Valeros

Grizzly the Archer's page

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If you drop the ring of protection to a +3 and dropped the amulet of natural armor to a +3 you'll pick up 28k gp. The amulet of spirits life will cost you 18k gp (since it's slotted with the amulet), leaving you 10k gp. Spend 5k gp on a dusty rose prism for a +1 AC bonus and you have 5k gp left over.

You'll lose 1 AC, but will gain an extra 1d6 to all your channels, and have an extra 5k go to spend. It's not ideal but it's the best I could come up with within the money constraints while leaving everything else.

You can also then get a mithral breastplate (agile) instead of the armored coat. Which would only add 2.5 lbs, which is 5.5 lbs shy of your light load for encumberance purposes. You'll gain more AC this way and have more AC then before the changes.

Finally, you can put on the restless enchantment on the armor for 4500 gp. So now you can sleep in your armor without worrying about donning it.

That is the best I could come up with quickly looking over everything. And you'll have 200gp tender!


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Ravingdork wrote:

Cool concept, Tells! Looks like someone who could readily team up with Kujo or Paegin.

Grizzly the Archer wrote:
I think for the kitsune oracle you having an Amulet of Spirits would help out immensely. Your Life revelations and the spirit abilities from the wandering spirit would both go up 2 levels. Meaning your channels for both channel pools would go up another 1d6 and so forth. Great item for 12k gp.
Would it stack with her other items though? It says "This effect does not stack with other abilities that increase the effective level of mystery or spirit powers."

There's nothing to stack. The phylactery just gives a direct bonus to channeling. Not to the ability that provides it.

So far I see nothing that would increase the actual level of the abilities except this. As such, it works for both channel pools and anything else.

Now, if you wanted to, you could use UMD to emulate a revelation from another mystery, or from life, on a ring of revelation to gain the ability.


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Looks good. When did you take the realistic likeness feat?

Also, I noticed you didn't take fey founding for the extra +2hp heal per die rolled when you heal. With all the channeling you'll do looks like a great feat.


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master_marshmallow wrote:

Schrodinger's Fighter is a thing.

Most of the components are already covered in the guide:

human (or bastard, required for feat access)
lvl 1:[feat]; [bonus feat]; [bonus combat feat]; Combat Stamina
lvl 2:(Improved Bravery?); Bravery
lvl 3:[bonus combat feat]; Armor Training 1
lvl 4: Barroom Brawler
lvl 5: [feat that definitely isn't Advanced Weapon Training]; Weapon Training 1
lvl 6: [bonus combat feat]
lvl 7: [feat]; Armor Training 2/Advanced Armor Training
lvl 8: [bonus combat feat]
lvl 9: [feat]; Advanced Weapon Training: Abundant Tactics (choose Barroom Brawler
lvl 10: Quick Study (sidebar- here it is appropriate to start taking the feat Advanced Weapon Training for other options, unless you wanted to take it earlier and retrain out of it at 8th for free instead of paying for it here.)
lvl 11: [feat]; Armor Training 3/Advanced Armor Training
lvl 12: [bonus combat feat]; (retrain old feat to Advanced Weapon Training if you don;t want to pay for it)
lvl 13: [feat]; Advanced Weapon Training

The only items that you really need are the Gloves of Dueling and the Manual of War.

This is obviously just a skeleton build designed to make you versatile, there's a ton of new options and mix-matching with various VMCs can create insane characters.

This seems like a very interesting build. I only saw the guide for fighters. Is there a guide to how the build works? I assume it's strong in most weapon styles. Looking at reach.


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AM BARBARIAN wrote:
YO.

Lol.

I've already done a pounce CAGM spell sunder barbarian. Twice. I would like to do another one if there was anything new to change about him in recent years. Anything good?


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avr wrote:

1. Decent but not feat-rich so it'd take a while to take off.

2. Doable.
3. You mean a stone oracle with rock throwing, a psychic telekinesis specialist, or a barbarian taking the hurling feats? Any of these is OK but I wouldn't call them the most powerful builds.
4. Bad idea IMO. It's so frustrating when they don't apply, and finishing at 12 you're not going to have instant enemy for most of the game.

