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Are there any details than can be said about the upcoming new adventure path?
I would like to see some "High Sea" adventures in there. The one thing I would say bad about the current adventure path is that exploration of the the realm was low. (either greyhawk or Fearun)
Sure you get to go plane hoping some but to travel far and wide from the city would have been nice.
I am the one and only party fighter and I started with a Horse for combat and I haven't really had the chance to use him much.
I guess overall I am saying lets have more Terrain in the next path.
Other than that great job.
Creative Director
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While we're not ready to unveil any of the juicy details on the new Adventure Path quite yet, we're definately interested in hearing what the readers want to see in it!
So what do you all think? Any requests for the Adventure Path 2? What did you like in the Shackled City Adventure Path, and would you like to see that in the second one? What about things you didn't like in the first? More gnomes? Less demodands? More new monsters? Less new prestige classes? More exploration and overland travel? Less dungeons? More ninjas? Less baboons?
We'll definately take any opinions and recomendations posted here into account as we plot out the next adventure path, but the earlier you voice any suggestions and/or concerns, the better!
The one thing I can guarentee is that we'll be building in goodies for all 11 of the core character classes throughout the next adventure path.
Ninja baboons!!!
Oh, and pirates.
I second that motion :)
I really like the set-up of the adventures. Some roleplaying / detective work together with a good old fashioned dungeon crawl. Overall, the pacing seems pretty good too. Oh, and the new format is GREAT!. Now, as for the input. Here’s some stuff I would like to see in a new adventure path:
More fluff I would like a more detailed setting and backstory. I like the way the adventures were linked together, but I think you could go even further. You know, provide more hooks for side-treks, write-ups for locations, detailed npc’s etc. Perhaps a write-up of one or more NPC’s per issue in an appendix
Locations I prefer locations like the Lucky Monkey to ‘generic’ dungeons like the Kopru ruins or Jzadirune. The latter, in my own mind and the player’s are less believable. A city built into a dormant volcano. That was a great idea. I want more of that! I would like to see castles, inns, ships, lighthouses, floating clouds-fortresses and hollowed out stalagmites rather than caverns and 30’x30’ rooms hewn into mountains.
Story arch I would like to see multiple stories woven together. And more continuity. I want to see stuff happening in the background as well. Like how more (half-orc) mercenaries where added as the situation in Cauldron got grimmer. I would like more (NPC) reactions to campaign events. And more NPC’s taking initiative. For example, I like how the stormblades went on their own adventures. I feel other groups, such as the chisel or the striders of Fharlanghn should be developing their own leads, and setting their own plans into action.
Encounters I love the encounter format. Very clear, and all the info in one place. I would like to see stat bocks in an appendix rather than in the text. That way they don’t muddle up the text. I would also like to see a small section on tactics with each encounter. That kind of stuff makes DM-ing a LOT easier.
That’s all for now
Chef’s Slaad
I love the adventure path and though I could drone on and on in what I do want to see, it might be easier to tell you what I would not like to see.
First, I would like it not to be setting specific. I know that there is a big push for Eberron right now, but an adventure path set there would most likely guarantee my not purchasing it. Adding setting specific sidebars would be great though.
Second, I would like to see a series of adventures that don't deal with the planes, but leave the adventuring terrestrial instead.
OK, two things I would like. Sea travel and dragons.
Neomorte
The only thing I don't like in Adventure Path is that our group will (I hope) finish the Zenith Trajectory adventury this weekend ;-( But the first two adventures were great!
You did a good job with Adventure Path. Thank you.
I really enjoyed the Adventure Path, and so have the two groups I've run through it.
Something I would really love to see:
Some up-front campaign information that can be given to the players for character creation purposes. It would be even better if it were presented as a web enhancement so it can be easily printed and given to the players.
I would like it to include:
Details on the area they start in. In this case, Cauldron. And any information that anyone living in the area would know: Authority figures (given without class and levels, Religious figures (also without class and levels), and Local merchants and proprietors of local establishments.
I read through the first four or five adventures, did a lot of typing, and got the information I wanted to my players... I even went so far to get color copies made of the Cauldron map and made folders for each player!
