Is there anything in the rules that says every player in the same game receives the same amount of Experience Points, and should level up together as a group?
I ask because sometimes I have a player who can't make a game. I'm wondering how to handle this.
Keep the character's XP at the same level? So, you don't have to be present in the game to be awarded XP. And if your character isn't there, the group gets more XP. You get more XP dividing the spoils by 4 people than dividing by 5 people.
The character's XP are at different levels. Players seem to be punished for not being able to gain XP when everyone else can because of real life situations (sick, work, school, no babysitter).
Advice?
- Another player plays his character.
- The GM controls his character.
I really don't like the above options.
There's nothing in the rules that says it but it seems to me that having a character with significantly less XP will just lead to inevitable character death down the line.
I like Option 1 though. We use that when people miss.
Had this just happen in my RotRL group. We normally have 5 in the party, but one guy couldn't make at the last moment, totally not his fault, life got in the way.
We all get a base amount of XP per session, so to that point, we all had the exact same amount of XP. We did the session without him, with our GM being kind enough to run a...side quest...of sorts, which was fun but didn't really move the RotRL story forward much at all. This was obstensibly happening while the guy who missed the session was off "praying in a temple" or "looking for information" or "whatever man, who cares, he's just not there".
We got XP and we're gonna give it to the guy who missed the session as well. Next session, we pick up the storyline and we're still all right on track together.
Then again, we all like each other and play well as a group and are all in it for fun.
|
This is really a GM call. I've played in some games where you got experience if you were there, and you didn't if you weren't. This occasionally creates issues in the group though when you end up with players at different levels. Chris Perkins, D&D's DM to the stars, has said that he just uses xp as a general guideline and levels the party up at story appropriate moments. This works pretty well in home games, but is a little more difficult to implement in AP's.
If your player has an unavoidable commitment keeping him from attending, I'd probably just give him a gimme on the xp for this session. It'll be easier than having a player end up behind the curve compared to the rest of the party.
Aha! The guideline method, I forgot about that way. I've read about it before but never tried it. I think this is a good time to go that way and level up everyone at the appropiate time. Thanks all.
Because I sometimes get players who grumble when someone who can't make it but would still get full XP and I'm not comfortable letting someone (including myself) play someone else's character beyond 'I'm running to the bathroom, just have me keep swinging at the monster until something changes or I get back', I've got a bit of a system. Next campaign/AP I start is probably going to use event-based leveling, but in the meantime I do it this way:
Assuming I've got no more five players (and I don't run for more than five anymore), I use the 'pre-calculated XP distribution table' from the Gamemastering chapter. You know the one, it says how much each award is distributed among various sizes of groups. But anyhow, I use that table but absent characters get XP as if the group is one category bigger than it is. So if I've got 4-5 players present, anyone absent gets individual XP as if the party were 6. So a CR 7 encounter would give the present players 800xp while the absent guy gets 535xp. It cuts down on grumbling over individual players not pulling their weight but it's not such a drastic imbalance that anyone is going to be more than a session or two behind anyone else in terms of leveling. (If they are more than a session or two behind everyone else, then there are bigger problems in play)
Of course, I don't apply this to story-based 'end of chapter/module' rewards.
If you have the time, you can always run a short solo adventure for the PC who was missing from the main session. It catches him up on XP, and gives the character an excuse for where he was during the session he missed.
|
|
Consider giving story-point leveling a try instead of XP. If you are an experienced GM (or are running an AP, in which case there are posts here for story points to level on), just make sure they happen around the same time as they would have anyway based on the advancement rate preferred.
I switched to story-point leveling of the entire party when Pathfinder first came out, and I never missed the old way.. On occasion, I ask my players if they want to switch back and miss adding up XP, etc, but the answer is always No!
Things that are good about Story-point leveling:
1- We have three players in the Navy. They have no control over duty days, tours, or being out to sea. This allows them to come and go and stay even with the rest of the party. Obsidian Portal allows them to stay current with the adventure itself.
2- In the past, I had players hunt down fleeing monsters, not because they were afraid of them coming back later, but because, and I quote "I wanted that extra XP"
3- Never have to worry about your players being too high or low for encounters in an AP.
