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You can't transform an existing magical item into an unslotted one. Those are guidelines for pricing custom magical items for GMs. (Of course, if your GM allows it, then you can. Rule 0.)
I believe this would work the same way as armor. Say you have a +1 Greater Fortification leather armor. At the same time, you are wearing a +8 bracers of armor. Because they do not stack, you are going to get only the benefit of the +8 bracers of armor, because they have the higher armor bonus, and lose the greater fortification ability of the armor as well as the armor bonus.
So, two amulets of mighty fist are just going to give you the benefit of whichever has the higher enhancement bonus, or if they are equal, I suppose you would get to choose which functions.
I see what you are saying, and I am stumped as to how an amulet with no enhancement and one with enhancement would interact. I do suspect, however, that if this is technically possible by RAW, and I don't even know where to look for written rules on this, if the devs weigh in on this, they would declare it no not be RAI. But, I have been wrong before on what the devs consider RAI, and they have surprised me with going with more liberal interpretations on occasion.
This is one those things that there is no rule for because the general assumption is that only one of these items will ever be used. In short it is up to the GM. The rules don't always cover corner cases.
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the simplest answer is always the right answer. if you aer simply trying to save money then you are circumventing the rule. if you need a work around to save money you are doing just that working around the rules. the other thing to consider is making the item requires the use of the same spell. and you are not allowed to be affected by multiple instances of the same spell. so even a character with an amulet of mighty fists that is just holy and keen that had greater magic fang cast on him would have to pick which he would be using. sorry it was a clever attempt but doesnt work.
the simplest answer is always the right answer. if you aer simply trying to save money then you are circumventing the rule. if you need a work around to save money you are doing just that working around the rules. the other thing to consider is making the item requires the use of the same spell. and you are not allowed to be affected by multiple instances of the same spell. so even a character with an amulet of mighty fists that is just holy and keen that had greater magic fang cast on him would have to pick which he would be using. sorry it was a clever attempt but doesnt work.
You are saying that someone wearing one amulet of mighty fist, with one ability, say flaming, that person could not benefit both from the amulet, and from a magic fang/magic weapon spell? That flies in the face of my assumptions, but I am the first to advocate destroying assumptions. Can you show me the rule?
I'm so confused by this, I am left at a loss for an opinion. And that may be a first for me :) I would really appreciate directions to the rules relating to this restriction, or lack thereof, simply because I really am confused as to where to look in the rulebook for this.
You only have one problem with something like this. A slotless item has to be held in your hand in order for it to function, unless it has some special ability built into it like the way ioun stones work. There is also nothing in the rules that lets you convert an item from one slot to another, so you could not turn the amulet into a ring or mount it in a headband, though a Headband of Mighty Fists would be pretty cool.
Mabven, which part is confusing you? Here is the text for the Amulet if that helps any:
This amulet grants an enhancement bonus of +1 to +5 on attack and damage rolls with unarmed attacks and natural weapons. Alternatively, this amulet can grant melee weapon special abilities, so long as they can be applied to unarmed attacks. See Table 15–9 for a list of abilities. Special abilities count as additional bonuses for determining the market value of the item, but do not modify attack or damage bonuses. An amulet of mighty fists cannot have a modified bonus (enhancement bonus plus special ability bonus equivalents) higher than +5. An amulet of mighty fists does not need to havea +1 enhancement bonus to grant a melee weapon special ability.
Mabven, which part is confusing you? Here is the text for the Amulet if that helps any:
This amulet grants an enhancement bonus of +1 to +5 on attack and damage rolls with unarmed attacks and natural weapons. Alternatively, this amulet can grant melee weapon special abilities, so long as they can be applied to unarmed attacks. See Table 15–9 for a list of abilities. Special abilities count as additional bonuses for determining the market value of the item, but do not modify attack or damage bonuses. An amulet of mighty fists cannot have a modified bonus (enhancement bonus plus special ability bonus equivalents) higher than +5. An amulet of mighty fists does not need to havea +1 enhancement bonus to grant a melee weapon special ability.
What I am confused about is the assertion that, since to create an amulet of mighty fists, the spell Greater Magic Fang must be used, and thus a creature wearing such an amulet could not be affected by the spell Greater Magic Fang. I am looking for a rules citation on this aspect, because I am at a loss to figure out what part of the book it would be in.
