Karmagator's page

I'm in the weird position that I will likely only ever get to GM SF2, never sit on the player side. So most of my experience with player options will have to come from PF2 compatibility, transferring classes and items into fantasyland. So I'd appreciate any ideas you have to make SF2 stuff fit in as much as possible ^^

Now, my PF2 GM's world is only a step below modern high fantasy like Warhammer Fantasy. Semi-modern tech like flintlock firearms, breechloaders, repeating crossbows and so on are common enough with some faction. Even some 19th century stuff like break-action shotguns in some cases. Alchemy is common as well. Magic isn't exactly rare, but true magical firearms (like star guns) are expensive and restricted, trending more towards level 10+. So while I have a lot to work with, just doing the easy "they're magic now" excuse for futuristic firearms isn't available to me.

So far I've had the following ideas:

1. ARs, MGs and similar high(er) capacity weapons can be represented as super-charged repeating crossbows, 2004s Van Helsing style (I've always loved that weapon :D). Maybe some super early repeaters. I don't think I can swing portable gatling guns, though XD

2. Pistols are converted into a variety of stuff we already have in PF2, but with some mechanisms/implements that make reloading faster. Like pepperboxes with breech blocks that you can swap out or handcrossbows with mags. This really only needs to make aesthetic and surface-level sense. Revolvers might be an option, but I'm not sure.

3. Grenades, grenade-launchers, flamethrowers etc are all alchemical or in some case magic, conceptually comparable to existing PF2 stuff. Just, you know, probably cooler and actually mechanically as useful as they should be.

4. Shotguns... are shotguns. Double-barrels are fine, though the stuff with a higher capacity needs some explaining. I'm not sure if revolver shotguns, Alof's "magazine" or actual pump-actions will make the cut.

6. Rocket launchers and Co. are a bit more... special. I'm currently thinking of adopting the spellgun idea, basically in-universe they aren't regular weapons but magic consumables that allow someone without magic to drop spells like they are hot.

That's where I'm currently at. Thoughts?

Apart from the vesk/android stuff I've put into the Field Test #3 thread, here's some info about SF2 that was given in the livestream:

- Over the coming weeks and months, they are looking to get together more livestreams and liveplay to show us what they are working on directly

- In March, we'll get the Envoy Field Test

- SF2 won't have stamina as the norm

- Technomancer is still a thing, but they can't tell us anything at this time

- They won't make too many changes to the setting due to the edition change. Most will be due to the several year time difference the base setting has experienced and to introduce some more nuance to some things. For example, not all vesk are battle-thirsty conquerors.

- There is in fact a current version of an ancestry with a 5ft base speed. SO that's a thing. Presumably Stellifera?

- Spell traditions are very adventageous for character design and necessary for compatibility, so that's what they went with. However, spell traditions don't really dictate how you cast spells, so there is still a lot of space for how you flavour your character.

- Means to allow for adventuring in space/vacuum/etc will be available to characters from level 1

- The playtest will focus on the rules. The setting will get its day in a major way when the game actually comes out.

- On the topic of compatibility, it was reiterated that the goal is for the rules to work together, which will happen. 110% compatibility on that front, apparently :P. But whether the options are actually balanced in the other system, that's gonna vary a lot and isn't an integral part of compatibility. SF2 will be its own system with its own internal dynamics. If you want to cross the streams, then the finer adjustments will be up to your table. [Which imo is the only way to really do this, so that's fine with me].

- The actual playtest will go all the way to level 20

- Augmentations will be a thing

What we know:
- skill focus instead of skill monkey (goes hard into one skill)
- has the Aim action, which gives precision damage (d6s, 2d6 at level 5, progression otherwise unknown)
- one subclass is a sniper
- another subclass will presumably focus on one-handed weapons (hinted at in a blog post and the iconic runs this playstyle)

Since we probably won't learn too much about the Operative in the next three months - the next Field Test is in January and that is about ancestries - and we demonstrably know very little in the first place, we might as well make a wish ^^

---

General vibe

I'd like it if the Operative shifted tone a bit from "space Rogue" and became something similar to what the Fighter is in PF2. Not in mechanics, but in terms of the general concept. A general combat class that has a lot of their playstyle choices tied to their weapon loadout, if more tricksy than the average Fighter battering ram. This specialisation should be achieved by subclasses comparable to the Rogue, rather than only proficiency and feat trees. The key attribute would remain DEX, but some subclasses should be able to pick STR as well.

It shouldn't go so far as to offer anything like a defense-focused playstyle as the Fighter does and heavy armor should be extremely restricted (if available at all). Non-agile/finesse/ranged weapons should also not be the norm. AoE weapons that are encouraged should be limited to grenades. But other than that its fair game. I would like it to be able to cover everything from the usual assassin/infiltrator/kleptomaniac/politician to something like a hard-boiled merc from a light infantry regiment.

Subclasses

Subclasses should be themed and generally created with a loadout in mind, but shouldn't be too narrow for the most part. For example, I would prefer it if a subclass that enables melee could do melee-only and mixed melee/ranged.

In particular I'd like:
- a direct daredevil/merc type focused just shooting very well
- a sniper
- a more traditional "sneaky" type that can work both at range and up close (can specialise in on or the other via feats)
- a magical subclass with a small but very versatile arsenal of abilities (the Psychic's cantrip+amp style system would be great here)
- an Eversor that wrecks house at close range, including control abilities like combat maneuvers (My brain always goes straight to 40K for this topic XD)

All subclasses should mainly modify the Aim action to suit their playstyle. For example, the sniper should be able to avoid at least lesser cover on their aimed shot and the sneaky one should have a choice of Deception actions (Feint, Create a Diversion) and Hide/Sneak as part of Aim. The Eversor could have some enemy-proximity bonuses and a built-in Stride or Trip/Shove/Reposition/Disarm.

The Aim action

This is probably the thing I'm most afraid of going wrong.

In my experience with the system, classes that are forced to frequently spend additional actions for their feature(s) to work are facing an uphill battle when it comes to both effectiveness and enjoyment. The Investigator is only the most illustrative example. The Gunslinger has probably upgraded to "second most complained about class" after the Remaster gave some love to the Warpriest. The Swashbuckler has come increasingly under fire as well. Ranger has some serious grumbling, but nothing too serious. Thaumaturge and Magus are afaik widely regarded as working well on the other hand.

I'm sure the devs know this well enough, but stuff like this can very easily make a class feel highly repetitive. So please, please, please avoid that in any way you can.

Built-in actions or action compression have worked well, but need to be versatile and have options. Otherwise they just get repetitive slightly slower and regularly leave you with a "no good options" scenario, which just makes things worse. Looking at you Swashbuckler and Gunslinger.

Another thing that helps is the repetitive action being an "enabler" for extraordinarily strong single-action abilities.

A combination is the best. The "enabler" action should not be a waste on its own and it should have a strong follow-up to make limiting your options like this satisfying and worth it. The Envoy in the stream was going in this direction and it worked well.

If we can avoid this pitfall, then I think we are in for a great time ^^

Continuation from the Mystic Blog thread to not clog that one up.

Tanks in Pathfinder work because they have lots of mechanics that either prevent enemies from getting in range of their allies, or punish enemies for focusing other creatures besides them; so far, the Soldier doesn't really do either because enemies can still shoot regardless, and won't un-suppress themselves in the immediate by focusing the tank.

Shooting the Soldier instead of the Mystic will not break suppression, and so the Soldier's toughness simply means there is less overall reason for an intelligent enemy to focus them over the Mystic or any squishier character, which to me is pretty much the opposite of what a tank would want. If the Soldier's suppression had a clause that exempted attacks against the Soldier from the debuff, then perhaps that could be an incentive, but we don't have that either.

[...] The underlying concern either way is that this approach feels like it can easily lead to a homogenization of HP due to what seems to be a lack of meaning to tanking in SF2e: either we still have tank classes who will draw incoming fire towards themselves, in which case we can still have 6 HP/level classes, or tanking in that respect is so ineffective that every class needs to be balanced on the assumption that they'll be taking fire at all times. I don't see the need to creep the minimum HP/level to 8 in a world where tanks would still be doing their job of soaking up damage just as well as in Pathfinder.

PF2 levels of tanking simply cannot work in SF2, at least not all the time. By far the biggest reason why it works in PF2 has very little to do with class abilities and pretty much everything with the system's and GM's assumptions. It's that you can keep your squishies safe by simply standing in the way of what would harm them, because most enemies don't have ranged attacks and maps tend to have limited space. It works because we allow it to, for the most part. I can make it not work in PF2 as well, simply by including significant numbers of ranged enemies and more open maps for example. Poof go the caster and the ranged attacker and the tank can do nothing about that. Ofc, I'm not gonna do that because that isn't fun.

SF2 will have to find a balance point that is much more reasonable and honestly more exciting. I don't think this robs the idea of a frontliner of much meaning. All the HP/armor buff does is provide some margin of error for both sides, which I'm completely fine with. It's not like certain casters already have this in PF2 and it isn't a major concern over there either.

For example, all the Soldier has to do is stand in the open while the Mystic and the other squishies spend an action per turn to Take Cover (or already have standard cover). That doesn't make him a great target by any definition, but still better than the Mystic to a decent degree. And even if they do target the Mystic, they effectively do so at a -3 with the Soldier's suppressed condition and melee enemies will have a hard time with that -10 speed.. In either case, I think you have done your job as a frontliner.

And if more passive tanking isn't your thing, then flanking and scraping the enemy out of their hidey holes is a perfectly valid strategy as well.

The dev team at least seem to have had a good experience, so I'm pretty sure it will be fine.

