I might also get a bit obsessed with gaming sometimes, but this just makes me sad and angry.
[quote=]From www.thatsweird.net:
Couple played Dungeons & Dragons while babies starved
Two babies were left starving and suffering health problems while their parents played Dungeons & Dragons.
American couple Michael and Iana Straw, 25 and 23, from Nevada pleaded guilty to child neglect, brought about by their obsession with internet and video games, authorities said.
Their children, a boy aged 22 months and girl aged 11 months, were badly malnourished and near to death last month when doctors saw them after social workers took them to hospital.
Michael Straw, who was unemployed at the time of the incident, had come into a $50,000 inheritance and spent it on computer equipment and a large plasma TV.
The Straws allegedly failed to feed or properly clean their children because they couldn't tear themselves away from the computer. Their main obsession was with the fantasy role-playing Dungeons & Dragons series.
Prosecutor Kelli Ann Viloria said: "They had food; they just chose not to give it to their kids because they were too busy playing video games."
Police were called in after complaints from neighbors that one of the children would not stop crying. According to the police report, the family's home was strewn with rubbish bags.
Police said hospital staff had to shave the head of the girl because her hair was matted with cat urine. The 10-pound girl also had a mouth infection, dry skin and severe dehydration.
Her brother had to be treated for starvation and a genital infection. His lack of muscle development caused him difficulty in walking, investigators said.
Both children are doing well and gaining weight in foster care, prosecutor Viloria told the Reno Gazette-Journal.
The parents face maximum jail sentences of 12 years each.
While child abuse because of drug addiction is common, abuse rooted in video game addiction is rare, Ms Viloria said.
Last month, experts at an American Medical Association meeting backed away from a proposal to designate video game addiction as a mental disorder, saying it had to be studied further.
Nevada Child Abuse Prevention said video game addiction's correlation to child abuse is "a new spin on an old problem".
"As we become more technologically advanced, there's more distractions. It's easy for someone to get addicted to something and neglect their children," a spokesman said.
- July 18, 2007
These parents are loser, but the person that wrote this article is just trying to abuse D&D again. "The fantasy role-playing Dungeons & Dragons series" yet it repeatively said the parents were addicted to video games... I can only "assume" that in reality it must have been DDO and they just want to hit "D&D" again. All of them are losers.
These parents are loser, but the person that wrote this article is just trying to abuse D&D again. "The fantasy role-playing Dungeons & Dragons series" yet it repeatively said the parents were addicted to video games... I can only "assume" that in reality it must have been DDO and they just want to hit "D&D" again. All of them are losers.
While I don't know the person who wrote this article, I would venture to guess that (s)he didn't know how D&D is played, and believed that it was a computer game. I find this fallacy is quite widespread. My co-workers, seeing me reading D&D manuals, don't seem to believe me when I mention that it's not a computer game, and few of them are nearly interested enough to bother learning the truth.
And I remember my local radio station presenting a news story about college students getting addicted to online games, such as WoW, and neglecting to go to classes as a result. One of the DJs commented "Listen you Dungeons and Dragons nerds, you need to go touch a woman inappropriately." I wished I - or somebody - could be there as a representative of "Dungeons and Dragons nerds" and explain that D&D is traditionally played with people in a face-to-face setting. (I also wished I could have been there to comment that what those students really needed to do was go to class, and to study.)
I find it hard to believe that drugs or alcohol were not invovled in some form here. Yeah, computer games can pull people in, but they are not physically addicting. Even television doesn't rot a person's brain to the extent they'd let their children starve to death.
While I don't know the person who wrote this article, I would venture to guess that (s)he didn't know how D&D is played, and believed that it was a computer game. I find this fallacy is quite widespread.
...even among gamers, which irritates me. A person playing "Curse of the Azure Bonds" on his PC is not playing D&D, any more than a person reading a Dragonlance novel is doing so. Both are examples of products inspired by the game; neither is an example of the game.
