
CJohnJones |
So, I am about to join a Legacy of fire campaign, and I want to try out the new Zen Archer Monk. Starting level is 5 so I get to avoid the worst of the "growing pains" years. My restrictions are: 20 point buy, no stat below 12 (for rp purposes I'm not going to pile every last point into WIS. Dips into another class are okay, but not so long as to cripple my flurry of blows progression (assuming that flurry is better than just using rapid shot and manyshot).
Also, 10,000 gold to spend on magic.
Party has cleric, fighter and sorc.
Should probably be human, but I am open to a particularly good Arcane archer build using half elf or the racial heritage feat (which is better for my roleplaying background).
Currently I am thinking 12,14,12,12,17 (+1 for fourth level), 12 for stats. Feats (including freebies and bonus feats): improved initiative, toughness, deadly aim, precise shot, wpn focus: longbow, point blank shot zen archery, point blank master and either rapid shot or dodge.
For gear I was thinking of a +2 headband of intellect, wand of mage armor, an efficient quiver, some durable arrows and then trying to cobble together some kind of bow if I have the cash. Might have to skip the quiver for now to do that.
Any thoughts (besides make a fighter or ranger instead)?

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I believe I saw somewhere (been awhile) that Arcane Archer was supposed to have been made available to all races, and that the elf pre-req was a holdover from 3.5 that shouldn't have been kept. Since I don't think it was changed in the errata though, I can't make any promises.
However, the Elves of Golarion has a section on "Alchemical Arrows" that have special new effects you might be interested in, so playing an elf might still be an option.
Furthermore, if you can use 3.5 stuff, there's a feat called Kung Fu Genius from a former Dragon Magazine that lets you use your Int for Monk stuff. It was later reprinted in the Dragon Compendium.
Also, Rapid Shot and Bow Flurry don't stack, so I'd suggest Snatch Arrows (to conserve your ammo or turn about a nasty attack) or Extra Ki instead, especially if you plan on multi-classing.

grasshopper_ea |

So, I am about to join a Legacy of fire campaign, and I want to try out the new Zen Archer Monk. Starting level is 5 so I get to avoid the worst of the "growing pains" years. My restrictions are: 20 point buy, no stat below 12 (for rp purposes I'm not going to pile every last point into WIS. Dips into another class are okay, but not so long as to cripple my flurry of blows progression (assuming that flurry is better than just using rapid shot and manyshot).
Also, 10,000 gold to spend on magic.
Party has cleric, fighter and sorc.
Should probably be human, but I am open to a particularly good Arcane archer build using half elf or the racial heritage feat (which is better for my roleplaying background).
Currently I am thinking 12,14,12,12,17 (+1 for fourth level), 12 for stats. Feats (including freebies and bonus feats): improved initiative, toughness, deadly aim, precise shot, wpn focus: longbow, point blank shot zen archery, point blank master and either rapid shot or dodge.
For gear I was thinking of a +2 headband of intellect, wand of mage armor, an efficient quiver, some durable arrows and then trying to cobble together some kind of bow if I have the cash. Might have to skip the quiver for now to do that.
Any thoughts (besides make a fighter or ranger instead)?
With human I would take dodge, toughness(or Noble Scion:narikoplus if allowed), deadly aim, point blank shot, precise shot, 14 str would be more desireable but 12 should be fine. You should have great saves, okay AC esp. if you pick up some potions of mage armor and reduce person for hard fights, and decent skill points. Or you can play a fighter :) good luck. As previously stated sadly you can't use rapid shot and many shot with your archer. Now for an interesting combatant you could go weapon adept monk with shurikens and get rapid shot in there, could be really interesting as a halfling doing 1 + str + PBS + deadly aim damage and you would get your combat manuever training going that route.

CJohnJones |
I believe I saw somewhere (been awhile) that Arcane Archer was supposed to have been made available to all races, and that the elf pre-req was a holdover from 3.5 that shouldn't have been kept. Since I don't think it was changed in the errata though, I can't make any promises.
However, the Elves of Golarion has a section on "Alchemical Arrows" that have special new effects you might be interested in, so playing an elf might still be an option.
Furthermore, if you can use 3.5 stuff, there's a feat called Kung Fu Genius from a former Dragon Magazine that lets you use your Int for Monk stuff. It was later reprinted in the Dragon Compendium.
Also, Rapid Shot and Bow Flurry don't stack, so I'd suggest Snatch Arrows (to conserve your ammo or turn about a nasty attack) or Extra Ki instead, especially if you plan on multi-classing.
Arcane Archer for humans? That I'd like to find.

