Yar.
I do hope you stick around long enough to get an answer to why this happened, and possibly see a fix to the problem. It'd be a shame to give up on something potentially great because of a glitch, and without giving any chance at all for the glitch to be fixed.
~P
I just did up a dummy order, and shipping came to just over $9. Total for the order $59.
Did you try to change the shipping type? There are four or five options.
Then again, the nice thing about storming off and swearing to never come back is you don't ever have to find out you're wrong about something.
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Why does the 'handling' part of 'shipping and handling' apparently cost more then the shipping part?
Disgusted, I am now leaving this site and will not even be purchasing the PDFs.
1. Ask for an explanation for something you have an issue with.
2. Inform everyone you're leaving and will thus be incapable of reading any explanation for whatever you have an issue with.
WUT
Srsly, give them time to answer at least. Also, what the above folks said and asked.
Senior Software Developer
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I'm curious, what delivery service will ship 4.2 lbs from the U.S. to New Zealand for $15?
The US Postal Service offers a Priority Mail International flat-rate box for $45.50, or a weight-based rate of $48.15. Our "standard postal delivery" has a maximum weight of 4 lbs for international packages, so we can't use it for shipping a core rulebook.
On the other hand, you can fit more stuff into the flat-rate box than just a single book, so if you want to order more than just that your shipping cost won't go up.
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We'll, I do have to conceed that I perhaps unfairly used the NZ postal system (what it would cost for me to send the book of that exact dimensions and weight back too the US) which obviously this site cannot use.
But also as stated I am have ordered from the US a fair few times, amazon for example will post this book to me for $12.49 with the D&D 4.0 or an old D&D 3.5 in the same price bracket. Blizzard will ship out however many of their books I want (interested in the diablo books before d3 comes out, as a side note) for under US$20 and even warhammer ship out their massive new hardcover rule book for under $20 postage.
I don't know any of the details about your postal and if there are invoices that can be posted or something of the like I'm not close minded - however I have checked up and found this exact item on offer for the same price but with shipping around a third of what this site offers.
When several sites are offering shipping on the exact same or similar sized items for consistantly under half the price of this site I obviously extremely inclined to beleive this site is attempting to 'rip me off' by trying to make profit on the shipping side of things. If I'm wrong - great, I dunno post up some invoices or something.
As a side note, this rule system isn't getting very good reviews from the Myth-weavers website - but I'm not sure exactly why yet...
Hi Bladeace
Maybe try to dial back the negative accusations just a tad :)
I can PROMISE you Paizo is not trying to rip anyone off! As a company, they are just about as honest and decent as they come. I also bet they are looking into how other companies are able to ship to NZ cheaper and will do what they can to find a way to reduce their shipping cost as soon as they can find a way. Honest, this company is not the 'rip people off' kind of company
As for bad reviews ... I don't think I've ever heard of Myth-weavers, but the Paizo RPG has gotten pretty universally positive reviews just about everywhere - and it's more or less tied with D&D in sales.
Bottom line - this is a great rule set from a great company.
The United States Postal Service has an online rate calculator at ircalc.usps.gov
A medium flat rate box (what the Core Rulebook ships in, going internationally) to New Zealand ships for 45.50.
I don't know how Amazon and Blizzard are shipping your packages, but one likely possibility (especially for Amazon) is that they're taking a loss on the shipping and absorbing it through the profit on the item itself or have a shipping facility in New Zealand.
As Gary points out, you should be able to fit a few other items into the Flat-rate box without increasing the shipping, which brings down the price per item. (I haven't checked, but I believe you can fit an APG and Bestiary into the same box without increasing the shipping cost.)
We're not trying to rip anyone off: we're just being honest about our shipping costs. The only other choices are to take a loss on shipping, or simplify our shipping rates so that we overcharge some customers while undercharging others (which isn't fair.)
As a side note, this rule system isn't getting very good reviews from the Myth-weavers website - but I'm not sure exactly why yet...
Check enworld.org. :)
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Yeah- amazon has the advantage of having distribution centers on multiple continents. If the Australian center doesn't have what you want they will let you order it anyway for normal shipping price and then they will ship it to the Australian warehouse with their next bulk restock shipment. It may end up taking you much longer than you expected to get it, but it will arrive with less shipping cost.
A small company with one distribution center can't do that.
Also living over seas I tried to get the Core through amazon uk when it came out to save on shipping costs. I canceled the order and picked it up while traveling after waiting 2 months and they still hadn't shipped it.
Well, all that does sound reasonable and that online price calculator backs it up.
Interesting point - it's a heck of a lot cheaper for me to post to you then it is for you to post to me? Like... less then half the price. Having seen that online price calculator for your postal service I appologise for my earlier posts. I hope you can understand where I was coming from considering that I when I post things to the US (second hand warhammer was the last thing I posted, heavier and larger then this book) they come in at significantly under that price.
Sounds like your international mailing companies are ripping you off?
I don't claim to understand the intricacies of international shipping, but it is possible that the NZ Post is using a slower but cheaper method for their international packages than the US Post uses for "Priority" package. Or does the New Zealand Government subsidize the post?