My handout looked something like this:
Authority figures
Lord Mayor Severen Navalant, male human
Terseon Skellerang, Captain of the Town Guard, male human
I also included the owners of all of the shops an inspiring adventurer might have met... Weer's Elixers, Gurnezarn's Smithy, Zanathor's Provisions, The Tipped Tankard, The Drunken Morkoth Inn, and the Sure Foot Livery. I added the leaders of each of the churches, and included the paladin... who could miss a paladin prancing around a city the size of Cauldron?
But I left out things they wouldn't necessarily know, like the name of the local thieve's guild, the Chisel, the Striders of Fharlanghn... although, if one of my players' character concept fit into such an organization, I would have given that out separately. It would have been interesting to have PCs that belonged (separately) to the Last Laugh and the Striders of Fharlanghn and maybe even someone aspiring to be a high hand-crafter.
A map of the local area and a little information on each of the local cities/villages... but only what would be considered "common knowledge." I didn't tell my players that the Shatterhorn was believed to have Yuan-ti there, nor that there are actually demon sightings near the Demonskar (although one might guess... what with the name and all). This information could help a player create a character that's from the area. Maybe a son of a stone mason from Redgordge, or an orphan that was raised by the local blacksmith or apprentice to an alchemist. (I did have a player ask me if he could be a Yuan-ti Pureblood... and I was more than happy to let him, and told him he was from the Shatterhorn region, and to keep his identity secret as long as possible.)
Add a little of flavor text to describe the current politcal attitude of the area, any local important events that transpire, etc. I told my players in our first meeting that the Flood Festival was a month or so away, and role-played the city's preparation all the way through the first adventure, and one side trek. (I described the months leading up to the Flood Festival like the months leading up to Christmas... merchants increasing inventory, cart vendors multiplying, the various churches fund-raising for their impending events. By the time the flood festival began, my players were eager to participate. We spent one whole session doing local competitions!)
These basic things would be great. To go the extra mile, you could include some basic description of the people, the stores, a sample price list or menu. But all geared as a handout to the players.
This is already a long post... I might have to do another to say what I would like in other aspects of the game.
I think I would like to see far more terrestial adventuring. My least favorite adventure was plane hopping to Occipatus. On a personal level, im just not interested in the planes. Plus, I, like a previous poster, had at least one character with the intention of being a mounted combatant, and before long, it became obvious that he would be spending money every session to stable his horse rather than get to use it. As a DM that jumped in with both feet first, it was very difficult to plan for future character arcs and help my players plan because I wasnt sure yet how it worked out in the end.
I would also like to echo an earlier poster that said having a more fleshed out "world" with sidetreks and campaign ideas would have been better. The focus on the dormant volcano that just happened to have a slew of underground dungeons hewn into it got a bit old.
Something I loved: two words - crazy jared.
My handout looked something like this:Authority figures
Lord Mayor Severen Navalant, male human
Terseon Skellerang, Captain of the Town Guard, male human
Big Jake,
would you care to post that little gem on this forum? I would love to read it. I did something similar, but it's in Dutch. I tried running it through bablefish, but it got horribly mangled.
I'll try to get it translated into something that resembles english and post it here too.
My players just finished Life's Bazzaar last week and will be moving into Flood Season. They thoroughly enjoyed the adventure. I do appriciate any tips on characters to bring into the game earlier since I haven't had time to read the entire adventure yet (well, the entire adventure that's availabe right now anyway ;)
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Chief Creative Officer, Publisher
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The next Adventure Path will probably be about as "Setting Specific" as our "generic" adventures. Everything you'll need to play the campaign will be provided for you in the form of "Backdrop" articles (like 114's "Isle of Dread") and poster maps.
It will range over a larger area than the Shackled City Adventure Path.
It will start in a village, with a suggestion that all of the player characters are from that village or are passing through when the first adventure begins.
The current outline does not involve a trip to the Outer Planes. We've been doing that enough lately.
The current outline involves a handful of dragons.
There will be many undead.
It's currently slated for 20 adventures, one for each level.
--Erik Mona
Editor-in-Chief
Dungeon
I might as well plan on purchasing then Erik. It is everything I could want. Now I am considering a subscription.