A significant part of the feedback basically boils down to "this isn't anything like the 1e Soldier" or "I thought this was the SF2 Fighter, so why doesn't it do the thing" and I doubt that will stop. And that is absolutely correct, the SF2 Soldier has essentially nothing to do with the 1e version or any type of Fighter-esque combat generalist. It doesn't even have the same role. That clash will lead to a lot of unnecessary headache. So even if only to manage expectations, I think not naming the class "Soldier" would go a long way.

While I like the ability to cycle between three ikons for the magic number, the feels and the versatility, the trend is already pretty visible. The weapon ikon is king and when you inevitable have to transcend out of it, one of your other ikons is clearly better and the other just gets used once in a blue moon. Once the root epithet comes online, worn ikons usually aren't the one you pick with any regularity.

I've also felt that when adding the items to your story, three feels like one too many. It feels kinda cluttered. Heroes in stories having special weapons is normal, but they usually only have something that qualifies as either a body or a worn ikon. Here in Europe this is more often than not armor, but figures like Achilles or Siegfried (the two obvious origins of Skin Hard as Horn) are more famous for their equivalent of a body ikon.

From all of that, it is worth considering to just have two ikons. One usually for offense (weapon) and one usually for defense (body). The body ikon can feasibly just absorb the worn ikon options with a minor reframing. Those two could then even be stronger or at least broader in application, possibly with always-on passive effects. The large negative would be that cycling suddenly becomes a lot less interesting until you add more interactivity into that department. But having two "modes" would still be pretty cool.

This might just be me, but the transcend-cycling between ikons often leads to a sequence of a great turn followed by a distinctly less great turn.

I used a Gleaming Blade greatsword Exemplar with the Brave root epithet, Palisade Bangles and Skin Hard as Iron. There was only time for a quick 3rd level scenario with my brother, basically a GM-off. Both of us were using multiple characters, one PCs (Exemplar, Fighter, Cleric and Bard) and the other monsters (2x crocodile and 3x weak crocodile). Btw, crocs are really scary once they have you grabbed.
Anyway, I had this hypothesis in my mind already when starting, this wasn't a real party and only a single combat, so take this with more than a whole tablespoon of salt.

Now, what my Exemplar usually did was use Gleaming Blade's transcend action - which is awesome btw - and then go into the Bangles, ending their turn. The last action was usually spend on movement either before or after the transcend. That was the great turn. On the next turn, after the bangles more than once prevented a crit on the Exemplar or the Fighter, you kinda just.. transcend out of your body ikon into your weapon ikon for one action, then usually move and sit there with a regular Strike as your last action. This isn't actually terrible, but compared to the other turn, it doesn't feel like you are really... doing anything. The bangles offer the possibility of getting the enemy to you, but as expected the Fort saves on a croc said "no" most of the time. In any case, the body ikon feels a lot more humble and small than the weapon ikon.

One part of this is that regular Strike. It goes without saying that the two-action transcend activities shouldn't be able to be spammed every round without a cost, such as Shift Immanence as a dead action. But the contrast of the awesome move and then the lame, plain Strike feels bad. My fingers are instantly itching to grab something off of another class to at least have the option of using something more interesting here. I'd like more in-class options here, just so the "off" turn doesn't feel so lame in contrast.

The real problem is when your initial transcend action completely fails, though. This happened only once, thankfully. Because then it basically feels like you have two "bad" turns in a row, as the lack of luck from the first cascades into the second, leaving it feeling even less impressive. You don't have the first impactful turn to prop you up, after all.

Picking names is - for me at least - always the hardest part whenever I write anything. But whoever (person or group) decided to go 100% ham on the names - feats, features and others - since the Psychic deserves a medal.

And the people who are responsible for the Kineticist and Exemplar ones deserve several dozen.

We're having a lot of discussion about very specific options and general theme, but there are not a lot of build discussions out there. There is a little bit of this over in the playtest character thread, but I think a more focused discussion is useful to get a feel for the class.

Basically, what options would you pick in specific/general? What would you imagine your normal turn would look like? And most importantly - why?

Initial Choices

To keep with the theme, my character would definitely have a nephilim or other extraplanar heritage. Human or orc base ancestry. STR key stat all the way, this class with DEX-focus just doesn't speak to me at all.

For weapon choice, I'd normally be a hard choice between a reach spear/polearm, a greatsword or a maul. Reach weapons are obviously the strongest, it is just much better than a minor damage upgrade. But Noble Branch's Transcendend ability is terrible no matter which way it is clarified - both 1-4 or 1d10 damage are bad in the long run, even if you get it automatically. It's neither good nor fun. So it's between greatsword and maul. Both Gleaming Blade and Titan Breaker seem very solid, but I prefer swords over hammers aesthetically. So Gleaming Blade it is. Shame there is literally only one generally good two-handed STR sword aka the greatsword. If my GM lets me, I'll reflavor (and regroup) a halberd into a sword. What my characters would give for an actually good reach sword...

Defence is a problem, so DEX 16 with studded leather is non-negotiable. To complement that, I'd choose the Scar of the Survivor body ikon. Eye-catching Spot is just... no and Skin Hard as Iron is just too situational for me (it is either very good or completely useless). Gaze Sharp as Steel isn't terrible, but has several problems. One is that you can also get Reactive Strike normally and in that case the active part of Gaze is completely redundant. Two is that the Transcend ability is just pretty bad in general. An action to just unlock a reaction plus the fact that it uses up your one transcend ability per turn? This would be super lame as a regular action, much less on one of your "super abilities".

The worn ikon is a much harder choice. Skybearer's Belt is the only one I can eliminate straight up, this character doesn't have the free hands/weapon traits for any of this. I've got offense and ranged defense covered already, so I'll choose Palisade Bangles to support me and my team in melee. Especially the other guy I'll be almost certainly be sharing the frontline with will appreciate that.

Epithets

Root: Cunning doesn't matter to this build and Mournful is too weird for me. The choice is between Brave and Radiant. This would come down to how much my team would benefit from extra healing, with a preference towards Brave. It would certainly ease up on the movement demand.

Dominion: Peerless under Heaven would be the obvious choice here for what shapes up to be a blademaster type character.
What is strange here is that it only gets the damage type upgrade while everyone else gets more. Granted, you can choose between three types. That said, the only one of these that actually matters is bludgeoning, which two of the others get as well, because that is the one that works well against creatures that are immune to spirit damage - mostly constructs. In any other case spirit damage is just better because it ignores physical resistance. So really, that choice is completely irrelevant unless your enemy is weak to slashing and your weapon doesn't already deal slashing.
Anyway, choices. Whose Cry is Thunder is just way too cool not to take. Just for this choice, I'll take my DEX to +5. I don't get any benefits from the passives aside from the damage type choice, which is a shame. Is it an optimal choice? With the Transcendent ability being ranged, probably not. But I think I've optimized enough for that not to matter too much. Also, rule of cool.

Sovereignty: Honestly, the choices here are really underwhelming in their variety. They are way, waaaaay too specific. Don't have specifically specced into Intimidation? Last Ruler is not a good option. You (understandably) haven't bothered with RK because you have neither the skills nor the actions for it, like living and most certainly don't like being weirdly forced into the mentor archetype? Teacher of Heroes is out. You aren't a sneaky character? Thief in Moonlight is not for you. This excludes so many character concepts it's just disappointing.
Just because I hate its theme the least and the mechanics are pretty awesome, I'll pick thief. If I were actually playing this character, this part would 100% be reflavored into something else.

Feats

Going into feats with any depth here would make this already too long wall of text unbearably long even for me, so I'm skipping that. I'm just gonna say that it is really slim pickings especially at early levels. Either because you only have one choice due to your weapon type (e.g. 4th level) or because there is only 1 actually attractive feat at that level (Thorns of Mortality at level 2 for me).

My "Normal" Round
This would actually be very straightforward when you look at how complicated this class seems at first look.
During my turn, I'll move to a priority enemy and use one of my Transcend abilities, probably Mirrored Spirit Strike, to deal some good damage while I have my weapon ikon active. Because if I don't have it active, my damage will be pretty unimpressive. I pity the people going DEX in melee already, they'll do absolutely nothing. To compensate for the fact that I can't do this every round and my class doesn't offer any 1-action offense alternatives (which I hope changes with the release) I'd definitely go pilfer something off the Fighter or something. The Palisade Bangles have a chance to alleviate this so I can go Embrace of Destiny into Mirrored Spirit Strike (which is the intent I think), but that assumes an enemy is within 30 feet and they fail their save (which is often unlikely).
Once my weapon ikon is spent, the spark goes to whatever defense ikon is best depending on what situation I find myself in. Palisade Bangles have a much higher priority due to the aforementioned combo. When I have taken a bit of a beating, Survivor will keep me in the fight on my off-turns. Feats don't really change anything about this dynamic before possibly level 8 with Additional Ikon. That'd let me cycle my offense, but I'm not sure how to feel about Barrow's Edge, so that's a hard "maybe". But yeah, I wish feats did more here.

How about you?

This is one of the things where I think SF2 and PF2 will differ the most at first glance. Ranged weapons most of all. Overall, it is way too early to draw any definitive conclusions, but it is fun to speculate and think. For example, I'd like on-hit damage for ranged weapons to be higher than in PF2. Because when we follow the same health curve and ranged combat is the norm, then with the PF2 paradigm fights are probably going to go on longer, as your overall damage is lower.

What we have seen so far is pretty tame but also treads new ground. I'm only focusing on the martial weapons for now, because that's your primary lineup.

The rotolaser is a two-handed weapon with d8 F for 10 shots/2 uses of Automatic Fire per reload. Low ammo, low-ish damage. Effective range is a 15/20ft cone for "normal" operation with the Soldier, which is basically nothing. Even regular Strike range is only 30/40, which is still poor. Sure, you can also Strike with it, but the Soldier's Stikes are anemic at best and you don't have the ammo for it, especially after using your usual area attack skill (as it is an attack). Overall, this weapon is pretty bad no matter how you look at it. I'd say this is below what we should expect as the norm.

