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You can't multiclass Monk 3/Monk 2, so you'd be a Monk 5 with the archetype that you chose applied from 1st level.
When you take an archetype, you must take all the substitutions for it (unless the archetype itself allows you a choice). You can choose to take an archetype later if you haven't already gained and used the abilities that it trades out, or if your GM allows you to revise your character retroactively.
Actually, archetypes explicitly say they have to be taken at first class level for that class.
Actually, archetypes explicitly say they have to be taken at first class level for that class.
I'm not seeing where it explicitly says that. Could you quote the rules text please?
APG page 72
Ultimate Magic page 14
Ultimate Combat page 23
When a character selects a class, he must choose to use the standard class features found or those listed in one of the archetypes presented here. Each alternate class feature replaces a specific class feature from its parent class. For example, the elemental fist class feature of the monk of the four winds replaces the stunning fist class feature of the monk. When an archetype includes multiple class features, a character must take all of them—often blocking the character from ever gaining certain familiar class features, but replacing them with equally powerful options. All of the other class features found in the core class and not mentioned among the alternate class features remain unchanged and are acquired normally when the character reaches the appropriate level (unless noted otherwise). A character who takes an alternate class feature does not count as having the class feature that was replaced when meeting any requirements or prerequisites.
A character can take more than one archetype and garner additional alternate class features, but none of the alternate class features can replace or alter the same class feature from the core class as another alternate class feature. For example, a paladin could not be both a hospitaler and an undead scourge since they both modify the smite evil class feature and both replace the aura of justice class feature. A paladin could, however, be both an undead scourge and a warrior of the holy light, since none of their new class features replace the same core class feature.
Presented below are several classic barbarian archetypes and alternate class features to help you in building your character, each one including a number of suggested rage powers that, while not mandatory, work to flesh out the character concept.
Note that it doesn't explicitly say "at level one". I don't see how the rules text contradicts the idea of choosing an archetype the first time a base class ability differs from the archetype ability. After all, that's what it says:
"When a character selects a class, he must choose to use the standard class features found or those listed in one of the archetypes presented here."
A character selects a class each time he gains a level. There's no reason the choice to use standard or archetype features needs to be made before the choice would apply.
"When an archetype includes multiple class features, a character must take all of them—often blocking the character from ever gaining certain familiar class features, but replacing them with equally powerful options."
This is the rule that stops us from picking and choosing; no level 1 selection necessary (unless the archetype has a level 1 ability, of course.)
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No. If any of the archetype features, or normal monk features they replace, are gained at levels 1-4, then you can't choose that archetype at level 5.
What AvalonXQ is talking about is what I did with my barbarian, actually. The Invulnerable Rager archetype for barbarians has class features at levels 2 and 3, which replace standard class features that would be gained at levels 2+. Thus, a standard barbarian and invulnerable rager barbarian both get the same class powers at 1st level. The difference between them doesn't kick in until level 2.
Thus, in my case, I made a barbarian at level 1 as a newbie to Pathfinder who didn't know about the archetype. Before hitting level 2, I found out about Invulnerable Rager, and decided to choose that archetype when I hit level 2. So at level 2, my barbarian gained the level 2 features of an Invulnerable Rager instead of the level 2 features of a standard barbarian.
That wouldn't have been possible if Invulnerable Rager had replaced abilities that a level 1 barbarian had already gotten and started using.
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So you can't multi class arctypes like fighter to wizard can.....
Note that you can take two (or conceivably more) archetypes as long as they don't replace any of the same class abilities.
Like the player is willing to retake level one monk and level one sensei and be equivalent to level 2.
He would be a level 2 monk with the sensei archetype (and even if he could multiclass he would still be a level 2 character), no equivalence involved.
So you can't multi class arctypes like fighter to wizard can.....
what im saying is i don't see a problem but just want to be sure.Like the player is willing to retake level one monk and level one sensei and be equivalent to level 2.
The rules don't let anyone take first level of a class more than once. Doing so would lead to unbalanced characters, such as a Paladin 1/Paladin 1/Paladin 1 who can smite evil three times a day and has awesome Fort and Will saves, when ordinarily a paladin cannot smite evil twice a day before fourth level. (In most cases, repeating first level leads to a weaker character. I had to search several classes for something that looked good. Nevertheless, weaker is unbalancing, too.)
An archetype of a class is not a different class. Instead, it is the same class but with alternative abilities at a few levels. Thus, Monk(standard) 1/Monk(sensei) 1 is as forbidden as Monk 1/Monk 1.
It is possible that to apply multiple archetypes to the same monk, for example, Monk(four winds and sensei), so long as the two or more archetypes do not contradict each other by replacing the same ability with an alternative ability. Monk(four winds and sensei) would have Elemental Fist instead of Stunning Fist, Advice instead of Flurry of Blows, Fast Movement, and Improved Evasion, etc. The changes accumulate.
Unfortunately, there is no way to undo a change. A Monk(sensei) swaps out Flurry of Blows and has no way of ever gaining that ability. No feat, multiclassing, nor multiple archetypes can restore it. But the monk could gain similar abilities, such as the Two-Weapon Fighting feat, to pretend that he has Flurry of Blows for a character concept.
Choosing an archetype after the character has taken the first level of a class would count as a retroactive change. However, if the archetype changes have not occurred yet, then the only retroactive change is a name change, which is no more significant than changing the spelling of the character's name, and almost all GMs allow that.