Farmer Grump

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Organized Play Member. 1,639 posts (3,435 including aliases). No reviews. 1 list. No wishlists. 2 Organized Play characters. 3 aliases.

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Liberty's Edge

So I have a question- How exactly is an Alchemist ever supposed to ever use Quick Alchemy? The equipment requires 2 Hands to use effectively.
Was the overall intent of Quick Alchemy supposed to be that you never actually need to use your tools, just simply that you have them in your possession?
If the intent here was truly that an Alchemist must never actually HOLD or USE the equipment in any way, why does the table state that it requires 2 Hands and why does it note in description that you can stow the equipment in pockets or bandoliers when you carry them from place to place (Suggesting you're not actually using them)?

If the intent WAS that it requires 2 Hands, how exactly is an Alchemist ever supposed to have the expectation that they should have 1 free Hand to perform Quick Alchemy?

The same thing goes for the Formula Book except with 1 Hand.
Next, with Quick Alchemy, eventually, you'll end up in a situation where you'll be creating multiple items with a single action through Double Brew.
Does this change the number of free Hands that are required to do this?
What happens to the second item that you make?
It is automatically stored on your person?
Are you holding two 1 Handed Alchemical Items in 1 Hand?
Do you just drop the additional Alchemical Item you make from Double Brew to the ground?

Inquiring minds would like to know.

Liberty's Edge

When can we expect to see the new rules and guidelines in their final form for use by the community and ... well, anyone.

I'm PRETTY sure that the Convention Games that are going to take place in the next week are all going to be for use with Pregen Characters only, but if this is at all untrue, then I think getting the new rules pushed out before the show might be advisable.

Liberty's Edge

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I mean... come ON, how is this NOT a thread already. I simply cannot believe it!


So let me introduce to you all, the secretly leaked Magic Item from 2E as previewed and much laughed over at the PaizoCon Banquet.

The Eye of Robes
Magic Item
Traits: Magical, Transmutation,
Magical Item
Item Level: 7
Price: 1,000 gp
Slot: Eyepiece
Method of Use: worn, eyepiece
Activation: 1 Action (Manipulate Activation)

This soft cloth eyepatch is made of fine red silk and black stitching. It is designed to be worn over a single eye. Affixing this eyepatch over a single eye obscures the wearer's vision slightly imposing a -2 on Perception checks beyond 30 feet. Those wearing this eyepatch may transform their equipment and that of their very own form to appear as that of another creature. No matter what form the Character takes, they are always seen visibly wearing all Magic Gear they're equipped with including Eye of Robes itself.

The eyepiece grants the wearer an ability to alter the appearance of their body, clothing, and other worn equipment to appear as that of another form, be it from another region, ethnicity, or manufacturer. The Eye of Robes may be used at-will by adjusting the strap around ones head to change the wearer's appearance as the Illusory Disguise spell which has been Heightened to 2nd Level. Unlike the Illusory Disguise spell, the actual form of the creature and equipment is modified to the newly desired shape and not simply projected as an illusion.

Illusory Disguise:
Illusory Disguise
Traits: Illusion, Visual
Spell 1
Casting: (1) Somatic Casting, (1) Verbal Casting
Duration: 1 hour or until dismissed

Your illusion can make you appear as another creature of the same body shape and roughly similar height (within 6 inches) and weight (within 50 pounds). The disguise is typically good enough to hide your identity, but not to impersonate a specific individual. The spell doesn’t change your voice, scent, or mannerisms. You can also make clothing and items you wear appear different, such as making your armor look like an ordinary dress. Held items are unaffected, and any worn item you remove returns to its true appearance until you don it again.

Casting illusory disguise counts as setting up a disguise for the Impersonate use of Deception; it ignores any circumstance penalties you might take for disguising yourself as a dissimilar creature, and it gives you a +4 conditional bonus to your Deception checks to avoid others seeing through your disguise. You can dismiss this disguise with a Verbal Casting action.

Heightened (2nd) The spell also disguises your voice and scent, and it gains the auditory trait.

Heightened (3rd) You can appear as any creature of the same size, even a specific individual. You must have seen an individual to take on their appearance. The spell also disguises your voice and scent, and it gains the auditory trait.

Liberty's Edge

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I am going to try something here, just hear me out.

I cast *Raise Dead* on the Pathfinder Tales line.

If that doesn't work:
I cast *Speak with Dead* to find out WHY it doesn't work.

Throw us fiction lovers a bone, lie to me, link to an unfinished URL or tease something that one author or another has pitched to the team since the line went quiet. Something, please!

Liberty's Edge

So I was wondering if anyone had some good insight into how Article 13 is going to impact the big-dog leaders of the industry.

Based on what little I understand the companies behind the VTT's in the market now are all going to have to start policing the content on them for any breeches or publishing of "protected content."

If anybody around here knows what all that really means I'd be interested in hearing your thoughts because as I see it, there is pretty much no way that some of these VTTs can continue functioning within the realm of the law without needing to themselves purchase the License for the specific content to appear on their website- Meaning that nobody can share, expound on, improvise, use, write, or distribute what would basically amount to product identity publicly....

Even more alarming is the idea that videos that display protected Content will need their material reviewed for this purpose, Twitch themselves put out a call to get folks to contact their reps because of how much it could impact them and well.... it's too late now. Does this mean that people cannot play any IP controlled Content on Twitch anymore if they do not explicitly themselves get writing that the use of their materials to play Twitch games will end up being removed, demonetized, or banned?