The stellar cannon is still 2-handed, but has better damage at d10 with a better damage type (piercing), which is amplified by being aoe damage (that +1 average damage per damage die comes in multiple times). Much, much better range and area at a 10ft burst in 50/60ft. Projectile/Usage is weird as it basically has 4 uses per reload, so making it 4/1 would be easier. But still, double the ammo as far as the Soldier is concerned. Sure, unwieldy and an area fire weapon, but the former really doesn't seem to matter for the Soldier (which is good) and the latter isn't a big deal for the Soldier either. Basically, if Primary Target ignores both, then this weapon is essentially an objective upgrade over the rotolaser. When taken on it's own in the context of the Soldier class, this sounds like a very powerful weapon and something I'd like to see more of.

Whatever weapon the Operative in the recent blog post was using had an identical crit damage profile to the PF2 arquebus. Add unwieldy (probably) and a decent mag size instead of 1 shot/reload (presumably) and I think that looks decent. Well, as long as your single big "pot of damage" is big enough, so we avoid the Gunslinger problem.

All in all, I think we are mostly headed in the right direction, but things except the stellar cannon could use a little more spice!

I just wanted to say that I really appreciate the insight the little sidebars in the Field Test offer. Knowing the reasoning makes understanding certain decisions much easier and also allows us to take a closer look at stuff the team is worried about.

Please keep them coming in future tests ^^

My only real wish is for the Magus to have a good reason to invest into INT. It is already the least valuable stat in the game by a fair margin and with cantrips losing the modifier, there is even less reason to have it now. And by "having a good reason", I don't mean making it mandatory, the class is already MAD as hell. I want it to have a real, tangible benefit.

Given that SOM is losing several full pages due to the elimination of spell schools, I think there is some space to add something cool that's not combat related. The combat part of the class is already great.

[Let's not crowd the compilation thread anymore (sorry ^^)]

Before Paizocon, I was impressed that the devs managed such a large project without disrupting their already bursting schedule. Now that we have more details on the true extent of the changes, all I can say is hot damn. I don't think anyone was expecting this much and we haven't even seen everything - the athletics changes, skill/general feat changes, and skill action changes still lack details, just to name a few. I hope you are at least getting some sleep!

As far as the actual content is concerned, the main idea seems to be pruning everything they can that doesn't really do enough or is purely legacy (spell schools, open trait, bespoke weapon lists, ...etc.) or too connected to the OGL. The overlap is considerable. This is something I'm all for. If something has no good reason to exist, it shouldn't. Similarly, if things are too similar, maybe they shouldn't be separate things - light and dancing lights coming to mind.

Overall, it looks like 2E will come out of this essentially the same, but with some snazzy new outfits and a new haircut. In my eyes, the promise of "this isn't a new edition" has been fulfilled as much as they possibly could. I really appreciate that they didn't just change a couple of names and called it a day, but went a bit deeper and added many QoL improvements as well. Even something as small as renaming "flat-footed" to "off guard" in an effort to make the condition more intuitive is just so neat.

So, what is your overall impression of the announced Remaster changes?

How It's Played's interview with Michael Sayre just dropped and in it we got a teaser for how the "new" damage types will work. As a twist, holy and unholy are not damage types, they are "traits that can apply to certain types of damage". More is to follow at the panel at PaizoCon.

Sayre you tease XD

As some of you may know, this class is very near and dear to my heart and I like to write absurdly long texts ^^. Naturally, I have some opinions, because I want this class to be as enjoyable and good as can be. While a lot of this might sound harsh, I have a lot of respect and admiration for the people who made this content. Comments I have seen on other sites that claim their work to be bad or shoddy are simply wrong, imo, and that is not the message I want to send with this.

The developers and quite a few of you also know a lot more about the intricacies of the game than I do - especially the mathematics part ;) - so I wouldn't mind some feedback for my feedback :D. Some more design insights would be awesome *hint* *hint* ;)!

For some background, I've played several snipers and one pistolero so far, one of those snipers for quite a while (6 months or so?). After having seen it in action, I want to play a vanguard next. I'll never play a drifter (not a fantasy I'm into & too weak mechanically) or triggerbrand (not my fantasy and I dislike combination weapons). I would consider playing a spellshot as long as I don't even have to think about that awful dedication - jay for understanding GMs!

The Class

To establish the basis for my arguments, let's start with the class itself. As a ranged character, your main job will always be offence, mainly damage (dead is the best condition after controlled ^^), but also crowd control and debuffs. The gunslinger is notoriously outclassed in this regard by their main competitors, the ranged fighter and ranger. This is a view I share. Not to the extent that "the gunslinger is a support class", but still. I would also like to add that "but Fake Out!" (the feat everyone talks about) is not a sufficient argument to justify that discrepancy, as I have seen some people attempt to do. Fake Out is awesome, but not that awesome.

The class is also viewed as quite inflexible with their action economy, to the point of being very repetitive. Once again, this is largely true, though in this case I also have to add the part that people tend to forget here - in practice the same is true for the competition, though for them it is a choice. If anything, the most praiseworthy thing about the gunslinger is that with a few levels under your belt and the right feats, you actually can do interesting things at range and not just Strike a million times every turn. The Way of the Vanguard is leading the way - as it should :D - by having that capability from the very start, even if the "range" part suffers a bit. There is still room for improvement, though, especially in how long it takes to get to this point. For example, the sniper doesn't feel like it really comes online until level 6 and only really gets going at level 9 when you actually have some options. A ranger or fighter feel done with their core build by level 4 - or level 1 in case of the Flurry Ranger.

The third part people will criticize is the "feast or famine" playstyle not being fun or rewarding. No matter if your weapon has fatal or not, the very nature of reload weapons is that you have to crit to even try to keep up. Evaluating this is much more subjective and is strongly connected to the lacking offence of the class. This is rather unavoidable due to the gunslinger leaning very much into the "all of your eggs in one basket" approach like the investigator or swashbuckler, so "fixing" this is not really possible. Dealing with the lacking offence in some form would greatly help here.

A special mention goes to misfire. In my opinion the "misfire on Strike failure" mechanic is used much, much too liberally. Such a huge risk should be accompanied by similarly substantial rewards, which is rarely the case. In the case of Risky Reload - all fine and dandy, because it is a very powerful effect. Alchemical Shot? Questionable, but ok. Scatter Blast? What? Chip damage in a moderate radius for functionally 3 actions is not very powerful even without misfire. It doesn't even trigger weaknesses on practically anything besides swarms. Smoke Curtain - while weak - takes a much more correctly measured approach by only causing misfire on critical failure in turn for a moderately useful effect.

The Weapons

I personally consider all non-repeating reload weapons to be underpowered, really without exception. Concussive is very helpful at lower levels (skeletons say hello!), the slight damage advantage is neat and the additional range beyond 60ft functionally doesn't matter. However, reload 1 alone is a massive burden on your playstyle, action economy and consequently your offensive output (not just damage). And, with all due respect, I do not feel Paizo have taken that into account nearly as much as they should have, particularly when it comes to classes that are not the gunslinger. I also do not expect this to substantially change in 2e, so my focus will be on class mechanics, rather than changing the weapons.

One thing I will say, though, why are there no permanent "silencer" modifications? Is it for lore reasons? The noise guns produce is clearly not factored into the balance and the shobad longrifle reinforces that, with the caveat of being an AP product. This is the main reason why I often will decide against using a gun. Yes, combat is loud, but one shot from my weapon and now all of China knows we are here, making any kind of infiltration or subtlety nearly impossible if you have a gunslinger along. Come on. Please :(

---

What would I like to see?

The damage situation should be eased up a little bit, but only enough to narrow the rift to a gap. As much as I loathe the common "Hunted Shot + Strike + 3rd action" gameplan, making something that is just as good while also having access to cool support feats isn't a fair solution. That said, any good and concrete answer to this requires much more knowledge of mathematics than I have, so I will leave this topic to someone more qualified.

Instead, I want to talk about way of making the gunslinger more interesting to play, apart from having more feats to choose from ofc. The sniper isn't the only one who should be able to aim their gun, just saying ;)

Variable action feats and "metamagic"
The thing the gunslinger needs most is some more flexibility without paying several higher level feats for it. The first idea I would milk for this is variable action spells, which is rarely translated to feats. You'll only get one good shot per round anyway, so might as well have the ability to make it count as much as you want. Three-action variants should probably include a reload possibility (not necessarily guaranteed).

Hitting a similar vein are "metamagic" feats, i.e. ones that give actions that modify your next Strike like Fulminating Shot. Ideally something that isn't just damage. Compared to activities, these have the option of being used for that big moment in combination with said activities.

More straightforward Ways
The gunslinger lacks a regular "gunner" Way that just uses it's weapon with no fancy melee-centric abilities or the "find cover or don't have a subclass" minigame of the pre-12/15 sniper. I'm personally in the market for something more interesting (I like that particular minigame), but from what I read the "vanilla" feel is the thing quite a few people actually want.

Also, alchemy Way when? There are arguably more feats for it than any other Way, but it sadly doesn't exist D:

My opinion on the Pistolero hasn't changed since the playtest - it should be split into a one-gun and a dual-wield Way. Currently, it doesn't support either, really, but tries for a weird split. It does nothing for the highly offence of a one-gun build and it does nothing to smooth the truly repetitive jankiness that is two-gun builds. Pistol Twirl does more for the former than anything else. I also just really hate Pistolero's Retort. It is one of the most situational class features in the game and interferes with both playstyles that would use the Way.