Is it legal to simply purchase the PDF and print off my own copy at the university (free printing!) then get it bound there? I looked into that and it looks like including the cost of the PDF ($10 right?) that would come in at around $20 US.
Check out this FAQ entry. Short answer: Yes.
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The United States Postal Service has an online rate calculator at ircalc.usps.gov
A medium flat rate box (what the Core Rulebook ships in, going internationally) to New Zealand ships for 45.50.
I don't know how Amazon and Blizzard are shipping your packages, but one likely possibility (especially for Amazon) is that they're taking a loss on the shipping and absorbing it through the profit on the item itself or have a shipping facility in New Zealand.
As Gary points out, you should be able to fit a few other items into the Flat-rate box without increasing the shipping, which brings down the price per item. (I haven't checked, but I believe you can fit an APG and Bestiary into the same box without increasing the shipping cost.)
We're not trying to rip anyone off: we're just being honest about our shipping costs. The only other choices are to take a loss on shipping (which we're unwilling to do), or simplify our shipping rates so that we overcharge some customers while undercharging others (which isn't fair.)
Just out of curiosity, is the flat-rate box the reason that you don't offer Media Mail shipping domestically?
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Chief Technical Officer
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Sounds like your international mailing companies are ripping you off?
Believe me, we've checked as many shippers as we can find, and none of them even come *close* to the USPS price. UPS and FedEx would each charge $141.19 to ship you that 4.2 pound package. (We've tried others as well; USPS International Priority beats the pants off them all.)
My guess is that your rates may be so favorable because the New Zealand Post might still offer surface mail. The USPS eliminated surface mail a few years ago, so everything has to go by air.
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Chief Technical Officer
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Just out of curiosity, is the flat-rate box the reason that you don't offer Media Mail shipping domestically?
No... it's that items sent via Media Mail cannot contain any advertising except for "incidental announcements of books." Almost every book we carry has at least one page that qualifies as advertising by the USPS's standards.
Interesting point - it's a heck of a lot cheaper for me to post to you then it is for you to post to me? Like... less then half the price. Having seen that online price calculator for your postal service I appologise for my earlier posts. I hope you can understand where I was coming from considering that I when I post things to the US (second hand warhammer was the last thing I posted, heavier and larger then this book) they come in at significantly under that price.Sounds like your international mailing companies are ripping you off?
Hmmm.... I never thought of shipping internationally before, but now I looked into it: shipping up to two kg (about 4.4 pounds) internationally would cost me over 40 Euro (about 55 US$ presently) with the Deutsche Post. Rates for higher weights are not even available online. So, this seems a normal rate for that kind of weight. I would think that lower shipping rates are subsidized one way or another. The shipping rates are the reason why I order hardcover books locally - it takes longer that way sometimes, but meanwhile, the pdfs can help.
Stefan
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Chief Technical Officer
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...even warhammer ship out their massive new hardcover rule book for under $20 postage.
Are you talking about the Dark Heresy, Rogue Trader, or Deathwatch rulebooks? Those all weigh about 3.5 pounds, give or take; since they're all under that 4 pound limit, we can ship those with standard mail. Specifically, we could ship Dark Heresy or Rogue Trader to you for $18.24; Deathwatch would ship for $18.44.
The Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook weighs almost three-quarters of a pound more than each of those, and that unfortunately makes a *huge* difference for international shipping.
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Chief Technical Officer
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...even warhammer ship out their massive new hardcover rule book for under $20 postage.
Are you talking about the Dark Heresy, Rogue Trader, or Deathwatch rulebooks? Those each weigh about 3.5 pounds, give or take; since they're all under that 4 pound limit, even boxed up, we can ship those with standard mail. Specifically, we could ship Dark Heresy or Rogue Trader to you for $18.24; Deathwatch is slightly heavier, so it would ship for $18.44.
The Pathfinder RPG Core Rulebook weighs almost three-quarters of a pound more than each of those, and that, unfortunately, makes a *huge* difference for international shipping.
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As for bad reviews ... I don't think I've ever heard of Myth-weavers, but the Paizo RPG has gotten pretty universally positive reviews just about everywhere -...
As a side note, this rule system isn't getting very good reviews from the Myth-weavers website - but I'm not sure exactly why yet...
Myth-Weavers is a PBP host site. I have an account there, but haven't used it for a couple of years, so I'm not sure about the reviews. It is a nice site for PBPs though... whatever that's worth.
Yeah- amazon has the advantage of having distribution centers on multiple continents. If the Australian center doesn't have what you want they will let you order it anyway for normal shipping price and then they will ship it to the Australian warehouse with their next bulk restock shipment. It may end up taking you much longer than you expected to get it, but it will arrive with less shipping cost.
The way Amazon is configured is based on what site you order from. If you place an order on the main .com website, the items are all from a facility somewhere in the US. Co.uk order come from one of the UK warehouses. .De and .Fr come from warehouses in those countries. Same with the .CA and .IT.
