Restoring Spell progression after 1 level fighter dip... possible?

[Vicon]

Just want to be certain about how the rules work before I press on with a build... When you have an item or trait that increases caster level (Like Magical Knack or an Orange Ioun Stone) the +2 or +1 (respectively) restore a caster's level progression for the purposes of gaining spells/channeling/turning and not just for the purposes of spell effects? True or Untrue?

I've seen talk on the boards that items or abilities like these can be used to maintain caster viability for characters that multi-class... but wanted to make sure I understood correctly.

Can anybody cite a clear ruling on this, or tell me what their opinion or the common consensus is?

[Artanthos]

They boost caster level for the purpose of spell effects only.

Spell progression is lost.

[TOZ]

Note the difference between '+1 caster level' and '+1 level of spellcasting progression'. One is given out by many different things to this or that type of spell, the other is only given out by prestige classes.

There is no way to regain that level of spellcasting lost when multiclassing.

[AvalonXQ]

When people say these items and ability keep your viability when multiclassing, people just mean that you can keep up with level-dependent variables like spell duration and damage dice.

Normally, a Wizard 6 Fighter 1 can cast 3rd-level spells at caster level 6 -- a 6d6 Fireball, for instance, or Summon spells lasting 6 rounds.

A Wizard 6 Fighter 1 with Magical Knack or an orange ioun stone can still only cast 3rd-level spells; he has no more spell slots or spells known than before. But, he can cast a 7d6 Fireball and Summon spells lasting for 7 rounds, just as his Wizard 7 friend can. He still doesn't get his fourth-level spells until he takes another level of Wizard or a prestige class granting spell progression.

[Vicon]

I had a sneaking and sinking feeling this was the case, hence my asking... so thank you for sharing the law and keeping me honest.

My next question is of course... if a Fighter dip is a bad idea (I was thinking of taking one at level 4 for the extra feat and heavy armor mostly) what prestige class or other creative means can one suggest to help me get heavy armor (and or any other interesting or useful skills/abilities?)

My character is primarily a caster/support cleric... and I want to make him as helpful as possible to the party. Not so much focusing on healing as buffs and skill assistance (for example I have "Helpful" as a trait to maximize "Aid other")

So besides just staying pure cleric, Your best assistance please!

[therealthom]

The heavy armour proficiency feat?

[3.5 Loyalist]

Vicon wrote:

Just want to be certain about how the rules work before I press on with a build... When you have an item or trait that increases caster level (Like Magical Knack or an Orange Ioun Stone) the +2 or +1 (respectively) restore a caster's level progression for the purposes of gaining spells/channeling/turning and not just for the purposes of spell effects? True or Untrue?

I've seen talk on the boards that items or abilities like these can be used to maintain caster viability for characters that multi-class... but wanted to make sure I understood correctly.

Can anybody cite a clear ruling on this, or tell me what their opinion or the common consensus is?

The dipping has a lot of potential (also seen sorcerer/barbarian), to try and avoid the costs is the path of cheese.

I've ran games for fighter/clerics, they can be really strong but there is a cost.

[Thazar]

The Crusader Archetype will get you a lot of the things you get by dipping a level of fighter, but at a cost spell casting and domains. But good for a cleric that wants to be more melee centric.

[voska66]

There is a way to get 1 or 3 spell casting level back. Esoteric training I think it's called in the Inner Sea Magic book. Basically it's guild you join and you can accumulate points by doing things for the guild. Once you have enough points you can buy a spell casting level. With even more points you get 3 and 1 in second spell casting class. I'd assume no GM would make this easy for you but it is possible. As GM I'd really make the player jump through hoops for this.

[pad300]

There is one thing that I know of that can do it, if you are adventuring in Golarion. Magic of the Inner Sea presents assorted Magical Organizations including magical guilds. These Guilds offer the Eclectic Learning special ability, which will provide you with a +1 to your effective level (to a maximum of your HD), specifically including gaining the enhanced number and level of spells a normal level gain would get you. This is specifically called out in the entry, as it is so different from the normal method of handling a caster level bonus...

[Raptor2012]

Take a look at the Holy Vindicator prestige class. At first level in class you gain your heavy armor proficiency, +1 to Will and Fort saves, +1 BaB. You still lose the spells but, you get to stack the levels of Holy Vindicator with another class that gains Channel Energy for the purpose of that ability. Finally, you get the extremely cool Vindicator's Shield ability that allows you to expend a use of Channel Energy to gain a holy or profane bonus to your AC equal to your total dice for that ability until you are struck.

I have played a Holy Vindicator twice now and both times my buffing cleric became an utter brick house. I dished out pretty vicious damage against evil outsiders and undead (with Alignment Channel and Channel Smite) but I could also park my character in a gap, enter a defensive stance and hold the line against some pretty heinous critters.

My two cents.

[Vicon]

thank you, sir.

[LazarX]

Like it was suggested earlier. the easiest most elegant way is to simply take the proficiency feat.

Just keep in mind though that heavy armor comes with it's own price, heavier weight, greater armor check penalties, and a slowed run speed, none of which are going to be ameliorated by class progression.

[Vicon]

I think the proficiency is the way I'm going to have to go...

I can navigate the weight easy enough with mule-back straps, masterwork backpack, etc...
The mobility issue is GREATLY reduced by my having the travel domain (+10 base speed, Longstrider as a domain spell for add'l +10, and as I level more mobility domain spells and powers)

Thanks for clearing this up.