Are you asking about other builds which would do similar things?

1. I saw some good reach builds but wasn't sure how to tackle it if they get within my reach.

3. The stone Oracle. I had made a rough build of it years back that allowed yhe rocks sinve they were fragile to have interesting effects.
4. There was a horizon walker/instant enemy build that allowed me to get my fav. Enemy most of the time and to give allies. I'm wondering if it's still viable.


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For a couple of years I've always known the best choice for small and medium were the Charau-ka and the Sasquatch respectively. Glad this list is out there for others to better find good combinations.


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If going for the archer archetype for the fighter, which I have played before and is interesting, due to the combat manuever trick shots, I'd suggest this:

H. Point blank
1. Precise shot
1b. rapidshot
2. Weapon focus
3. Deadly aim
4. Weapon specialization
5. Combat reflexes
6. Manyshot
7. Clustered shots
8. Greater weapon focus
9. Snapshot
10. Improved snapshot
11. Improved precise shot
12. Greater weapon specialization
+ later levels give you more freedom, but at 14th I'd pick up Pin Down as my feat, so that if an enemy is next to me, I prevent him from moving away from me while I plug him full of arrows.

Get bracers of falcons aim for the extra crit range of 19-20, the +1 competence range attack bonus, and the +3 per emotion bonus.

You now can threaten out to 15' and make AoO attacks on enemies from there. With combat reflexes,myoull have plenty of AoO to utilize. Don't move a lot, get heavy armor, or medium Mithral, crank your AC high as well as your attack and damage, and your a walking ballista practically.

Gloves of dueling are a needed item and anything to help your saves is a huge help.
----
As a fighter you'll want a decent will save to help you out. Buffering cap, cap of the free thinker, jingasa of the fortunate soldier, and other items will really help you out in the long run.

Since your picking up the fighter archetype the choices you have for the trick shot ability should go as follows in my opinion:
- disarm
-sunder
-trip (at 11)

At lower levels you'll be fighting humanoids more often than not, so disarm their weapons from 30' if you can, and if it makes more sense then damage, then do so. Sunder is not too bad to use on wizard/spell caster types on their spell components/focus/divine focus.
At later levels, trip even though it's mid level still has uses, so it's not too bad. It's certainly the bat bet compared to grapple.

There are tons of items to boost CMB.


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Weapons: since your a barbarian, your going to have a huge static damage bonus. As such, I like to embrace that through crits. Keen falchion, or improved critical. For starters.

Make it, +5 adamantine falchion with Furious, courageous, dueling (from field guide, only if you spell sunder) holy , and impervious to make it tougher to break
If not holy than impact and one other ability

As for other items:
Headband of havoc: a barbarian must- immediate action rage, and +4 lvl to one power
Boots of speed, striding and springing, feather step boots( ignore hindering terrain)
Pauldrons of the juggernaut- these are amazing for barbarians
Gloves of reconnaissance/ gloves of stone shaping- move earth around like clay
Light fortification on armor- 25% miss chance for crits
Fortification stone put on your weapon
Cap of the free thinker- to help out will saves
Jingasa of the fortunate soldier- reduce a crit hit or sneak attack and help out your AC.
Quick runners shirt- get close than full attack. Even helps with pounce barbarians.


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I would make it a custom Furian race.. No more than 15 points I think.

At least a few levels of ranger, for favored enemy human and favored terrain: urban. He might be seen on distant worlds, but he still survives it even when it's not his native land. This can be witnessed by a very high survival skill as well as some horizon walker levels, for some other terrain.

Dark vision is a must for him bit with a light sensitivity drawback for it, unless wearing dark goggles.

Rogue for a few levels for sneak attacks and the sort. Also, trapper ranger might work better since it would provide the ability for him to make some useful traps much like he did in the newest movie.