I don't see how it could really mean anything else for the platform, and in kind does that mean that only the REALLY BIG Industry Giants like Critical Role who have inside networks to the lawyers of the content they use will be able to get the permissions they need? I really don't see the hundreds of smaller companies being able to handle putting someone in charge of granting these special exceptions to folks so they can share their game online, be it a Play by Post, Stream Game, VTT, PbCA, Facebook Group RPG, or the like.

Some of these sites are just BURSTING with "homebrew" games with entire gigs of protected material that was scavenged various Campaign settings, although I doubt the IP holders in most cases are going to push to have things removed as they'd only be shooting themselves in the foot, I'm not sure how this will be policed.

Will those that operate these websites (Obsidian Portal, Fantasy Ground, Roll20 et al) be forced to create new filtering and searching tools to identify lines, maps, images, videos and text for protected material?
Will these things be considered exempt from the restrictions?
Is it even legal (In the EU) to PLAY a Tabletop game of ANY sort on a service/website that doesn't themselves own the License to 100% of EVERY IP rule and proper noun that is used in the game?

Thoughts? Wild speculation? How does the sausage get made?

Liberty's Edge

As they say, "no news is good news," but I'm really getting nervous with all of this "good news" I'm hearing about Monk.

Has there been any concrete discussion of what changes and updates the Monk can expect in light of all the other "Sub-Class" and other interesting changes that've been leaked?

Maybe some under-the-radar hint'hints?

Wild speculation? Everyone is welcome!

Liberty's Edge

In the Class Descriptions - Weapon Proficiencies section, the CRB (p.59) states:

Grenades, missiles, and other consumable weapons never add specialization damage, even when you?re using weapons like a cyberbow or grenade launcher.

While I am aware that this is likely just a typo/oversight I wanted to inject some homebrew fun with it, so I present my homebrew Cyberbow.

Cyberbow, Handheld
Small-Arm Ranged Weapon
Technological Item
Item Level: 2
Price: 455
Damage: 1d8 P
Range: 40 ft.
Critical: –
Capacity: Drawn
Usage: 1
Bulk: L
Specials: Analog, Quick reload

Modern advancements in kinetic energy conservation has yielded a new type of handheld projectile launching system that requires neither explosives nor batteries to function. The Cyberbow resembles the illustrations of ancient weaponry from the pre-gap era called the "Crossbow." Unlike traditional crossbows the Cyberbow uses state of the art Shape-Memory Alloys to enable the effortless pulling back of the firing string combined with a simple trigger that sends the loaded projectiles flying. It uses the same ammo as a standard Bow including grenade arrows.

Liberty's Edge

Hey guys, I don't know how or why this category exists but you have a blank webpage for the Paizo Blog for posts from 1999 at the following URL.

It can be found here.

Liberty's Edge

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Preface: This turned into a much bigger rant than I intended so please try not to pull at any one thread too hard lest the shoddy craftsmanship of the post fall to shreds, this is intended to a discussion launching point about how best to position the mechanical components and "power level" of PF2 against it's competitors.

I've read the criticisms, the praise, the back-tracking of a few design decisions, the theorycrafting, pitfalls of the tight math, the endless circular debates about the "true" role of a number of classes, bemoaning of loss of backwards compatibility, and the million and one discussions about the caster/martial disparity that is being discussed around here.

One thing that I haven't seen much of, that I personally see as one of the best potential components to the future of PF2, is one that I think is being skirted by Paizo intentionally for the VERY reasonable fear that they'll be stepping on toes or infringing on someone else "zone" but nonetheless I think represents a function to enable more cross-pollination between different play groups and also to be attractive to new players.

This being, the degree to which published 5e D&D Adventures and player Content can be EASILY AND QUICKLY be converted for use with Pathfinder 2E. The Dice & Slice Podcast has tackled this discussion point HEAD-ON and I applaud you guys for doing so and jogging my imagination.

As it stands many people have been apt to compare the various components of the PF2 crunch to that which is present in 5E, some levying talk of how it is a bad idea or that it would serve to dumb things down, but they rarely touch on the idea that it is inherently in everyones best interest to line things up in such a way that a GM could take a published 5E Adventure such as the Temple of Elemental Evil, and with only a little bit of tweaks implement almost the whole Adventure with minimal pain. As it stands with PF1 being puffy and swollen like a Bloatmage at level 20 it is nearly impossible without rewriting EVERY statblock, challenge, trap, and encounter to use 5E Adventures.

If in the final version of PF2 we can bring some of the mechanical parity between the systems closer together I really think the system as a whole could greatly benefit, even WITHOUT a formal conversion guide (Which I'm certain is NOT in the cards legally speaking) I'd like to see this bridge to D&D repaired, and for some of those really great changes from 4E>5E to have comparable pieces that be used in the PF2 system.

Right now, we aren't actually too far off from being able to do this, but there are still stumbling blocks in the way, primary among these is the degree of PC customization and choice when first being created or advanced. There exists in 5E very VERY few choices a player can make to make themselves meaningfully different from someone else who is playing the same Race/Class compared to Pathfinder at large, but this isn't a weakness, in fact I think it stands as a strength but as it stands the ABC method for character creation is still an order of magnitude more adjustable than the elephant in the room.

The player choices really shouldn't matter too much in the scope of this sideways-compatibility , it's the back-end stuff like how Challenge Rating is handled, what "level" is appropriate for a given Spell/Power/Challenge that lies at the core of this.

