Okay, in the SRD, it says that you can give an NPC a PC's gear for a +1 CR cost. In PAthfinder, NPCs get a -2 if they are not monsters with class levels. So, if you give a villain the PC gear, does he:
Class levels +1 (CR-2 goes away, CR +1 added)
Class levels -1 (NPC penalty remains, add one for equipment)
Okay, in the SRD, it says that you can give an NPC a PC's gear for a +1 CR cost.
Where *is* that in the SRD? I don't think I've ever noticed it before.
Okay, in the SRD, it says that you can give an NPC a PC's gear for a +1 CR cost.Where *is* that in the SRD? I don't think I've ever noticed it before.
I second this question ... I've searched the SRD site and can't find it.
Took me a while to track down where I had heard of it myself. Turns out it's from an official FAQ on 3.5 that giving an NPC classed dude or a monster equipment as a PC level equates to +1 CR. It does specifically say that there's no "hard and fast rule" about this.
Interestingly, Paizo doesn't seem to regard PC gear as being worth even +1 CR on its own. Check out Pathfinder 12, page 58, where a certain villain gets: ability scores generated with 32 points, a potent artifact, and gear determined as if she were a PC ... ALL for +1 CR.
The same thing goes for a certain villain in Pathfinder 6, page 64. Stats plus exceptional gear equals +1 CR.
So, I guess I should revise the question to include 32 point stats and PC gear, but the basic math issue remains.
Took me a while to track down where I had heard of it myself. Turns out it's from an official FAQ on 3.5 that giving an NPC classed dude or a monster equipment as a PC level equates to +1 CR. It does specifically say that there's no "hard and fast rule" about this.
Thanks for tracking that down and satisfying my curiosity. I *had* noticed the Pathfinder NPCs that got +1 CR for exceptional stats and PC gear, and that seems about right for higher level characters.
For lower level NPCs (say, up to 10th level) I would guess PC gear alone would be worth a +1 CR bonus.
For lower level NPCs (say, up to 10th level) I would guess PC gear alone would be worth a +1 CR bonus.
I agree. The +1 CR bump is necessary for what exceptional stats or PC-equivalent gear would grant a low-level villain. But, once you get into the higher levels, a lot of those upgrades start to lose their potency. So you have to stack some of them to equal a +1 CR.
Thanks for tracking that down and satisfying my curiosity. I *had* noticed the Pathfinder NPCs that got +1 CR for exceptional stats and PC gear, and that seems about right for higher level characters.For lower level NPCs (say, up to 10th level) I would guess PC gear alone would be worth a +1 CR bonus.
On a side note, you should SEE what ridiculous stats Green Ronin gave its "name" people in its Freeport trilogy. It took me a while to figure out why that villain was playing so well.
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A public service announcement here because I've seen some people making mistakes in their comments (and, thus, their judgments):
The Pathfinder -2 CR for an NPC with PC class levels only applies to NPCs with no racial hit dice. That means the adjustment does not apply to:
Vashkar, the False Maharajah
Boemundo, Brenno's Shadow Protector
Rustin Harp, the Vengeance of Freaks
Sartel Bollen, Mistress of the Headless Caravan
Gulga Cench, Scion of Cyth-V'sug
Ryth'a
All of those entries have racial hit dice and thus are not eligible for the -2 CR rule.
A public service announcement here because I've seen some people making mistakes in their comments (and, thus, their judgments):
The Pathfinder -2 CR for an NPC with PC class levels only applies to NPCs with no racial hit dice. That means the adjustment does not apply to:
Vashkar, the False Maharajah
Boemundo, Brenno's Shadow Protector
Rustin Harp, the Vengeance of Freaks
Sartel Bollen, Mistress of the Headless Caravan
Gulga Cench, Scion of Cyth-V'sug
Ryth'aAll of those entries have racial hit dice and thus are not eligible for the -2 CR rule.
Thanks for catching this ... I had to run to work and was going to check it when I got back home, but you beat me to it :)