Tiefling straight Paladin is one of the hardest to kill. Their favored class bonus for paladins is crazy good. Pick a variant tielfing heritage that is +CHA, +STR/+CON and -WIS.
Paladins make pretty decent party healers, agreed. They don't need a high AC at all due to the excessive self-healing.
Agreed that going straight paladin is easily the hardest to kill, and if you're content with using wands for healing others, then it's the best option.
RaizielDragon wrote:
Sounds interesting; I've seen Oradin mentioned a lot on the forums here, and just to ensure I understand, is that just an Oracle and Paladin multiclass? Is there a specific ratio that is recommended?
Correct. Typically you go 3-4 levels of Life Oracle, and the rest in Paladin. There's some debate as to the best order to level in. Personally I like..
We are only currently level 6, so the Oracle would need to at least be enough levels to bond with all other party members correct? That would mean not enough levels of Paladin to even have spellcasting yet
How many people are in your party? You only need 3 levels for a normal party of 4. Also if you're already level 6 then swap the above order with Paladin first so you get the extra max HP from level 1.
Fey Foundling + the Tiefling Paladin FCB and Hero's Defiance will make you nearly impossible to kill. Add in the Lifelink from Life Oracle and you have an effective means of in-combat and out of combat healing. If you care less about damage, then Hospitaller is a great archetype for Paladin, and you can get some great Channeling efficiency with levels into Holy Vindicator since it stacks with both Hospitallers channels, and the Oracle channels.
For even more cheese, consider a VMC into Cavalier Order of the Stars. You'll lose a ton of feats, but...
"In addition, the cavalier adds 1/2 his cavalier level to any levels of paladin or cleric he might possess for the purposes of determining the effects of channel energy or lay on hands."
There are other responses, but those are largely due to other factors. Nodachi is a polearm without reach, and can be used with Shield Brace for 2hed damage while still wielding a shield. Longspear is the definitive simple weapon reach weapon. Most of the martial options aren't much better, though Bardiche is basically the best of them due to the 1d10 19-20/x2.
Honestly the penalties should outweigh the benefits. If we gave up feats/class features to use these there would be argument. But right now you can slap this stuff on top of anything.
No, they really shouldn't. If these were replacing feats or class features then there shouldn't even be a penalty.
If you want to use corruptions purely as a form of punishment for your PCs then go for it, that's what they are there for as written. But others do enjoy the concept of great power at great cost. This isn't. This is "kind of ok power I guess? maybe? at great cost"
My recommendation is outright skip the corruption, and just throw on the corruption templates to your PC, using the rebuild rules. It makes a hell of a lot more sense, and is at least more balanced than the standard templates like Vampire.
Being interested in the corruptions is not a bad thing, it can make for an interesting character. It is there for a reason. Believing that the downsides are stupid and should have never been put in (and this has been posted) is munchkin. Concern over how fast it takes you over is a matter of taste. Believing that you should be able to avoid any downsides, is not a matter of taste. I don't see you falling into the Munchkin camp from what you have posted.
The problem isn't that there ARE downsides, the problem is the downsides FAR outweigh any potential strengths the corruptions may have even had. The result is a punishment system.
The Benefits/Stains are simply not even close to equal, and that's not even including the whole three strikes and you hand your DM your character sheet and go back to browsing tumblr for the rest of the session clause.
For the low low price of 16-18k you can create a nifty wondrous item which grants you constant Protective Penumbra and never worry about the sun again.
I was hoping for a friendly way for PCs to experience becoming undead and other things without throwing party balance out of wack since that typically always results in +1-3 CR increases etc. In reality we get "Here's a way to permanently lose control of your character if you have a bad will save".
Will have to see how those alternate progression routes Mark mentioned turn out and if they actually make these corruptions not into a terrible game of Russian roulette.
its not "specific" deities, just "Specific domain/portfolios"
Umm... no? The SRD is vague because they can't deliberately state the deity name for the feats. You still need the specific deity for them to work in practice.
When it says "worship a god of battle" it means "Gorum" but it can't say "Gorum".
Look at Archives of Nethys for the actual text of each feat.
Paladins gain their powers not through any deity, but by the their own Lawful Goodness.
Should the Paladin decide to worship this being he is still totally fine unless he commits evil acts and breaks his Paladin code, and sinks from Lawful Good.
Also seconding that this whole thing just sounds really dumb.
Welcome to to world of wizards winning fights with one spell. People incorrectly believe that Wizards are weak early and grow into power, but as you've found, they start off strong and only get better.