Please forgive my rambling nature on this thread, but I've not seen much cogent discussion of the value that could be engendered by simply making sure that 5E Content could easily be either converted for PF2 or simply drag/dropped "as-is" to open up entire new exciting Campaign Settings, Iconic (Truly culture shifting) Adventures like CoS, and to work as a way to let players who are new the game and chomping at the bit for more content and options to be able to play/learn the new Edition as an avenue for people who want more "meat" and player choice in their RPGs.

Places to start- Something that need tackled if this is ever going to work is a way to transfer "Advantage/Disadvantage" mechanics that makes sense without breaking the math. I personally like the A/D system, but I do not think it is very "Pathfinder" and would like to see what any other folks think on the issue. To start off, there is going to be a quite sparse number of published modules/adventures for people to try PF2 and each of these are going to be truly untested pieces of new fiction.

If as a GM on day 1 I could come up with a few guidelines to bring my 5E books to the table and play them nearly "as-written" but supplanting the mechanical differences I feel that could be a HUGE advantage for the new system, and conversely if Paizo takes the tack that they should be doing everything they can to differentiate the "reality" of the two systems then I think it will not only be detrimental to the new Edition, I think it would be a crippling blow that ensures that D&D loyalists never even TRY PF2.

Honest replies, thoughtful comments, genuine input to how this could be done without starting from scratch, dad-jokes, and criticism is welcome here, I mainly got this rant started in hopes to spark some NEW conversation about how PF2 can set itself up as a single "step up" from the simplicity of 5E without stepping over that "Sue me please" line.

Liberty's Edge

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I know things are coming to an end soon, and the timeframe for input they can actually test (Internally or otherwise) and print is rapidly approaching.

In light of this I wanted to create a new thread for all of us to just GET IT OUT, you know, that ONE nagging itching thing that you feel absolutely must be changed, added, or addressed.

To keep things light on the moderation staff, I'd like to propose that discussion be kept to a minimum in regards to debating one another. I'd like to to be a good thread where we can each note our one sticking point with the Rules as they stand now.

Liberty's Edge

4 people marked this as a favorite.

What would YOU change?

I thought it may be time for a more lighthearted discussion of changes we could make to the Playtest.

Personally, I think Quack Repair is a good improvement over Quick Repair, but maybe Create Mood is better.

Liberty's Edge

Some of you may be aware of the buggy state of the game right now.

I've sunk some time into playing and its various learning curves, and I wanted to note that if there is only 1 message I can get to everyone just picking it up it would be:

Create new Save Files (With a manageable naming convention) at the beginning of every quest, major encounter, event, and expedition. Due to a number of BUGs you are going to want a variety of backups of your game in case you need to revert to a previous state to avoid the issue.

Have fun!

Liberty's Edge

2 people marked this as a favorite.


Seriously, what justification is there for making Fighters better at Unarmed Strikes than a Monk?

Right off the starting Line Fighters are ALREADY at Expert where Monk is only Trained.. **baffled look**

Is there some reason that Monks should be more inaccurate with their primary attacks than a bare-fisted Fighter with no special training or unarmed focus at all?

This makes no sense, can we please get a Dev to chime in as to if this was an oversight or intentional.

Liberty's Edge

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Quite simply, why was the Tower Shield omitted from the PT? I thought if ANYTHING the Tower Shield would need more testing than it's lighter counterparts? They are a quintessential component to MANY Tank/Protector Builds and as it stands PCs are left with only regular Shields to use.

I'm assuming they will make a comeback with the full release, but is there any chance we can maybe have them included in an Update midway through the Playtest?

Additionally, will Tower Shields require a special Armor Prof like they have in the past?

Liberty's Edge

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The topic really says it all, I noticed that Leadership is missing from the Feats and I just want to say GOOD! Paizo, please save your Diamonds, you don't need to cast Resurrection on this one.

I've NEVER EVER played a game where Leadership did anything other than grossly expand the power and wealth access a PC has to an abusive or disruptive degree. I don't mean to insult people who liked it, and I'm not saying there isn't design space that should be made to allow PCs to recruit Cohorts, but the Leadership Feat is NOT the way to do it, it's always been to powerful, awfully balanced, and a drain on resources such as "Length of a Players Turn" and WLB. A feat that essentially grants the PC a second Character to play (Albeit at a lower level) is simply WAY out of it's league considering how weak Animal Companions, Mounts, and Cohorts in general are now.

Don't try to balance it, don't make it a Rare Feat, don't gate it behind prohibitive Stat/Level/Feat requirements, just let it die and we can all have a nice Wake in it's memory. If we MUST have this kind of thing, please just roll it into an Archetype that has to be invested in over the course of several levels.


Liberty's Edge


Flying Kick

Monk Class Feat 4
Traits: Monk
Two Actions

Frequency: Once per round.
Make a Leap or attempt a Long Jump. At the end of the jump, if you’re adjacent to a foe, you can immediately Strike that foe.

So I'm curious about how this interacts with Quick Jump.


Quick Jump

Feat 1
Traits: General, Skill
Prerequisites: trained in Athletics

You can use High Jump and Long Jump as a single action instead of 2 actions. If you do, you don't perform the initial Stride, and you don't need to have moved 10 feet.