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the simplest answer is always the right answer. if you aer simply trying to save money then you are circumventing the rule. if you need a work around to save money you are doing just that working around the rules. the other thing to consider is making the item requires the use of the same spell. and you are not allowed to be affected by multiple instances of the same spell. so even a character with an amulet of mighty fists that is just holy and keen that had greater magic fang cast on him would have to pick which he would be using. sorry it was a clever attempt but doesnt work.You are saying that someone wearing one amulet of mighty fist, with one ability, say flaming, that person could not benefit both from the amulet, and from a magic fang/magic weapon spell? That flies in the face of my assumptions, but I am the first to advocate destroying assumptions. Can you show me the rule?
just like similar bonuses dont stack you cannot benefit from the same spell twive. i.e. cannot haste a hasted creature cannot stack bulls strength. since the spell required to create your amulet is greater magic fang you are under a constat effect of the spell and cannot benefit from it while wearing the item.
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Mabven, if i understand What Nephril wrote, it is as an amulet of mighty fists with flaming is made by enchanting a normal amulet (or a leather string for that matter) with the spell Greater Magic Fang, and therefor that spell is affecting you as long as you are wearing said amulet, therefor you can not be affected by a druid casting Greater Magic fang on you. as you already are.
1: then get Greater Magic Weapon, problem solved, two different spells.
2: then get ready to hear an outcry of anguish from all monk players world wide (as one of the few ways of increasing a monks +to hit and dmg per round just got shot down)
3: then as you are already under the effect of a Greater Magic Fang spell (by wearing the Amulet of Mighty fists), you should then get the enhancement bonus to your unarmed strikes that is normally granted by said spell AND the bonus inherent within the amulet in addition, as it comes from the same spell...
sorry enhancement bonuses dont stack. unless specifically stated. so no magic weapon and magic fang stacking. its been tried.
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i thought maybe u just wanted to see if you could wear to amulets by wearing more. but if you are actually trying to make this work there is a weapon that any monk can wear enchant and still get the bonuses to his unarmed strikes.
http://www.d20pfsrd.com/equipment---final/weapons/weapon-descriptions/rope- gauntlet
now an amulet of +5 abilities and rope gauntlets (individually enchanted) of +5 attack would stack. there is no rule that says they cant. and sorry i didnt point this out earlier (as i am a long time monk player) but i figured you guys were just theorycrafting on here not trying to get more power to yoru character.
well, the point isn't so much that the 2nd amulet is unslotted, as it is can two amulets, with the specific enchants as stated in the OP be combined, or rather work together / stack. the location of said "Amulets" isn't the point.
Actually, no, this will not work because you cannot have more than one active item per body slot other than rings, and even then you can only have two active rings at one time. So stacking or not, if you are wearing two amulets, you have to choose which one is active and which one is "turned off".
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Rope gauntlet is just a light weapon now. In fact, there are no longer any unarmed strike altering weapons as per developer errata. Well, the emei piercer is still up in the air, but I imagine the ruling would be the same.
just googled the errata it hasnt filtered down to the pfsrd website yet but here is a http for anyone interested
http://paizo.com/paizo/messageboards/paizoPublishing/pathfinder/pathfinderR PG/rules/adventurersArmoryQuestions&page=2
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well, the point isn't so much that the 2nd amulet is unslotted, as it is can two amulets, with the specific enchants as stated in the OP be combined, or rather work together / stack. the location of said "Amulets" isn't the point.Actually, no, this will not work because you cannot have more than one active item per body slot other than rings, and even then you can only have two active rings at one time. So stacking or not, if you are wearing two amulets, you have to choose which one is active and which one is "turned off".ok, now you are just not reading the other posts. if they are both made at twice the normal price and made UNSLOTTED. call it a hovering globe of mighty fists (it hovers around your head, granting you the bonuses stated in the OP)
to nephril, rope gauntlets are not masterwork items, they are used for a day, they can not be enchanted. you could get a wizard to cast masterwork weapon on them, then u'd need to remove them, so he could spend a long time (about 1 day per 2000 gold by the total enchantment price, assuming +5 on the cratf DC for rushed work) enchanting them.
2nd, with rope gauntlets, why bother with the Amulet of mighty fists, weapons can get a total of +10, where only +5 can be enhancement bonus, the rest weapon special abilities.
3rd. rope gauntlets are not part of the Core rule book, nor Advanced player's guide, or Ultimate Combat or Magic. you would have ask your GM nicely to get them..