Low-level active Way features
Until level 9, most Ways have clear differences, but the features only feel like they compensate for the awfulness that is reload. They really lack an active component you get very early on, like level 3 or so. Having a Strike-related active component here would be great to alleviate the "you do the exact same thing every turn" problem I've always experienced. I would like something that is not just a Strike replacement like Snagging Strike, which wouldn't solve anything, but something limited by some kind of resource that you can throw out occasionally. I hear focus points are still available, though that is probably more of a feat thing like on the ranger ^^.

Integrate special ammunition more
These are close to the "metamagic" options I talked about earlier, but they take your entire turn to use and block practically all your actual fun abilities for that same reason. A Reload + Activate an Item (ammo only) feat or Way feature would be rather boring, but it would do the trick. Before anyone yells "OP", this is literally just restoring functionality that bows already have.

Stances
I'm sure something interesting can be done with this.

Reload Feats are incredibly overpriced
This is more about classes other than the gunslinger. If you have to pay at least a 4th level feat for basic functionality and could just use a bow and be arguably just as good, that is a problem. Running Reload is really a 1st level feat that should be widely available, just saying ^^. As long as this is a thing, using reload weapons on other classes will always leave a bad taste in your mouth. Yes, I've said that plenty of times and yes, that is a hill I will die on :D.

Thus endeth the wall of text! I'm looking forward to your suggestions. I'd like to focus on fun improvements as much as possible, as I think the "gunslinger deals no damage" or "reload weapons are bad" part of the discussion really doesn't need more fuel than absolutely necessary, at least as far as the gunslinger is concerned. They were just necessary to explain my view on things.

This is my opinion piece (read: thesis XD) on the investigator class, based mostly on the experiences of myself and people from my table in various one-shots and parts of our campaign (Curse of the Crimson Throne). As such, everything I say is to be taken with an appropriate amount of salt. Maybe not the last part, that one is salty enough

The Praise

To start, I want to highlight the good parts, because this class does a lot of things right. Most importantly, the core mechanics of Pursue a Lead, Clue In and Devise a Stratagem (DaS) do an awesome job of combining flavour with fitting mechanics. An investigator feels and plays exactly like it should - you are investigating a mystery and are methodical, even in combat. Not just a brute with a sharp stick, but someone who thinks 3 steps ahead of everyone else.

Secondly, the Methodologies do a very good job of adding a special bend to your character, allowing even such a comparatively narrow field to have individual flavours. In addition, a Forensic Medicine Investigator (especially with the medic archetype) really relaxes the healing situation in difficult fights, leading to fewer “heal bot” situations.

Thirdly, there are quite a few feats that encourage and reward teamplay very well. Special mentions go to Shared Stratagem and its awesome upgrade, Didactic Strike.

Fourthly, for the most part, feats that can be very disruptive in play or can break an adventure are properly gated behind the rarity wall. That's Odd is a notable exception.

The Disruptive

Sadly, while I really want to like this class, it suffers from many problems, one of which is that it can often be very disruptive to play or at least dictate the pace in an uncomfortable manner. The main source of that is not the gated feats, but rather the internal "cooldowns" of your basic class features Pursue a Lead and Clue In, as well as the minute that Pursue a Lead takes to activate. The "let's wait for the cooldown" or “gimme a minute” situations happened far too often in my experience.
Clue In - We are investigating the study of someone who we suspect to be a baddie. I Clue In someone to help the check, it still fails. We have a bit of time, so we wait to try a different method with the bonus. Eventually, you realise that the whole feature fairly quickly becomes more like “worse Aid” in most situations.
Pursue a Lead – The natural drive of any player will be to use this as often as possible to get DaS for free. But only being able to do so every 10 minutes and having to take 1 minute to investigate after finding something can massively slow things down. This only really matters in situations where you are really in a hurry or after a trivial fight, so mileage may vary. Still, especially in APs the latter happens rather frequently, causing annoyance for everyone involved.

The Murky

Next, some things necessarily have to be very GM-dependant, but Pursue a Lead’s combat effectiveness can change drastically with the GM. It’s about this part here:
“This subject is typically a single creature, item, or small location (such as a room or corridor), but the GM might allow a different scope for your investigation.“
If you as the GM interpret this conservatively, they’ll only ever get free DaS on a single creature per encounter, if any. If you don’t and say that “small location” also means “the creatures in that small location” or completely rely on the last part of that sentence, that number can go up by a lot.
I’ve seen and heard too much discussion about this for it not to be a concern.

The Bad

- “Unique” Class Features –
The first topic I want to talk about here is unique class features after level 1. Most classes already get a lot of cool and unique stuff just from their features as they level up. The investigator gets the really good stuff at level 1 and then that’s that. Sure, you get quite a decent haul of proficiency upgrades and skill feats/increases, but that’s really it.
You know who also gets a comparable, less limited set? The rogue. The more limited nature doesn’t really bother me, but you know what does? Looking at Keen Recollection and Deductive Improvisation and then comparing that to Debilitating Strike and Deny Advantage. Keen Recollection is a worse version of Untrained Improvisation, a level 3 general feat (or level 5 human ancestry feat) that is borderline useless for the Investigator. Even at level 1, the average investigator will be trained in at least 11 out of the 16 skills. Even should it come up and for some reason you are the only one in the party who has any chance, your chances aren’t good. They also get really bad as DCs continue to increase. This feature has a shelf life! Deductive Improvisation isn’t much better. If you don’t have the necessary proficiency, chances are very high that you’ll not succeed the check either. Sure, it gives you a chance, but all it really does is slightly mitigate poor party planning, mostly for Thievery. For us, this has literally never come up. Meanwhile, Deny Advantage often seriously saves your bacon and Debilitating Strike is an amazing combat feature. Let’s not even think about Double Debilitations at 15.
At level 19, it gets even worse. The Rogue’s Master Strike isn’t the greatest thing in the world, mostly a very good anti-mook weapon. But it is leagues ahead of “you get your hand held by the GM” aka Master Detective. Not only is it incredibly anti-climactic after the first few times it triggers, but it is also a pain for the GM, because it erodes the main part purpose of any mystery – being mysterious. It can work well, but more often than not the GM just has to work harder to conceal the clue, so that the investigator actually has something to investigate for more than 5 seconds.
So yeah, the investigator really needs some class features that actually make him better over the course of his career.

- Combat Performance and Niche –
The big one people often complain about and I’m no different, as that’s the reason why I stopped enjoying playing my investigator. This part has been discussed to death, so what it boils down to is this: in combat, you are just a worse rogue or (by now) thaumaturge. Outside of combat, you are not useful enough to compensate that fact.
I really like the idea of DaS, but even with the formerly mentioned generous interpretation of Pursue a Lead, almost any other martial who is even halfway competent will pull ahead of you if you do not specifically spec into Eldritch Archer. If you don’t have such a generous GM, even that isn’t an option against most enemies. The fact that the investigator also has very few feats that directly improve combat performance like other martials isn’t helping that fact.
I don’t like feeling like I’m not pulling my weight and that is definitely the case here.
-
All in all, I really want to like and play this class, but I just can’t get over all the problems. That said, I hope there are many people out there that do not share this issue and have fun with their character

I'm just making a new thread, simply because I couldn't find the main APG errata thread for some reason. I'm probably just blind, so please tell me if you could find it ^^.

Anyway, I was checking out the poisoner archetype and noticed that the dedication is literally just a worse alchemist dedication. I doubt that is supposed to be the case.

What both have in common:
- basic alchemy benefits (infused reagents feature, advanced alchemy, Alchemical Crafting skill feat)
- reagents equal to your level
- advanced alchemy level 1 with no automatic increase

The poisoner dedication gives no further benefits, but instead limits what you can make to only poisons. You also need to be trained in Crafting to take it.

The alchemist dedication has somewhat more demanding requirements, as you need to have 14 INT. However, it also provides a lot more:
- 4 additional formulas
- trained in Crafting & bombs
- trained in class DC
- no limit to type of alchemical items you can produce (not technically an additional benefit, but should be mentioned for contrast)

So yeah, that's kinda unfair in my opinion.

Just some stuff I picked up from various sources and from my own playing/theorycrafting. I thought it'd be cool to share them, just in case they might help others. If you've got something similar, please share as well ^^

The most basic things is that you can have a free hand when using a two-handed gun/xbow, at least temporarily. When you have discharged your weapon, you can Release one hand for free, so you now have a free hand to do things with. Then, Interact to Reload (or use another Reload action like your Slinger's Reload), which in addition to everything else, allows you to put your second hand back onto the weapon for free. Bam, limited free hand usability for no extra cost.

Second, if you don't like the crit-centric playstyle of most guns, the taw launcher is your best friend. It combines a strong d10 damage die, having whatever damage type you want and the huge crits into one, nice package. You can grab it at level 1 as a human with Unconventional Weaponry or just at level 6 with a class feat.

Third, the boomslinger. There was a thread recently that made me aware of this, but I can't find it anymore. Basically, take Munitions Crafter at level 1 and Quick Draw at level 2. Shoot, throw Bottled Lightning to make a guy flat-footed to your entire team and deal some damage, Reload. Not necessarily in that order, Pistolero and Sniper should probably Reload second to get the benefit of that for their bomb throw. At level 6, Munitions Machinist is recommended for better bombs, but it is not strictly necessary. Alchemist Goggles are your friend in any case, though. This can be combined with the first tip to still wield a two-handed weapon.

Fourth, how to shoot a lot without spending actions to reload every single time. Easy, get a Gunner's Bandolier and treat it like your primary weapon. 4 dueling pistols are a significant investment early on, but it will pay off. This is where the cheese feat, Risky Reload comes in. Shoot, Risky Reload (Reload+Shoot) and then regular reload. If you gun misfires, who cares, Release and use the Bandolier's active ability to grab the next one for the same action cost as reloading it would cost. A reliable two shot attempts per round without breaking the bank.