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Ravingdork has an interesting build for a character that uses an armor suit for his protection and as a potential combat buddy. Very FRANKY esque.

link


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Congrats on choosing a sunderer barbarian as your PC. I made a sundered human barbarian. One of my most memorable and favorite characters ever.

Get a way to rage cycle quickly. Either buy a Cord of Stubborn Resolve, take 3 levels horizon walker, 1 level dip into oracle (after 8th level) for lame curse, to gain fatigue immunity.

Items to help: dusty rose ioun stone slotted into a wayfinder for a +2 CMB/CMD bonus as a resonate ability.
-bracers of skilled manuever (sunder): for another +2 bonus to your CMB.
-the dueling property found in the pathfinder society field guide. Has all the manuevers listed, except sunder. However, this is an error as sunder is similar in every mechanical way to trip and disarm, so it's allowed as such. Get a furious courageous +5 adamantine weapon with dueling on it. 7 enhancement +14 dueling ability luck bonus=+21 bonus from your weapon to CMB for sunder.

I was able to get my CMB numbers up to about over +80 or higher at 20th level give or take. Versus casters, of any level, those spells are GONE!


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Idk. I'm currently in a game where we spent 16 days in the actual wilderness with nothing but what we were as a class to help us out. Everything, even tools and clothing was fashioned and crafted from raw materials we had to find, make, and use. We were naked, tired, hungry, and confused, and after jumping through a crystal clear lake, ended up in a forest.

Survival skill is good to have for not getting lost, since you know where true north lies. You don't remember though, where the party camp is. Weather, terrain, normal animals will be your issues for your pcs. Do they go after the deer and dire deer to get hide for clothing?mor do they try to go to the nearest town, with what they have, and hope for the best? Had issues with a mother panther, owl bear, boars and dire boars, deer and dire deer, so forth. My archer had to make his bow from scratch, that's fine. But to took him days to do so, and he had to go put and catch/kill birds for the feathers for his arrows.

If you can micromanage or minimize the overall impact certain aspects of the game, all the better, at least for a start. (examples: carrying capacity,strength scores to pull/break/cut trees for shelter, fire wood, and weapons; encumbrance, weather effects, terrain issues, ammunition tally, so on). These little things of checked implemented, will have a greater impact on the party, and make them more survival like.

Force them to use swim, know: nature, climb, stealth checks. Survival is for living in the wilderness and surviving it in general. It takes know:nature to know that these berries your party wants to eat are poisonous, but not those berries over there.

Hope this helps.


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I've always played in a sandbox style campaigns. Never had the opportunity to try an AP or something similar, although we've had the AP converted for more sandbox style.

Either way be prepared for surprises. That's easy enought to say about any game, I know, but when you open the metaphorical floodgates on what the campaign is sorta going to be, you need to be more keen on potential surprises. Both good and bad.

Also, it's a good idea to plan out a lot of what the overall arc, theme, locations, names, that sort of thing, beforehand. Not every detail, but a good rough estimate of the foreseeable future.

As for helping with traveling many times I use details in the terrain to open up new stimuli to the group. Many times dmsmwill say " ok so you walk he 3 miles to the other town. Nothing happened on the way. ( or they might say how the scenery is nice but still nothing eventful). On the other hand, if you were to allow a perception check every once in a while, if applicable (if your in a desert let's say, and our surrounded by nothing there's very little to improve upon), that might allow you to throw out some possible plot hooks, or little side quests or something. This is a lot easier and more meaningful at lower levels. At higher levels travel becomes less tedious and more direct because there are better ways toget the group more immersed in the world than travel hooks.

As for quests, use the characters background for a starting point or even an arc ending issue. Once that is resolved, use earlier issues, points of adventure to have rip
Le effects throughout the campaign, just like real life. It can be as big or small as you want. From there use that as another point of issue, and have that become its own quest. And grow from there using previous quests. I call it the snowball effect for campaigns that don't have a good foot hold start, or want to start bare. If none of that is to your liking, or even for more quests, use a mission board. Many guilds, tabernacle, city halls, Town courtyard will have a wanted board, or job board. Since they are open jobs to the public it's an easy way for your party to get involved in the world Ina bigger way and for them to start developing the group as a whole. After a while that might get boring. It has happened to my gaming group many times. Just like I mentioned earlier about the ripple effect, use it here now. Once the group has established themselves as a force, trust me they will if they get past level 4 or 5 and they get to be more known, there will be positive and negative ripples playing at work.

