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| 14 people marked this as FAQ candidate. Staff response: no reply required. 1 person marked this as a favorite. |
Or, yet another poorly-worded Rage feat/spell/CON-boosting whatever which eventually kills the characters who take it:
When adjacent to other raging allies, your rages become even more powerful.
Prerequisites: Half-orc or orc, rage class feature.
Benefit: Whenever you are raging and adjacent to a raging ally who also has this feat or flanking the same opponent as a raging ally with this feat, your morale bonuses to Strength and Constitution increase by +4. This feat does not stack with itself (you only gain this bonus from one qualifying ally, regardless of how many are adjacent to you).
Or, yet another poorly-worded Rage feat/spell/CON-boosting whatever which eventually kills the characters who take it:** spoiler omitted **So....me and this other tenth-level orc are flanking this horrible paladin who keeps murdering our brood, and we're both down to 15hp -- and the bastard just five-foots away from the flank, and we both instantaneously lose twenty hitpoints and fall unconscious (even though we're smart orcs with the Raging Vitality feat)?
Without it wouldnt you have fallen unconscious a round earlier when whatever-it-was happened which dropped you to 15hp?
Well, I think Rage is meant to be a risk so... I don't see the problem.
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<paladin, telling his tale while recuperating>
"It was the strangest thing, I tell you: I was disarmed and Slowed,
and couldn't do anything except try to feebly withdraw and wait for the
bitter end -- but as soon as I took a step, they both fell over out cold.
Never saw anything like it, and still can't explain it."
Or, yet another poorly-worded Rage feat/spell/CON-boosting whatever which eventually kills the characters who take it:** spoiler omitted **So....me and this other tenth-level orc are flanking this horrible paladin who keeps murdering our brood, and we're both down to 15hp -- and the bastard just five-foots away from the flank, and we both instantaneously lose twenty hitpoints and fall unconscious (even though we're smart orcs with the Raging Vitality feat)?
I hit the FAQ button also. This one is not making my favorites list.
Ah ha, rereading it... I see the problem. If the enemy moves... you lose it. Ok then. Now I flagged it for FAQ.
<paladin, telling his tale while recuperating>
"It was the strangest thing, I tell you: I was disarmed and Slowed,
and couldn't do anything except try to feebly withdraw and wait for the
bitter end -- but as soon as I took a step, they both fell over out cold.
Never saw anything like it, and still can't explain it."
How do you feel about everyone taking turns in a nice orderly fashion during a frantic melee? Or picking a lock, going to bed and waking up better at sneaking around than they used to be? Or the fact it takes longer to chop an elderly master tailor to bits with an axe than it does his younger apprentice? Or the fact the barbarians stood still while the paladin backed away from them?
PF/D&D isn't much of a simulation - there's a fair bit of 'implicit action' in every round, imo.
Without it wouldnt you have fallen unconscious a round earlier when whatever-it-was happened which dropped you to 15hp?
This.
Yes, it's strange that it ends as soon as the enemy moves away, but this feat doesn't kill the Barbarian any faster than, you know, NOT having the feat. It's poorly worded, but it doesn't kill you. The damage you took that would have killed you anyway is what kills you.
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Well, that's the way it should go: "Gorum! I got a sword rammed through my chest and fell down with big 'X's in my eyes!" -- not "I'm so angry that I'm able to resist the lure of death in order to keep wailing on you and, and...you've stumbled backward a pace and I actually have to take one single step toward you and, oh my, I fell myself suddenly being overcome with ennui and eyelids growing heavy....<face plant>"
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Suggestion: the text of Raging Vitality be errata'd to include:
"Benefit: Whenever you are raging, the morale bonus to your Constitution increases by +2.
Temporary morale bonuses to Constitution granted by spells, feats and abilities while
you are raging do not cease until your rage ends. Your rage does not end if you become
unconscious. While unconscious you must still expend rounds of rage per day each round.
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This ability don't need any errata. It is cleary meant to offer more resilience from the creatures that took it, and seeing them fall when you move out of their fury or when they break formation isn't strange, since they probably have grievous wounds which should already have put them to an agonizing state if they weren't in a transe from their collective fury.
Add in Gang Up, and you get several barbarians with huge offense and HP who just need to stick together and be close to you.
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For the record, the raging orcs have the same problem whether the paladin moves, or they kill it. In that circumstance, they are trapped and really need external healing to rescue them.
If they stand adjacent to each other, they have more control over when the benefit ends. If they go all in and flank, they will likely lose the benefit at the end of the round (target is killed or moves).
Using the feat, you gain the benefit of stronger attacks, and the benefit of not falling unconscious immediately when you lose all of your "normal" hitpoints. You still need to be aware of your actual hitpoints though to avoid a Pyrrhic victory.
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You still need to be aware of your actual hitpoints though to avoid a Pyrrhic victory.
Which make it another one of those "self-negating concept" type of feats which, instead of permitting you to "get into the roleplaying mood" of howling in anger as you destroy your enemies, instead require you to tiptoe around like a duelist and keep careful track of everything like an accountant.
...ugh
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New feat:
Raging Defiance
Your fury will not be denied.
Prerequisite: Raging Vitality
Benefit: You are immune to effects which would end your rage involuntarily, even while unconscious. Additionally, when raging, you do not cross the thresholds of death or of unconsciousness against your wishes as a result of changes in hitpoints or Constitution score which occur by means other than damage. For example, if you are recipient of a bonus from a feat, ability, or spell such as Bears Endurance, and they expire or are Dispelled while you are raging, the loss of hitpoints will not drop you below zero (if you are conscious) or cause you to die (if you are already unconscious). Excess unapplied hitpoint loss goes into escrow which is applied immediately when your rage ceases. When you are the recipient of healing, escrowed lost hitpoints are treated first.