The last one is a variant of the previous one, though it requires your group to play with the Automatic Bonus Progression variant rule. Otherwise, you simply won't have the money. Get at least two dueling pistols, preferably three. Get Risky Reload as normal and use it the same way, but at level 4 you pick up Instant Backup. Works as the previous one, but you also skip the extra action cost of drawing the next gun.

Distant Grasp Conscious Mind - 10th level deepest psi cantrip dancing blade:

The last entry of the amp mentions the "Push" action. This should obviously be "Shove".

They don't have eyes, they see via magic. Which is why literally any skeleton ever has had darkvision. But PC skeletons only get low-light vision and have no feats that allow them to get darkvision.

Was that an oversight or is it a balancing thing?

So yeah, to avoid crowding the Dark Archive PC thread, have this one.

For anyone who hasn't seen it, here is the reddit writeup of the KnowDirection preview. Give the person who went through this effort some love ^^.

Anyway, regarding some stuff from the original thread:

I know this is more of a PC concept thread, but just wanted to say that getting details on how unleash psyche works has me very excited for the class. Cantrip damage (really psychic damage in general) in the playtest was very low given how it was touted as a... Not exactly at will blasting class but definitely a class with a focus on cantrips and focus spells as their main tools.

Tracking bonuses and penalties round by round is a lot more exciting to me than having daily limits on things as well. I do worry that maybe stupefied is too debilitating a condition for when unleash psyche ends (way too many times I have failed DC 5 flat checks) but overall I still like it a lot.

The only thing that has me kinda bummed is Tangible Dream's cantrip stuff, they're not really my cup of tea. Everything else so far has me very much excited as well!

It certainly continues to look like something that goes a a ways away from the more traditional (aka "boring" form me) caster playstyle and role, which I find pretty interesting. Slots are much more like "use in case of emergency" than your main bread and butter.

Regarding Stupefied, it depends on how powerful the rest of the kit is and how well you can compensate with non-spell actions. Given that you can do some cantrip stuff during that time it doesn't hurt as much, but it will be pretty brutal. Definitely not the time for spell slots, though ^^. That said, a good deal of combats are only 3 rounds long, at my table at least, so it will probably happen somewhat infrequently anyway. I just hope it's just stupefied 1 like they said in the video not 2 (which I have seen from some people), that would be a bit overkill.

G&G has been out for a while, but with a new adventure ahead for my group, I put some more though into the gunslinger. So my GM and I came up with a roughly workable design.

The basis is still the dueling pistol with repeating added, as "recommended" by the book. Then we cut the range increments down to 30ft and changed the handedness to 1+, meaning you need two hands to fire the weapon. The latter was to avoid dual-wielding, especially cheesing with Paired Shots in particular.

It is still not 100% in line with existing weapons, but much more reasonable, we think. If you wanted to really balance it, you should also make it advanced. We just honestly didn't care at that point, sorry XD

On a more out-there note, we also agreed that the gun could be single-loaded like a regular weapon, in addition to via the "magazine" of the repeating trait. It just feels good and right. If you want to properly balance it, you probably shouldn't do that either :D

If all else fails, the Rowan Rifle likely shows that you could probably also do this at a higher level as a specific magic item.

I hope this helps someone who also wants to play a gunslinger with such an iconic weapon ^^.

I really appreciate the way 2e balances things overall and between similar options. There will always be some options that are weaker and some that are stronger and that isn't a problem. But there are quite a few feats that are essentially a duplicate of another, but worse or at a higher level or both. And that is just plain unfair.

Some examples:

(1) Felling Strike (fighter 8) vs Felling Shot (rogue 12)

Felling Shot only works on ranged/thrown weapons instead of literally all weapons and unarmed attacks. Felling Shot also requires the target to be flat-footed, then for the Strike to hit and then a save on top. Felling Strike just requires a hit. Both do the exact same things in the end. Felling Shot is just straight up a worse version of Felling Strike, but 4 levels higher.

(2) Archer's Aim (archer archetype 8) vs Incredible Aim (fighter 8)

This example is pretty debatable, but still worth looking at. Archer's Aim, in addition to everything that Incredible Aim does, also reduces the flat-check for hidden creatures from 11 to 5. The reason this is a debatable example is the fact that Archer's Aim only works with bows. I'd still say this is an example of an archetype being a better version of a class feat of the same level, which is not how this system is supposed to work.

(3) Visual Fidelity (Inventor 6) vs Deadeye (Gunslinger 12)

Probably the most unfair example of them all, of those I have found at least. Deadeye, for an action, allows you to see invisible creatures and objects for a round, but they are still concealed. Visual Fidelity also makes invisible things merely concealed. But it is on permanently, with no activation cost. It also grants low-light- and darkvision. And as if that wasn't enough, it also helps you against blind effects. And the level difference is just... yeah.

In this case there is something to be said for different class specialisations (such as self-augmentation for the inventor) and how seeing invisible thing with the naked eye (instead of mechanical help) is obviously high level stuff. But the differences are so massive that such explanations are no longer sufficient.

---

It would be really cool if stuff like this would receive another balance pass ^^

The book obviously doesn't have infinite space and we still got a quite well-rounded bunch of content, but there are a couple of things I'm missing. The Alkenstar AP will probably have a bunch of stuff and the LO Impossible Lands another, but that's still a ways off.

Here is some stuff I want and will probably homebrew for now:

- an extradimensional holster that allows you to stow bigger firearms and a bunch of ammo; bonus points if it also has a neat activation effect
- a reload feat that combines activate an item (ammunition only) and an Interact to reload to make using special ammunition more feasible (especially with two-action-activities)
- a proper magical suppressor that actually [i]stays on]/i]
- energy-damage firearms that aren't specific weapons
- custom firearms of the Inner Sea Region (Chelish devil guns, anyone?)

So what else would you want? Remember, only G&G-themed stuff, so no modern or Numeria equipment.

The Rowan Rifle in particular has really inspired me, because boy is that thing cool. But true star guns are an Arcadian thing and that is fine. What I am really interested in is the Inner Sea Region's answer to these old technologies and the new developments in firearms from down south. Magic obviously limits the impact firearms technology will have on combat and war, but it is still a potent technology. No country will ever willingly rely on a foreign power to supply it with something like that, if they have any choice in the matter. Currently they simply don't have the technology, so it would make sense for them to seek an alternative. Not in huge quantities, since bows, crossbows and similar technologies are actually comparable in effectiveness, but still.

We already know that combination weapons are an answer to the limited supply of gunpowder, but why wouldn't they also apply magic to the problem? Because that is one avenue of approach that Alkenstar and Dongun Hold cannot use effectively. The pure existence of damage runes and weapons like Flame Tongue imply that this is perfectly possible and not even a stretch from existing technology. And of course, we can't forget spells like fire ray and telekinetic projectile.

So, from a lore perspective, I would expect the first-rate powers of the Inner Sea at the very least are already trying to come up with a solution, if they haven't already. A more traditional magi-tech solution compared to the bio-magical hybrid beast guns of Arcadia. You could have fun things like Cheliax being up to some Dark-Mechanicus-esk shenanigans with binding devils to weapons to make them more powerful.

---

What is the mechanical specifics I'm looking for? Here is a rough example. Note that while it is somewhat similar to the base weapon of some beast guns, it is not supposed to be a specific weapon.

Energy Rod
Usage held in 2 hands Bulk 2

The energy rod is a martial firearm with a range increment of 90 feet. It deals 1d8 fire damage and has the modular C (cold damage) and fatal d12 traits. It resembles a particularly long and thin crossbow or a musket, but instead of a barrel or flight groove it features a long, thin rod reminiscent of a wand or staff. This weapon can be manufactured in any combination of energy damage types, but never more than two and the user can switch between them by rotating the firing chamber into the second position (or back - imagine a really early revolving design). Ammunition is inserted into the firing chamber as if it were a regular firearm, though it uses alchemical energy cartridges based on alchemical bombs rather than gunpowder, which are fully consumed to provide the weapon with enough energy to fire.

Now that we have a good selection of these, how do we feel about this system?

I'm personally rather split, tending towards a negative response. A lot of them are cool and inherently tell a story, but the majority of them are just as frustratingly impotent. Not everything is an Oathbow, where with a minor increase in price at worst, you can build an objectively better weapon from your existing one by just filling the rune slots. There are a couple Holy Avengers, Celestial Armours, Flame Tongues and Rowan Rifles out there, though not many.

My other gripe is their inherently limited lifespan (unless they are like level 17+), because their effects and most importantly their DCs don't scale, meaning within about 4 levels at best, you are basically required to take the cool ancient sword you found not too long ago, which has served you well until now, and sell it to the next merchant. It makes a lot of sense that they work this way, I just don't like it.

Maybe I just care about optimization a bit too much? Thoughts?

Since we don't have one of these yet, I thought I'd start.

The Spiral Rapier seems to lack the deadly trait or is in the wrong category. As-is it loses deadly d8 for parry, but becomes an advanced weapon in the process, which seems extremely odd.

I have rarely seen such a beautiful union of mechanics, flavour, memes and guaranteed roleplay impact of pretty much everything you do. Bravo.

All of the other ways are so damn cool, but in comparison Way of the Pistolero still has pretty much all the old problems from the playtest. It is not unplayable or anything, it just seems really ... meh. Ten Paces and Grim Swagger are both awesome, no question, but they are fairly alone in that regard.

(1) Raconteur's Reload

The only Slinger's Reload that becomes essentially useless against an enemy after you use it. Given the number of times you will need to reload against an enemy is considerable, that really hurts. Demoralize literally doesn't do anything after the first try and against repeated Create a Diversion enemies get a +4 bonus. At least the latter can be improved with feats (Lengthy Diversion and Confabulator).

