Desert Fox
(modeled after Michael J Fox in back to a future)
Human Male Level 7 Gunslinger (RAW)
Chaotic Good
S 13
D 16
C 9
I 14
W 14
Ch 13
(stats were rolled)
AC 16
Hp 49
Skills I took were:
Acrobatics 3
Bluff 4
Intimidate 4
Craft Gun Smithing 6
Craft Alchemy 6
Perception 1
Feats:
Rapid Reload
Two Weapon Fighting
Master Craftsman
Craft Magic Arms and Armor
Lightening Reload Deed
Vital strike
Equipment:
+1 pistol
+1 Pistol
+1 Pistol
+1 Pistol
+1 Pistol
+1 pistol
(I made them)
+1 longsword (I found)
+2 Leather Armor (found)
Hat of disguise (found by party, no one wanted it, so i took it)
Duster of resistance +1 (its a cloak)
everything else is already printed in rules or not necessary for the play test.
Ok so, our first combat with my gunslinger (of note) was with a giant praying mantis thingy.
We have a cavalier, a witch, a rage prophet, and inquisitor and normally my magus but i subbed in the gunslinger.
The Cav charged it and did 40 something damage, the witch shot it with her long bow and did 8 damage, the rage prophet closed distance and the inquisitor shot it with her xbow for 9 damage.
I shot with one pistol using vital strike (+1 pistol) rolled a crit, confirmed the crit. rolled my 5d8 damage and got 32, it was dead.
Rage prophet was grumpy.
reloaded my pistol.
Next fight was against a pack of hooting charau-ka (monkey dudes)
there were 6 of them.
Monkeys won init, all the melee types (5) closed distance and threw sticks at us (throwing clubs) I got hit in the noggin for 4, the witch got hit for 3.
I went first and shot the guy who threw the club at me with both barrels (he was close) drilled him for 8 and 7. The rage prophet closed with his monkey and cleaned it.
The cavalier charged his monkey, same thing the charge damage brought his monkey well into negatives.
Witch cast hobble hex on her monkey.
Inquisitor shot two bolts from her repeating xbow at hers, 5 and 6.
the caster monkey tried hold person on the cav, but he made his save.
Next round.
Monkeys attack again, hobbled monkey doesnt make it to witch, rage prophet moves over to engage with his axe.
monkey on inquisitor closes to melee with her and hits her for 9
my monkey closes on me too and misses.
funky spell casty monkey moves and channels negative energy hurting the cav and his mount. (we just took to calling him funky monkey after this)
Inquisitor and I switch monkeys, she five foot steps and shoots at my monkey twice missing. I move, drop pistols and draw my longsword (provoking AoO from my monkey, but so would have reloading) monkey misses me. I walk over to her monkey and hit it with my longsword for 7.
the cav and funky monkey trade wiffs, the witch and the rage prophet take down the other monkey. and there is still one melee monkey that just hasnt seemed to close with anyone yet.
my monkey closes with the inquisitor and hits her for 9, her monkey attacks me and misses.
I draw a pistol as a move action and attack her monkey with the longsword, for 8
random melee monkey manages to flank with funky monkey on cav, ho ho hes a rogue! does a bunch of damage to cav. Rage Prophet decides to go help.
witch decides to go heal.
combat is now split, the funky monkey encounter is about 60 feet from me and the inqusitor at this point.
funky monkey ends up being a rogue/cleric (which is why we called him funkey monkey) and drops with cav with a poisoned sneak attack before the other two can get there.
inquisitor 5 foot steps drops he xbow and draws her mace and swats her monkey with judgement.
I hit same monkey with my sword dropping it and shoot the other monkey with my pistol, took a 5 foot step and swung with my iterative with the longsword and ended up dropping him as well.
meanwhile we are far from funkey and his rouge buddy.
inquisitor picks up her xbows and reloads it.
I sheath my sword, move closer, drop a pistol.
funkey monkey and rogue buddy make the witch nervous but she's able to sneak her familiar (a silvanshee) in to the cav, to deliver a healing spell, the rage prophet charges rogue buddy but misses.