Since the Flying Kick Ability seems to be a specific action which tells the PC to use an "Activity" which NORMALLY takes 2 Actions, I'm not sure if Quick Jump will reduce the Actions required to use Flying Kick it to 1 Action.


Liberty's Edge

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I know that there is only so much you guys can do to ensure that the Binding on the Hardcovers are going to hold up, but we all know, there have been some pretty serious issues (Which I'm SURE cost the company BIG $$) with the binding quality of the last few big Hardcovers.

Have you switched printer/binder partner companies, shouted down their throats, or otherwise addressed this kind of quality issue in relation to the Playtest book?

After the entire first run of Starfinder was botched (Collectors edition included) and reprints being sent out, Paizo has done a GREAT job of "making it right" but I cannot fathom how the Purple Golem could EVER hope to reprint or replace these Hardcover Playtest books since I believe there is only 1 Print-Run planned for the product.

I'd considered buying the PF2 PTRulebook but after some really disappointing print qualities I decided it wasn't worth risking my money on it should it run afoul of binding problems.

Liberty's Edge

I posit that the phrase "For all Purposes" should FOREVER be stricken from Pathfinder 2nd Edition, Playest and beyond.

Whenever you print this line of text you could JUST as easily print that the Character GETS that feature you're trying to emulate. This always leads to forum threads asking what "for all purposes" means, to varied result from what I can tell for NO good reason. Some cases allow silly non-sense such a abusing Polymorph, other are just irritating to PCs, such as Subtype issues.

If you want Flurry Of Blows to function as TWF, literally just give them TWF, who cares if they use it with non-monk weapons?

If you want a Spell to treat a Targeted Creature as your Favored Enemy, just have the spell overwrite an existing Favored Enemy temporarily.

If you want Tieflings/Halflings/Half-Anything Races to be treated as Humanoid (Human) make those abilities ACTUALLY give them the given Subtype.

The Sawtooth Sabre is considered a Light-Weapon, BUT ONLY when using TWF, and as such qualify for the Impact Enchantment which does.... or does not(?) work when using TWF.

Liberty's Edge

Any word on how the more "Adult" or controversial content will be handled for this Edition?

Will we be seeing more/different rules or systems which revolve around the use of Drugs, Alchohol, as well the purchase of Slaves, Ladies/Men of the Night, and the like? Services such as Assassination, Thugs/Mooks to protect you, or simple Hireling rules seem like a ripe area for improvement.

Over all I think Paizo did a great job the last time around, but I wonder if this new Edition will have any changes coming down the pipeline especially since it sounds like Consumables are going to have a MAJOR makeover for the new System balance.


Liberty's Edge

I figure with as much discussion going about regarding Redcaps, we might as well have a good place to properly discuss ways in which one may kill said Redcaps to compare various Characters, Builds, and Classes for comparison between Editions.


1 person marked this as FAQ candidate.
Starfinder Core Rulebook wrote:

Walk the Void (Su) 1st Level

You are immune to the harmful environmental effects of outer space and vacuum. You also gain a fly speed of 20 feet while in space. In addition, whenever you can see the stars, you can determine your precise location. Finally, add Piloting to your list of class skills.

Hello all, I ran into this in the process of trying to help some folks with Hero Lab Online whom raised the question of Maneuverability granted via the Mystic Class Ability "Walk The Void" when in a Vacuum.

There IS no Maneuverability listed for WtV, I assume in error since there IS no general rule regarding how well you can move via flight by default, and in fact the Skill writeup for Fly includes penalties/bonuses for various levels of proficiency.

Should I assume average Maneuverability? I'd very much appreciate an official response if this hasn't somehow been answered elsewhere somewhere hidden.


Grand Lodge

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I shudder to think that a year from now the Dev team neglects to properly give Kobolds their due space on Asteroids and Moons through the system to mine hollow for profit and exploitation.

Just think of it, orbital space stations filled to the brim with a rainbow of mini-dragons all chomping at the bit to get just past that next Thorium vein, space diamonds galore!

Grand Lodge

This is a thread dedicated to reviews of our new grass overlords. May their photosynthesis grace our lungs with life giving oxygen as we offer our prayers to feed them in kind.


Grand Lodge

2 people marked this as a favorite.

Commoner has a BIG problem. It's name.

I understand GW has to pull from PF Roles, and make everything fit to make sense for the Brand, I get it, but Commoner is more or less an outright insult to anyone. If someone on the street used the word, your first reaction would likely be of confusion followed quickly by anger or bewilderment.

Synonyms for commoner include the following, none of which have a positive historical or personal meaning to ANYBODY I can imagine.

Huge list:

Synonyms for commoner



















We are supposed to be powerful, fun, interesting Characters in game, and recycling the name "Commoner" for a Player Character Role is just plain silly. In the TTOP nobody was EVER meant to actually play a commoner, it was made so you could stat up helpless citizenry, and give them some moderate "benefits" to being that over say a Rogue or Expert.

You have a variety of other words you can use to name the Commoner Role, and you SHOULD at least look at using one of them instead because there is simply nothing "epic" about being a Commoner when everyone else is running around as Assassins, Pathfinders, Barbarians, and Wizards.

Choosing to keep Commoner is the decision that legacy is more important to Role equality in terms of perceived power, wealth, influence, and experience. A level 20 Commoner Role PC is still, even at his height of awesomeness, relegated to equate to "just some guy who picks up stuff for a living."

Grand Lodge

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Proof of innovation folks!