4- There was this hidden pressure to level that I never noticed until we removed XP from the equation. The focus of the game for the players went from leveling to paying more attention to the plots.
5- It removed a heck of a lot of extra math from the game, at least from the GM perspective. I started awarding hero points and faction points instead of XP, so the players still have something to watch accumulate and do extra things to earn.
I just switched over to a PFS-style of XP recently (1 XP per major plot point or boss battle, 5 XP to level - I think. I'm still tweaking).
Before I did that, I gave out uneven XP on a few occasions, but it only ever mattered for one session, where the Inquisitor had reached level 6 while everyone else was level 5. It really didn't unbalance things too much, and everyone else got their level the session after.
Personally, I'm ok with tracking actual XP and awarding more or less to certain players based on events, but if you do, you can't let them get more than half a level behind the furthest ahead player. Eventually, if they don't stop falling behind, the difference between them will shrink in importance, since the distance between levels gets larger each level. 5000 xp is a lot to a 3rd level character, and chump change to an 18th level one. Doing it this way will make the party level up over the course of a session or three, but prevent any major unbalance from occurring.
We dump XP entirely, ding the group together at important points in the plot, and have players who aren't in attendance "guard the rear." The punishment for not showing up for a game is you don't get a divy of the loot for that day.
The punishment for not showing up for a game is you don't get a divy of the loot for that day.
Personally that seems a lot worse than not gaining XP for the session to me.
Though I have been at every game session for the last year (perfect attendance yeaaah!) we try to give our character sheets to the GM and update them accordingly. He has a sheet just in case someone isn't there and he runs that character when they are not there.
We do use a MVP award that he comes up with and he may give to more than one player depending on what happened.
Some players use computers at the table and don't supply their character sheets [raises hand].
There are all kinds of ways to help a player out. He doesn't have to die in the long run. The GM can hand out XP for any number of reasons and the character could level up with the rest of the party.
I think a lot of it has to do with the group you play in.
And the #1 thing of HOW OFTEN DOES THE PLAYER MISS??!?
If you have a group of 4 players... and you all agree to be there every week. The DM plans on you being there. The players count on you to be there.. And you don't show up? That hurts EVERYONE. It hurts the players if they have to compensate for your wizard not helping that night... the CRs are much tougher with 3 players. It's really a kind of 'jerk' thing to do... and if it happens often, then the character shouldn't get xp. He didn't figure into earning it... he shouldn't get it.
This is NOT a hard and fast rule. If life gets in the way... It HAPPENS. Work comes before the game ALWAYS... You simply can NOT turn down overtime to come to a game... If you shift gets switched... You have no say in the matter. Now that we're older.. There are wives and husbands... kids... Things happen.
If you SICK... I'd prefer you did NOT come get US sick too!!! Stay home! Get well... we'll see ya NEXT week. People shouldn't be punished for being responsible human beings...
On that note...we HAVE had players who 'Just didn't FEEL like it'... 'Had a date'... 'Forgot'... and a myrid of other excuses that WERE preventable. THAT gets very frustrating. It basically says that 'WE who honored our agreement to BE here on SCHEDULED days... are not important to you.'
If they CHOOSE not to show up, then they CHOOSE not to get xp...
If this makes them a level behind... so be it. The rules themselves make expectations for 'level drain'... there is no set NEED for EVERYONE to be the same level. There are many campaigns and adventures where one level means nothing. At its most important it's a +1 to BaB difference... and you still have the D20 factoring in. I've had bad nights where a Rogue with a BaB 3 lower than me hits more often that I did!!
As for 'someone else' playing the character... I personally don't LIKE that idea. There's a few problems....
#1) DM must keep ALL the character sheets. If XXXXX calls in and says he can't make it... DM needs to have the sheet to pass on the table or it doesn't work.
WHat this means is that NOBODY gets to look over there sheet in between game sessions... get to know their new spells... level up the character... That's just not reasonable.
#2) They may DIE... It's one thing to play someone elses character... it's another thing to KILL him. I would be very annoyed if someone got my character killed when I wasn't there. I would also feel bad if I got someone ELSES character killed when HE wasn't there... If they are on the board... they have to be valid targets... or it just feels cheap all around.