The counter is to not group, if they can only get 1 person in the spell then there's a chance it does nothing. If you have multiple people you're more likely to have at least one of them fail.
Ascalaphus has some other good ideas.
This. Your players not taking massive advantage of Color Spray in the past is baffling. Sleep, Color Spray, Grease, etc, all capable of ending an entire encounter in 1 casting. Of course, as you're finding now, it goes both ways.
What about the Besmara's Deific Obedience boons? Or is that not legally postable on here?
Dunno about legality, but it's also in there.
Evangelist Boons:
1: Tricky Adversary (Sp) illusion of calm 3/day, daze monster 2/day, or twilight knife 1/day
2: Coerce Service (Su) You understand and can exhibit the blatantly charismatic pull of your goddess, convincing others to aid you even if they normally might not. Once per day, when you attempt a Diplomacy check to bribe a target (treat as if you are attempting to improve an NPC’s attitude toward you by one step) or an Intimidate check to coerce a target, you can use this ability to gain Besmara’s blessing to ensure further cooperation. You gain a +4 sacred or profane bonus (of the same type as that provided by your obedience) on the Diplomacy or Intimidate check, and if you succeed, the target is immediately subject to a geas/quest effect. For as long as the effect lasts, you can concentrate as a standard action and learn whether the target is actively undertaking your orders or actively defying them.
3: Bribed Sea Monster (Sp) The sea monsters at Besmara’s behest follow your call at the goddess’s command. Once per day as a standard action, you can summon one of the monsters Besmara has bribed or intimidated into aiding her followers. You must choose the monster from among the following list: adult sea dragon, sea serpent, or vouivre. The monster appears as if summoned via summon monster, and you must summon it into an appropriately watery environment. It follows your commands perfectly for 1 round per Hit Die you possess before vanishing. The monster doesn’t follow commands that contravene Besmara’s interests, such as blocking waterways or giving a navy better control of a sea region; issuing such untenable instructions, if they’re egregious, could cause the monster to attack you.
Unfortunately, Archives of Nethys doesn't list a Deific Obedience for Besmara, so you're going to have to work with your GM to come up with one,
Again, Inner Sea Faiths.
Besmara Obedience:
Steal a gold coin or alcoholic drink by force or trickery. Then, while recounting your latest or most impressive act of piracy and blessing Besmara’s name for all to hear, offer your stolen item to her by throwing it into water at least 4 feet deep. Alternatively, you can
recount your most impressive or recent act of piracy to someone unaware of it, although you are free to hide the fact that the act was yours. You then gain a +2 sacred or profane bonus to AC against attacks of opportunity. The type of bonus depends on your alignment — if you’re neither good nor evil, you must choose either sacred or profane the first time you perform your obedience, and this choice can’t be changed.
I prefer my necromancers more life-drainy and "vampiric", trafficking more in souls and life-energy than in rotting minions. Not to hijack, but what's best suited towards that kind of necromancer?
It's actually recommended that if you're taking crafting feats that you be given extra wealth to make up for you using feats on crafting.
Absolutely not. The exact opposite is actually recommended.
Your reward for the feats is being able to gain bonuses earlier and faster, or more equipment sooner. You are not supposed to be REWARDED with more gold for taking something good. Item Creation feats are THE most powerful feats in the game, bar none.
If you make gear for others, that's actually supposed to count against YOUR WBL, not theirs. Which puts a natural brake on amplifying the wealth of the whole party.
False.
Ultimate Camapign
"Some GMs might be tempted to reduce the amount or
value of the treasure you acquire to offset this and keep
your overall wealth in line with the Character Wealth
by Level table. Unfortunately, that has the net result of
negating the main benefit of crafting magic items—
in effect negating your choice of a feat. However, game
balance for the default campaign experience expects you
and all other PCs to be close to the listed wealth values,
so the GM shouldn’t just let you craft double the normal
amount of gear. As a guideline, allowing a crafting PC
to exceed the Character Wealth by Level guidelines by
about 25% is fair, or even up to 50% if the PC has multiple
crafting feats.
Example: The Character Wealth By Level table states
that an 8th-level character should have about 33,000 gp
worth of items. Using the above 25% rule, Patrick’s 8thlevel
wizard with Craft Wondrous Item is allowed an
additional 8,250 gp worth of crafted wondrous items. If
he uses his feat to craft items for the rest of the party, any
excess value the other PCs have because of those items
should count toward Patrick’s additional 8,250 gp worth
of crafted items."
Just precaution. Most characters I make are quite emotional, and I'm feeling Hunter for a new game. I figure the character would be heavily attached to the animal, and would be devastated if someone were to kidnap the animal and then break their bond forever.