Grand Lodge

I am a 67 year old failed priest and farmer. I have no personal attachments to any family members at present and looking to pick a fight! I think your house is drab, and your garb is less then fresh, whats-more I'll tell you I think so. Once I swept your feet while cleaning my stalls and I never even apologized!

I know you kids always think it's funny trying to fool the old man, tipping my livestock and pissing in the well, but don't think I won't come chasing you with the Rake or Shovel if I catch you "lookin a fool" as you'd say... I think.

You believe I "have it coming" but I wont be fooled. We got do-overs! Thats why I packed up and moved here in the first place, and I'll not be easily deterred. Anyhow, not on my lawn! So, step forward, my eyes aren't the best anymore and declare yourself!

I'm looking to explore the Feud system and would like to see serious applicants to try it out, as long as we can keep things "personal" as it were I'd relish the opportunity to try out it's features.

Applications should be in Roleplay.

Thank you

Grand Lodge

We all know we aren't going to be deciding the minutiae, abilities or implementation of Crowdforging choices, and instead it will be more like how each Guild is choosing our Hex choices, we have a list of options of what gets programmed first.

This is a clone of a less productive thread with a Bard consensus although it was pointed out the Monk wont be made until pretty far on. That being said we have a choice from 4 Roles to voice priority to.

So what do you think? Barbarian, Bard, Paladin, or Sorcerer?

Grand Lodge

We all know we aren't going to be deciding the minutiae, abilities or implementation of Crowdforging choices, and instead it will be more like how each Guild is choosing our Hex choices, we have a list of options of what gets programmed first.

So- To the title. We know that Monk animations are going to be QUITE intense for GW to make, and they won't be there day 1, or maybe even shortly thereafter. Bard has similar problems in that they need animation and music programming for various Instruments, Songs, and especially illusion magic. These are different, but both challenging Roles for them to tackle.

Which would you rather see implemented first, Bard or Monk?

Grand Lodge

Per title; I see plenty of talk within tavern threads and the like, with names of some such Alcoholic libation or another being used. I have no clue what they are, or if they mean anything, but who cares. This is beer we're talking about.


If you purchased the Epic Brewmaster add-on package, what have you named your Beer? It'd be nice to get a running list of all the official micro-brew PFO will have to offer in game.

Grand Lodge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

(WARNING!!! This thread is for levity purposes only, please do not shout, take off your shirt, or flip the table. )

<----My Nose

Ok guys, lets list off the Phat Loot we want to see in the game. I'll start.

A Level 14 Bugbear Fighter dies an awful fiery death and he drops a Recipe for the +3 Kobold Cleaver.

Grand Lodge

1 person marked this as a favorite.

Hello everyone!

I'm posting this with the intention to open the community up to a little bit more transparency in regard on how happy we are with where our Guilds placed, and claimed during the Week 1 LR. I know quite a few of us have been trying to play with our cards pretty close to our chests in order to prevent possible espionage or the like but the time for that is now over. The cat is out of the bag and I think it would be useful to start a discussion about how satisfied we are with where we landed. I will go ahead and start it off for everyone.

I'm doing this with the hopes that some of the cloudiness about who got what they wanted can be cleared up so we can all start communicating directly about future development, teamwork, and possible cooperation towards the goal of settling where we desire.

Keepers of the Circle have claimed AB as the location for Keepers Pass (Our Settlement), and I think it probably goes without saying that we are all very excited and happy with our Hex. I cannot speak for everyone in the Keepers, only myself, but I for one am overjoyed to see so many friendly, familiar faces in the neighborhood.

9/10 Stars for Land-Rush 1

Dark Archive

That's right, we are going to speculate, and complain about other models we have seen in other games, and be all anal about how we want do give Goblin Works, our money.

I figure what better way for your company to understand how their target audience wants to spend their money on your product than by asking them?

A couple ideas to think about here.

1) Pay to Win

2) Lottery Tickets Keys

3) What products/services do you want to see

4) Cash shop Auction House

Dark Archive

I figured since I haven't seen an actual formal poll anywhere around here as to the hard numbers on what proportions of the community are going to playing any given alignment.

So, I put together This Alignment Poll. I figure these figures can help give us a fair estimate to what kind of alignment spread we will have in Early Enrollment especially.

It's simple, answer the following


What Alignment do you intend on Role-Playing for your PRIMARY Player Character in Pathfinder Online?

Lawful Good
Lawful Neutral
Lawful Evil
Neutral Good
Neutral Neutral
Neutral Evil
Chaotic Good
Chaotic Neutral
Chaotic Evil

Link takes you to an external free polling website, simple as it seems.

Thanks for helping.

Dark Archive

I understand that any system needs testing, and that is what Early Enrollment, or EE, will be for.

One of the communities main goals during this buildup and testing phase will be to find out where the bugs and inconsistencies are, report it and move on. This is common practice. GW will have to test against encounter balance, PVP, and commerce among other things, and on particular thing they will ALSO have to test is the ANTI-Griefing, and reputation system.

To this end, I think it is VITAL that these systems are in place and effective before the primary public release date of the product.

All that being said, during the early days of the game, would it be beyond your grasp, or will, to create ways of testing these last few important systems, meaning you will need to forge your Ban-Hammer with care, precision, and grace. The only way to do that is through thorough testing of a volunteer group within the EE enrollment period.

