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I'm looking to make and assassin themed character. Highly mobile, highly efficient, and a master with his twin daggers(one the black blade, the other a force athame)... Not I've been contemplating how best to build him. The dual archetype is my primary class, but I'm willing to dip others, even fairly substantial dips, if they fit the theme and give him that efficient killer optimization. Ninja? Knifemaster? Monk? Ranger?
Race has not been selected at all yet, do I'm wide open for the best suggestion to pull this off. I'd considered elf, but I'm willing to play just about anything for this character. He was raised in an assassins guild/temple from an extremely young age.
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Spellblade's don't use spellstrike if I remember right.
As for what I'm wanting to do, stealth is a must for obvious reasons. I'm wanting him to have high mobility and the ability to assassinate(hence ninja being suggested). For a look/feel, I'm leaning towards him being very similar to Ezio/Connor from the assassin's creed games.
One thing I'd recommend, if traits are allowed, is the River Rat trait which gives you a free damage bonus to dagger attacks.
Maybe dipping one level in rogue would also be nice, to get you a bunch of class skills that are thematic for assassins, like stealth, disable device, and sleight of hand. You could also go into the knife master archetype, which makes your sneak attacks with daggers deal d8 damage.
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Why magus then ? Ezio is not a spellcaster.
I feel like you will love this awesome class, as it fills exactly what you may want to play. SGG's designers are known for the balance and quality of their work.
i can tell you that the fetchling race fits your idea vary well, but there are also others
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It depends on the kind of versatility you want, again. TWFing with a magus, especially multiclassed with another 2/3 BAB class, is the best way to ensure you will be versatile but never hit anything because of crippling penalties. Especially since the spellblade depends on your magus spell levels.
Your best bet within Paizo rules would be the ninja if you want to blend stealth with some mystic, handy powers. Maybe even arcane trickster, focusing on some touch attack spells.
Otherwise, stick to magus levels, select spells complementing your gameplay and get yourself a trait for Stealth as a class skill, the trait for additional dagger damage plus some metamagic feats to cast without drawing attention.
Dervish Dance if that is available.
Maybe a Scout Ninja for 10 Levels.
Can you even Cast when using TWF?
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His spells would mainly be for mobility and resourcefulness, and buffing himself. As well as cleaning up messes.
I'm leaning towards Magus 10/Ninja 10 if anyone knows of a good build one. I'm pretty sure I've settled on fetchling for his race, possibly with the subtle manipulator alternate racial trait.
Basically, alternate between the two classes or start with Ninja to get Assassinate Quickly.
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I've been poking around my books all morning, thinking up some ideas, trying to build this character how I'm envisioning him.
Right now, as he stands, I'm looking at Rogue(knifemaster) X + Alchemist(vivisectionist) 1 + Magus(Bladebound/Spellblade) X + Red Mantis Assassin X
Saw tooth saber as his black blade, force athame in his off hand. I'm wondering if I should try to squeeze in a level or two of shadow dancer, but I'm unsure if it's worth it. Still deciding traits and feats, fetchling will be his race.
That much multiclassing into 3/4 BAB classes will certainly hurt your to-hit bonus and make sure you're not very good at the specialty of any of those classes.
I'm not sure about the Red Mantis assassin, as I don't know the class very well, but the other 3 will hurt each other's progression more than help, IMO.
I'd probably drop the Rogue levels and go full Magus (Bladebound), using Chill Touch/Shocking Grasp as my "Sneak Attack") or, if I really, really wanted Sneak Attack, full Alchemist (Vivisectionis), maybe full Ninja, as its increased options seem lot more useful than extra SA damage.
Also, while I like the concept of the Spellblade archetype, losing Spellstrike is quite painful.
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... multiclassing in that much 2/3 classes will utterly cripple your base ability to, you know, actually hit things. You do know you will have a terrible BAB before even starting TWFing, which can reduce a dedicated fighter's efficiency despite using light weapons ? ಠ_ಠ
I'll stick to my advice to remain pure ninja or magus if you are dead set on playing a furtive combat mystic with good options; or I suggest to you again the Shadow Assassin that gets a blade made of shadows growing in power with your character and a lot of cool powers to fight effectively while remaining stealthy, since it seems to be exactly what you want out of your character.
Rangers are pretty good at the whole Stealth/Infiltration/Assassination thing.
They don't synergize very well with Ninja, though, as you'll need both Cha and Wis (unless you take a level of monk to make your ki pool Wisdom based).
You should also check Inquisitors. They can be even better at infiltration. They can grab awesome domains, such as Feather, Luck or Travel. Or, if you want a more socially adept character, you can get the Conversion Inquisition and use Wisdom instead of Cha for a lot of skills.
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I second the Inquisitor suggestion, which is a nice one if you are fighting various foes.
