)