Every week or so players will make a test or raid against one or more other players, and casually playing the CN, to CE roles of a typical griefer during the other times. These few will do whatever slimy backwards, abusive, antagonizing, exploitative, and subversive as they can manage to get away with in some kind of semi-coordinated effort (I was thinking a Thieves Guild sort of thing), where these systems will be levied against these folks. Ruined reputation, and whatever settlement/CC consequences on that would allow you to test the real time consequences of both your Alignment, and Reputation systems in conjunction with member action and influence.

I understand players don't like griefers, but if we dont practice, and try to get ahead of the curve then we will have to start off with real experience stressing the mechanics during the beta testing period.

I volunteer to be an anarchist!

Dark Archive

A whole variety of things, but if I don't ask, who else will right?

An archetype that focuses on Crafting, Professions, and Settlement Politics and Leadership. Generally something that thrives on the economic and trade/social aspect of the game etc.

A variety of fancy hats for every man, woman, and lizardfolk.

Farm Equipment.

Player created, deity specific shrines.

A quality rating on any (Food) the player makes with Profession(Cook). Let the community write recipes, you've already said you're considering what role food will have, crowd-source it.

How the Channel Energy feature work.

Numerian technology.

Firearms and Gunslinger.

Multi-Piece outfits, costumes, and non-combat clothing.

Dark Archive

I think as far as item variety goes, I believe in a world where variety is the goal letting us create a simple Flaming Rapier as opposed to a +1 Flaming Rapier will help put more unique and varied weapons in the player base.

My main reasoning is the following. For months to go into day 1 release, the game will have almost exclusively "level 1" characters, and even going forward the highest levels will but around level 2-4. This is when most PCs would get access to their first magical items, armor and weapons. As such that means anyone with a magic armor, will end up with a plain old, regular around the campfire run of the mill +1 weapon or armor. This will go on for months, and even years later everyone under level 5 will end up with a plain-jane +1 piece of regular steel and leather.

In a game where people can pick up a magic item with the same equiv value I would much rather allow a Masterwork Frost Dagger be just as common as a +1 dagger, or a Glimmered Studded Leather armor.

Mechanically it wont matter, because the crunch of how effective items and armor is will be changed dramatically from how it is in PnP to MMO, and leaving the arbitrary necessity that an item be +1 prior to having unique magical effects will make every low level character have the same quality magical equipment.


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I know we are still pre-alpha days here folks, but I would like to start the discussion of character and to some extent monster collision. To see what everyone thinks about it.

Personally, I think to maintain any kind of spirit of pathfinder, character collision MUST be part of the engine, and we cannot allow players and creatures (At LEAST in combat scenarios) to harmlessly pass through each other. This would defeat any kind of tactical arrangements, tanking styles of MANY kinds, and might as well write off the entire premise of Attacks of Opportunity.

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As I understand it, crafting will have its own unique close-set abilities that you will rank up through repeated use much like any of the archetypes. The same has been said for things like the collection of natural resources in the form or of harvesting, and possibly even farming.

It has also been established that large swaths of the crafting, resource processing, and delivery will be handled by local, persistent NPCs.

My question has a few different parts.

1) In terms of cultivating, or "crafting" particular items such as food, crops, or even "ranching" animals, will the players be able to interact in such a way as that they can become personally involved with the various decisions revolving around these things? Meaning, will I as a new player (Less than a weeks experience) be equipped with the tools, skills, and options to be able to stake my claim as a humble farmer, choose my individual crops, work to improve farm conditions, and see an actual improvement in the results? This opposed to simply paying the right NPC, and logging off for the time it would normally take for these systems to do the legwork for me.

2) Should we as players be armed with he tools to control our own land, workers, and crops be able to invest in, and produce what the PFRPG refers to as "Black Market" goods? The campaign setting as it is, does contain a number of these things, and in many cases have a number or feats, and rule-sets that work based off them. Poisons harvested from certain creatures comes to mind, as well as the more obvious ones such as Pesh, Zerk, Tobacco, or Shoanti Barbarian Chew to name a few. These are all things which in our real world represent HIGHLY profitable luxury goods, which are always in high demand, and I believe can come to flourish in the economic model the game will sport.

2a) This moves past even a question regarding the moral aspects to general profession mechanics, crafting, and farming. Lets say a LE character chooses the path of charismatic manipulation, and takes possession of other creatures to open a brothel, or slave market. What structures are planned to either support, customize, administer over, or even fight against such organizations? These are all what most modern civilizations would consider immoral or evil acts and groups, however that does not accurately reflect what the are to the individual citizens of the River Kingdoms. Certainly there will be good lands, where the law prohibits these things, but on that same coin, there will also be much more "lawless" or even properly evil states looking to make their fortunes. Even in highly structured, lawful societies there exists an underworld, beyond the sight of the law enforcement where one can get things they "aren't supposed to have." I don't expect a NPC, with a shop in Thornkeep that is clearly labeled "BLACK-MARKET," or "WHOREHOUSE" but should a player look to explore these things, will they even exist? What about things like priestesses of Calistra, and sacred prostitutes? Slaves? Will we be mechanically be branded by the game engine as "evil" for dealing with these professions and goods?

I can't think of a much more rewarding RP experience, and challenge than toiling out on the far edges of known land, with a well armed group of like minded people to set up the appropriate production, and smuggling lines into the main cities. Keeping an appropriate "front" (Which could be a business in it's own right) for these commodities underground and defended would be very interesting, and touches on some of the ideas being discussed in the Anonymity and Disguise thread.