For instance, if there are pirates and on the job board the town asks for someone to capture or kill the pirates and try to get back some of the stuff they have been stealing from incoming and leaving merchant ships then your party might think about doing that job. If they do, no problem they get dp, loot, gold, etc. However, what they don't know is that that ship is part of a pirate ring, or group, or a fleet of some sort, where that is just a division captain of some major pirate smuggler who has an alias like "The River Spider". He now takes notice of one of his ships being taken out, so he sneds another one or two to investigate. Presto! Instant campaign arc full of quests for your pcs.


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Clustered shots is all you need.


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Also get the Amazing Tools of Manufacture, to give a +4 competence bonus, and a straight 2,000 gp progress in 1 hour time/ a day.


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Turgan wrote:

I currently play a very similar concept, with only minor deviations.

I think almost every single advice given by Porpentine makes perfect sense; but if you play the archer from level one, which I did not, I'd still say grab Clustered Shots.

There is at least one other zen archer guide around that really isn't half that good.

Improved Precise Shot is not needed if you can get a seeking bow, because seeking is even better than IPS.

I took Big Game Hunter instead of Hammer the Gap, because I do not like the mechanics of the latter, already calculating enough things during combat. I made some other minor feat changes, but I would not generally recommend them, just a matter of style.

actually, Improved Precise Shot IS needed for any and all archers as it ignores cover and some concealment, while the seeking property inores ALL concealment miss chances.

So the 2 abilities overlap, on some things, but BOTH are required to get by all of cover, except Total cover.

Again, seeking is good, and overlaps a small amount with IPS (concealment), but not everything, so both are needed.

I also made some feat changes, but kept hammer the gap. The zen archer and sohei are the only real ranged characters that can benefit greatly from hammer the gap, with so many attacks. Big game hunter is an amazing feat, especially later on where many more enemies are more likely to be large or bigger.


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Oversized wrote:

@Fuel Drop. Completely agree. Because of the weakness in Will saves I would HIGHLY recommend a Clear Spindle Ioun stone with Wayfinder (4,500gp). This will make you immune to possession and mental control...you don't want to the character that TPK's your own party.

And nothing is quite as sweet as telling you GM their mind control has no effect!

I personally think the Bracers of archery are way overpriced for the bonus you get.

If your fighting in tight spaces it helps to have a high AC. Dex obviously helps but Ring of Force Shield, Ring of Protection, and Amulet of Natural Armor can go a long way in boosting your AC.

The mind effect protection however is only vs. evil enemies. Also to DM discretion.

The Cap of the Free thinker, found in ultimate campaign, allows you to make another save vs. A mind-affecting effect. This is vs. ALL types. So if you have both this item, and the wayfinder OVERSIZED mentioned, you are immune to evil mental control, compulsion, and charm effects. and you get a second save vs. all other types, besides evil that would do mind-affecting control on you. I don't think the DM will ever control you, unless by way of wish/miracle, or deity.

-Also, ring of foe focus, for better saves and AC.
-Xorn robe, for better perception
-Quick runners shirt, to quickly move and get into position, to scout ahead and attack. Many great uses.
-if the archer fighter archetype, that allows for combat manuevers, the gauntlets of skilled manuever are definetly needed. Gives a +2 bonus to one combat manuever. If custom made, can have the bonus to multiple types, like trip, disarm, sunder. One of my favorite hew items for this type of archer.
- and my personal archer favorite, goz mask. Allows you to see through smoke,mcloads, underwater particulates, and the sort. Better than water vision ability, or flame sight from oracle.


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Deane Beman wrote:
Can we discuss the merits (or lack thereof) of Raging Vitality? I see it left off of many builds but proponents of the feat consider it a death wish if you don't take it.