#3 NOBODY plays a character like his creator. Maybe there are some super experienced players out there who memorized every rule book as it comes out.... but I try to know my feats, skills traits and the things that apply to ME. It does NOT mean that i will be worth ANYTHING if you hand me a cleric or druid... Spells domains and abilities I've NEVER looked at, Equiptment I don't know... Spells I never heard of?? All on a completely different sheet in someone elses handwriting??/
I've been there before... I don't LIKE it. If I wanted to play a ninja/samuraii... I'd have made one up ;)
The punishment for not showing up for a game is you don't get a divy of the loot for that day.Personally that seems a lot worse than not gaining XP for the session to me.
Would you rather be a level 8 guy Ina level 8 party with level 7 loot, or a level 7 guy in a level 8 party with level 7 loot?
The loot by level table differential grows exponentially. Even missing 20% of the gaming sessions, you still never fall more than one level back on loot.
Settle down phantom. Real life > RPG life. Wait til you're my age and all your players have babies, little league, office parties, etc etc. Missing players is a fact of life. Most of our games have 8 intermittent players, of which three to five show up for any given session.
|
Because I sometimes get players who grumble when someone who can't make it but would still get full XP
Ah, God bless the Manchild player.
@ OP: There's a bunch of different ways to do it. Personally, my job as DM is hard enough as it is, I typically don't punish players for missing games unless it's a habit, because otherwise, they fall behind in level and then I have to tweak encounters to ensure that I'm challenging the high level players without outright murdering the low level players, and that's just frustrating after a while.
|
I find it easier to just keep everyone equal and use alternate award systems for creativity and roleplay. One of our other GMs give XP to those who actively participated. Not everyone was the same level. If someone was at the start, but left to go to bed, then their character left and didn't get the rest of the XP
Settle down phantom. Real life > RPG life. Wait til you're my age and all your players have babies, little league, office parties, etc etc. Missing players is a fact of life. Most of our games have 8 intermittent players, of which three to five show up for any given session.
Oh I'm there already :)
And I even said that above. Life > Game. Absolutely.
There is a difference between 'good excuse' and 'getting blown off'. If life gets in the way, then don't penalize a player.
If he blows you off because he doesn't care enough to consider you... to heck with it.
We've had players miss for 'good reasons' and it sucks, but that happens... We've also had players who just 'didn't feel like it' that night and didn't even bother to call and tell us to start without him...
In our group, we just lost a player for a short amount of time (she gave birth to twins).
We are normally a 5 party group. So we've agreed to split any and all XP and loot 5 ways no matter what. And when she comes back she will be at our same level.
For us, the game and playing (with everyone at the same level) was more important than the numbers.
But, we talked about it first and I think we've got players that realize that life happens.
Yeah... we had that happen a few years ago too!! Twins seem a popular thing lately!!! :)
We lost her for quite a few months at that point... It's usually best to 'write the character out'... have her go on a solo quest, spell research,
>.>
<.<
Coma spell... ;)
Something that explains WHY she isn't there... AND you don't have to play her character for her... At which point, it's really just Split the xp your earning with 4 players... between 4 players. Then when she comes back, tell her where your at and have her level up accordingly. She's technicely getting free xp, but you are all progressing at the same rate you should be for the AP ;)
Unless your in such a spot that's just not feasable... I'm not sure WHAT we would have done had that happened during serpent skull O.o
Unless your in such a spot that's just not feasable... I'm not sure WHAT we would have done had that happened during serpent skull O.o
Hoo ain't dat da troof.
We're having enough trouble as it is with people not showing up in that AP. There's been exactly ONCE that it was feasible to just let a char not be present for a while.
Is there anything in the rules that says every player in the same game receives the same amount of Experience Points, and should level up together as a group? I ask because sometimes I have a player who can't make a game. I'm wondering how to handle this.
I play it that way because not being able to take part in every game session is bad enough. You don't have to be punished in addition to that.
Plus it's much less work for the gm.
|
In 3.5, lower level character got more exp so they could catch up. This meant that they players could miss session, use EXP to craft items, die an lose a level and what not and they could still make that up. In PF, this is no longer the case...so if the exp gap gets too big, all it does is cause headache for you to run encounters. So basically I just have everyone level up together in games I run...just one less thing to toss a wrench into my encounter designs (my player do enough of that on their own already without me mucking it up more).