Again, just a precaution.
You should be FAR more worried about them actually, you know, killing it.
Considering you're perma dazzled while the eye is out, I wouldn't recommend using this for in-combat. This is very much a scouting ability. That said, I'd be terrified of it gets spotted while scouting since it's your actual bloody eye, and losing that would be terrible.
Not really that big a fan of skinshaper in a non-spy themed campaign either. Enhancement bonuses, especially limited to +4, are just a big bucket of meh.
Main difference is the Skinshaper doesn't lose access to all his spells.
With regards to the Tyrant, gotta agree, height of laziness. But it's still better than the terrible Gray Paladin. Just think, the Tyrant could of been something truly terrible if they actually tried to make it unique like that. Sadly I suppose that means we just got lazy instead.
Traits: Magical Knack
Feats:
1 Fencing Grace
3 Extra Arcanist Exploit: Eldritch Blade
5 Extra Arcanist Exploit: Spell Strike
6 Exploit: (Weapon Specialization, or Metamagic Knowledge Intensified Spell or Arcane Strike)
7 Extra Arcanist Exploit: (Metamagic Knowledge Intensified Spell, or Weapon Specialization, or Arcane Strike)
8 Improved Initiative
9 Extra Arcanist Exploit: Whichever is left
It lacks the medium armor proficiency needed for HKS but I think it makes up for it. Could drop one of the Extra Exploits to pick up proficiency as well if ya really wanted to go HKS.
Frankly, this sounds utterly wrong, and someone is clearly misreading something.
I'm assuming this is an angel-kin Aasimar, which gets +2 STR and +2 CHA. If you burn all your 20pt buy on getting 18 STR then that's still only 20 STR. Not 25.
If he is cherry picking from the variant aasimar abilities table without your permission then clearly he is misunderstanding how those work. Even then, at most that'd give him another +2 for 22, which is still not 25.
Another option would be to just make an entirely new character that is out of the crosshairs of this other player. This is only recommended if you have no other options than quitting the campaign and finding another group.
This could work honestly. Yea, you'll have to abandon your concept, but it should work. If the problem player deliberately also suddenly wants a new character, then you basically got your proof he's trying to f$%~ with you.
4E also included a sort of catch-22, in that enemies were penalized for attacking allies (with negatives to attack) as well as granting the character a sort of AoO if the enemy chose to attack an ally any way. On the other hand, they could instead attack the tanking character, whose AC was normally through the roof, and had plenty of HP to spare.
Pathfinder has a Paladin archetype that does most of this.
At 1st level, a sacred shield can call upon the powers of good to defend her and her allies against evil. This ability functions as smite evil, except that the paladin gains no benefit on attack or damage rolls against her target. Instead, any attacks the target makes against allies within 10 feet of the paladin deal half damage. Attacks against the paladin deal full damage, but the paladin gains a deflection bonus to her AC equal to her Charisma bonus (if any) against attacks made by the target of the smite. This bonus increases by +1 for every four paladin levels (to a maximum of +6 at 20th level). As with smite evil, if the paladin targets a creature that is not evil, her bastion of good ability is wasted with no effect. Feats, abilities, and the like that increase a paladin’s number of uses of smite evil per day increase a sacred shield’s uses of bastion of good per day.
This ability replaces smite evil.
I don't see OPs issue? Learn to build encounters better to suit the party.
Core only is a complete crutch as the CRB is arguably the most broken thing in Pathfinder. All it does is limit creativity and push your players into playing tier 1 classes or playing something utterly under-powered and terrible like a crb rogue.
Kinetecist. Non-lethal and burn is a whole new level of annoying mechanic to deal with.
Summoner. Summons are a whole new level of confusion and the action-economy created by summoning will drag gameplay to a halt for a newbie. Synthesist on the other hand, much better option.
Lame as it is, I'd recommend the fighter. It does what it says on the tin can, and there's no thought required of it really, despite other classes being a clearly superior option.
I know the op said no archetypes, but I vote Eldritch Scion Magus. Its a bloodrager + a Magus. So you have high damage output, but you're a spontaneous casters so your choices are simpler. If you allow retraining spells according to the rules then they can always fix a poorly trained spell later on. You end up getting a decent grasp on weapon enchantment mechanics earlier on.
Just send them a guide, or PM me and I'll send a link for one or two. And they can skim the guide on the best Arcana and spells. Its hard to go wrong with a magus. The spontaneous casting complicates the normal magus builds, but a first timer or non optimizer won't care and it simplifies casting for a first timer as well. And they have bloodrager abilities also. They'll have a fine damage output from the jump. I would recommend them doing a dex build also so they don't have to worry about anything but cha and dex really.