I understand the kind of pressures game (Especially video game) developers are under to make sure your product is "family friendly," and not encouraging of actual illicit & illegal activities to your players, but in a sandbox RP environment where our choices as communities will come to form the very laws of the land, we as players will be coming together as a community to decide what is, and is NOT acceptable.
I am personally concerned that with the nature of game ratings, and certain "watchdog" groups out there, the creativity and options of the players will be limited.

What does anyone else think about these things?

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Hello, having recently delved into Terry Pratchett's novels I found myself overcome with the urge to try and build a the threads named Character. This is a conversion of him into the Pathfinder rules set.

I always build "ode" characters up to around level 5-6, just so as that you have a little bit of freedom to try to really achieve the core features of the Character. In any case I felt like having done statted Rincewind up I should share him with someone, and having done that personally I figure why not the community.

I really just did it for fun, but you guys are welcome to critique the build, and YES I know, he's only supposed to have 2 opposition schools, and it really doesn't matter anyway (Seeing as how he has below average intelligence), but I figured it made sense in one way or another. As for alignment, I pegged him as NG in intentions, although I feel like given the situations that arise around him, he probably has a hefty sliver of Chaos in there somewhere.

Rincewind the Wizzard:
Male Human Expert 3 / Rogue (Charlatan) 2 / Wizard 1
NG Medium Humanoid (human)
Hero Points 3
Init +3; Senses Perception +7
AC 13, touch 12, flat-footed 11 (+1 armor, +2 Dex)
hp 49 (5d8+1d6+18)
Fort +5, Ref +6, Will +8
Defensive Abilities evasion
Speed 30 ft.
Melee Shortsword +2 (1d6-1/19-20/x2)
Special Attacks sneak attack +1d6
Wizard Spells Prepared (CL 1): The 8th Octavo Spell
Str 8, Dex 15, Con 16, Int 8, Wis 16, Cha 14
Base Atk +3; CMB +2; CMD 14
Feats Defiant Luck (1/day), Inexplicable Luck (1/day), Scholar (Knowledge [Absurd], Knowledge [local]), Scribe Scroll, Skill Focus (Linguistics) (Focused Study)
Traits Resilient, Suspicious
Skills Acrobatics +6, Appraise +3, Bluff +8, Diplomacy +8, Escape Artist +7, Handle Animal +3, Knowledge (Absurd) +7, Knowledge (arcana) +3, Knowledge (dungeoneering) +4, Knowledge (geography) +8, Knowledge (history) +3, Knowledge (local) +5, Linguistics +10, Perception +7, Sense Motive +8, Spellcraft +3, Stealth +7, Survival +7, Use Magic Device +6
Languages Celestial, Common, Dtang, Elven, Ettin, Gnome
SQ forewarned +1, hero points, natural born liar, opposition schools (abjuration, conjuration, enchantment, evocation, illusion, necromancy, transmutation), prescience (2/day), rogue talents (fast getaway), silver tongued, specialized schools (foresight)
Combat Gear Staff; Other Gear Old WIzard Robes, Shortsword, Bag of devouring (empty), Backpack, masterwork (empty), 100 GP
Special Abilities
Bag of devouring - Or The Luggage, is his only magic possession.

Defiant Luck (1/day)
Evasion (Ex)
Fast Getaway (Ex)
Foresight Associated School: Divination
Forewarned +1 (Su)
Hero Points (3)
Inexplicable Luck (1/day)
Natural Born Liar (Ex)
Prescience (2/day) (Su)
Scholar (Knowledge [Absurd], Knowledge [local])
Silver Tongued
Sneak Attack +1d6

Despite years of training, despite being a Wizard born, Rincewind has officially never managed to cast a single spell (He did once cast the Eight most powerful spells in the History of Creation, but he read them from a book, and got one of them wrong anyway). He has no magical talent whatsoever, and has never passed any of his exams. He may not learn magic, and may only cast spells under exceptional circumstances.
Solves minor problems by turning them into disasters
Favored champion of the Goddess the Lady.

Titles Earned
Egregious Professor Of Cruel And Unusual Geography
Chair of Experimental Serendipity
Reader in Slood Dynamics
Fretwork Teacher
Chair for the Public Misunderstanding of Magic
Professor of Virtual Anthropology
Lecturer in Approximate Accuracy
Assistant Librarian
Health and Safety Officer

The Luggage: (Noted as Bag of Devouring) This brutally omnicidal piece of travel equipment has the appearance of being a brass-bound wooden chest that walks around on hundreds of little legs. It is actually made of Sapient Pearwood, and very, very dangerous. It is pretty much a character in its own right. It can travel between dimensions, through time, outside of reality, and between planets, in order to follow its owner. It has, on occasion travelled to both the country of Death, and Hell. Note that the luggage cannot fly. There is, as yet, no established upper limit to the contents of the Luggage. It will also launder any clothes left in it.

His Bonded Staff was lost long ago.

(Created using Hero Lab by Lone Wolf Development)

Thanks for checking this out!

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Seriously, I dont think there are a pair of more poorly worded spells remaining in the system than Simulacrum and its lesser version.

Thing is I have a player wanting to use Alchemical version of the spell as a discovery, which is all cool with me really, but looking harder at the spell it becomes extremely confusing how exactly to create a creature (I guess I should call it a stat block) for any kind of simulacrum, much less a nerfed lesser version.