It helps give another 1 HP per level to your rage HP you gain. It also helps out when you get below 0hp to allow you to continue raging, thus keeping your higher HPS stilled,mane not dropping them off, and thus practically killing you. I recommend it for those 2 actual reasons alone.

However, another good reason that many people miss is that it works well with raging brutality. Raging brutality will allow you to spend rage rounds to get your con modifier to be added to your damage rolls. With rqging vitality, that damage is increased by 1, and if 2 handed weapons are used, an additional .5 Dmg for every 1 damage additional.

Makes my barbarian throwing hammer build ridiculous, with deadly aim, raging brutality, 2handed thrower, rage, and so forth.

@gobo: thanks for the praise. I had only made the barbarin about 2 years ago, and had not seen some of the other barbarian builds, especially fully fleshed out ones. At the time, everyone was doing either the huge rage cycling half Orc for deathless stuff, or the ragepouncelance builds, that don't actually function. This build seemd like a happy medium of all the best barbarian stuff, smoothed out nicely. I also enjoy Diferent builds, but until now, I had never played a barbarian, some wanted to see what all the hype, fun, and talk was about. Loving it every moment.


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"I Don't Summon. I AM SUMMONED!"- said by my CN barbarian after being interrogated.

"This is taking too long." ::goes down the hall, comes upon an enemy, kills it, returns back to party. "You guys are still talking?"- same barbarian as above


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STR: 17 DEX: 12 CON: 14 INT: 10 WIS: 12 CHA: 8

You could max out strength to 18, but would then need to cut back on Int to 8 and wisdom to 10. This is more well rounded, and gives you some more skills for perception, survival, acrobatics, and whatever else you want.

Trait: Reactionary, xxxx
human: favored class bounds: 1/3 level superstition bonus
DR 6/-

1 power attack- feat , Race feat: raging vitality
2 superstition- power
3 improved sunder- feat
4 witch hunter- power
5  ERP: reckless abandon-feat
6 spell sunder-power
7 erp: beast lesser
8 beast totem
9 combat reflexes
10 greater beast totem
11 Dazing assault
12 come and get me

Use a nodachi, or a falchion if you can't. Get furious, courageous, dueling-fg, keen on it and make it +5

Normal gear: +6 enhancement bonus items for your main stats ( str>con>dex= wis)
Cloak of resistance +5
Boots of speed/ boots of striding and springing
Headband of havoc- amazing barbarian item
Cord of stubborn resolve- free rage cycling
Ring of protection
Necklace of natural armor

Since this is for PFS, the ruling-fg weapon property should be allowable, considering it came from a PFS book. It will allow your enhancement bonus from your weapon to double up ( so a +5 weapon, now gets a +10 bonus that is a luck bonus to your original enhancement...making it a +15 to certain combat manuevers, sunder being one of them, even if not listed due to writing errors).

Spell sunder is a very powerful ability, so use it wisely and with the dueling-fg enchant on your weapon, your CMB to sunder, or spell sunder will be very high, making you miss on nothing but a 1 typically.


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Hold off taking the one level in oracle or rage prophet for rage cycling. Your better off getting a cord of stubborn resolve, found in the Ultimate Equipment book, to rage cycle practically for free, and cheaper too.


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106. You hopped out of a box that said Police on it and when everyone looked at you funny, you said "wait till you come in." You've now been traveling with your "companions" ever since.

107. The journal of Melody Pond said you would.


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48. It was either travel with this group, or kill them as ordered. You figured money in the long haul made more sense.

49. Your the only one with actual survival skills to find someone/something.

49. The GM asked for comedy relief.

50. You are the old kings jester before he decided you were no longer funny.


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Ultimate combat has the ship prices and the sort. Also, ultimate equipment might have some stuff as well that is used for the seas, or sure.

As for sea/pirate themed stuff, there are quite a few resources for material:

Inner sea world guide
Inner sea world primer
Skulls and shackles players guide
Magic of the inner sea
Pirates of the inner sea
Knights of the inner sea

These books have some overlapping material, but plenty of other stuff for you to use. It has info for organizations, sea life, sea adventure, obstacles, items, classes, and so forth.
Also, the Faction Guide can also help out.