I have now emptied three pistols, I draw two more pistols.
and move.
The inquisitor shoots twice her her repeating xbow hitting rogue buddy monkey twice.
Funkey monkey flamestrikes cav and witch familiar, but familiar escapes.
Cav is crispy critter.
Everyone wishes I was playing my magus instead.
to be honest, this guy feels a little like the magus right now.
rogue buddy and rage prophet trade misses.
Witch hobbles funkey monkey.
I shoot both my pistols at funkey monkey, targeting torso, one crits and confirms, the other hits.
the resulting 3d8 damage does 18.
Funkey charges me (with his hobbled movement it wasnt far, but far enough) with his crazy poison dagger.
swings and misses.
Next round the witch closes behind me to heal me.
I pistol whip, 5 foot step, drop a pistol and draw my dagger (left my longsword back yonder).
inquisitor nails funkey twice with xbow.
rage prophet and rogue buddy busy themselves.
I lost track of everyones hp and damage at this point.
witch misfortunes the funkey monkey
funkey gets confused, attack witch, attack me?
Witch it is, he hobbles toward her his move provokes Ao0 from me but i miss with my dagger.
Funkey channels neg energy and gets me and the witch for 18 damage.
witch 5 foot steps, casts ray of enfeeblement, I have one pistol shot left.
I draw pistol and fire, touch AC targeting torso, vital strike...gosh could have been so cool if it was a crit.
2d8 damage anyway. I drop funkey monkey and get me a grit point back.
Woot.
Ive got weapons strewn all over the battle field, I really could have used quick draw.
Never had time to reload.
and the rogue buddy decides to beat feat and run away, inquisitor missed him and me with out any ammo for a parting shot, I blow a grit on lightening reload. reload. targeting torso, vital strike, fire 2d8 parting shot, he limps off into the jungle, bleeding wound would have been handy here, apparently he had one hit point left.
So at the cavs death we brought back in the magus and made some changes to the gunslinger.
and leveled everyone to 8
with my bonus feat as an 8th level gunslinger, I took improved critical, pistol.
I dropped craft magic arms and armor for the purposes of play test and took quick draw instead (ill post how that made a difference in the next couple of combats later)
If anything I feel the need to congratulate you on those crits.
If anything I feel the need to congratulate you on those crits.
Yeah, you hit a lot, got missed a lot, and crit twice in about eight shots.
Thanks for posting the whole thing! I know it's a bit of a pain, but it's really helpful.
I couldn't help notice your critical damage. Were you using pre-nerfed guns? If so, why? The guns in Pathfinder are already pretty sub-par weapon choices. You shouldn't cripple them further by reducing their critical multiplier to x3.
I couldn't help notice your critical damage. Were you using pre-nerfed guns? If so, why? The guns in Pathfinder are already pretty sub-par weapon choices. You shouldn't cripple them further by reducing their critical multiplier to x3.
well they are only 1d8 guns, vital strike doesnt figure in to crit multiple, so that one crit with the vital strike in there is 5d8 so with the top damage being 40, i didnt think 32 was bad. You had the damage from dex (2) and magic (1) being figured in x5 so 15 of that damage was "augmentation" and not dice. so 17 on 5d8 is 3s and 4s on average, so not probably slightly below averagish, guess i got lucky in the crit and not so lucky on the damage dice.
the reason i hit alot is because several times i was only attacking touch AC.
Im +7 for 7th level, +2 for dex,+1 for magic.+1 for gun training, -4 for two weapon fighting so bonuses and negatives balance each other out, so basically Im +7 to hit on touch ac, it pretty much makes for hitting alot.
With my sword Im only +9 (BAB, magic str) and -4 so +5 total. So im still better with guns. when i had my dagger out: I was -2/-2 with the two weapon fighting So the dagger was +6 to hit (which didnt matter, i missed
the AoO) but the pistol was then +9 to attack touch AC. (which was only 14)
When i level to 8 and switch around the feats you'll see a big difference, i'll post that in a bit.