At first it seems pretty easy, ok cool. The PC can make one of a creature/level total does not exceed his HD. Check, done. Then comes the problem of it only ACTUALLY possessing half of it's own HD... o...k... I sorta see what you're getting on here, but um. A creatures HD effects absolutely everything about EVERY creature, and it's not like we have a 7 HD progression for any 7 HD creature, all the stats it had at a given point, which EX abilities it would still have, the order in which it takes its feats, skills, Base Attack Bonus, saves, ability score pumps, etc.

On top of all this, there dont seem to be any rules for leveling DOWN a creature, with any kind of user friendlyness. Sure I can take the characters intended minion creature as it is, an Young Blue dragon, give it the stats of a wyrmling, take away its magic and BOOM we have a nerfed lesser simulacrum, but these kinds of convenient stat place-offs are so extremely rare to come across the only ones I can think of at all ARE the Dragons.

My player even suggested letting him use the Eidolon (Spelling?) Rules for an appropriate HD creature to try to emulate whatever the lesser simulacrum was shaped after, and it seems like the easiest fix I can think of, even being as clunky, and non-intuitive as it is.

So, here I am left questioning myself as to what to do here. The flavor fits with the PC, and I want to make it work, but he and I are having a hard time justifying even letting him do it simply for the amount of paperwork, number crunching, and motrin 800's it would require.

For the record I think this spell would be a perfect candidate for ERRATA IN FUTURE PRINTINGS, to simplify, balance, or basically just make work. Even a template or creature sub-type with matching rules would work... so help, please!

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This is a thread with the intention of spelling out some of what the community would call a "PC Role." I understand the concept, and have my own opinions to the validity of the necessity in such things but that isn't what THIS thread is about. I think a list of as many "PC Roles" may be insightful as to the variety, or maybe lack of found within.

I want to put together a universal list of any of these roles, sort of like an index.

I'll start to rattle off a few common ones.




Ranged Bomber


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I have a Catfolk kitten rogue playing in my Slumbering Tsar game, and during the game the PC came about the idea of growing, and use of Catnip, and I have no clue how to handle it with the basic assumption that they will end up hallucinating much like our real life companions do. Knowing what we do, that each cat responds uniquely to the plant, I didn't really know how to deal with it so I came up with a simple table based off half a minute of googling.

Even results are ignored every use, as it doesn't work on some cats. Rolling on a d10, and on an odd result roll again until until an even result appears.

1 - Hallucinations

3 - Drowsiness

5 - Aggression

7 - Arousal (Horniness)

9 - Extreme Hyperactivity

It feels fudged, and I really don't like it so well, so I come to you all hoping you have some ideas?

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This is Ryan Furnas (For those of you who I met for long enough to remember), or HeroLab Society Booth guy #1.

This goes out, not only to the Society Venture Captains, or the Paizo staff, but also all of the volunteer GM's, booth guys, and players that just plain stopped by and chatted with us (Brett[HeroLab Society Booth guy #2] & myself), kept us entertained and sane during the weekend.

I am just now recuperated enough to the point where I can sit down and e-mail and message everyone from the show. I wanted to take the time to thank each and every one of the awesome people that made our work at the convention a success.

Being tied up in a room together for hours on end during the 4 days I made a few good acquaintances and more. I want to say thank especially to everyone who helped me get into a few society games regardless of my work shifts, and responsibilities helping all of the PFS players get their characters in order in time for their own events. You made us HL volunteers feel very welcome, like a part of the team and I only hope that we made things a little easier for all of you as well. Between helping me with regards to the PFS boon tokens, bathroom breaks, water bottles, and somebody to talk to between waves of players you all helped make it a truly remarkable weekend, and I hope to see, and work with all of you again next year!

Thank you all once more for the amazing opportunity to help all of you make it a great show!

Ryan T. Furnas

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C'mon man, just play Bard.

I see you over there, in your chair, browsing the internet for class choices, but what you fail to understand is that in our universe there is a certain, unique and beautiful binary state we all are afflicted with.

Simply you either have a Bard, or you don't have a Bard, and really who wants that... that's right, nobody doesn't want a Bard, so just suck it up and play one already.

C'mon! You really don't need another Ranger, Bard is where it's at man.

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So, the long and the short of this is that I am attempting to get together a checklist of certain things the party should have, or can find access to which are vital to the party's overall success. ex. Rope, Cure Potions, Something for traps etc...

I am looking at a 7th level game to start, and the lowest CR's I plan on throwing at them are CR 8 encounters or greater. I plan on using this during the game next week in order to make sure the group (About 5-8 people) has their ground covered.

Any suggestions to add to the list are appreciated?

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I am heading a group to play The Slumbering Tsar Saga. Information on the campaign can be found here and here.

We will be starting in a few weeks and I am DESPERATELY looking for experienced players. We currently play on Sunday evenings from 4-10, but this, as many things, are still up in the air. I have a handful of people already organized, personal friends etc, but I am looking for more people who play locally.

The closest other organized group of players near me is 50+ miles away in the form of a PFS group. My next step from here will likely be calling these coordinators to see if we can share resources.

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My necromancer needs to know.

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Would this work on an Oracle? I don't see any reason why not due to the wording of the spell, and neither curse states that the condition cannot be overcome through spellcasting. Yes, it is a 3rd level spell but everything has a price tag, your thoughts?

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I figured you started 2-3 of these threads a day anyway, a few of them getting locked so I figured someone might as well start a thread that is appropriate for it.

Rave away my good dork.

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