(2) Pistolero's Retort

Still an extremely situational reaction and you get it baked in. This type of reaction is great for a melee weapon and would be for a bow, but the need to have a loaded weapon really hurts your chances. If this would include are reload beforehand or you could draw your backup pistol for it, then sure. But as it stands, you are unlikely to see it more than once per book even if that book actually features significant numbers of ranged enemies.

(3) Pistolero's Challenge + Come at Me!

You, a squishy ranged character, paint a big target on your back for an at best modest amount of additional damage per attack on a class that makes few attacks. And it requires a check with the additional obstacle of the linguistic trait. And, of course, the enemy gets the same bonuses! Just that they likely have the same or higher attack modifier and make more attacks than you. At least it lasts until the end of combat and is really cool flavour-wise, so there is that.

At level 14 (!), you get Come At Me!, which allows you do do that to as many people as you like... for one action each as normal. Just that Pistolero's Challenge has the flourish trait, so beyond doing it before combat, it is basically pointless. Because as a GM, in most cases I would say that insulting the enemy triggers initiative and the last thing you need is more enemies coming for your squishy butt.

So a feat that, with how enemy health scales, does very little for you past level 10 and an upgrade that only really allows you to force your GM to focus you. Hard pass, I'd rather take something like Pistol Twirl + Showstopper and spend an action each round that actually has a perceptible impact.

(4) No clear incentive to use one-handed firearms

Unlike all other ways and the usual one-handed builds, you actually have no real reason to use the weapons it is primarily intended for. The only thing you really lose is the free draw form Ten Paces, but you likely have your weapon out anyway, so that isn't a huge loss. You technically also lose Pistolero's Retort and your way-exclusive feats, but I've already explained why I don't think that that is significant. The rest of Ten Paces, which is the important part, your Slinger's reload and Grim Swagger (it only needs to be worn) are perfectly usable without ever using a one handed weapon.

There is the argument to be made that it allows you to do stuff with your free hand, but since reload allows you to put your hand on the weapon anyway, so that is way less of an issue.

I like Unleash Psyche, or at least the idea and mechanical possibilities it offers. But I feel like the binary on/off dynamic it has going on could be made more interesting. I had a literal shower thought - what about a 3 stage mechanic?

Dormant stage: Your psyche is stable and protected. It only provides a very minor benefit (e.g. Autonomic Telekinesis for distant grasp) and has no drawback.

Awakening stage: Your psyche strains against its confines, granting you power, but also making you vulnerable to others interfering with your casting. You enter this stage when you roll initiative or if you choose to in a comparably stressful non-combat situation.
Moderate benefits. Minor-ish drawback - you could actually tie the downsides of your subconscious mind to this, as the barrier between your subconscious and the outside world thins. For Precise Discipline, at this Stage you are flat-footed against reactions during Cast a Spell, but aren't stupefied when disrupted.

Unleashed stage: You have mostly eroded the barrier between your mind and the world. You are employing the full extent of your power, but you are more susceptible to outside influences. Activated the same way and with the same requirements as it is now.
Major benefits. Major drawbacks plus the full drawbacks from you subconscious mind.

3 also has the advantage of being an important magical/occult number, just saying :)

After playing 2e pretty much since release, I can't believe I'm just now noticing this. Without being able to Step at least 10 feet, Feather Step actually doesn't do anything.

You step carefully and quickly. You can Step into difficult terrain.

It only removes the limitation on being able to Step into difficult terrain, it critically doesn't change the movement cost associated with it. And since it costs 10 feet of movement to go into a square of difficult terrain... you need another feat for it to actually do anything.

Now the big question is - is that really intended? My group, every live play I've seen and every discussion I've read seems to have never considered that isn't actually "when you Step, it doesn't matter if the square is difficult terrain". A feat without a feat prerequisite that does noting without another feat also seems really strange.

Thoughts? Errata?

And we just unlocked the power to get stronger by being rich :D

"We will add guidelines for advancing your dragon's power by building a hoard, rather than buying weapons, armor, or skill items."

Just a quick word before we get into this - I usually exclusively play martial characters in 2e, though I have decent knowledge of how to play a full caster. I just don't like being able to run out of the thing you do, even if that isn't a big problem at higher levels. That said, the flavour and non-spell slot parts of the psychic really speak to me - not that I'm saying no to those spell slots, mind you ^^

-

Initial Proficiencies + later weapon/armour progression
Not really anything to talk about here. Squishy caster does squishy caster stuff. No expert in perception is 100% an unintended mistake.

Save progression
Expert reflex (5th) and fortitude (9th). Will master at a somewhat reasonable level (11th) and legendary at 17th, both with the usual upgrades. I really appreciate this class not being totally robbed in this department like many other casters.

-

Psychic Spellcasting and Spell Repertoire
Most of this is standard spontaneous caster stuff. Just like a sorcerer you can replace material with somatic components, but the replaced components look different. No actual mechanical change, but nice flavour.

The two big ticket items here are the max 2 spells per spell level and the accordingly massively reduced number of spells known. So, realistically, at the end of the day the rest of the class has to make up for 18 spell slots and 18 fewer spells known right out of the gate. That's a tall order, even though it only has to do so gradually until level 18 - the others don't get all those spell slots and spell immediately after all.

Subconscious Mind
The feature that determines our key ability and what we do about those pesky verbal components with cool flavour. That you can replace material components with somatic ones is repeated for no reason (that should be fixed).

Verbal component substitution is weird or at least phrased in a way that is easily misunderstood.

The only audible parts of Cast a Spell is the verbal component, and after you have finished casting, the spell manifestation. Lightning bolts are kinda loud. The part "Your spells still have clear and noticeable visual and auditory manifestations as normal for a spellcaster." in your spellcasting feature can easily be misunderstood as saying "while you cast a spell there is all sorts of noise going on". That in actual fact your Cast a Spell is completely silent before the actual spell manifestation should be explicitly stated.

But what are the actual effect of what replacing your verbal component accomplishes? Both emotion and calculation components still add the concentrate trait, so that doesn't change. Your spells still have the usual clear and visible signs of spellcasting, so it does little to nothing for stealthy casting. There are some situations where I can see this making a difference - e.g. casting on a blind opponent - but it is very, very situational. The other benefit is that you can cast when affected by silence or any other effect that disallows verbal components, but let's be real here - how often does this happen to you? From my experience, basically never unless the source is your own party. And I don't think you abusing the heightened silence spell is the actual goal here.

And then there is the downside as well.
Emotional Acceptance's penalty is pretty significant (cantrips heighten one lower). It also triggers whenever you are under a harmful emotion effect - so most commonly by abilities that apply frightened. Which is way, way too frequently for that significant of a penalty, especially when you get into Frightful Presence territory at higher levels. Good luck with getting out of a 90ft emanation that "ruins" your main casting options for 1-2 rounds at minimum :P. No wonder you get legendary in will saves with that amount of training :D
Precise Discipline is much more modest by comparison, flat-footed to reactions while Casting a Spell and stupefied if disrupted. It's still a significant downside, especially at higher levels where disruption on hit is not exactly uncommon. But I like this one.
The main difference here is that Emotional Acceptance is basically "let's hope I make the will save", i.e. you have basically no control or opportunity to actively mitigate how boned you are. Precise Discipline, in contrast, offers such opportunities, which makes it infinitely more manageable and interesting.

All in all, you get a significant downside for an at best fringe upside. I love the flavour and idea behind it, don't get me wrong. But Emotional Acceptance has a heavy penalty that triggers very frequently and without meaningful options for counter-play. That one just doesn't work at all. The downside for Precise Discipline is absolutely fine, but an omnipresent downside needs an (about) equally omnipresent and significant upside.

Psi Cantrips and Amps
Amps are a thing, you get 2 focus points and get both back from refocus. Neat, necessary and easily understood. Good job. The one thing I would say about this part is that the "you only get 1 if you used something other than an amp" part needlessly complicates things. It should be cut entirely without breaking anything in the slightest.

Concious Mind and some related feats

The class paths now. Everything gives some neat spells like a Bloodline and has great flavour, so far so good. Every path granting 3 things automatically is a good idea as well.

- Distant Grasp -

Mage Hand amp is.... extremely situational and even in that specific situation it provides very little benefit. I certainly can't think of a situation I've played that this would have made a difference in. And something so "expensive" (remember, 18 fewer spell slots) and mandatory can't be this situational. This desperately needs some heightened X with additional/different effects. These could absolutely be situational (if maybe not as situational as the original), but need to provide substantial benefits in those situations.

Telekinetic Projectile amp is semi-decent, if boring, and has the usual attack spell problem. And, you know, crit effects on spell attack rolls.... . This needs to do more at higher levels and on a success.

Enough has been said about Telekinetic Rend. Interesting idea, but useless at heightened +2. It would be pretty spicy at heightened +1 with the same damage, but I can see that working out.

Arrest Trajectory. +1 circumstance bonus (+2 at 13th level) to AC for anyone within 30 ft, but only against physical ranged Strikes. That +1 is really often already redundant due to cover. Also, hello Reactive Shield in disguise, what are you doing here 7 levels higher? Yeah, Reactive Shield provides a higher bonus, works against melee attacks as well and is a level 1 feat. Maybe the amp pulls this one out of the hole? For the cost of a focus point and an action next turn you can cast a basic telekinetic projectile. Again, cool idea, but this is just a weaker combination of Deflect Arrow & Arrow Snatching. Needs to be better or it isn't worth the feat slot.