I find it hard to believe that drugs or alcohol were not invovled in some form here. Yeah, computer games can pull people in, but they are not physically addicting. Even television doesn't rot a person's brain to the extent they'd let their children starve to death.While I don't know the person who wrote this article, I would venture to guess that (s)he didn't know how D&D is played, and believed that it was a computer game. I find this fallacy is quite widespread.
...even among gamers, which irritates me. A person playing "Curse of the Azure Bonds" on his PC is not playing D&D, any more than a person reading a Dragonlance novel is doing so. Both are examples of products inspired by the game; neither is an example of the game.
I disagree. If you're playing a Dungeons & Dragons game, you are playing Dungeons & Dragons.
The original Pokemon games inspired dozens of spin-off games, from camera-based video games to card games to pinball games. I don't think we're well served by acting like there is One True Way to play D&D, and all those derivative works with the D&D logo on them are simply pretenders to the throne. It smacks of the same sort of elitism that causes 1e or 2e players to scoff at newer editions as "not D&D".
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Scott, I think what most people are upset with is the fact that the writer failed to differentiate between the tabletop game and the computer games. There is a difference. One would hope that if they had been playing tabletop D&D someone would hve said something to the parents, and if that didn't work, to the authorities. Computer games are much easier to tune out the world. To me, the anger and concern that I see in the other posts is at being lumped in with these knuckleheads simply becaus they play a version of D&D even if it is not in the same medium.
Frankly in situations like this I favor old school punishments. Put them in the stocks with signs around their necks that say "I think video games are more important than my children." Then you pass out the rotten fruit and/or rocks to the angry masses.
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Owner - Johnny Scott Comics and Games
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I read this story when it was originally written back in 2007 on a different website (Yahoo, I think). The couple actually were playing World of Warcraft, not D&D. This story seems to be a re-hash of the original story, but the author changed WoW to D&D. I'm not familiar with the website referenced by the OP, but it looks like their authors should check their facts before posting stories.
I find it hard to believe that drugs were not invovled in some form here.
+1
The original Pokemon games inspired dozens of spin-off games, from camera-based video games to card games to pinball games. I don't think we're well served by acting like there is One True Way to play D&D, and all those derivative works with the D&D logo on them are simply pretenders to the throne. It smacks of the same sort of elitism that causes 1e or 2e players to scoff at newer editions as "not D&D".
My beef isn't with editions, it's with format. In any edition, D&D is an interactive roleplaying game. A single-player PC "adventure" is not. A Forgotten Realms novel is not. The "Dungeon!" board game is not.
A Pokemon-themed pinball machine isn't Pokemon, it's pinball.
A computer game could be a roleplaying game as long as it's interactive, multiplayer and allows for more than kill-and-loot; I'm enough of a geezer to prefer it have a living DM as well, but I will allow that a sufficiently well-programmed simulation might replace a DM and still be called a roleplaying game.
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I find it hard to believe that drugs or alcohol were not invovled in some form here.
Oh, I can see it happening. So far, I've had one acquaintance who's played online MMORPG's to the point of losing his fiancé, 2 roommates, his university slot, his waistline and then his cleanliness. The only thing he was accomplishing was 16+ hours of the game a day and "experiments" in his kitchen with rotten rice.
While that may be the extreme (as well as the idiots in this story), I've had other closer friends (including one of the said roomates) who have lost semesters or at the very least lost contact with friends over months at a time because of WoW. It's really easy to get dragged into playing for a long time and blocking out the world around you.
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Oh, I can see it happening. So far, I've had one acquaintance who's played online MMORPG's to the point of losing his fiancé, 2 roommates, his university slot, his waistline and then his cleanliness. The only thing he was accomplishing was 16+ hours of the game a day and "experiments" in his kitchen with rotten rice.
While that may be the extreme (as well as the idiots in this story), I've had other closer friends (including one of the said roomates) who have lost semesters or at the very least lost contact with friends over months at a time because of WoW. It's really easy to get dragged into playing for a long time and blocking out the world around you.