No, no they really shouldn't. It has been brought up many times, the archetype is a colossal trap. It's vastly inferior to both a Bloodrager, and the base Magus. Further, it plays nothing like a Magus, and has none of the power potential it's known for, leaving "Magus guides" completely worthless to the building of an Eldritch Scion, since it is impossible to play it like a standard Magus and none of the standard methods apply.
I'd disagree regarding any prepared caster, as it can create a situation of paralysis by choice. *Do I prepare this today? How many? Do I need 2? But I could also get this..."
At least with spontaneous you make your choice, and you're done. Prepared you do that every damn day.
This idea got brought up over in the other impaling critical thread but I figure the discussion was getting pretty off topic, so I figured I'd start this up.
The concept here is to use Ascetic Style to apply monk unarmed strike damage to a cestus, then through Improved Critical or Keen to achieve a 17-20/x2 crit rate and then crit somewhat reliably for Impaling Critical shenanigans.
Using Unchained Monk we can actually take the Hamatulatsu Master archetype, allowing us to pick up Weapon Focus (Cestus) as our lvl 1 monk bonus feat, and use our normal lvl 1 for Ascetic Style. At lvl 6, we use our bonus feat to gain Hamatulatsu, allowing us to deal piercing damage, and sicken on a crit. At level 9 we can theoretically take Improved Critical (Cestus) or have it enchanted to Keen by this point, and lvl 10 we finally take Impaling Critical (Cestus) for our fun impaling shenanigans, and since we take it as our monk bonus feat, the prereqs are not required.
However, I'm not much of a monk player, so beyond this basic framework, I'm unsure how to make this work even better. It also brings up a variety of questions due to Ascetic Style: Do Weapon Focus for Unarmed and Cestus stack to give +2 to hit? Say I have a Keen Cestus, and an AoMF +2. How does that even work? Do they stack? What takes precedence?
Lots of questions, but impaling people with fists is too great a concept to ignore.
My recommendation: keep the GMPC as far away from the NPCs as possible. A dumb martial would be ideal so you can let the others shine. Don't talk to yourself (NPCs), minimize any risk of metagaming as much as humanly possible. Your goal is to not exist. Serve your role in combat, and stay away from anything else.
As mentioned, the dumb martial works, but you could also try something like a reach cleric and focus on primarily healing the party, while also being able to fend for yourself a bit. This all really depends on what the other players are though.
it sounds like not giving you a chance is getting closer to that line
While I agree the Paladin should be trying to redeem OP, the reality is that if OP shows no signs of redemption, then he will be smited with extreme prejudice. It's right there in the Code "If they will not turn toward the light, I will redeem them by the sword. "
Further, with regards to using the Code against the Paladin...
"I will protect my allies with my life" You could argue that the party, including OP are his allies and he should protect them, not smite them, but considering OP was basically kicked out of the party for an entire week, his status as "ally" is highly subject.
"I am fair to others." Not giving OP a fair shake and being highly judgmental could be an issue, but frankly OP is already trying to piss off the Paladin anyway and attempting to undermine him.
"I will not abide evil, and will combat it with steel when words are not enough." Yea, this and the "redeemed by the sword" part basically mean OP is going to die before this campaign ends.
Atarlost wrote:
They had to kick you out to prevent you from sabotaging their plans. You are the unruly party member. You're also plainly not the party leader because they aren't following you.
Seconding this also. The party should just abandon you at this point.
The critical element here is that the party needs to actually care enough about having you in the party in the first place. You mentioned the party basically kicked you out for a week because they knew you'd screw up their plans with the village elder. This party can very easily just leave town without you, and then you end up just rolling a new character since the party no longer cares to have you.
If the party really doesn't mind you though, and it's mostly just the paladin, the issue is clearly the paladin seems to be on the lawful stupid side of his alignment sadly. Sarenrae as mentioned is very much about redemption and forgiveness. His paladin should be trying to turn you good, not smiting you. The matter of willfully allying with an evil character could be waived by saying you are critical to the success of the party, or simply the paladins mission is to redeem you, and thus he is sticking with you, in addition to whatever the parties greater goals are.
My recommendation, talk to the Paladin player, try to get him to alter his personality to be less "lawful stupid" and more redemption, and forgiveness, and THEN let things play out. They should be much better for all involved.
Otherwise, it's only a matter of time before that Paladin just goes "Smite Evil" and your little sorcerer is a pile of gibs on the floor.
