Ok so from time to time I contemplate taking a concept a little off of the beaten path. I usually do this by looking at the rules and how they are conventionally used and then finding a goofy little loop hole and running with it (mostly for laughs).
In this vein I was perusing the Duelist and noticed how most of its abilities required the use of a one handed piercing weapon. And then I said to myself, "Self, isn't a Heavy Pick a one handed piercing weapon?", and after taking a moment to double check I found that it was much to my glee.
So now I'm on a theoretical journey to build a Duelist who uses a Heavy Pick, and invite suggestions, comments, or criticisms.
In other words, feel free to "pick" this idea apart...pun very horribly intended :)
I may steal this idea. Just saying.
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I keep thinking of The Shoveler, from "Mystery Men".
For flavor, perhaps an escaped mining slave, who wields the weapon in honor of those friends and compatriots who fell to the horrors of the mines and/or their fiendish overlords?
There's a picture in the human section of the Advanced Race Guide that sort mirrors this, I think.
I believe he plans to use the main class Swashbuckler
TCG: Steal away, it's all in good fun!
Lamontius: The fact that my idea made you think of The Shoveler is just more of an affirmation as to why this is a great idea. Thank you! Also those are some great flavor ideas. I will pocket those in case this character concept goes beyond the planning stages.
Deuxhero: Also some very good ideas regarding how to make the concept work mechanically. Thanks for the great tips!
I believe he plans to use the main class Swashbuckler
Actually I haven't decided on a main class yet. That is something that I have been weighing. Fighter and Rogue are currently at the top of my list (even if the Rogue isn't getting much love on the boards lately). I had contemplated using the Ranger class, however, there really isn't a combat style that mirrors the Duelist at least not like the way the Free Hand Fighter Archetype does.
Still, it's all pretty up in the air right now. He could end up being a Bard...although probably not...but maybe! ;)
you know if you went bard to begin with you could be an arcane duelist...
Very true Ratlord and that is a possibility I hadn't considered.
In truth, however, I was invisioning more of a classic swashbuckler sans magic with a bit of a brutal twist over the magic and steel blending Arcan Duelist.
Not saying it's off the table, but it just wasn't my original concept.
I believe he plans to use the main class SwashbucklerActually I haven't decided on a main class yet. That is something that I have been weighing. Fighter and Rogue are currently at the top of my list (even if the Rogue isn't getting much love on the boards lately). I had contemplated using the Ranger class, however, there really isn't a combat style that mirrors the Duelist at least not like the way the Free Hand Fighter Archetype does.
Still, it's all pretty up in the air right now. He could end up being a Bard...although probably not...but maybe! ;)
In that case, do look into the Swashbuckler (not the archetype), as it has full BAB and fits your concept (In my Opinion)
In that case, do look into the Swashbuckler (not the archetype), as it has full BAB and fits your concept (In my Opinion)
You know. In all the time I've spent playing Pathfinder, I really haven't gone back to the old 3.0 and 3.5 stuff. I guess I always thought of it as working backwards or moreso that I might miss out on something by playing a class that wasn't designed to be comparable to Pathfiner's base classes and all the little things that Paizo added to the Fighter, Rogue, Wizard, etc.
Perhaps I will have to give the swashbuckler another look-see. Thanks Sister Maeve!
This made me think of a heavy pick wielding Kensai Magus it might only crit on a 19-20 (assuming keen or imp crit) but with an arcane pool point can do it for x5 damage. This would allow an intensified shocking grasp as a level 10 caster to do 50d6 damage (+100 if you took a level of crossblooded orc/dragon sorc too)
As to class Ranger isn't a bad call as for level 6 two handed nets you a free power attack and furious focus or great cleve without taking cleave. Or for pure cheek take natural nothing says the weapon focus has to be in claws or bite and a free vital strike isn't terrible.
In that case, do look into the Swashbuckler (not the archetype), as it has full BAB and fits your concept (In my Opinion)You know. In all the time I've spent playing Pathfinder, I really haven't gone back to the old 3.0 and 3.5 stuff. I guess I always thought of it as working backwards or moreso that I might miss out on something by playing a class that wasn't designed to be comparable to Pathfiner's base classes and all the little things that Paizo added to the Fighter, Rogue, Wizard, etc.
Perhaps I will have to give the swashbuckler another look-see. Thanks Sister Maeve!