ItoSaithWebb |

Ryu_Hitome wrote:Arcane Archer for humans? That I'd like to find.I believe I saw somewhere (been awhile) that Arcane Archer was supposed to have been made available to all races, and that the elf pre-req was a holdover from 3.5 that shouldn't have been kept. Since I don't think it was changed in the errata though, I can't make any promises.
However, the Elves of Golarion has a section on "Alchemical Arrows" that have special new effects you might be interested in, so playing an elf might still be an option.
Furthermore, if you can use 3.5 stuff, there's a feat called Kung Fu Genius from a former Dragon Magazine that lets you use your Int for Monk stuff. It was later reprinted in the Dragon Compendium.
Also, Rapid Shot and Bow Flurry don't stack, so I'd suggest Snatch Arrows (to conserve your ammo or turn about a nasty attack) or Extra Ki instead, especially if you plan on multi-classing.
Ask and thou shall receive.
The blood of a non-human ancestor f lows in your veins.
Prerequisite: Human.
Benefit: Choose another humanoid race. You count as
both human and that race for any effects related to race.
For example, if you choose dwarf, you are considered both
a human and a dwarf for the purpose of taking traits, feats,
how spells and magic items affect you, and so on.
The PF Arcane Archer you only need a little bit of elven blood it seems to take the class. Hope that helps. BTW I would suggest only taking 3 levels of this so you can take advantage of your main class.
If you are allowed 3.5 then look up the Feat Heroic Surge and you will be glad you did.

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Noble Scion:narikoplus
This.
First, I'd go 14 STR, 12 DEX instead of the other way around, and always use the best STR bow you can.
The Zen Archer monk is so nice because there's such a plethora of good archery feats, you get a ton of bonus feats, and two of the best archery feats you don't need at all: Rapid Shot and Manyshot you can ignore since your flurry will be better. Also ignore Far Shot--during a normal adventuring career of 1-20, you will probably only actually use it maybe 5 encounters. Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, and Deadly Aim should be the first 3 feats you take. Weapon Focus you get for free. Take Imp. Precise Shot as soon as you can (6th level bonus feat) and your days of missing shots will basically be over (ignore cover/concealment less than total). You don't need such things as Stabbing Shot because you still threaten with your monk unarmed strike. Pick up Combat Reflexes by 9th level so you can make fullest use of your Reflexive Shot ability. Deflect Arrows is situational for most monks; since they run into melee, they are at highest risk from melee attacks. You, OTOH, will be trying your best to stay at range, so you will be taking more ranged weapon fire and Deflect Arrows will consequently be a better choice. Snatch Arrows is cool, but not especially useful. Scorpion Style actually gives you some great synergy with ranged weapons and monk speed; if you find yourself in melee, you can Scorpion strike, run your speed away, and take several free rounds of ranged flurries before the enemy can catch up to you. Imp Crit is great, but you can take it at 11th level anyways, so I'd take Pinpoint Targeting as your 10th level bonus feat (if you don't take it as your lvl 10 bonus feat, you can NEVER get it--+16 BAB prerequisite). I can see uses for Spider Step and Cloud Step, which can allow you to put yourself in otherwise unreachable sniping positions. Really, though, you get enough feats and bonus feats that by the time you hit lvl 6 or 7, you'll have all the good archery feats and have all the prerequisites out of the way to take the top-end ones when you're high enough level. You'll have some feat slots available for stuff like Dodge, Imp. Init, Toughness, saving throw feats, Extra Ki, etc.
As far as skills, keep Acrobatics and Escape Artist capped out to escape from melee and grapples. UMD (or a 1 level ranger dip) can allow you to take advantage of some truly spectacular and cheap wands, such as gravity bow and aspect of the falcon, plus let you heal up in between fights with a wand of cure light wounds.
Other fun archer tactics:
If there's cover on the map, you should be behind it.
When you're at range, kneel. It's a free action and it gives you +2 AC vs. ranged attacks, -2 AC vs. melee attacks. It can also allow you to get better cover (depending on your GM, a low wall might give you improved cover instead of regular cover if you're kneeling behind it).
Because you flurry, you can potentially get a lot more use out of energy damage enhancements (flaming, frost, etc.) on your weapon. More attacks = more +1d6 energy damage. Same for holy.
Fly makes you nearly immune to melee. Death from above! Spider climb, including slippers of spider climbing, is almost as good.