If you plan on doing a more sea style type of campaign than the are other resources to help you, depending on what you need, but these books have plenty.


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...your low level character can sunder epic level spells, via spell sunder, on a 2, 1 being a miss.
...other players at the table think one of your abilities neutralizes half the parties use, so they try to restrict you in using it.
...you start with feats/scores/or a crazy over the top idea, before you even have a character name.


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If I were you, my bow progression would follow something close to this...

Mwk Longbow-> +1 Longbow -> +1 Adaptive longbow -> +2 Adaptive

This is for low level . By the time your getting your gold together for the +3 your just possibly seeing or will see in a few more levels concealment play a bigger role, as well as more use of cover. Reason this is important is because of seeking.

Your better off getting the +3, if your attack is gonna be a little lower than getting the seeking ability. Either way it should be the first big upgrade besides straight +'s to enhancement that you get.

+3 Adaptive/ +2 Adaptive seeking-> +4 Seeking Adaptive

After this, unless your fighting lots of evil or your in open areas a lot, your other 2 choices typically for your bow here on out is holy and distance.

Last: +5 Adaptive Impervious Seeking, Distance, Holy, Merciful, Called.

This is the full +10 enh. being used. Your bow will be able to shoot at 220'. Have double its hardness and HP. Mold to your strength score and ignore miss chances. It also will now be able to do mercy shots, to not kill, but knock out an enemy, as well as have the bow teleport back to you within 100', even if in another person's hand.

My soon to be zen archer will have all of this on it, but will also have glamered as well maybe, to have it look like a walking stick.


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True, there are better uses. For that amount of gold. A wyroot weapon might be one of the best ki gaining options.


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I love poisons, especially with my archer characters. As for the poison pricing, it is 1/3 since it is crafted. For cheap, or faster crafting of some of the more expensive types, try getting the item, Amazing Tools of Manufacture, from the advanced race guide. It can create, using the keyed to it, craft alchemy, to produce 1 item of up to 2,000 gp in one hour. So Deathblade or dragon bile, I forget which is 1800gp, instead of taking hurs or days to make, will take just 1 hour.

The master alchemist feat will help considerably, regardless of which class for its ability, or item you use, b/ c for one feat you can make multiple poisons and for the exchange of gp instead of sp for progress, which means its 10x faster rate. I know there might be an alchemist discovery or two that mimic this, but for the one feat, you can save those abilities for something else to enhance your poison.

As mentioned, the best delivery system in my mind and in my opinion, many people on these boards, is for archery. They can last longer on each arrow head when in an efficient quiver, and it is once usable for the arrow anyway. If applied to a blade, even with the sticky poison discovery to make it last a few more rounds, it's still not as useful, when you can plunge 4 or 5 arrows into the enemy using a cheap poison like drow and making it have now a DC 19, from 4 arrows. To do the same thing you'd have to be a TWF build to have that many attacks at the same level, and to be able to apply the poison twice with each weapon. That is a lot tougher, and not as effective, if at all.

If however your using poison as a side thing, and not as one of your primary arsenal or even if you did, it's better to then use the poison outside of combat for certain instances. Dragon bile and Deathblade are great, but they have ok DC's and the con and dex loss isn't that substantial unless used in groups via arrow method, or applied to a much weaker enemy, where the one dose will be more effective. If it comes to that, its an expensive solution for just the weak enemy to begin with.

As for the blowgun idea, that works really well with the archer style. You can have the gnome use a longbow, for small creature, instead of a short bow, b/ c the longbow is overall better in every way. Many of the same feats for a blowgun work with a bow, and vice versa. So there really is no downside to just picking it up anyway. If you plan to use multiple doses, the bow is better. If is just one shot, and you want to be a bit exotic with it, the glow gun works fine.