The darkness (Night) domain gives you a limited invisibility while the death (Murder) provides some damaging options that will blend well with multiple critical hits. The sin, imprisonment, heresy or conversion inquisition are awesome too. The spells provide you with cool buffs and utility, the Bane ability and judgments will apply to all attack rolls against targets you wish to assassinate.
Fighter Weapon Master would work better than Rogue.
You could go straight Spellblade, you know. I would drop Bladebound, though, so you could take Arcane Accuracy as early as possible. The stealth bit you can pick up with a trait (highlander is one, I know there are others) and use spells to hide where more mundane assassins could not.
You'd be missing out on the sweet Knifemaster sneak attack damage but it would keep you out of multiclassing which, as I'm sure you know, isn't normally as desirable as it was with 3.x.
Spellblade would be nice to stay straight with.
Bladebound trades some arcane pool and 3rd level Magus arcana for a free magic sword. I think that waiting until 6th level to take arcane accuracy isn't worth it. That's just my opinion, though.
Arcane Accuracy is... Meh... Easily Held off on. Especially, if it means getting a Companion-Style Feature.
RMA is meh if you already have spells.
Ninja is as well.
Straight Magus would be simpler and probably easier to keep track of.
I mean you get your Spells, A scaling Weapon. Which is hindered if you multiclass.
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Hmmm true, might just have to look into traits to get stealth and such for him. Though if like to retain RMA for fluff reasons, possibly Magus 15/RMA 5 for him.
I'm debating whether a single level dip into rogue, ninja, or ranger would be worth it to make some skills easier to attain. Though I'm uncertain if it would be worth cutting another level from magus.
For the record, a saw tooth saber CAN be a black blade, right?
Yes, but you treat it as a Longsword until you get EWP(Sawtooth Sabre).
Going Red Mantis is going to eat up most of your Feats though...
If you want to go RMA go ahead.
Also If you want take the 1st (&/or 2nd) Level(s) of RMA as early as possible.
This nets you Stealth as a Class Skill.
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Hmmm, I'm willing to consider dropping RMA, I've been looking at shadow dancer(which would fit fetchling tremendously) if only for a few levels. Maybe just enough to get the shadow companion and jumping from shadow to shadow.
As an aside, is there any good ways to make a whip more of a deadly weapon? A black blade whip seems like a really cool idea if you can get past the armor problem of whips.
The Whip Mastery feat chain makes whips actually viable. Your damage output won't be amazing, but its range and increased versatiliy compensate for that.
I actually have a whip-wielding Bladebond/Kensai Magus build among my HeroLab characters! It seems pretty effective, but it haven't seen actual play yet, so I can't be too sure about its real abilities and limitations.
Whip Mastery is the only Legal Way that I know of.
Are you planning Finesse or STR based?
Then you really want to get the Agile Enchantment.
And I just realized Whip would require you to get EWP(Whip) wouldn't it?
It functions as a Whip unless you are within 5 feet.
Hmm, I am kinda spooked by my interest in a Whip Magus...
I am thinking a Magus(Bladebound Kensai) focusing on Whips.
Hmm, a Magus of Calistria... =D
Why wouldn't you be able to TWF with a scorpion whip and the athame? On a side note, talk to your GM about enchanting Black Blades, many people believe that it cannot be done (just search the forums...you'll see). If he says "no," than there is no way to make it Agile.
True I forgot he was planning on Bladebound...
Spellblade and looking into making or finding an Intelligent Whip would be better...
Or go the Almost-A-Cliche'd-Stereotype Dervish Dancing Magus...
You are a Dancer who sneaks in as entertainment and Thwack kill your target then flee!
Yeah... it is 04:00 and I am tired... Don't judge me!
Spellblade Kensai seems best...
We have a whip magus right now in our CotCT group.
she seems pretty effective, flavor has been fun, even got a trip in.
works really well with spell strike, helps out tremendously with the casting AoO problems.
She sports spiked armor if anyone gets too close.
Never thought of spell blade for her, she's a hex crafter.
I was toying with the idea of letting her craft a special whip made from her own hair, and letting her take the prehensile hair feat, so she could do wicked stuff with her scorpion whip of hair.
i think you should do a 2 level ranger dip for the extra class skills, BAB kick start and free TWF feat and general flavor and then stick with magus the rest of the way. The magus ability to enchant his own weapons in combat is extremely handy and so is his spell asenal. It's the closest class to the old school "assasin" that had a few levels of spellcasting. The magus my group has in the party tears stuff up and is very hard to kill with his defensive spells like mirror image etc. don't forget good ole "arcane strike"! :D And maybe eldricht heritage feat line (shadow bloodline) to get your in plain sight (probably same feat sink as shadow dancer without the loss in spellcasting).
Shadow too Shadow can be mimicked by the spell it mimics...
That is Dimension Door.
Am I the only one that can go for days without sleep?