I meant the Pathfinder version of Swashbuckler
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you know if you went bard to begin with you could be an arcane duelist...Very true Ratlord and that is a possibility I hadn't considered.
In truth, however, I was invisioning more of a classic swashbuckler sans magic with a bit of a brutal twist over the magic and steel blending Arcan Duelist.
Not saying it's off the table, but it just wasn't my original concept.
It sounds to me like Barbarian wouldn't be a terrible choice. A Barbarian/Duelist would let you combine shrewd technique with raw power. Also, before you get to the Duelist levels you could hold the pick two-handed and benefit from the 1.5xSTR enhanced by rage.
I meant the Pathfinder version of Swashbuckler
Oh I see. I hadn't run across this before, probably because I don't dip into 3rd party stuff that often.
The 3rd party Artificer may have scared me away a bit lol.
I will look at this with an open mind and see if this might be the route for my newest character! Thanks again!
wow, swashbuckler has the base traits to make rogues decent... to ad its third party.
Although in general I like the class, The Swashbuckler does have one class ability that concerns me due to cheesiness. Find the Mark and Improved Mark could be exploited pretty easily (of course, most of the really good abilities can).
Find the Mark (Ex)
At 8th level, the swashbuckler increases his threat range by one when using any melee weapon with which he has Weapon Finesse. A weapon that would threaten a critical on 20 would now do so on a 19 or 20, and one which threatens on a 19 or 20 would now do so on an 18 to 20. This ability works with other abilities which increase threat ranges.
Improved Mark (Ex)
At 16th level, the swashbuckler becomes even more adept at finding marks. The threat range now improves by two when the swashbuckler uses his Find the Mark ability.
So basically my swashbuckler, should he take this class up to level 16 (which he probably wouldn't), picks up his +1 Keen, Flame Bursting Adamantine Heavy Pick and makes four attacks where he threatens to crit on 17-20, doing 4d6+1d6(fire)+1d10(flame burst)+2 damage (plus double strength bonus, and anything else crazy like power attack or such). Even worse I could use the light pick which would allow me to use the Swashbuckler's Thrust ability and now we have 4d4+1d6(fire)+1d10(flame burst)+5d6(thrust)+2 damage (and then strength/piranna strike/weapon training/etc.) That makes for some serious ouchie!
Sure he won't crit all the time, but he'll crit a heck of a lot more than he would otherwise. Personally I think it's lovely, but I can imagine my GM getting a little annoyed at me after a while.
Needs a catch-phrase or 3 as he picks apart the enemies defenses, getting in digs at their failure to stop him.
Eye cee wat ewe did thar!
Also, you're 16th level. Dude: you're more powerful than Gandalf. Run with it!
Also, you're 16th level. Dude: you're more powerful than Gandalf. Run with it!
Oh please, don't get me wrong, I love the potential. love it.I just don't want to come in with the cool character concept, and leave being the twink that everyone complains to the GM about after the game.
is heavy pick axe a light weapon? can the mark abilities even be applied to that?
even if it could the +2 to threat range is not a big deal
No, the heavy pick is not a light weapon. The light pick is. If you'll notice in the second example where I added the Thrust damage I changed the damage to reflect d4's (light pick) versus d6's (heavy pick).
And I also admit that it would not be very often that the character would crit and get the thrust damage at the same time. I am just saying that if he did it could totally cream a standard bad guy, and put a fairly nice dent in a mini boss or even a boss fight. My calculations have this *mega attack* doing somewhere in the neighborhood of 31-82 points of damage. If he gets any of his other 3 attacks to hit in that round he would do even more. And if he was buffed even more than that.
Like I said before. I just get leary around 3rd party stuff, after that whole Artificer incident.
Um. 31-82? I refer you to the DPR Olympics thread. Enjoy not feeling overpowered.
Also, heavy pick -> light weapon: use mithril and darkwood. Enjoy a heavy pick that is now a light weapon.
(In other words, no, it's not terribly "over powered", at least by "common" standards. IF, on the other hand, you think your group would rebel, go with what's best for your group and collective play style. It is a nice, decently powerful combination, however.)
Other options include leaving off the flaming burst pick and focusing on different options, like wondrous items (a miner could do worse than having a lyre of building), armor enhancement (yeah, they're just clothes, but they also grant me damage reduction and a +5 bonus to my AC!), and other things of that nature. In other words, focus your resources on things other than your weapon!