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This is out of context from the original post (here) so I thought I would start this question.
Yup; the average D&D player today is in his/her mid to late twenties these days. Maybe it's the proliferation of video games, maybe not, but there's not a lot of kids playing D&D these days.
<snip>
What about economics. I'm in my later 30's (as is my whole gang) and it is only now that I find that I can afford this hobby. I love Pathfinder and I have no problem with the price tag, but how many teens can afford it? Between the car, gas, and dating, I didn't have an extra $50-100 bucks to DnD with 16 years ago.
Each month you could have the following average expenses:
- WotC = $35+ (one or more books, maps, minis, ...)
- Pathfinder = $20+ (monthly subscription, supplements)
- Gamemaster = $15+ (modules, maps, item cards)
- Third Party books = $15+ (Goodman Games, Necromancer Games, Green Ronin)
- Misc PDFs = $15+ (Blackdyrge, Octavirate, The Le, Tricky Owlbear, ...)
And this doesn't take into account one time biggies like Open Design and Pied Piper's stuff. Of course you don't need to spend this every month...but I don't find it hard to believe a lot of kids don't play.
I wonder how many groups play with the only the SRD, pens and paper?
Ayep. Now that I actually have a decent positive cash flow, I started picking up all the 2nd edition D&D stuff I was drooling over back in the day on the shelves of Walden Books in the mall.
I think the market could really use a "D&D lite;" like a $5 package that comes with the rules the SRD is missing (xp, character creation), or a $10-15 set with the same plus 2 minis, the SRD on cd, and some cheap dice.
I think the market could really use a "D&D lite;" like a $5 package that comes with the rules the SRD is missing (xp, character creation), or a $10-15 set with the same plus 2 minis, the SRD on cd, and some cheap dice.
Well, there was something like that back in my day: The (red) basic set. Later on, there was the black box. Soemthing like that could get more kids into playing - it was tried with the diablo adventure game a few years ago.
But it is true: only now can I afford to buy the stuff I want to. As a teen, even one rulebook (or -box) was something I could buy once in half a year or so. As a twen, it got a little better, but only after I turned 30 and got a new job, I was able to afford what I wanted to - well, most of the time. I love ebay for completing my collection these days.
Stefan
I have two gaming groups; my brothers (three of them), and some guys from work.
The great thing about gaming with my brothers is that we can decide which products we want and either chip in for them or, more often, take turns buying stuff to spread the cost of the hobby around. The great thing about gaming with the guys from work is that I can use the stuff my brothers and I already bought ;)
I am 36, and I too now have more disposable income than I did when I started playing D&D at age 13.
I think another important factor in why younger people are less likey to play D&D is that role playing requires imagination, and being raised on video games is an inhibitor to creativity. Don't get me wrong, I spent more time logged onto Diablo 2 than I did doing homework back in college, but a video game offers only so many options while a RPG is limitless.
I moved to South Africa when I was eight. It was 1981. There was only one shop I knew of that sold any AD&D books, exclusive books in Hillbrow. I would get to go there once or twice a year and look at the books. The only ones I ever owned though, were the PH, DMG, MM core binder, FR box, Dungeoneer's survival guide and Wilderness survival guide. My brother took his first edition books when he left the house. Dungeon was available as a photocopy or roneo samisdat.
When I was seventeen my books were confiscated from my hostel homeroom. I was charged with satanism, but the charge didn't stick, and I was allowed to continue in the school as long as I went to a state therapist to "cure my atheism". I got the books back when I left school a year and a half later. The covers were torn off of them and some of the art had been censored with black paint.
During the time that my gear had been taken, I made friends in Johannesburg. Cyberpunk, Vampire, Traveller and Marvel Superheroes were all played by our group from imported books, or more frequently, photocopied books.
When I was 21, I finally got my own copies of the White Wolf core books. My best friend and I played the hell out of that system. When I was 25, my landlord's wife burned all my books to "save me from the devil" My landlord was a police officer. He made it clear to me outside the small claims court that if I made any more fuss he would have me arrested and charges would stick. No books again.