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If he's going to craft his own poisons, might I suggest the master alchemist feat, as well as amazing tools of manufacture item found in the advanced race guide. they can make any poison up to 2k gp in one hour. other than that, they provide a +4 circumstance bonus to craft alchemy, it any craft skill for which it is designed for.


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BTW, for the tricksot ability fun that I had made mention long ago and a few others as well, once you hit 11th level things really get fun. Trip them on your turn or when they provoke you somehow. Their now prone. Then when they try to get up they provoke from you. Disarm their weapon, if they have it, if not sunder something of theirs that's useful, be sure to use adamantine arrows for that exact purpose. When they try to reach and get back their weapon they provoke agai. you can now trip them from that AoO and cycle through again.

They eat up their actions to do anything and at their best their standing with a weapon in their hand nothing sundered, only because you didn't want to tricksot them. If you did, they'd be prone, armor in pieces, shield in pieces, and weapon tossed to the side.


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Ultimate magic was ok, ultimate combat was good, ultimate equipment so far seems to be meh, from many peoples opinions and views on it.

When I was thinking ultimate equipment I think all of us were expecting a MiC similar type book, and if not at least something similar to compare it too. With Lots of nice new stuff for all of us to play with and fall in love with as well as have a type of compendium of a majority of the items already published. So far, it has only really been the latter of that, and even then not a whole lot made it in.

Typos like crazy, copy paste entries from previous books ( which later received corrections) still not corrected. Not happy at all.

Edit: smoke and blunt arrows are from the APG, nothing new. And crafting such arrows aren't even mentioned yet smoke would be a dc 15 craft alchemy, and blunt craft dc12 fletching it seems.


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xanthemann wrote:
That is awesome Grizzly! I had to stop laughing before I could type. lol

Thanks. Now my barbarian yells out "I AM SUMMONED!" before he goes. Scares the crap out of some of the enemies.

...... Another time my barbarian was just relaxing at the local brothel in some town for a while. He decided to speed things along, since the party ha only a few hours before going after the disappearing sailors, and have 3 women at once. Not only that, he decided to actually Rage during his entertainment. Needless to say, He ha to pay for a new bed, new wall, and cover medical expenses (healing) for 3 women.

Best 1k gp I ever spent. Now, I have my own personal room there (only I can stay in there), and now I have 3 informants when needed.


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Far shot is really only for when you don't want to purchase a distance enhancement for your bow, or even if you do, you tend to fight in smaller areas. Far shot is only really for large open areas,mor even in just forests, but your in the treetop scouting, or look out, and you spo enemies either 115'+ ( normal composite longbow 110') or 225' (distance composite longbow is 220'). I'd get it if you have some free feats open at later levels.

As for pinpoint targeting vs. vital strike it reallly depends....
If you like to move a lot, vital strike is better.
If you want to hit the enemy better get pinpoint targeting.
More damage, and not by much I might add, at most 4d10--->avg.=22 pts, vs 1d10-->avg. 5.5... Difference of 16,5 pts, for 2 feats. Pinpoint is just one feat but you can't move, and not all enemies have a high natural armor and shield bonus. Pinpoint is situational advantage to hit, disadvantage to move, and disadvantage at options when facing certain enemies. Vital strike is more damage but you can still move, thus providing more options. Honestly I was never a huge fan of vital strike for zen archers, but between the two it seems to be the better choice.

Clustered shots is amazing. Take it and never look back.


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agreed. I do however like the fact that I can use it as part of an AoO with snap shot and imp. snap shot. I get charged, I trip or disarm a part of the AoO, then I attack on my turn. pretty best. but yes, the losses are harsh. my dm allows the gloves to work, so there is that little bit of hope.
_________
anyway, I think the OP's question had been answerrd, at least mostly.


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Obscuring mists would only hamper an archer who didn't have seeking bow, since it ignores the mischance. But as for sight, just get the goz mask I mentioned before, it allows you to see through mists, fogs, vapors and the like as if it were not there. Using that with the seeking bow, or even just that without the seeking ability, and your golden.