Sad as it is, I can see this referring to people without an actual substance abuse problem as well. I've had friends and aquaintances that dropped out of school and lost jobs and fiancees over WoW. My brother was in a good raiding guild a couple years ago, and one day he realized tht no only was he always tired, but he was the only guy in his guild with his own place and a job. And as the job was 40 hours / week and his gaming was 40 hours per week, he was running out of time to sleep, clean house, buy groceries....
He quit cold turkey, and won't even try to play again, because he found it so addicting, he doesn't trust himself to "play just a bit".
Sad as it is, I can see this referring to people without an actual substance abuse problem as well. I've had friends and aquaintances that dropped out of school and lost jobs and fiancees over WoW. My brother was in a good raiding guild a couple years ago, and one day he realized tht no only was he always tired, but he was the only guy in his guild with his own place and a job. And as the job was 40 hours / week and his gaming was 40 hours per week, he was running out of time to sleep, clean house, buy groceries....
He quit cold turkey, and won't even try to play again, because he found it so addicting, he doesn't trust himself to "play just a bit".
There's a world of difference between "house cleaning and 8 hrs sleep are optional" and "meh, my kids don't need to survive, I can always have more later if I want."
But clearly, my skepticism does not keep these video game zombies from existing. If only they'd consistently waste away before breeding...
The original Pokemon games inspired dozens of spin-off games, from camera-based video games to card games to pinball games. I don't think we're well served by acting like there is One True Way to play D&D, and all those derivative works with the D&D logo on them are simply pretenders to the throne. It smacks of the same sort of elitism that causes 1e or 2e players to scoff at newer editions as "not D&D".My beef isn't with editions, it's with format. In any edition, D&D is an interactive roleplaying game. A single-player PC "adventure" is not. A Forgotten Realms novel is not. The "Dungeon!" board game is not.
A Pokemon-themed pinball machine isn't Pokemon, it's pinball.
A computer game could be a roleplaying game as long as it's interactive, multiplayer and allows for more than kill-and-loot; I'm enough of a geezer to prefer it have a living DM as well, but I will allow that a sufficiently well-programmed simulation might replace a DM and still be called a roleplaying game.
Again, I disagree.
Again, I disagree.
That's fine.
Right so It's on "weird news" so I'm going with untrue until proven otherwise, you know, like the "kid that commits suicide over D&D" that pops up every other year, or the Kenyan Birth Certificate.
Chief Technical Officer
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Here is the story as originally printed in the Reno Gazette-Journal.
Here is the follow-up story on the sentencing (4 years prison each, eligible for parole after a year).
The Washoe county court website doesn't seem to have much more information on the cases (his and hers), but I did see that she filed for divorce earlier this year.
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I really can't see myself worrying about a game more than a child.
I know a guy who pulled s+$+ like that.
One of the people I used to play D&D with back in the day (well... five years ago or so) was the stepfather of my best friend and his sister (who I'm now dating). He seemed like a slightly creepy, but harmless middle-aged dude.
Then he found Jeebus and went off his meds.
Jerry (I don't give a f%@@ if everyone finds out his name) suddenly became a video game-addicted alcoholic who beat his wife and her kids (thankfully, they were old enough to fight back) and left piles of rotting garbage all over the house. He refused to pay for things like the mortgage, hot water, or food (other than the McDonald's and Heineken that he himself subsisted on).
About a year ago, he finally pulled some s#*~ that I really don't want to get into, and his wife and step-daughter left him (his stepson had already left for college). To this day, Jerry is still living like a f~$*ing troglodyte in his own refuse, swilling beer and playing CounterStrike until his eyes bleed. I hope he dies.
That said, I can see and have seen this sort of thing happen, and I'm surprised that it doesn't happen MORE. And while I hate the fact that the article replaced World of Warcraft in the title with Dungeons and Dragons, it really speaks to a lack of responsibility on the part of more than just these parents.
I find it hard to believe that drugs or alcohol were not invovled in some form here.
Oh, I've seen it, and reported it. A friend of mine that I moved in with and his wife got addicted to an MMO, and were ignoring him to the point where he was eating his diapers.