I now live in Taiwan, a civilised and safe country with a functioning economy. I can buy as many books as I want, but I find it is not the books that are important. We played with no books, hard to read copies of the books, and any inspiration that came to hand Our games were often awesome. The game was an outlet for us that kept us sane in the waning days of apartheid South Africa.
I learned that playing a good game has more to do with the players than with splatbooks and supplements. I use the core books and the monster manuals. Dungeon is magnificent too.
How much does D&D cost? Nothing. It is yours by right.
There was an attempt at an introductory set not too long ago, with minis, character sheets, map tiles, a scaled down rules book, etc. Production values were impressively high. I don' think it sold very well though. I remember picking up three sets 6-12 months ago at Toys R Us for $6.98 each just to get multiple sets of the minis...
That is something to consider. How many "kids" are playing but not paying. It is easy enough to find stuff online to download, and I can only assume that RPG books are not an exception.
That is something to consider. How many "kids" are playing but not paying. It is easy enough to find stuff online to download, and I can only assume that RPG books are not an exception.
I can tell you right now that's the case. I've had players offer to send me pirated PDFs when I'm DMing a PbP and won't allow some book because I don't own it yet (and I'm proud to say I've never accepted). You can find just about any book you want on the Internet right now...
However, I've also seen plenty of younger players that get by juts fine and enjoy the hobby using the SRD and other legitimately free sources. So, there's good kids, and not so good kids in this regard.
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That is something to consider. How many "kids" are playing but not paying. It is easy enough to find stuff online to download, and I can only assume that RPG books are not an exception.I can tell you right now that's the case. I've had players offer to send me pirated PDFs when I'm DMing a PbP and won't allow some book because I don't own it yet (and I'm proud to say I've never accepted). You can find just about any book you want on the Internet right now...
However, I've also seen plenty of younger players that get by juts fine and enjoy the hobby using the SRD and other legitimately free sources. So, there's good kids, and not so good kids in this regard.
A guy in my group has over 100 books on PDF that he never paid a cent for. Offers to send the file to any of us in his group, but I never partake. It may or may not be illegal, but it is scummy to me, and I won't do it even though I hate WotC right now.
FH
Hi, my name is Todd. And I'm a D&D Spend-a-holic.
It's safe to say that I spend about $100 a month on D&D products. When 3e came out, I did an inventory of all my stuff. The pricetag was well over $6k! As I type this, I'm looking into additional storage options as I pack away 3rd and 3.5.
What does 4e have in store? Well, I told myself that I would cut back. So, who knows...
Just remember, it's only illegal to upload PDFs.
Reproducing a copyrighted work is illegal (and a prime example of asshattery; do you want your favorite writers to have to become accountants?). No one other than the copyright owner (which is "not" the purchaser) may make any reproductions or copies of the work. You may resell (the original you purchased) or even destroy your purchased copy if you like, but that's where your rights end. There's some legal grey area in regards to the fact that you aren't the "distributor" (assuming your upload is set to zero) or the one who reproduced the copywriten work, but then you still knowingly took receipt of stolen goods (which, if you have say roughly 125 .pdf's, prepare for Federal Prison).
Just remember, it's only illegal to upload PDFs.Reproducing a copyrighted work is illegal (and a prime example of asshattery; do you want your favorite writers to have to become accountants?).
By virtue of file sharing programs, you are also considered a "distributor" as a downloaded file can be used to spawn additional copies across the application.
Real world example. If you are caught with a stolen item that you know was stolen, you can be prosecuted.
