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In the interests of protecting people from being torn to shreds by housecats, by flocks of raven familiars pecking small children to death, and from goblin children running amok, I recommend the Phil Athans rule be adopted by Pathfinder, meaning any damage rolled that ends up being less than 1 point of damage is reduced to 1 point of nonlethal damage.
The wise and learned Sean K Reynolds talks about it here - http://www.seankreynolds.com/rpgfiles/misc/philathansrule.html
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mmmmm NEVER thought about before. Now I want to run a 1st level game and attack a wizard with housecat.
ANd has anyone ever been REALLY attacked by a housecat. I bet they could kill ya. Just accidents are bad enough :) In fact I would support moving housecats to the Demon section. I have 6! I know what I am talking about!
But for the other situations listed I fully agree this makes more sense.
In the interests of protecting people from being torn to shreds by housecats, by flocks of raven familiars pecking small children to death, and from goblin children running amok, I recommend the Phil Athans rule be adopted by Pathfinder, meaning any damage rolled that ends up being less than 1 point of damage is reduced to 1 point of nonlethal damage.
The wise and learned Sean K Reynolds talks about it here - http://www.seankreynolds.com/rpgfiles/misc/philathansrule.html
RPG Superstar 2008 Top 32, 2011 Top 16
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mmmmm NEVER thought about before. Now I want to run a 1st level game and attack a wizard with housecat.
ANd has anyone ever been REALLY attacked by a housecat. I bet they could kill ya. Just accidents are bad enough :) In fact I would support moving housecats to the Demon section. I have 6! I know what I am talking about!
But for the other situations listed I fully agree this makes more sense.
A few years ago I read an AP news article about an elderly couple that actually were killed by their housecats after not feeding them for long enough. So, it could happen.
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A few years ago I read an AP news article about an elderly couple that actually were killed by their housecats after not feeding them for long enough. So, it could happen.mmmmm NEVER thought about before. Now I want to run a 1st level game and attack a wizard with housecat.
ANd has anyone ever been REALLY attacked by a housecat. I bet they could kill ya. Just accidents are bad enough :) In fact I would support moving housecats to the Demon section. I have 6! I know what I am talking about!
But for the other situations listed I fully agree this makes more sense.
DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANG.
*goes feeds cats*
DAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAANG.
Honestly I have long thought the idea od doing d4-4 or some such is just plain dumb. Just say 1 point. Period. d4-600,000 is also just 1 point dang it. Why waste our time? In fact if it is so bad then it makes sense to just say 1 point nonlethal. Period.
I love this thread :-)
It reminds me of my example when discussing the current Grapple system:
Since you can Pin someone if they are "Grappled" at the beginning of your Turn,
If you try to grab a House-Cat (using a Full Round Action, and becoming "Grappled" yourself)
It would seem that by Pathfinder rules, the Cat would PIN you back 5% of the time. :-)
Of course, it should probably use the rules on Giant Monsters with Reach like Tentacle Monsters, who don't become "Grappled" themselves. But that's not in the Grapple rules themselves :-)
Director of Brand Strategy
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Honestly I have long thought the idea od doing d4-4 or some such is just plain dumb. Just say 1 point. Period. d4-600,000 is also just 1 point dang it. Why waste our time? In fact if it is so bad then it makes sense to just say 1 point nonlethal. Period.
But if the cat is under the effect of a Bull's Strength spell, that 1d4-4 becomes 1d4-2 and if the MM only said 1-damage-no-matter-what, the poor fool who bothered to cast Bull's Strength on their housecat would have no idea how to alter the stats to maintain rules consistency.
Honestly I have long thought the idea od doing d4-4 or some such is just plain dumb. Just say 1 point. Period. d4-600,000 is also just 1 point dang it. Why waste our time? In fact if it is so bad then it makes sense to just say 1 point nonlethal. Period.But if the cat is under the effect of a Bull's Strength spell, that 1d4-4 becomes 1d4-2 and if the MM only said 1-damage-no-matter-what, the poor fool who bothered to cast Bull's Strength on their housecat would have no idea how to alter the stats to maintain rules consistency.