Neomorte
The next Adventure Path will probably be about as "Setting Specific" as our "generic" adventures.
Which is fortunate because Shackled City was about as setting specific as you can get without actually having the benefit of a setting. As much as I love the series, it was really a strain trying to place a fantasy campaign in a volcano surrounded by baboon-filled jungle. The featured monsters (from the Skulks to the Spellweavers) were too alien and really seemed to be used just to market the Fiend Folio.
I'm glad to hear the next series will be a bit more generic and that will go a long way towards easing use. As for everything else, I'd say keep it exactly as it is now. I love the politicking of the various churches and factions. I love how there's noticeable evolution in the city between adventures (coming back from Occipitus and finding the Lord Mayor gone was quite a blow). I love the way later adventures leave free-reign to the players to call on previous contacts to solve mysteries. That's everything that should be in a campaign.
If you're still looking to add things, though, there are a couple areas that I'd like to see expanded on. A) If you could somehow provide player maps as beautiful as the DM maps, I could use those as hand-outs/battlemats. It seems a real waste to have such classy work be available to only one person at a table. 2) More time in-between adventures to go on side-treks. There've been some pretty decent adventures in your magazine that I would like to run in between Adventure Path episodes, but with one adventure per level, it sounds like it might be pushing it. I'd like to have little distractions that take the PCs places that don't actually have anything to do with the metaplot. Lastly) more noticeable change in seasons. If the party is going to rise all the way to 20th level, it shouldn't all happen in a year. Except for the winter rains during "Flood Season", I don't recall any mention at all of the years passing. Things like environmental factors or even the seasonal tax collector could be used to show the passage of time.
And finally, a question: Will Adventure Path 2 take place in the same "world" as Shackled City? For the reason I mentioned at the start of this post, I'd rather it not be, but it seems a waste to have the earlier party save a city and then not have it be around any more. Especially if somebody from that party manages to get appointed Lord Mayor or something.
Thanks for listening, sorry for the length.
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Chief Creative Officer, Publisher
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Good questions.
There've been some pretty decent adventures in your magazine that I would like to run in between Adventure Path episodes, but with one adventure per level, it sounds like it might be pushing it.
On the contrary, I hope the new approach makes it easier to "sub in" alternate adventures if you don't care for one of the 20. We'll see how it goes.
And finally, a question: Will Adventure Path 2 take place in the same "world" as Shackled City?
Assuming we go with the current outline, it will be on the same "world" as Cauldron, but about 1,650 miles to the northeast.
--Erik Mona
Editor-in-Chief
Dungeon
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I've been the DM for Paul Rees and my gaming group in the Cauldron campaign. For the most part, I've had absolutely no problem with the campaign. It's been a lot of fun for all, and I've really enjoyed running it. The umberhulk attack was my favorite, what with all of the drama of the other scenes. The rescue of the baby was outstanding, hanging out the window and grabbing the kid at the last moment.
I'd have to say that the two suggestions I have (and I think mught have already been made) is that a concise timeline of how many months/weeks between adventures there are. I had no clue how much time to put between the first and second adventure. Also, I'd like to see suggestions for where to set each adventure path. Most people apparently used the Savage Frontier for their Forgotten Realms setting, while my party used the western chain of mountains outside of Halruaa for theirs.
Outside of a timeline and a location, I had no complaints about the game. It was an outstanding effort on Dungeon's part, and I look forward to playing in the next adventure path.
I really hope ya'll tie up the Celeste string. I'm curious as to where it's going to go.
I really hope ya'll tie up the Celeste string. I'm curious as to where it's going to go.
I'll second that request.
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Chief Creative Officer, Publisher
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The first Adventure Path was written to a very loose outline, with authors dropping in dangling plots here and there in an attempt to leave fertile ground for future authors in the series. Many of these threads, such as the Sign of the Smoking Eye template, were picked up by the authors closing out the series. Others, such as Celeste and the Ebon Triad, were not.
I'm sad to say that Celeste does not appear again in the Shackled City Adventure Path.
I am pleased to say, however, that she _will_ appear in the _next_ Adventure Path, and will play a fairly important role. The truth behind her mysterious character will come out eventually, and we're hoping it will be all the sweeter because it will have been about a year in the making.