There were no drugs or alcohol involved. I was the one that drank or did anything, and I'm the one that cared for the kid until the authorities came, well, when my GF wasn't around. Thank god we were there, I don't know how the little guy would be doin otherwise.
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Chief Technical Officer
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...while I hate the fact that the article replaced World of Warcraft in the title with Dungeons and Dragons...
I've seen no evidence that leads me to believe that the game was anything other than D&D Online. A few people have said "WoW seems more likely," but as far as I can find, all professional articles available on the internet suggest that DDO was their game of choice (when they indicate anything at all).
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I remember seeing this when it first came out.
I am sure -- in fact, we all know -- that there are negligent (neglectful?) parents who are involved in Second Life, sex chat rooms, Madden, and Guitar Hero.
If Second Life were just a little more popular, they would take all our hits for us table toppers. Not enough name recognition. Yet.
And lets not forget that the guys who make the game GURPS have cyber-terrorists writing their books for them*.
* - another fine moment in journalism history
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One of the people I used to play D&D with back in the day (well... five years ago or so)
HEY, KID! GET OFF MY LAWN!
If you never had to ink your dice yourself, you don't know "back in the day."
/threadjack over - return to trashing people who won't stay compliant with meds and take care of themselves and their families
If you never had to ink your dice yourself, you don't know "back in the day."
Ink? Back in my day we had a little white crayon. Have you ever tried coloring in heiroglyphic covered dice with a little white crayon?
Crayon? What is this new invention of which you speak? We still recut our dice with flint when they wear down!
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...while I hate the fact that the article replaced World of Warcraft in the title with Dungeons and Dragons...I've seen no evidence that leads me to believe that the game was anything other than D&D Online. A few people have said "WoW seems more likely," but as far as I can find, all professional articles available on the internet suggest that DDO was their game of choice (when they indicate anything at all).
I remember seeing an almost verbatim article somewhere (Newsweek, I think, though I can't be certain) in which the game was WoW.
In any case, DDO just isn't that good.
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My brother lived next to a guy who got cranially warped by WoW. Before the Warcrack he had an almost 6 figure job, a house, and a knockout wife. Then he got hooked quit the job and everything else to pay more. After 6 months or so the wife kicked him out and filed for divorce. Last we knew he had found an apartment and was selling Characters, gear, etc from warcrack in order to pay the rent support for his addiction.
Bottom line "People are freaking crazy!"
Yes, I include myself in that statement just not to that degree.
This article just makes me sad. And I have a similar tale to relate as well.
Someone I know in the USAF is currently divorcing their husband because he won't stop playing WoW. He's also currently in trouble for a variety of reasons that stem from the fact that he just doesn't give a damn about anything But WoW.
Myself, I play WoW. I'd much rather play real RPGs though. And when did video game geeks become gamers?
RPG Superstar 2009 Top 8
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My brother lived next to a guy who got cranially warped by WoW. Before the Warcrack he had an almost 6 figure job, a house, and a knockout wife. Then he got hooked quit the job and everything else to pay more. After 6 months or so the wife kicked him out and filed for divorce. Last we knew he had found an apartment and was selling Characters, gear, etc from warcrack in order to pay the rent support for his addiction.
Bottom line "People are freaking crazy!"
Yes, I include myself in that statement just not to that degree.
*blinks*
And WoW isn't even that good...
Wow. What a bunch of losers. Chained to there computers. No social life. All the people they care about only known to them as a bunch of whacked out avatars.
* clicks refresh *
Anyone out there?
Heathy?
Nameless?
Jal?
Sebastian?
So ... lonely ...
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Ink? Back in my day we had a little white crayon. Have you ever tried coloring in heiroglyphic covered dice with a little white crayon?
If you never had to ink your dice yourself, you don't know "back in the day."
Bah. I never had dice. I had a sheet of paper with a number grid and the eraser end of a pencil.
I can very well imagine that online games are addictive - which is the precise reason I stay well away from WoW and other games. I spend way too much time in the net anyway, and with any games, it would only get worse. You don´t need any additional substances to get hooked. IIRC, there were even a few deaths in Asia somewhere from playing some game too much and neglecting basic needs like eating, drinking and sleeping.