Autonomic Telekinesis. Am I missing something here? This is one of the weaker 5th level ancestry feats... as a 10th level class feat. If it had a significantly higher range and fewer limitations, it would be really, really cool. I hope something gets done with this, because this has a lot of potential. As it stands, this feat is 9 levels higher than it deserves.

- Infinite Eye -

Detect Magic amp. Now this is more like it. Good bonuses, great flavour and scales like it should. I would like to point out, though, that currently you can just activate this and get the bonuses by not ignoring your own items/magic or that of your allies. I doubt this is intended.

Guidance amp. Pretty damn nice, there are a lot of saves you really don't want to critically fail. But I would still like to see some "heightened X" options here as well. Not absolutely vital like with a lot of the others, but I would like to see more out of a focus spell once we get to spell level 5+.

Mental Scan. The base cantrip is great. A Seek and an Aid that you can only help with as 1 action. Granted you still need to spend your reaction to actually Aid, but this class isn't exactly heavy on your reaction economy. The amp is just as great, if not even better. This could easily go into the final product as-is, no changes needed.

Future Path. This is the exact opposite. It triggers reactions on the initial casting of the cantrip to provide the benefit of a 2nd level feat - Mobility. Or your could just Step and then Stride to get the same result 90+% of the time. For alternate speeds, who can't Step, Mobility is still waaaay better and honestly less expensive, even with having to pick up the rogue dedication. The amps are in the same category. At 15th (!) level your team is better off with one person spending one, maybe two actions (again, Step is a thing) rather than 3 total.

- Silent Whisper -

Daze amp. I'm sorry, but this is easily the worst of the lot. Daze is already a questionable choice to spend actions on, outside of very specific situations. The additional damage is fairly negligible even at level 1 and things just get worse from there. The only good thing about this is -1 status penalty to will saves. But for that you can get Bon Mot - you have a better chance at success, with much greater effects and it only costs one action. This is literally never worth using.

Message amp. I can easily see this being useful - one action and focus point for your allies' reaction to Stride/Step. And the 4th level one is just really good. Normally I would say the investment is too high - just one action for a reaction is plenty - but with the psychic being able to just use a focus point each round ,this is just fine.

Nudge Intent. This one is pretty good against certain enemies. Specifically spellcasters (choose skill action) and monsters that can't reach your allies from their position. It is too bad that you can't specify what specific action they have to do, though I can see why you can't ^^. Having the massive beastie requesting food with "Request" or thinking real hard on what you are (Recall Knowledge) would be really funny. Still, for two actions, I would like to see a little something more in case the enemy pursues the specified action. There are just too many big melee monsters that really don't care if they trip you first and then stomp you into the ground or the other way around. The amp definitely should be better at later levels as well.

Shatter Mind. Base effect is ok-ish, heightened +2 is really problematic as always. The amp is kinda meh. If you don't fight against masses of enemy spellcasters, this isn't particularly good. The only reason why I would even consider using it is the fact that it only targets enemies and even then it is a though choice. On a side-note, why can you designate a 30 or 60ft cone if it only hits enemies?

Unleash Psyche

I love this. Two rounds of spending focus points and then going ham for 3 rounds at round 3. In my experience the overwhelming majority of fights only last 3 or 4 rounds, so that is plenty.

The "no other focus spells, only psi focus cantrips" restriction once again is unnecessary. I can't see a thematic need for it and if the free amp on any of your psi cantrips isn't enough to make you want to use it, then we have a completely different problem.

There is also the fact that you can only Unleash once per Refocus. That isn't too bad, but is there an actual need for it? Having to wait for a minute like Rage seems to perfectly satisfy the thematic requirements without really screwing the psychic on back-to back encounters. Those aren't too frequent, so it isn't a huge deal, but it is something to think about.

The only part I really disagree with here is the basic Unleash you get, but I made a thread about this already.

-

- TL:DR - (I really understand XD)

I love the flavour and I love the basic mechanics. They just work great, seem fun and are also easily understood/remembered. If the power level was adjusted way up to a proper level (remember this comes at the cost of 18 spell slots and the same number of spells known), then this would easily be a fun class for me. The vast majority of my problems really are just a lack of bigger numbers, which is easily fixed. Though I challenge you to fix daze :P

Just a quick one I noticed while looking over the document. Title says it all, really.

If other people already noticed it and reported it, then sorry for the additional post ^^

This particular one just doesn't work very well for the one baseline Unleash everybody gets, at least not in its current form.

The most significant part is that it is not very good at low levels, least of all at level 1. You have basically no spell slots to use it with, the extra damage is pretty meh and the moment you turn it on you are just asking to die. -2 to AC when you are already 2 behind the curve? Even the giant barbarian is wincing.

At higher levels, basically 9+, this one gets pretty good, as you have pretty massive AOEs at this point. 5d8+10 damage to every enemy in a 15ft burst or 30ft cone with shadow blast? Yummy. But even then the drawback is still too much imo.

Whenever I see the occasional medusa in an AP, I always want to play a less murder-y version of that. And when I looked up medusas on AON today for reasons, it also listed "Stheno" under the results. I remembered reading the name on here somewhere and some people being excited about them, so I read the entry.

And boy howdy, do I want this as an ancestry now. If it doesn't come in Grand Bazaar, then hopefully soon. Though it would be the perfect place for them, since they don't really have a home.

Apart from the really cool backstory of how they came to be and, you know, medusas without all the murder and statues, it also has one of the best abilities I've ever seen - Snake Search. When you Seek or Search, your hair-snakes do the same, but with a penalty. If they find anything, they try really hard to tell you, but they are still little dingus-snakes. So they are not exactly mental champions and may or may not tell you stuff that they think is vitally important, but really isn't. I absolutely love it XD

Really quick oversimplification for people who don't know what I'm talking about: this a system that allows you to use parts of monsters you acquired - whether by violence, diplomacy or other means - to both create and "level up" items. Get the parts, build an item (or use an existing one)and imbue it with power overnight. Next day - boom, your item is now more fancy! This includes essentially the equivalent of fundamental runes, but also things that are more akin to property runes, but more gradual and varied. A little later in here is some more info, if you are interested.

-

My problem with most items in 2e (and several other systems) is that items are kind of... boring? With 2e (and 1e if I deduced that correctly) making them part of the necessary progression path, they are even bordering on something mundane, almost. Most of them simply do not spark my interest or imagination in the way a lot of other things in 2e do. I also do not like that most non-armour/weapon items have a natural expiration date due to the inability to change their inherent DCs or bonuses. It is not a bad system by any means, it just lacks a little something for me.

The new system totally invalidates my second problem and neatly solves my first by creating something that feels absolutely natural to an RPG - roleplaying. But in this case you don't "just" have your character, now you get to RP your equipment as well. There is a world of difference if you bought that +1 sword or carved it out of the ribcage of that big nasty beastie that wanted to destroy your hometown. For me at least.

There is also the added bonus that most encounters feel more meaningful, even if just a bit. Some will hit that spot a lot, like carving your new weapon out of your bane's ribcage. For my GM side, any additional reason for people to care about a given encounter is welcome! For my player side, it helps with immersion, RP and satisfying those old hunter/gatherer instincts :D

All in all, for me this system will breathe much needed flair and wonder into the item section of the game.

Let the speculation begin. Based on the picture, maybe some kind of warlord or military leader? Looking forward to hearing more.

So, a while back in the General Discussion section, we had a talk about the Shifter and how it could translate to 2e.

Here is my idea.

I originally wanted to just create a mock-up or something and it somehow turned into this. It is questionably balanced, so far unfinished (aspects and feats atleast) and probably way too complicated. But is has been a lot of fun to create, even if it will be (hopefully) superfluous by late next year.

Any constructive criticism is welcome!

---
Just to pre-empt some questions:

(1) What's with the damage die sizes on these unarmed attacks?

The problem is that I can't really make them any lower without making this class useless and MC into monk for stances feel mandatory. This class also lacks any inherent damage boost features like sneak attack or panache to compensate for this. I liked the animal barbarian model and removed most traits (or downgraded unarmed attacks with a trait to one die size lower) to compensate for the "rage only" the original has. I would love to add those traits back in, but I haven't found a good way to justify that, yet.

(2) What's your vision for this class?

My version of the shifter is a primarily melee martial class that leans heavily into crowd control, senses, movement types and changing yourself to suit the situation. You have Change Shape to transform into what is basically a constantly evolving monster whenever you feel like it. Adapt is your bread and butter active ability, which allows you to gain an advantage by planning ahead.

Apart from all of that, this is simply a way of "playing the monster". Not in the "I'm evil and everybody's gonna die!" way but in the "I'm a bloody dragon!" way.

It says:

Melee [one-action] jaws (deadly, reach 10 feet), Damage 1d12 piercing;

Maybe I'm missing something here, but this looks like an error.

The issue lies in abilities that apply the stunned condition and can be used with the ready action, which is only flurry of blows with stunning fist and silencing strike, as far as I am aware.

Normally, you would need to be stunned 3 (or 4 when quickened) to lose all actions on your turn. But that is not the case when you are stunned on your turn. The moment the stunned condition is applied to you, you can't act, i.e. you can't use any actions, until you are no longer stunned. Which, due to how the "losing action" system works, is the start of your next turn. So if you get even stunned 1 on your own turn, you effectively lose that turn.

So just ready one of those actions with any trigger like "when I see the enemy do anything", "when they get into range" or something like that. Bam, good hit chance and a very decent chance to remove their entire turn plus any reactions.

I think it is very obvious how abusable this is. This looks like definite errata material.

Considering a certain Bull Man is involved, the fact that he already promised tons of cool lich stuff, this seems like a pretty safe bet. There is also the fact that the phylactery is already an item and that the lich creation rules show a certain modularity that translates quite well.