Oh, by the way, the current plan is to include appendices in the second Adventure Path that include suggestions regarding inserting the campaign into the Eberron and Forgotten Realms campaign settings, written by some of the foremost experts on those worlds.
I'm really excited about our current plans, and it's definitely a Herculean effort not to just post my full outline here on the message boards!
Which reminds me. One difference for the next Adventure Path will be short "The Path Ahead" articles every five issues or so that will chart out in broad strokes where the storyline is going, what NPCs you might want to try to keep alive, etc. We'll also be doing fairly extensive "concept" art for important characters and locales, and hope to build excitement through these articles.
I'm glad most people seem to have enjoyed the Shackled City. I suspect you're really going to like what we have in store for 2005.
--Erik Mona
Editor-in-Chief
Dungeon
I'm glad most people seem to have enjoyed the Shackled City. I suspect you're really going to like what we have in store for 2005.
--Erik Mona
Editor-in-Chief
Dungeon
Um.... if it's 20 modules long... that's more like 2005 and most of 2006! I've got no problems with that, especially since that would be a module a month. However, I do have some requests, so please bear with me.
First of all, let me start by saying that I love the series, and have recommended it to other GMs. But there have been several things wrong with it, mainly with inaccurate stat blocks. I've had several instances where the weapons NPCs were said to be using did not match what their stat block said they used. (Greataxes for Greatswords, for example.) Grappling modifiers have been added incorrectly for a few NPCs. (Believe me, I know. I have a half ogre monk grappler with the Vow of Poverty feat in my party, so I've had to use those grapple checks a lot!) Hookface was described early on as being female, but when the party meets her, she's male.
My biggest gripe, and for that matter, my party's, is the sudden plot shift inbetween "Demonskar Legacy" and "Test of the Smoking Eye". My party thought that this sudden shift in the direction of the plot, (from trying to keep Redgorge from being invaded to being told to plane hop by an unknown voice, without any chance to head back to Cauldron to stop the invasion,) was horrible and without explanation. The only reason that they were willing to plane hop was the fact that I didn't have anything prepped other than this module. (I had picked up that issue the night before the game.) So, please, please, please, better plots, tighter plots, and no inexplicable plot shifts.
I know it sounds like myself and my group think the series sucks, but that's far from the truth. We love the series, and we can't wait to see how it ends. (As a matter of fact, they want the series to go Epic... they're planning on hunting down Hookface's lair and raiding it.)
I am curious about one thing. I believe you have said that there are currently no playtesters for Dungeon. Is it possible to request to playtest the new Adventure Path, or any other modules?
Squid
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Creative Director
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There should be fewer instances of sudden plot shifts in the second Adventure Path. The dramatic shift in plot from "The Demonskar Legacy" and "Test of the Smoking Eye" works on some levels, but in hindsight it does leave certain story elements hanging. Since the second Adventure Path will be more or less completely planned out from start to end, this shouldn't be a problem the next time around.
As for errors in stat blocks and continuity errors (such as Hookface's gender swapping)...they're unfortunate, but they'll creep in now and then. Having the entire adventure path plot laid out should help a lot, if only because we won't have to wait for Author #3 to finish his installment before we can get Author #4 working on his installment, which should give us a LOT more time to develop and edit them!
CONCERNING AUTHORS:
you got some pretty well-known authors to write installments for the first adventure path. Can you give us a few clues as to who will be writing the for second one? Or better still, can we give sugestions?
Personally, I would like to see a mix of well known and debuiting authors.
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Chief Creative Officer, Publisher
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By all means give your suggestions. We're very open to them.
We probably won't "debut" authors on the Adventure Path. That's not to say all of them need to work at Wizards of the Coast, or anything, but writing an adventure to an outline that is linked with 19 others takes some doing, and isn't something I'd want to foist on a novice.
What authors from the last couple of years of Dungeon have you thought well of? Which do you think would do a good job on the new Adventure Path?
--Erik Mona
Editor-in-Chief
Dungeon
By all means give your suggestions. We're very open to them. What authors from the last couple of years of Dungeon have you thought well of? Which do you think would do a good job on the new Adventure Path?