Players needs the illusion of choice. End of discussion. Give them perception checks. Doesn't matter if the check is a 30 and they will only make it on a 17, give them that choice. It is absolutely crucial. There is nothing more irritating as a PC than things happening out of your control when you were never even given the chance of gaining it in the first place.
Not granting checks is akin to railroading. Of course your PC is irritated.
I'm a fan of the Arcane Strike feat line since Bloodragers have CL 5 at lvl 5, so they right off the bat get that +2 to damage off Arcane Strike. Riving Strike will make your casters love you, and Blooded Arcane Strike will help your action economy by getting you back your swift actions Arcane Strike had been taking away. Cleave just isn't that worth it. Also if you're taking Raging Vitality that's something you typically want at lvl 1 or 3.
Vexing Daredevil seems like a solid archetype for a melee focused Mesmerist. One of the current Mesmerist guides also describes a melee build which seems pretty solid here, just ignore the 3pp race used.
I think expecting only first-person RP is a little too heavy-handed. It can be very difficult to pull it off well. Meanwhile something like: "I tell them that we just got attacked by a dragon, it's probably somewhere close by still, Jeremy our cleric is bleeding out and is probably dead on the ground, we are in a really bad spot here and we could really use some help!" is 100% legit.
Some people can do first-person really well, but third-person like the above is totally fine, and shouldn't be discouraged or looked down upon.
On the one hand, his restrictions are... odd, on the other hand I can certainly understand not letting you have an animal companion, as in my experience, pets, summons etc really just serve to clog things.
Since he isn't letting you take a wolf, then you should probably drop the dog, as it's not useful, and take something which is moderately more so, like the alternative companion bond with your party, or perhaps an archetype that replaces the bond with something more useful.
A good way to describe the "brutish and less lock-down" would be that he's more animal-like. He can find me and is relentless but he's more the "charge now question it later" type. The shadow demon has a burst of speed every minute, too much defensive capability, and Fear + Teleport which makes him too sticky. The biggest thing is we need to be able to outsmart and outmaneuver him as lvl 1-3's so we can survive until there's a way to physically deal with him
Protip: Every outsider is going to have greater teleport at will. The only way you outmaneuver that is to box them in and push them into attacks of opportunities. Or kill them before they get a turn to retreat.
Think of it this way: The demons goal isn't to kill you or the party. It just wants to ruin your lives and spread discord and misery, then maybe once it has played enough with its prey, when you're say around lvl 6+ish, it will actually attempt to go for a kill.
Sending a shadow demon on a lvl 3 party is likely to be a terrible, terrible idea. Since shadow demons are incredibly jealous of the corporeal maybe the demons personal goal is merely to annoy, then it does its job. If it's doing the bidding of a wizard after all, it probably wants to prolong its time on the material plane as long as it can after all.
When it finds the party maybe it just does a shadow conjuration and sends them into the camp as the party is sleeping. Or maybe it possesses a close friend of the party and has some fun that way.
What you are asking for simply isn't possible at such a low level. You need to make compromises. Or just ask your DM to make a brand new monster to your specifications.
If you use DEX you are completely missing the point of this concept. It's all about being a tiny brute. Being simply tiny and powerfull is all but too common around here.
If "brute" = STR then it is simply not possible if OP wants to be tiny. Small is manageable as it'd only be a -4 to STR which is till terrible, but you can kind of make it work in a really terrible subpar way.
Why would you have any penalty to your STR? If you look at the small races only a few have a STR penalty and that is in their stat line. Yes when you use things like reduce person spells you get a penalty to STR, but from what I can see you would start with a 10 STR like anyone else.
Just about all tiny and small sized monsters have either a -8 or a -4 to their STR. A medium sized Cave scorpion has 11 STR. Meanwhile a tiny sized Greensting Scorpion has a -8 to their Strength, bringing them to 3 from their "natural" 11.
A Pixie is naturally a Small sized creature, it therefore has an innate -4 to STR, and therefore they start with only 7 STR after applying stat arrays. Obviously OP is planning some weird custom race like a Pixie while also being significantly smaller to the size of Tiny, which would therefore drop the STR another -4 bringing them to a 3 from a "medium" sized Pixie of 11.
PC races like halflings and 0 HD Races are exceptions to the rule. Even if you want to BS your way into having a tiny sized Pixie magically have more STR somehow, the end result is nothing short of absurd on all levels as you're still attacking people with a toothpick, with 0 reach. Hell, does a tiny sized reach weapon even still have reach?