So in building the character, because i started it at higher level, we discovered i made a mistake, i never added in by +1 stat at 4th level. and since im 8th level now, we took +2 and added it to dex. I also forgot 4 skill points off the character.
i switch feats as mentioned before, added one for 8th level, and since i dont have craft magic arms and armor, i dont have magic pistols. but we made them adamantine/darkwood masterwork pistols so they weight the same but don't explode.
so here we are:
Desert Fox
Human Male Level 8 Gunslinger (RAW)
Chaotic Good
S 13
D 18
C 9
I 14
W 14
Ch 13
AC 20
Hp 54
Skills I took were:
Acrobatics 3
Bluff 4
Intimidate 6
Craft Gun Smithing 8
Craft Alchemy 8
Perception 3
Feats:
Rapid Reload
Two Weapon Fighting
Master Craftsman
Quick draw
Lightening Reload Deed
Vital strike
Improved Crit Pistol
Equipment:
6 mwk pistols
+3 studded leather armor (it was in party treasure we didnt know about until later)
+1 scimitar (also in party treasure just written a page somewhere)
Hat of disguise
Duster of resistance +1
Our next battle:
The party is now:
Lvl 8
Gunslinger
Witch
Rage Prophet
Magus
Inquisitor
we face four serpent folk on a bridge.
The are armed with battle axes and javelins.
We don't want to engage them on the bridge but they wont come off.
We spend a round trying to harass them off but they aren't budging, rage prophet, witch and magus begin buffs. amoung other things, the magus casts magic weapon on my ammo. Inquisitor judgements but i dont remember which one.
I have nothing to do, so i five foot step, get into 20 foot range of the first one and full attack with two pistols targeting torso on each shot.
Their touch ac is 11. (fire, fire, drop, draw, fire
two weapon fighting im -4/-4 but +8 BAB. +4 Dex, +1 MW pistols, +1 gun training, so i have a choice of hitting them or misfiring, thats it.
They ALL hit, two of them crit (improved critical and targeting torso brings my crit range with pistols to 17-20, i rolled a 18 and a 17)
at this range confirming the crit is almost as good as auto confirm.
first shot landed for 10, next crit does 21+16 (37), next crit does 31+16 (47). So a total of 94 damage. Twice the creatures hit points apparently. I killed, and critted twice, but since it was a new day, I hadn't spent any grit yet, so i didnt gain any, Lame. With as little grit as you get, I think you should at least be able to have Twice your natural grit from grit earning actions (total) but that if you dont use it it goes away at the end of the day (so if I have 2 natural grit, i could have gotten 2 grit or a max of 4)
The other three serpent folk huck their javelins at me: two missed one hit for 11 ouch.
Inquisitor shoots her xbow and missed.
next round the rage prophet and magus run up the bridge to close with two serpent folk, the witch shoots her longbow at the one farthest away and hits for 3.
Rage prophet hits with dwarf ax for 12 damage.
Magus doesnt close all the way and casts scorching ray.
Hitting for 9 and 12.
The inquisitor shoots her xbow twice and lands twice for 11 and 8.
I take a five foot step, drop my two pistols (total gone are three) and draw two more pistols. Blam Blam, short range on two more of them. this time i target two different serpent folk as they have both taken damage.
hit both times.
9 and 12.
Serpent folk retaliate, the two more wounded ones up front attack the rage prophet and the magus, hit on the prophet, miss the magus. I don't remember how much damage the prophet took but he can take a ton of it.
The one in the back moves up and attacks the prophet, and hits.
I move up, and reload a pistol. (back into the within 20 range again, but this time on all three of them)
The witch moves and hexes the one in back, hobbling him.
the inquisitor moves and shoots her xbow. missing.
The rage prophet manages to drop one of the serpent folk.
The Magus casts scorching ray again, then five foot steps and attacks, killing another serpent folk.
One left. he is hobbled, so hes not running away.
Serpent folk stands his ground.