From how it could work, it would be a perfect fit for a class archetype. At first glance it seems like a wizard-exclusive thing, but here the lich creation rules make it quite clear that that is not the case. It only requires a caster that can cast at least 6th level spells. So it is very attractive in regards to page space efficiency, which seems to be a big thing with class archetypes.
An Urgathoa-created abomination is the first that come to mind for a cleric. A druid could twist the energies of a particularly destroyed piece of land for a "green" lich? An occult lich is just a regular lich but with more tentacles and reeking of fish :D

The thing all but writes itself. Start out as a more or less normal caster with a love for the school of necromancy and a taste for immortality. You advance your studies to the point that you build your phylactery and complete the ritual somewhere in the level 13 region.

A literal shower-thought this time. This is more of a super-fiction trope these days - your Superman, Captain America, Titan or even Thanos (to a certain extent) - but I think it would translate to regular fantasy quite well. Especially given how diverse of a setting Golarion is.

---

The paragon is a class that is as much about doing what you think is right as it is about bringing that vision into reality with the strength of your body. But rather than the unstoppable force of the barbarian or the flowing swiftness of the monk, you are the immovable object. The rock of your party that your foes break themselves against.
Traditionally, this is a fundamentally good character archetype, but I think the idea of "doing what you think is right" is broad enough to fit any lawful alignment under the hat.

Mechanically speaking, this class focuses on defence and athletics actions, combat maneuvers in particular - suplexing a dire-lion and (theoretically) throwing your enemies through walls, that kind of thing. Weapons-wise it is restricted to simple and brawling weapons with a regular martial progression. Maybe with a feat buy-in for the rarer weapon users.
Signature class features would be maneuver-related enhancements to your unarmed attacks and weapons. Weaker passive features that enhance your defences, as well as stronger, but temporary ones. And of course a feature similar to powerful fist.
Feat options mainly related to maneuvers, but with stuff like laser eyes and flying later on.

While the monk, champion and especially the barbarian all come somewhat close to what I have in mind, none of them are conceptually close enough that even a class archetype could fix it, in my opinion.

If your party, like mine, needed a more heavy-hitting but survivable frontliner and you want to play an evil champion? Also, your GM is nice and gives you access to to Free Archetype? Boy do I have a build for you!

This build should be fun to play at every level, but I highly recommend using this for a character starting at level 10 or higher. Also, while not 100% optimized, this is pretty powergamey, so make sure it fits into your game even beyond the problems that inherently come with playing an evil champion.

Stat requirements:

This build requires you to have 14 in Dexterity at level 2, so keep that in mind.

Equipment:

Plate armour and a two-handed weapon. Shields are for lesser combatants whose enemies last more than a blink of an eye. For optimal smashing potential I recommend a d12 two-handed weapon with two damage runes to start.

Class feats:

1 - Iron Repercussions (duh)

2 - Divine Grace (optional)

4 - Aura of Despair

6 - Attack of Opportunity

8 - Rogue Dedication

10 - Radiant Blade Spirit (use the flaming rune effect)

12 - Marshal Dedication

Archetype Feats:

2 - Fighter Dedication

4 - Intimidating Strike (Basic Manouver)

6 - Power Attack (Advanced Manouver)

8 - Mobility (Basic Trickery; optional)

10 - Dread Striker (Advanced Trickery)

12 - Inspiring Marshal Stance

How it works:

This is all the things you need to deal damage like a barbarian, hit like a fighter and still have the great AC of a champion. Everything else, including all other feats - skill, general, class or otherwise - is entirely up to you.

The basic idea is that you get an enemy to frightened 1 via Intimidating Strike (and Demoralize if you build for Intimidation). Now their everything is 1 lower and due to Dread Striker, their AC is 3 lower for you. Then you activate Inspiring Marshal Stance either on turn 1 (if you didn't have to move or use your third action otherwise) or on your second turn. Now you effectively hit at +4 compared to a regular martial character. Proceed to Power Attack or simply Strike until the enemy is done.

For reactions, you have Iron Command for whenever you take damage. If an enemy has the tendency to Stride away, drop prone due to Iron Command or cast spells, you have AoO. Both should pad your damage output nicely and make you an absolute nightmare you cannot get rid of.

Deity recommendation:

I personally really like Dispater as a god, as he is one of the more socially acceptable of the LE gods. His edicts and anathemas work in a way that is both really cool and not unnecessarily disruptive to how your party usually does things. It is a lot more personal. And since you are playing a champion, chances are that you are not particularly subtle about your choice of deity, so having one with a fairly decent reputation for not being a back-stabbing and/or warmongering lunatic is a good idea.

"Longswords can be one-edged or two‑edged swords. Their blades are heavy and they’re between 3 and 4 feet in length." (CRB p. 281)

The description is entirely correct for the modern (and for Germans historical) use of the name. However, the stats and traits do not match that description at all. With a very long and relatively thick blade, such a weapon requires a long(er) handle, which makes it somewhat awkward to wield with only one hand all the time. That is why, historically, these were primarily wielded in two hands. This would also be the case for most small and medium people on Golarion, since most people are relatively normal, by our physical standards.

So the appropriate stats would look more like this: a two-handed d10 weapon with parry, one-handed d8, versatile p and maybe one more low-power trait.

The current stat block of the longsword is more appropriate for a regular one-handed sword. I would call it "Einhänder" (German, literally one-handed sword), which is not exactly great, but at least doesn't have the very specific cultural implications of the arming sword.

The description would be something like this: The einhänder is a sword with a short handle, with a blade typically measuring just over two and a half feet.

I don't know what it is with me and religion in Pathfinder, but it just clicks. Sarenrae, Abadar and Dispater in particular are very interesting to me.

But I feel like I don't really have that enough choices as a Champion. I'm sitting there playing the "shield or no shield" game and that decides like 95% of you feat choices. Unlike, say, the fighter or the rogue, who can go one of what feels like a dozen build paths each. It is not like you cannot play the offensive role even as a non-evil or non-paladin Champion, but it lacks some spice and choice you know?

Anyway, The things I feel the Champion could do with are

1) active options (Power Attack at level 1 and Intimidating Strike at level 2 feel like obvious early feats, especially with Aura of Despair being a thing)

2) more feats that that require blade ally and that don't just add runes (Radiant Blade Master in particular is just reaaaally underwhelming)

3) Divine ally (armor) - could function similar to the blade ally

4) feats that make the steed ally actually worth taking (though this one is extremely low priority, considering how... poorly mounts generally fit into the general gameplay of APs)

So that is my two copper pieces for when we get around to more divine stuff in the (probaly not so near) future.

P.S.: Here is one for the errata - Blade of Justice is missing the "tenets of good" requirement

So, one of my players is playing an Investigator. He is planning on going the good 'ol Archer->Eldritch Archer route with his Free Archetype feats. But that is going to take a while - they are still level 2 - and the combination is not that potent. He insta-killed a skeleton with a crit, but that is about the extent of his combat contribution. To help with that and for my own personal enjoyment, here is a weapon I'll throw on one of their upcoming enemies. I imagine this monster of a weapon as the bastard child of a wheellock gun and a crossbow. The description is most likely complete nonsense of course, but it sounds cool :D

~~~

Double-shot Wheel Crossbow
Price 50 gp; - Damage 1d10 P; - Bulk 2
Hands 2; - Range 60ft; - Reload 1
Category Martial
Ammunition Bolts
Group Bow Traits deadly d10, capacity 2

A relatively new and therefore rare pattern of crossbow that feeds from an internal magazine just below the flight groove. It sports a complex system of springs, cogs and winches that can be engaged with a wheel-like device integrated into the stock. When used correctly, a new bolt is fed from the magazine and the string is spanned at the same time. Due to the limited space in the stock and the complexity of the reloading/self-spanning mechanism, the magazine only holds two bolts. Additionally, the correct operation and maintenance of this weapon requires significant training, which, when one includes the hefty price, makes it quite unsuitable for standard military adoption.

- Traits -

Capacity: A weapon with capacity can be fired the listed amount of times before it has to be reloaded. After it has been fired, you must spend a free Interact action to put the next piece of ammunition in a ready position to be able to fire the weapon again. This interact action is treated as an interact action to reload, but only for the purposes of feats (such as Crossbow Ace). If the weapon is not at full capacity, spending the number of interact actions to reload listed under the "reload" statistic returns the weapon to full capacity.

It is not exactly part of the playtest, but seeing as we have basically exhausted the discussion about the existing material, this is a good a time and place as any.

Anyway, it is not hard to see that any weapon with a capacity of higher than 1 will be... interesting in the balance department. I have never played 1E, only watched it, but even from that I can surmise that this is not a direction we want to go in. From what I have gathered you run around with a dinky little pistol/crossbow until you pick up something that costs as much as some magic items, at which point you become the god of dakka.

For 2E, the problem is that these weapons largely get around the reason why reload weapons need to be substantially better than they are currently - the reloading part. It is conceivable that capacity could be the answer to propulsive variants of non-reloading ranged weapons, but that is a very fine line to walk.

Capacity 2 is still fine, as that still only allows for two attacks per round, which is mostly fine. Unless the reload stuff the gunslinger gets is as hilarious as the 1E semi-auto musket, this should work. Actually a decent equivalent to composite variants. Propulsive is not really useful to anything but the drifter, as far as the gunslinger goes, so that would make sense as an option. Being able to consistently do 2/3 of the attacks of a bow specialist is a lot better than half, so these could be reasonably balanced. It would also be much more satisfying to be able to do 2 attacks per round, rather than the 2-1-2-1 routine.

Anything more than that is problematic. The strongest versions - revolvers, rifles, repeating crossbows, ...etc. - would definitely have to be advanced weapons or they would just not fit into the general balance of power. At least not if the rest of the stats stays the same from the one-shot versions, which is the only thing that makes sense. But is that enough?