RPG Superstar 2013 Top 32
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My gaming expenditure over the course of the last year has been approximately $1000, so I'm managing just a bit under the $100/mo. mark. It comes in spurts for the most part, buying $100-200 worth of stuff all at once and then waiting a couple of months before the next one. The frequency is largely based on how good my bonuses at work were that month. :)
hmm, I guess we out here in the sw are a bit different; as we all do the homegrown stuff; mostly my d&d expenditures are for other people; gifts of dungeons and modules and whatnot to get them started in the game. As a player you really only need a PBH and some dice and we all pretty much share books and dice so bringing your own paper and pencil is nice, but heck; we all share that too; you basically you can play for free; gms, well, mostly it is time once you have the books your going to use; just time and imagination. We always played this game when we didnt have any money :)
Me too, lots of homebrew. I picked up some minis on e-bay lately. Probably 50 a month now including Pathfinder.
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(which, if you have say roughly 125 .pdf's, prepare for Federal Prison).
I've got... 4.
By virtue of file sharing programs, you are also considered a "distributor" as a downloaded file can be used to spawn additional copies across the application.
Which is why I removed them from my shared files after they downloaded.
Anyway, the way my gaming group avoids astronomical expenditures is if one person buys a book, they notify the others. That way, there generally aren't duplicate books in the group, and there's one of all the necessary books in a communal 'book pool.'
It's true that you do need to have some disposable income in order to invest in DnD.
When I was still playing 2nd edition I had the DMG and the rest of the group had either a photocopied PHB or a file with the relevant information in it.
For 3e I've bought the PHB and DMG and several copies of Dungeon.
(Dungeon really gave me value for money, and I am really going to miss the maps they sometimes added, the greyhawk maps prove essential for my campaign)
My last paizo order consisted off some dungeon back issues and pathfinder, the order cost me 50 euro's. A decade ago that would translate into 100 guilders, no way that I would have spent that amount on DnD.
So it seems to me that the paying costumer is at least 25+ years old.
Creative Director
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The hobby requires money. But in the grand scheme of things, buying D&D stuff is on par (or even less expensive) than going to see a movie every week, or buying video games twice a month, or going to every home football game at the stadium, or going out drinking with friends every Friday and Saturday.
That said, the expense of the game certainly does mean that those with disposable income are going to buy it more. I don't think the hobby's out of the range of kids, though, since a lot of them have disposable income to buy video games or see movies all the time. The question is; do kids these days WANT to sit around in a room for hours on end playing tabletop RPGs?
As for downloading PDFs... it's illegal and unethical. Remember that it's not the same as borrowing or getting a print copy from a friend; when that happens, the friend no longer has the print copy. That one copy is still paid for and legit, even if it passes through the hands of dozens of owners. Illegal copies of PDFs are the same as if someone made duplicates of a print book and distributed them. It does indeed hurt the industry, so keep that in mind when you're downloading those PDFs (or when you admit to doing so on an RPG publisher's public messageboards, for that matter).
The question is; do kids these days WANT to sit around in a room for hours on end playing tabletop RPGs?
I know I do and did, but then again I've always been wierd.
The question is; do kids these days WANT to sit around in a room for hours on end playing tabletop RPGs?
My friends and I are all 21 and we play D&D on Friday and Saturday nights, and we got into the game about five years ago. So don't think that there's no young'uns joining the ranks of the D&D players these days :)
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The question is; do kids these days WANT to sit around in a room for hours on end playing tabletop RPGs?My friends and I are all 21 and we play D&D on Friday and Saturday nights, and we got into the game about five years ago. So don't think that there's no young'uns joining the ranks of the D&D players these days :)
I believe that what JJ is alluding to is that while back in the late 70s and 80s the average age of D&D players was much lower than today. There are always exceptions to statements and while I do agree that there are young people into D&D these days, I would also have to agree that the percentage of younger people into D&D these days is much lower than the percentage of younger people into D&D back in the older days.