Chris Perkins, Chris Perkins and, let's see... how about Chris Perkins.
What authors from the last couple of years of Dungeon have you thought well of? Which do you think would do a good job on the new Adventure Path?
James Wyatt is, by far and large, one of my favorite authors. I would also include David Noonan, and Christopher Perkins.
Neomorte
I sugest a Backdrop article to go with the first instalment of the New adventure path. It should include a map of the city, some suronding area, lots of fluff, maybe some import locals that would be used during and between adventures, and a few important NPCs
Christopher West for the cartography, and I'd love to see a poster map of the city like in the first one.
Authors, Robert Lee's a favorite of mine and Chris Perkins is great, but I'd really like to see Jonathan Tweet do an installment. He did an adventure for Dungeon called Headless that was great, completly story driven. I'd love to see him do that kind of adventure for the Adventure Path.
Authors I'd love to see write for the next adventure path:
Bruce Cordell
Monte Cook
Any of the Game Mechanics (I love their stuff!):
Stan!
JD Wiker
Rich Redman
Skip (& Penny!) Williams
I also have run several adventures from the download section from the WotC site... I particularly enjoyed Ramon Arjona's Fallen Angel and Gwendolyn F.M. Kestrel's Desert Sands (which I ran between The Demonskar Legacy and Test of the Smoking Eye).
Instead of making a huge 1st to 20th level path, why not make minor story arcs (3 or 4 adventures long)?
I really liked the "Faces of Cauldron" 2-page spread that was done up in one of the issues, as well as the seperate pictures of various individuals in the modules. I make my own cardboard tokens rather than use miniatures in my games, and having good images to work from saves me a lot of time that I can devote to other game prep. A "headshot" of each major NPC would be much appreciated.
While Im not going to suggest any authors in particular, my real question is how soon after the conclusion to the first adventure path can we expect the second to start?
The second Adventure Path will begin shortly after issue #120. Probably #122 or thereabouts.
--Erik Mona
Editor-in-Chief
Dungeon
That soon! all right.
hum di dum di dum.... 7 more issues. Counting the months.
:-)
The second Adventure Path will begin shortly after issue #120. Probably #122 or thereabouts.
That is good news! I look forward to it.
Neomorte
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It's great to read all the stuff above! I can't wait to have the first part of the new adventure path in hands!!!
What I would like to see then is:
1) Please no poster maps with all the npc on it. The one you gave us for Cauldron looked cool, but was almost useless for me. Single pics for the npcs would be cool!
2) It's great to hear that you plan a "The Path ahead" section. This is defeniately is very good add to the series!
3) Could you think about having an area map for the pcs. That means no entrys on it except the village the pcs will start out?!
4) npc-tokens so that I can use them during fights! God, I would love that!
5) Floor plans (as inserts to the magazine) for the areas of the BIG encounters/fights.
And, well, are you able to speed up time, so the next seven months will be a little bit shorter ;)
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I really like The Shackled City Adventure Path. I was able to work it flawlessly into our campaign and the players really enjoyed it. I personally liked the underground adventuring and the use of Fiend Folio critters. I have no complaints about Shackled City - great job.
As for Adventure Path II, I think it is exciting for notes that include using it in Eberron (or another setting). I have embraced Eberron and I think it is a fantastic setting. So, I will certainly appreciate some notes detailing how to best fit APII into that setting.
I think a generic platform is the best idea, so that the Adventure Path can be used and have appeal to the broadest possible audience. But, some notes for applying it to commcercially published settings will really fire me up.
-------- Don (Greyson) --------
Well, my party has chipped in their impressions of the 1st A.P. and have given me their thoughts on what they want for the next one.
More Puzzles... from the impression I got, one a module would be nice.
More Dragons... not just evil ones, but good ones as well. Maybe even the good ones are at cross purposes with the party and become adversaries.
More Handouts... more things to give my players while they're playing. Everything from location maps to notes made by the bad guys.
More of a focus on traditional monsters... basically, try and focus on monsters found in the Monster Manual. Monsters from the other three MMs, (MM II & III, and Fiend Folio) are fine, but they should not be the main villians, but more like the sidekicks or unusual monsters.