When items are shipped out of those countries, (such as US to NZ) they go by various international shipping methods. There's no crossover of inventory from the different sites.
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Also of note, it is actually very good of Paizo to offer shipping outside the U.S. My employer, a fairly large catalog retailer, will not ship outside the U.S. just because of the added cost. We have Canadian customers who live close to the U.S. border and have items shipped to a P.O. box Stateside. Then, they cross the border to pick up the package. A small business like Paizo is cool to offer it, especially when there are other outlets for their products, like Amazon.
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It’s not just gaming companies, it is a whole range of products.
For example, a lot of British ex-pats living in Australia have realized that white goods (amongst other things) are far, far more expensive in Australia than they are back home. Unfortunately, the stores where they can get them cheaply in Britain generally do not ship overseas … but they will ship to the docks. So they buy their white-goods over the internet, have them delivered for free or cheaply to the docks where they have arranged their own shipping over to Australia. Even with the cost of shipping, they will have made a substantial saving over buying the same product from a local retailer in Australia.
Long live PDFs!
Bladeace: I also live in NZ and buy most of my stuff from thebookdepository.co.uk which has free shipping worldwide. Not actually sure how they turn a profit though.
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Sounds like your international mailing companies are ripping you off?Believe me, we've checked as many shippers as we can find, and none of them even come *close* to the USPS price. UPS and FedEx would each charge $141.19 to ship you that 4.2 pound package. (We've tried others as well; USPS International Priority beats the pants off them all.)
My guess is that your rates may be so favorable because the New Zealand Post might still offer surface mail. The USPS eliminated surface mail a few years ago, so everything has to go by air.
Noble Knight Games offers something called USPS International Surface Air Lift - Printed Matter. Putting the PF Core rulebook in the cart and using the shipping calculator, I get a quote of $16.40 to Italy (where I live) and a quote $22.23 for New Zealand. They also offer something called FIMS – International Mail Service, which gives a quote of $27.41 for New Zealand.
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As a side note, this rule system isn't getting very good reviews from the Myth-weavers website - but I'm not sure exactly why yet...
Can you link? I've looked over there and don't see anything negative about Pathfinder.
Of course, if all you can point out is the "Pathfinder Fighter Thread," that isn't strictly about PF and more about why melee classes suck when compared to magic classes. That is an age-old debate that I can fit into any system out there.
Surely, you didn't base "not getting very good reviews" on more than this one post?
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Sounds like your international mailing companies are ripping you off?Believe me, we've checked as many shippers as we can find, and none of them even come *close* to the USPS price. UPS and FedEx would each charge $141.19 to ship you that 4.2 pound package. (We've tried others as well; USPS International Priority beats the pants off them all.)
My guess is that your rates may be so favorable because the New Zealand Post might still offer surface mail. The USPS eliminated surface mail a few years ago, so everything has to go by air.
Noble Knight Games offers something called USPS International Surface Air Lift - Printed Matter. Putting the PF Core rulebook in the cart and using the shipping calculator, I get a quote of $16.40 to Italy (where I live) and a quote $22.23 for New Zealand. They also offer something called FIMS – International Mail Service, which gives a quote of $27.41 for New Zealand.
That's something quite interesting, as I had to cancel a couple of subscriptions based almost only on a steep rise on international shipment rates (and those dreaded VATs our customs seem to apply more or less at random).
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Chief Technical Officer
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Noble Knight Games offers something called USPS International Surface Air Lift - Printed Matter. Putting the PF Core rulebook in the cart and using the shipping calculator, I get a quote of $16.40 to Italy (where I live) and a quote $22.23 for New Zealand.
They're not allowed to do that. International Surface Air Lift (ISAL) uses something called M-bags, which involves bundling several packages intended for the same destination, but one of the restrictions on M-bags is that "The combined weight of each printed matter mailpiece and the related articles may not exceed 4 pounds." That is, no single parcel in the bag is allowed to weigh more than 4 pounds. (We use a version of this method; that's where that 4-pound weight limit we talked about earlier comes from.)
They also offer something called FIMS – International Mail Service, which gives a quote of $27.41 for New Zealand.
That's FedEx International MailService. We use a competing service from UPS called Mail Innovations, but we have quoted with FedEx; their rates weren't as good for us as Mail Innovations. I should note that FIMS encompasses a few different services, and the one that I think would be close to that price actually uses USPS ISAL—meaning that that 4-pound weight limit per parcel applies. FIMS *does* accept parcels over 4 pounds, but I'm pretty certain they can only go by a much more expensive rate.
I have a strong suspicion that Noble Knight is simply underestimating the weight of the book, and either sending them improperly, or paying more than they realize to ship them.
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Just another point of info, Games Workshop has an Australian office, so that explains why their postage would be as cheap as it is. Amazon also has an Aussie distribution center.
-Lisa
Yes but GW prices on actual product are outrageous. As one friend points out, its actually cheaper to buy said GW products in the US or UK online GW store, and have it shipped then walk down the road and buy it in store....