There was an "Average age thread for board members" thread a year or so ago that resulted in a rough average of 28 years old with a sampling of a hundred or so board members. I know this isn't an official way of finding out that info but it is the best I have so far as an insight in which to base my thoughts.FH
this game doesnt cost much; heck buying books is downright dangerous and i dont recommend it; I got suckered with 3.5 and bought like 15 books only to find out not even a year later that 4.0 is coming out so they can kiss my grits; I will just keep making up my own stuff and use what I have and just buy graph paper and lead for pencils, course I do a lot by computer generating my maps and stuff on my laptop.
compared to card games like that Magic insanity; or Warhammer this game is downright cheap; to gm sure it might cost a little more if your unwilling to reinvent the wheel, but to play you pretty much just need to show up.
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The question is; do kids these days WANT to sit around in a room for hours on end playing tabletop RPGs?My friends and I are all 21 and we play D&D on Friday and Saturday nights, and we got into the game about five years ago. So don't think that there's no young'uns joining the ranks of the D&D players these days :)
Totally agree with you there.
At the camp I work at during the summer, about half of the younger staff, and a good portion of the older staff are gamers. That's about twenty people, ages 14 to 26, that play D&D.
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Totally agree with you there.The question is; do kids these days WANT to sit around in a room for hours on end playing tabletop RPGs?My friends and I are all 21 and we play D&D on Friday and Saturday nights, and we got into the game about five years ago. So don't think that there's no young'uns joining the ranks of the D&D players these days :)
I'm 23 almost 24.. I've played since I was 15.. 15-20 were play by posts on Roleplanggames.net during this time I only had the players handbook. now I dm, but pathfinder subscriptions are much more worthwhile to me than a dmg, which I still do not own. all in all the past 10 years all i've NEEdEd to buy was a PHB and subscriptions to the adventure paths, since that is all i've run (would have been more, but i do not have a regular face to face group until last year) So my vote is an initial $25 plus 3.88 a month (now change to 19.99 a month)
PS please excuse the lack of ds in some spots, my laptop's d key got soda spilled on it so I need to paste a d whenever I want to use it
A few notes on the spending patterns of younger gamers -
As part owner of the LGS I get to observe the way gamers spend their $$ rather often.
It's true that teen players have less cash than adults, but they appear to spend it much more freely. The gamer kids (as I call them) who come into the store have no problem spending practically every penny they have on game stuff. They don't stick to just one game system, either. They'll combine a D&D purchase with a MtG purchase with a minis purchase with a who-knows-what-else purchase. They'll also spend an hour in the store looking around, and hit the snack bar while they're at it. If they're too young to drive, they'll often bring their parents into the store and hit them up for more money while they're there.
The adults who come into the store tend to buy the higher-priced items more often, but the lower-priced items less often. Those with little expendable income frequently comment on saving up or doing without to afford items like WotC's colossal red dragon. Those with more money don't spend it any more freely, though. Most will come in and spend $50 on books and supplements without hesitating, but they won't do it very often - maybe every other month or two. Those who subscribe to magazines and such rarely ever buy anything at all from us. They come in regularly to play and to preview things they're thinking of purchasing, but then they stand in the aisles and proclaim loudly to everyone in the room that "this book is cheaper on XXXX's website!"
But teens and 20-somethings are our bread and butter. Even though their total income isn't that much, they love spending it. It's not uncommon to see a teen come into the store with $300 worth of birthday money and plop it all down on the counter. If his mom drove him, he'll probably ask her for more while he's at it. And we'll see him every time he earns a dollar or gets his allowance, too. Kids will pool their money, borrow from each other, or even ask to do odd jobs around the store for a chance to buy something new. I've even taken to telling them to save their money on occasion (the other owner hates it when I do that), because I wouldn't want my own kids to spend that way.
20-somethings are even better. We routinely see folks who are old enough to have real jobs but young enough not to have families coming in and spending hundreds at a time. Since we have a large room available for gaming, many of these people show up on their chosen game day and bring their credit cards with them. Any given young-adult game group who enters the store is bound to drop about $100 every time they meet to play. That includes dice, books and supplements, snacks and drinks, minis and other accessories, etc..
Of course, my stores might not be the norm. I know certain other areas have a much larger proportion of adult and young-adult gamers. Another store I'm involved with almost never sees anyone over the age of 18. These things vary. Hopefully, though, these notes might help you see how your fellow gamers spend their money.