And as far as i know, there is no rule saying that spells used to craft items are constantly effecting you, please give a link to that rule, pref. one here on Paizo's PRD.
as to the comment about the masterwork. you can make any "weapon masterowrk" i dont know if you have any experience applying handwraps. you really couldnt wear them all the time. you could enchant the wrap itself bu to put them on takes time and then they aer effectively wrapped on you for 24 hours. you then need to take them off and rewrap them. you do not throw away the wraps and get new ones each time.
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nephril, ok, so you craft them yourself, or get a "weapon" smith to craft them as masterwork. then you enchant them, still by the errata, they are light weapons, and a monk no longer gets his special monk unarmed strike damage when using them. therby they are no longer that useful.
and as i stated in the OP, this was a Rules as Written question, not if you have a better ide, or if you would accept it as a DM, or anything like that. simply RAW, it is possible to do so ?
it's either YES ! or NO ! and then citation to the rule that shows why it can not be done, or link to the errata or FAQ where it shows why not.
dude chill out. i already answered your question. and any player knows it. you CANNOT BE AFFECTED BY THE SAME SPELL TWICE REGARDLESS OF ITS SOURCE. if you want to sit here and continue asking until someone says "well uhhh gee that sounds like a fine thing and i think it would work" then PLEASE keep asking the same question. but dont pick me out when so far out of everyone in this posting i have had a more informed posting than any other.
also read my post a bit higher i agreed to the errata and guess what genius IM THE GUY WHO POSTED THE FING LINK.let me ask you a question..... if i got a belt of ogre power and then wanted even moer strength could i get another belt of ogre power pay twice as much for it and wear it around my chest?? like i said just keep asking bro im sure you will get the answer you want from another player as uninformed as yourself oh and whats with the !!! umadbro
I think if you had an amulet of mighty fists that granted special properties such as agile, holy, etc. and someone cast greater magic fang on you, those would stack.
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I think if you had an amulet of mighty fists that granted special properties such as agile, holy, etc. and someone cast greater magic fang on you, those would stack.
BADDDDOOOOOM i told you if you waited long enough someone would agree. but honestly just start faqing everything and eventually paizo will come over and post on it. since there is no way for monks to get a +10 on there natural weapons i guess paizo may make specific allowances but this opens up all kinds of nastiness.
The fact that an Amulet of Mighty Fists can only have up to a +5 equivalency suggests the designers did not want to have characters running around with the equivalent of a +10 Amulet, regardless of how people try to achieve that aim.
Personally I think the Amulet as written is flawed and should be the same as magic weapons - at least +1 before you can add special abilities. The ability to have a special ability without a base enhancement bonus is unique (afaik) to this particular item. I doubt the thought that people might look at ways of creating one with only bonuses and one with only special abilities did not cross the designers' minds.
Oh, snap! I've been immune to fireball all this time? I'm going to have some choice words for my GM tomorrow.
well, when you put it that way, RAW for guidline doesn't exist, then ok, it's a rather wasted point to ask about. but tbh, i am still awaiting the rule that shows spells used as components in a magical items crafting completion is determined as to constantly affecting you.
As based on that "rule" any weapon a wizard has with the weapon enchant:
Returning: This special ability can only be placed on a weapon that can be thrown. A returning weapon flies through the air back to the creature that threw it. It returns to the thrower just before the creature's next turn (and is therefore ready to use again in that turn). Catching a returning weapon when it comes back is a free action. If the character can't catch it, or if the character has moved since throwing it, the weapon drops to the ground in the square from which it was thrown.Moderate transmutation; CL 7th; Craft Magic Arms and Armor, telekinesis; Price +1 bonus.
would make that wizard UNABLE to use the spell Telekinesis, as it is a requirement for crafting a magical weapon with the returning property, thereby as the rule would have it, a constant effect on said wizard, and he is not a viable target for a second telekinesis spell.
And someone with a weapon with flaming special ability would be under a constant flame blade, flame strike, or fireball. seems normal right ?
It depends whether the magic item emulates the ability/effect that the spell grants.
Belt of Giant Strength, created using Bull's Strength, is the same as if some directly casts Bull's Strength on you.
A returning weapon might require telekinesis but wielding a returning weapon does not give you the the same abilities that having telekinesis cast on you does.
Plus having a weapon on you doesn't mean you are wielding it. Applying your reasoning would mean that having a +2 dagger on your belt would mean the +1 mace in your hand would not function.
Oh, snap! I've been immune to fireball all this time? I'm going to have some choice words for my GM tomorrow.
And then prove to him that having an Elixir of Fire Breath in your pocket means that ancient red dragon's breath weapon can't hurt you ;)