Arillius |
I am also making a zen archer monk and was curious about whether or not rapid shot was better or worse the using flurry of blows. The flurry of blows means I can dip into my ki pool for an extra hit, but if rapid shot has better to hit it might be useful to get against enemies with high AC.
Also, where is kneel in the PHB? Does it take another free action to stand or something bigger?

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cant you rapid shot+many shot+flurry+ki pool?
No, it explicitly says that flurry does not work with rapid shot and many shot. So you can either spend the feats (rapid shot and manyshot) and have the following attacks at level 20: +13/+13/+8/+3
Or you can not spend the feats, just use your class abilities, and by spending a ki point for the extra attack get the following attacks at level 20: +18/+18/+18/+13/+13/+8/+8/+3, and have two extra feats to spend!So, yeah Flurry + Ki Point >>>>>>> Rapid Shot + Manyshot

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cant you rapid shot+many shot+flurry+ki pool?
No, it explicitly says that flurry does not work with rapid shot and manyshot. So you can either spend the feats (rapid shot and manyshot) and have the following attacks at level 20: +13/+13/+8/+3
Or you can not spend the feats, just use your class abilities, and by spending a ki point for the extra attack get the following attacks at level 20: +18/+18/+18/+13/+13/+8/+8/+3, and have two extra feats to spend!So, yeah Flurry + Ki Point >>>>>>> Rapid Shot + Manyshot

CJohnJones |
grasshopper_ea wrote:Noble Scion:narikoplusThis.
First, I'd go 14 STR, 12 DEX instead of the other way around, and always use the best STR bow you can.
The Zen Archer monk is so nice because there's such a plethora of good archery feats, you get a ton of bonus feats, and two of the best archery feats you don't need at all: Rapid Shot and Manyshot you can ignore since your flurry will be better. Also ignore Far Shot--during a normal adventuring career of 1-20, you will probably only actually use it maybe 5 encounters. Point Blank Shot, Precise Shot, and Deadly Aim should be the first 3 feats you take. Weapon Focus you get for free. Take Imp. Precise Shot as soon as you can (6th level bonus feat) and your days of missing shots will basically be over (ignore cover/concealment less than total). You don't need such things as Stabbing Shot because you still threaten with your monk unarmed strike. Pick up Combat Reflexes by 9th level so you can make fullest use of your Reflexive Shot ability. Deflect Arrows is situational for most monks; since they run into melee, they are at highest risk from melee attacks. You, OTOH, will be trying your best to stay at range, so you will be taking more ranged weapon fire and Deflect Arrows will consequently be a better choice. Snatch Arrows is cool, but not especially useful. Scorpion Style actually gives you some great synergy with ranged weapons and monk speed; if you find yourself in melee, you can Scorpion strike, run your speed away, and take several free rounds of ranged flurries before the enemy can catch up to you. Imp Crit is great, but you can take it at 11th level anyways, so I'd take Pinpoint Targeting as your 10th level bonus feat (if you don't take it as your lvl 10 bonus feat, you can NEVER get it--+16 BAB prerequisite). I can see uses for Spider Step and Cloud Step, which can allow you to put yourself in otherwise unreachable sniping positions. Really, though, you get enough feats and bonus feats that by the time you hit lvl 6 or...
I had my first game with this yesterday. It went decently, and I was an acceptable damage add. Kind of a one trick pony, but I climbed up things with the slippers of spider climbing and did my turret impression. Thanks for the advice. Those slippers are gold, plus as a bonus it has the whole "Crouching Tiger" climbing the walls thing covered for a monk. No if only our fighter-type was any kind of a tank.

lectric |

Name Violation wrote:cant you rapid shot+many shot+flurry+ki pool?No, it explicitly says that flurry does not work with rapid shot and manyshot. So you can either spend the feats (rapid shot and manyshot) and have the following attacks at level 20: +13/+13/+8/+3
Or you can not spend the feats, just use your class abilities, and by spending a ki point for the extra attack get the following attacks at level 20: +18/+18/+18/+13/+13/+8/+8/+3, and have two extra feats to spend!So, yeah Flurry + Ki Point >>>>>>> Rapid Shot + Manyshot
I completely agree. Was just having this conversation in another thread.