<paladin, telling his tale while recuperating>
"It was the strangest thing, I tell you: I was disarmed and Slowed,
and couldn't do anything except try to feebly withdraw and wait for the
bitter end -- but as soon as I took a step, they both fell over out cold.
Never saw anything like it, and still can't explain it."
Great post. Really funny, but I don't get the OP.
There is nothing unclear about the rule. No need for a FAQ.
Which make it another one of those "self-negating concept" type of feats which, instead of permitting you to "get into the roleplaying mood" of howling in anger as you destroy your enemies, instead require you to tiptoe around like a duelist and keep careful track of everything like an accountant.
Not sure I see it the same way. It's a teamwork feat, so the benefits are situational. The effective bonus is +4 to str and a form of Orc's Ferocity. While the situation holds, you can go to -2 hp/level and not be disabled/unconscious. It doesn't increase your ability to take damage overall.
Since the con boost will last for an undetermined number of rounds, it is a bad idea to view that as a new hp total. It's just a buffer to give you another round or two when you are negative. That's it. A strike that would have killed you without the feat may let you fight for another round with the feat. Without healing, you'll still be dead due to that strike when the situational bonus no longer applies.
Or, yet another poorly-worded Rage feat/spell/CON-boosting whatever which eventually kills the characters who take it:** spoiler omitted **So....me and this other tenth-level orc are flanking this horrible paladin who keeps murdering our brood, and we're both down to 15hp -- and the bastard just five-foots away from the flank, and we both instantaneously lose twenty hitpoints and fall unconscious (even though we're smart orcs with the Raging Vitality feat)?Without it wouldnt you have fallen unconscious a round earlier when whatever-it-was happened which dropped you to 15hp?
This. People need to stop expecting rage to provide its temporary bonuses permanently.
Yes, it's possible to fall unconscious or outright die when you stop raging. But only when you've taken enough damage that you would have fallen unconscious/died already without it.
It's the same with any other effects that might end prematurely. What if you'd both had bears endurance on you, and instead of moving away one of you had Bear's Endurance end, and fell to the floor as a result? That's not a problem with Bear's Endurance, it's a problem with you RELYING on the extra HP you get from temporary bonuses to CON.
New feat:Raging Defiance
Your fury will not be denied.
Prerequisite: Raging Vitality
Benefit: You are immune to effects which would end your rage involuntarily, even while unconscious. Additionally, when raging, you do not cross the thresholds of death or of unconsciousness against your wishes as a result of changes in hitpoints or Constitution score which occur by means other than damage. For example, if you are recipient of a bonus from a feat, ability, or spell such as Bears Endurance, and they expire or are Dispelled while you are raging, the loss of hitpoints will not drop you below zero (if you are conscious) or cause you to die (if you are already unconscious). Excess unapplied hitpoint loss goes into escrow which is applied immediately when your rage ceases. When you are the recipient of healing, escrowed lost hitpoints are treated first.
Good idea, too complicated. How about:
Benefit: You are immune to effects which would end your rage involuntarily, even while unconscious. Additionally, while raging, you cannot drop below 0 hit points due to a decrease in your Con score. If you are already at or below 0 hit points, your hp does not change if your con score is reduced. This benefit also applies to the reduction in Con score from ending your rage.
This would have the side effect of letting a negative-but-conscious barbarian heal themselves back up to 0 hp by raging and immediately ending it, but they still have to spend rage rounds to do so, so it's not free unlimited healing.
Doesn't "adjacent to," mean next to, like square beside I mean? Would you really get the ability if you were flanking?
Doesn't "adjacent to," mean next to, like square beside I mean? Would you really get the ability if you were flanking?
It says there in the description 'or flanking the same opponent.'
Doesn't "adjacent to," mean next to, like square beside I mean? Would you really get the ability if you were flanking?
Yes, you need to be adjacent or flanking.
Whenever you are raging and adjacent to a raging ally who also has this feat or flanking the same opponent ...
Whenever you are raging and adjacent to a raging ally who also has this feat or flanking the same opponent ...
Ah... duh me.
Sounds like at least one of the flankers had best have Step Up and hope that stepping into the square just vacated will be allowed by the GM for that feat. That brings flankers adjacent to one another, and the bonus remains.
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Raging Defiance
Your fury will not be denied.
Prerequisite: Raging Vitality
Benefit: You are immune to effects which would end your rage involuntarily, even while unconscious. Additionally, when raging, you do not cross the thresholds of death or of unconsciousness against your wishes as a result of changes in hitpoints or Constitution score which occur by means other than damage. For example, if you are recipient of a bonus from a feat, ability, or spell such as Bears Endurance, and they expire or are Dispelled while you are raging, the loss of hitpoints will not drop you below zero (if you are conscious) or cause you to die (if you are already unconscious). Excess unapplied hitpoint loss goes into escrow which is applied immediately when your rage ceases. When you are the recipient of healing, escrowed lost hitpoints are treated first.
Good idea, too complicated. How about:
Benefit: You are immune to effects which would end your rage involuntarily, even while unconscious. Additionally, while raging, you cannot drop below 0 hit points due to a decrease in your Con score. If you are already at or below 0 hit points, your hp do not change if your con score is reduced. This benefit also applies to the reduction in Con score from ending your rage.
-- This would have the side effect of letting a negative-but-conscious barbarian heal themselves back up to 0 hp by raging and immediately ending it, but they still have to spend rage rounds to do so, so it's not free unlimited healing.
I like it a lot.
<sing-song voice>
"Yo, Pai-zo!"