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As for downloading PDFs... it's illegal and unethical. Remember that it's not the same as borrowing or getting a print copy from a friend; when that happens, the friend no longer has the print copy. That one copy is still paid for and legit, even if it passes through the hands of dozens of owners. Illegal copies of PDFs are the same as if someone made duplicates of a print book and distributed them. It does indeed hurt the industry, so keep that in mind when you're downloading those PDFs (or when you admit to doing so on an RPG publisher's public messageboards, for that matter).
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(or when you admit to doing so on an RPG publisher's public messageboards, for that matter).
I have never downloaded PDF files of Paizo products, only non-brand-name OGL supplements.
I'm going to kinda stay off this subject in the future, as it seems to be a touchy one.
[/threadjack]
It should be noted that those who object to WotC's Online Initiative have those distributing illegal copies to blame. Any publisher will tell you that this kind of piracy is killing the publishing industry (certain parts of it, anyway). I suspect that avoiding book piracy is a large part of why WotC doesn't want to produce much in print anymore.
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In the past five years I have spent more on gaming materials than in the previous fourteen. I'd certainly attribute that to having a much more stable amount of spending money. "Will work for gaming gear" signs don't seem to work out that well.
I also am in a place financially that I never expected to be in. In the past few years I have picked up almost all of the 1e and 2e material I never bought in the past. I have also picked up most everything 3e that I want. All the Ravenloft content ever produced, Planescape (I was not gaming when that came out - WE WERE ON A BREAK!).
I have had to make a spreadsheet to keep track of it and to break it all down into plastic continers in the garage. It has been a great year or so...
Anyway, the way my gaming group avoids astronomical expenditures is if one person buys a book, they notify the others. That way, there generally aren't duplicate books in the group, and there's one of all the necessary books in a communal 'book pool.'
Unfortunately, I'm the "sole provider" for the group.
I've become horribly stingy with my gaming budget- after seeing the quality of the products WotC were spitting out over the past 18 months, I got seriously leery of putting that kind of outlay. My last big purchase was the Arthaus edition of Pendragon.
That said, my subscription to Pathfinder is still sitting in my shopping cart- Paizo is probably the only D&D publisher whose product I'd buy blind (along with Ptolus- damn, but that was money well spent).
What I'd love to see is a copy of the Players Handbook, about the size of the new Star Wars RPG- a stripped down, sleek set of rules with minimal talk and a decent set of reference tables at the back- The old GW copy of Runequest, while not perfect by any means, was at least easy to grasp and find one's way around. I think Chaosium's walkthrough for CoC is probably the most easily navigable Character creation chapters- WotC has no excuse this time round. They have the staff, they have the resources and they've had the time. There should be no call for a Dummies Book; the game should render one obselete. Price range should be no more then $15- $25.
I seriously want to see a hard sell- TV slots, promotions at Starbucks, another ScFi TV movie. The game is regarded with bemused and sypathetic affection by the mainstream media and as the progenitor of the gaming industry as we know it now. This kind of captial is pure gold- it's time our demographic was utilised properly by WotC. The educational, social and teambuilding qualities can be pushed. Why can't we see Jamie Lee Curtis on the Telly talking up D&D along with the rest of Hasbro's Lines? Why the hell can't WotC stop being treated like the idiot cousin of the Hasbro Family? Ghettoising D&D isn't doing anyone a favor- someone in marketing needs to grow a pair and get ambitious, rather the trying to catch the runover from other demographic groups and the shrinking diehard market.
And what the hell happened to the RPG adage of "you just need the rules, dice, pencils, paper, friends and imagination". You never hear this line from WotC any more- are they afraid that we'll suddenly realise we don't need the extraenous pap they keep pumping out? Does the sound too thrifty, too much work, too unmarketable? Are RPGs just hard to sell to parents who appear to be increasingly terrified of their kids and what gets pumped into their heads? Is imagination being pushed out in the name of easy interactivity? If we insist on serving our kids a diet of prepackaged imagery and concepts, instead of letting them come to such ideas themselves, are we doing them a disservice?