I spend a grit, lightening reload, and let him have two barrels at close range. Both hit, one for 10 and the other for 9.
5 on one, I reloaded my pistols, and went about collecting my dropped firearms and let the rest of the party finish him off.
Quick draw and improved crit helped alot, still really lacking on regular damage, but i guess over all, easy confirm crits, make up for the lack of regular damage, with the vital strike at farther away than 20 it is also helpful because you wont use the iterative.
by and large, i hit alot because of touch AC and i dont get hit myself much because the enemies I have fought are close to or under the CR for our party and so, have the normal chances of hitting us at this level.
wonder what was so important with this bridge?
Twice the creatures hit points apparently. I killed, and critted twice, but since it was a new day, I hadn't spent any grit yet, so i didnt gain any, Lame.
Actually you DID.
Targetting costs 1 Grit. You have 2 Grit total from your Wisdom.
You targeted, that brought you to 1 grit, then you not only killed it, you even critted, twice. Theoretically thatd get you 3 grit (1 Grit per confirmed crit and 1 for the first kill of the day), but the crit alone did bring you back up to your full 2 Grit. So yes you technically wasted 2 potential Grit. However since the Crit gave you the Grit, your next kill would trigger the First Kill Grit regain since you didn't actually get it.
crit grit, gritty crit?
say that ten times fast.
Yea i forgot about that, what i meant is i got more regainable grit than i spent.
Targeting burns 1 grit, but like i said, at that close of range, trying to hit something with a touch AC of 11, crits are almost auto confirmed.
So alot of people are complaining about not enough grit, but I havent run out yet and I have only two. Seems to me targeting and improved crit work well to get back your grit. With a 17-20 threat range combining the two weapons.
Later on I found a reason to use targeting limb, just havent posted that one yet. I think it's lame, it should maybe do half normal damage. I can't see hitting someone and not doing damage, unless your are hitting the object in their hand. No other attack does this in the game.
Edit: actually i just re=read that again and it seems i have to spend a grit for each and every attack that round, not just a round of targeting. so i would have spent 2 grit and got 2 grit back, seems lame to spend that much grit just for a chance to maybe crit. Should be a boost for the entire round for 1 grit.
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As a side note, targeting is a swift action that only effects your next shot. So you can't target torso more than once per round. Also, improved critical doesn't stack with any other effect that changes the crit range of a weapon. So you can't use improved critical and torso to increase your threat range to 17-20 by raw( If you could it would only be 18-20 as both would work on the original crit range of 1 and not the modified crit range ). Thanks for the play test info though! Those were fairly minor details and don't effect the overall feeling of the class.
As a side note, targeting is a swift action that only effects your next shot. So you can't target torso more than once per round. Also, improved critical doesn't stack with any other effect that changes the crit range of a weapon. So you can't use improved critical and torso to increase your threat range to 17-20 by raw( If you could it would only be 18-20 as both would work on the original crit range of 1 and not the modified crit range ). Thanks for the play test info though! Those were fairly minor details and don't effect the overall feeling of the class.
Hmmm we talked about that on another thread pretty extensively. Keen and improved crit dont stack. Yes that's unfortunate wording.
That makes targeting torso by spend a grit a giant waste of time.why spend grit when you can get it through keen or improved crit.
Another way the whole gun/gunslinger becomes ultra lame through any feasible build.
Tageting needs to stack, or it isnt worth it.
getting ready to throw gunslinger in garbage and make a commoner with rabies...more vicious, more deadly.
how in hades can you do damage with this lame charatcer?
the best way i can see, is having one pistol and make single shots, ever round using vital strike plus dex, you cant even use focus shot because it burns the same standard action. But even then the best damage you could do is 2d8 +4 dex +4 int (assuming 18 in both stats) yippie! a romping stomping 24 damage! you cant crit much (the fighting styles ONLY strength) because x and y and z all prevent you from doing it so 19-20 x4 is only marginally better than 20 x4, so you cant do it that way.
seems the only thing this character sheet is worth is making a good airplane or spitwads (which might actually do more damage)