Very little plane hopping. While "Test of the Smoking Eye" was a good module, and "Asylum" makes sense for the finale, try to keep hopping planes to a minimum. And if we're plane hopping, how about to a less typical plane, such as the Plane of Shadow or one of the Elemental Plane?
Squid
One of the things I always find lacking in high adventure modules is, like Squid said, the presence of good dragons that the PCs get to interact with. My players LOVE that. You just dont see it very often in published modules and it was the primary reason I bought Dragonomicon. I find that I have to build those encounters myself. It would be awesome to see some of that in APII
I really liked the "Faces of Cauldron" 2-page spread that was done up in one of the issues, as well as the seperate pictures of various individuals in the modules.
I also appreciated the Faces of Cauldron. I had no problem scanning the faces and seperating them for handouts and I appreciated the glimpse of what a street in Cauldron looks like. The only complaint I have about it was the give-it-all-away clue to Vhalantru's identity in the form of his curiously-shaped shadow. Maybe that was just the artist being cute, but it made the image nearly unusable as is.
Another area I wanted to comment on is the apparent anti-climax of Shackled City as it winds to a close. I hope it's just a first reaction to reading them since we haven't gotten that far to play them, but after a series of adventures that covered the underdark, jungles, canyons and city streets. Taking the PCs from the lowest thugs to the highest class lounges. Involved them in political intrigues and long-standing mysteries, the last couple of adventures have just been a revisit to the walk down the hall and slay the monster adventures. Even the big political conference in 'Foundation of Flames' came off empty as the city is destroyed and anything the party achieved during the conference is pretty much nullified. I'd hoped the conclusion of the series (which, I admit, hasn't actually concluded yet) would take the PCs to places they hadn't been before and not just be more of the same with more powerful monsters.
If it's not too late to suggest for APII, I'd like to see the campaign progress to a grander (more epic?) scale. Let the players lead armies or take rulership of kingdoms or defeat the tarasque.
I also want to back Squid on everything he said. His thoughts mirror my own. I especially like the idea of good dragons that may have to work against the party. That's such a keen idea, I may just use it anyway whether it's in APII or not.
Again, thanks for listening.
Rest assured, everything that gets mentioned on these messageboards about Adventure Path II is being noticed.
Really? Then I want one of the major NPCs to be named, or nick-named, "Big Jake!"
That would rock!
First, let me congratulate everyone on a great adventure so far. I have liked it very much, and while we are still in Life's Bazaar, the players seemed to have liked it so far as well.
I would also like to say how pleased I am that the editorial staff not only read these message boards, but actually take the time to respond. This is a very good thing.
Now, on to business...I don't mind the Fiend Folio monsters at all. They were a nice change of pace for both the players and me. I think mixing these more exotic creatures with the common ones helps accentuate the "differentness" of the Fiend Folio creatures.
I also vote for more tightly-woven plotlines (which seems to have been addressed already). There are a few dangling plot threads out there, and if I know my players, THOSE are the ones they're going to want to follow. (I fully expect Celeste to be hounded to the ends of time by this group of players.)
I, like many others, would like to see more detailed environment, character, and historical information for APII. Not that I mind thinking this stuff up on my own, but I had my players asking what the educational system was in Cauldron. (They ARE a bit odd, I know.)
I would also like a Player's Map of the area the Path will occur in, whether it be city, area, whatever. I had the map of Cauldron lamenated and hung on the wall with a legend key that grew as the players found (find) new stuff. The players like this very much.
And while, it has been said that the Aura section at the beginning of each room has been eliminated due to space considerations, I would strongly petition that it be brought back in some standardized form. I liked that very much, as it made some of the standard character actions easier to DM.
Once again, thanks for a great Adventure Path. I have enjoyed it so far and I am looking forward to APII.
As to the Fiend Folio monsters. I didn't mind them too much, but as I don't own the Fiend Folio, and don't want to buy it just to run these adventures, I would like just a bit more description of the monsters added to the magazine if they are used. Just including the monster's stats left me struggling sometimes to know how the creatures should respond, and what their special abilities really were.