Not to mention criticals (2D4 - 4 rather than 2), and enlargement.
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Director of Games
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Trust me everyone...
Sean has mentioned this particular rule to me more than once.. and it makes a lot of sense. I am seriously considering it.. (stupid house cat vs commoner debate...)
Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer
Paizo Publishing
(I also heard that Sean wrote a book about this topic... ;)
Hey replace the silly massive damage rule with this one!
One of my very first D&D experiences was having my 2nd edition fighter killed by a housecat. Couldn't hit it, couldn't avoid it.
...oddly, I play mostly wizards these days.
Anyway, I think it's retarded that a housecat can do any damage *at all* to an armored fighter. I have had my cat do his honest to goodness best to disembowel me and go for the throat at the same time. (Flea baths, good times.) I came out with an angry scratch. Now, I'll admit, if he had gotten a bite in, he might have done a single point of damage. Maybe. On the same token, I carry scars of good size and color from another cat, just from claws. But certainly not anything life threatening.
But there is some tradition of small animals killing armored fighters. Just sayin'.
Housecats cannot kill people. Unless the person is helpless. /nod
I guess this in one more little thing favoring introducing DR for Medium/ Heavy Armor.
...Did you ask your DM if you could PLAY that House-Cat after your Fighter died?
House-Cat with Class Levels.... :-)
I don't suppose we can just add a common sense rule in somewhere? You know, something that says that if it sounds stupid enough, it probably is stupid.
If a fighter in full plate mail gets attacked by a cat, the cat is not going to hurt it. Although the rule above is elegant enough, I don't know if there really needs to be a rule the prevent adventurer deaths at the hands of cats, bats, rats, or whatever.
I guess this in one more little thing favoring introducing DR for Medium/ Heavy Armor.
...Did you ask your DM if you could PLAY that House-Cat after your Fighter died?
House-Cat with Class Levels.... :-)
Heh! I should have. But I wasn't savvy enough, yet. ;)
I love giving class levels to odd things in 3.5. My party dreads kobolds, as they never know what they're going to be able to do. And I've been known to give psuedodragons levels in odd classes as well.
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Trust me everyone...
Sean has mentioned this particular rule to me more than once.. and it makes a lot of sense. I am seriously considering it.. (stupid house cat vs commoner debate...)
Jason Bulmahn
Lead Designer
Paizo Publishing(I also heard that Sean wrote a book about this topic... ;)
I have to throw in support on this idea. I like the rule; hadn't ever considered it. Thanks for listening, Jason.
Robert
My old roommate made a 1st edition Monk once, and for some reason was desperate not to be at 0 xp. So I let him attack a rat in the street. Not a dire rat, just a rat.
He proceeded to roll up a new character after his corpse was dragged off into the sewer for feasting.
Good rule. Though won't change things too much - as soon as the cat knocks you unconscious it takes -4 to hit to deal lethal damage.
Also:
Not to mention criticals (2D4 - 4 rather than 2), and enlargement.
Criticals multiply strength penalties from all that I know.
Roll the damage (with all modifiers) multiple times and total the results.
We had an Elf Druid with a 7 strength in the party, trying to coup de grace a regenerating goblin once... stabbed him three or four times before it worked.
Well if a DM is having housecats or rats attack PCs then he's not doing it right anyhow. Animals in D&D should act rationally, like they do in the real world. A house cat should avoid people unless cornered and even then would likely risk an AoO to escape. Rats are equally skittish and unless they are starved would not attack people.
That said... it's a good rule.
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Well if a DM is having housecats or rats attack PCs then he's not doing it right anyhow. Animals in D&D should act rationally, like they do in the real world. A house cat should avoid people unless cornered and even then would likely risk an AoO to escape. Rats are equally skittish and unless they are starved would not attack people.
That said... it's a good rule.
Unless the vampire is using his awesome super special control animals power to make the rabid rats attack...
OK I don't remember vampires having this ability but it fits the movies... but then it would be a swarm and not just a few rats but still...
It's the FLAVOR of the attack.
*ewww rat flavored attacks ewww*