Phew.
I need to lie down.
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Actually, I don't think D&D is costly as compared to a electronic gaming genre.
I will not say about the situation now (as I can definitely afford it and sort of abuse my spending) but twenty years ago, all I had was the red basic box set, a dice set (those that you had to write the numbers on), paper and pencil.
Total cost = $39.90 (I think that's what it cost then). It took me at least over 2 months to save up the money (meanwhile "borrowing" from my friend's elder brother)
This in itself was sufficient to accrue months of fun between myself and friends (a group of 9). Subsequently, I remembered on that same year, we pooled our money and book the expert set and at least 2 game modules (second hand).
What I believe is we're living in an age of extravagant spending on our hobby. Just like the electronic version of gaming, if that gamer also spent extravagantly (gaming mouse, high resolution monitor, improved CPU, RAM, graphic card, heatsink, headset,...etc), it will be definitely much much more than our pen-and-paper genre :)
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I've become horribly stingy with my gaming budget- after seeing the quality of the products WotC were spitting out over the past 18 months, I got seriously leery of putting that kind of outlay. My last big purchase was the Arthaus edition of Pendragon.
That said, my subscription to Pathfinder is still sitting in my shopping cart- Paizo is probably the only D&D publisher whose product I'd buy blind (along with Ptolus- damn, but that was money well spent).
What I'd love to see is a copy of the Players Handbook, about the size of the new Star Wars RPG- a stripped down, sleek set of rules with minimal talk and a decent set of reference tables at the back- The old GW copy of Runequest, while not perfect by any means, was at least easy to grasp and find one's way around. I think Chaosium's walkthrough for CoC is probably the most easily navigable Character creation chapters- WotC has no excuse this time round. They have the staff, they have the resources and they've had the time. There should be no call for a Dummies Book; the game should render one obselete. Price range should be no more then $15- $25.I seriously want to see a hard sell- TV slots, promotions at Starbucks, another ScFi TV movie. The game is regarded with bemused and sypathetic affection by the mainstream media and as the progenitor of the gaming industry as we know it now. This kind of captial is pure gold- it's time our demographic was utilised properly by WotC. The educational, social and teambuilding qualities can be pushed. Why can't we see Jamie Lee Curtis on the Telly talking up D&D along with the rest of Hasbro's Lines? Why the hell can't WotC stop being treated like the idiot cousin of the Hasbro Family? Ghettoising D&D isn't doing anyone a favor- someone in marketing needs to grow a pair and get ambitious, rather the trying to catch the runover from other demographic groups and the shrinking diehard market.
And what the hell happened to the RPG adage of "you just need the rules, dice, pencils, paper, friends and imagination". You...
Son of a B#%%!! You're RIGHT!
Son of a b!#%&! You're RIGHT!
Coming from you, sir, that means a lot :)
Seriously, though, is it too much for us to expect Hasbro to push the boat out for the flagship game of the flagship publisher of RPGs? What happened to the pamplet sized rulebooks of the red box? There was feck all intimadation factor there- why the hell can't get get back to that "plug and play" ethos? I don't need more rules- I need a game that can sweep the world, a game that can go camping, a game that doesn't require enough reading to get a Law Degree, crates of equipment and all the optional dross to feel I'm getting all I can out of it.
We don't need to sell more optional crap, we need to sell more of the basic rule to more people. And sorry, but that means outlay and effort.
I had hugely high hopes when Hasbro bought Wizards- I thought that at last, we'll get some serious professionals in to market our game properly.
Shows what I know.
I don't need more rules- I need a game that can sweep the world, a game that can go camping, a game that doesn't require enough reading to get a Law Degree, crates of equipment and all the optional dross to feel I'm getting all I can out of it.
We don't need to sell more optional crap, we need to sell more of the basic rule to more people. And sorry, but that means outlay and effort.