That said, even if it was DDO these parents got hooked to, it still was a cheap attempt at bashing D&D in general - obviously, it is easier to convey "D&D is bad" than to explain what MMORPGs are and why they can be addictive.
It is also easy to say "bad parents", but any addiction normally is a sure sign of something else being amiss, as the addiction normally is the symptom, not the cause. This is no excuse for neglecting their kids (there cannot be any excuse for this), but denouncing them as "bad parents" does not help them, their kids or anybody else with an addiction. And chiding any addict for his lack of self-discipline is no help either.
Stefan
It smacks of the same sort of elitism that causes 1e or 2e players to scoff at newer editions as "not D&D".
What about 3e players? I know for a fact that there are 3e players that scoff at 4e as "not D&D"
Since you consciously excluded them, I reason that you don' think them elitist for thinking that, and that you, in consequence agree!
;-P
Here is the story as originally printed in the Reno Gazette-Journal.
That's what I remembered, too: They played DDO.
I remember this from back when it happened.
It's basically of no consequence what the name of the game was, and whether it was a MMORPG or tetris. I guess every other sort of game, and by extent, hobby can become an addiction and obsession like this.
Of course, MMORPGs are designed to "stimulate the addiction gene", but it's not the Hypnotoad Show, people themselves are responsible, too.
And it can happen. Without drugs. Or med addiction. Or alcohol. Just the game.
I know someone who had withdrawal treatment for WoW.
When it hits people who are responsible for others, it takes on a whole other dimension of tragedy.
In cases like this, I'd put them in prison, coupled with or followed by therapy. My reason is that why it is a mental illness, they are still responsible for their actions.
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My brother lived next to a guy who got cranially warped by WoW. Before the Warcrack he had an almost 6 figure job, a house, and a knockout wife. Then he got hooked quit the job and everything else to pay more. After 6 months or so the wife kicked him out and filed for divorce. Last we knew he had found an apartment and was selling Characters, gear, etc from warcrack in order to pay the rent support for his addiction.
Bottom line "People are freaking crazy!"
Yes, I include myself in that statement just not to that degree.
*blinks*
And WoW isn't even that good...
Wow. What a bunch of losers. Chained to there computers. No social life. All the people they care about only known to them as a bunch of whacked out avatars.
* clicks refresh *
Anyone out there?
Heathy?
Nameless?
Jal?
Sebastian?
So ... lonely ...
Some of us are secure enough in our identity to use our real names.
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Chief Technical Officer
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...while I hate the fact that the article replaced World of Warcraft in the title with Dungeons and Dragons...I've seen no evidence that leads me to believe that the game was anything other than D&D Online. A few people have said "WoW seems more likely," but as far as I can find, all professional articles available on the internet suggest that DDO was their game of choice (when they indicate anything at all).I remember seeing an almost verbatim article somewhere (Newsweek, I think, though I can't be certain) in which the game was WoW.
In any case, DDO just isn't that good.
Maybe you're thinking of the couple in Korea whose child died while they were playing WoW at an internet cafe?
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Anhen there is this story and this one about individuals who have died themselves while playing video games on-line. No mention in either article about what they were plaing but I believe I heard on the telivison that it was Counterstrike.
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Maybe you're thinking of the couple in Korea whose child died while they were playing WoW at an internet cafe?I remember seeing an almost verbatim article somewhere (Newsweek, I think, though I can't be certain) in which the game was WoW.
In any case, DDO just isn't that good.
Yeah, that's the one. Thanks for the correction.
I find it odd that the proscecutor invoked the video game as a motive. Seems like that is something the defense would cook up to try to cover their abusive behavior.
Ink? Back in my day we had a little white crayon. Have you ever tried coloring in heiroglyphic covered dice with a little white crayon?
If you never had to ink your dice yourself, you don't know "back in the day."
Hmph...if you arn't drawing numbered chits from a cup then your doing it wrong.