What I think we need also are tons of affordable (10$ to 15$) adventure modules... Which seems to be incredibly scarce since the third edition came out. It's one of the reasons I subscribed to Dungeon magazine actually.
I need maps (lots of maps) of cool places, plots, legends, rooms with traps, pictures, treasures, enemies, monsters with a twist.
After 25 years of gaming, I don't need more rules... I need more material to throw at my PCs!!
Ultradan
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Son of a b!#%&! You're RIGHT!Coming from you, sir, that means a lot :)
Seriously, though, is it too much for us to expect Hasbro to push the boat out for the flagship game of the flagship publisher of RPGs? What happened to the pamplet sized rulebooks of the red box? There was feck all intimadation factor there- why the hell can't get get back to that "plug and play" ethos? I don't need more rules- I need a game that can sweep the world, a game that can go camping, a game that doesn't require enough reading to get a Law Degree, crates of equipment and all the optional dross to feel I'm getting all I can out of it.
We don't need to sell more optional crap, we need to sell more of the basic rule to more people. And sorry, but that means outlay and effort.
I had hugely high hopes when Hasbro bought Wizards- I thought that at last, we'll get some serious professionals in to market our game properly.
Shows what I know.
Clap, clap, clap. Standing ovation. I agree 100%. I, too, thought that D&D going to a subsidiary of Hasbro would mean a return to the game being marketed in a box, in stores, next to the board games like Life, Risk, and the others and that my beloved hobby would see an explosion as it became marketed as a game for the masses, the smarter masses, but still the masses. I expected box sets (not the joke box set they have now that gives play to 3rd-ish level then can be tossed in the trash sans figs and dice), I thought of modules packaged in plastic and hanging on racks ready for perusal of the back, and I thought that When people would overhear conversations of having family game nights, that D&D would be mentioned in the same breaths as Monopoly and Trivial Pursuit.
WOTC and Hasbro failed.
WOTC and Hasbro failed.
Is anybody really surprised by that?
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WOTC and Hasbro failed.Is anybody really surprised by that?
No, considering what they did to my beloved Magic: the Gathering with the Mirrodin block. Everything since has been against the original 'feel' of the game, and is either extremely overpowered, or moronically weak. Thanks a f+&$in' million.
I actually haven't played 3.5 for that very reason, it seemed more a money making scam (I know you're out there but..) I thought as I reviewed the 3.5 materials "no one could be up on all this enough to have a smooth emersive gaming experience." that being said and that planned obsolesence is the american way, I must say I'm glad this communnity survived..I thought everyone on here would be alot younger and as people fess up I find there is a substantial older core still! (41) the only thing that sucked me back in was a Dungeon cover a few years ago (sphere of annihilation trap from the Tomb of Horrors caught my eye at a news stand) I found there was so much creativity inside the PAIZO Dragon, that I was forced to keep picking them up, even though I haven't played in maybe 10 yrs. The point of all this is that (up until this month) I was still spending 10-12 bucks a month on DnD(though I recently began playing mini's with my 7 yr old to introduce him to gaming)
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Bella Sara Charter Superscriber
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No, considering what they did to my beloved Magic: the Gathering with the Mirrodin block. Everything since has been against the original 'feel' of the game, and is either extremely overpowered, or moronically weak. Thanks a f~!!in' million.
Clearly you weren't playing when WotC released the Urza block, well before they were acquired by Hasbro.
Or Homelands...
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No, considering what they did to my beloved Magic: the Gathering with the Mirrodin block. Everything since has been against the original 'feel' of the game, and is either extremely overpowered, or moronically weak. Thanks a f~!!in' million.Clearly you weren't playing when WotC released the Urza block, well before they were acquired by Hasbro.
Or Homelands...
I was playing when Urza block came out, but I was too young to appreciate the finer points of the aesthetic and true 'feel' of Magic: the Gathering. However, Homelands was before my time by a couple of years.