However, not every archer is going to have that kind of stuff. In that case, just move closer to the opponent till your next to them, (based on if they moved from the last time you saw them.

As for darkness/deeper darkness, heightened continual flame (I think) on an ioun stone, would negate that darkness, and for less than 100gp.
-------
Back on topic, besides what was mentioned about archer's, such as:
Lots of full attacks
Need little movement
Lots of synergy for their atk/dog
Range, range, range'
Amazing at bypassing, or minimalizing DR
.....they also provide:

Weapon versatility

Spoiler:

Archer builds also benefit from the utilization of their weapon a lot better than other builds. For instance, if you didn't have the clustered shots feat, the only way for you to bypass the dear is one of 3 ways, which you can do normally are: getting a high enough enhancemement bones on your weapon with a +5 covering alignment/adamantine/silver/and cold iron, or get penetrating strike feat chain to ignore a certain amount of DR, or have the right ammunition type for the metal based DR and holy on your bow for evil DR. The last option, with regards to making cold iron, silver, or adamantine weapons, with also potential of an alignment on the bow or arrows, is the most common for archers. Not many classes, let alone builds, can swiftly change from one damage type to another so quickly, or within mid attack.

*Trick arrows- has got to be one of my favorite parts about an archer. Just using the patio books, no 3pp (kobolds quarterly is not 3pp), we get:
Silver, cold iron, Adamantine arrows
Blunted arrows
Whistling arrows
Smoke arrows
Obscuring mist arrow
Fog cloud arrow
Pheromone arrow (I love it)
Durable arrows (amazing)
Rain
Dye
Bleeding
Thistle
Splintercloud
Grappling hook
(there are some others, but these are the best ones that are non- magical)
.......

With all of these different types of arrows, besides the ones used for actual damage for combat, the there are very versatile. Including perhaps an adamantine durable arrow, which now never breaks when firing (certsin circumstances do) and bypasses hardness 20.

Expert combat strategists

Spoiler:
Of any martial class, the archer is the only one who can have a dunamic outcome on thebattlefield. Due to their distance and utilization of trick arrows ( of which i personally love many of them), they can kill the sorceror in the back casting something on the party front liner, while at the same time, lay out a smoke cover to escape, and kill a few of the bad guys chasing after you. They can asses the whole battlefield, because they, unlike the melee guys can and do focus on everything in sight of them to deal with somehow.

Archers are also, depending on classes and build, amazing chasers and volley masters zen archers), CMB at range and volley of death with an area (archer archetype((fighter)), battlefield controllers (arcane archer, elderitch knight, ((maybe also archer archetype with the CMB at range, but it's limiting and short range, not ideal)), scout/spotter/lookout/trap dealer (ranger).

Walking tanks

Spoiler:
If you go with an AC heavy archer, not only wil they not get hit that often, but couple that with the fact your in the rear typically and putting out at least 4 arrows a round, your a mobile turret. Add in some more arrows, put you in the front, and with the snapshot line, the archer is now a mobile turret who loves playing whack-a-mole within 15'.


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first off, nice concept, I had started to make an archer like this. the thing is, archer are feat dependent, also as a barbarian you'll need a good dex, decent strength, and a decent con. dump charisma and int. wisdom, its not a dump.

you need precise shot, point blank shot, rapid shot, many shot, those are the main ones. imp. precise shot is very good, and setting add how you want snap shot, imp snap for, and combat reflexes. that's 7 feats you need, possibly 8.
if you go human, that's:

H point blank shot
1 precise shot
3 rapid diy
5 many shot
7 combat reflexes
9 snap shot
11 imp. snap shot
13 imp. precise shot (I would really get this at 11th level, its that good; if you didn't get many shot yet, then things are fine; get imp precise shot in that case)
15 ... ok you can either get point blank master,.do that when you uneaten you don't have to move away 5', our you can just 5' step. seeing as how your feat deprived, let's ignore pbm..... instead get deadly aim, it'll help you hurt more.
17 raging vitality (take sooner if you want, earliest ay 11 or 13)
19 toughness
... if you decide to take fighter lectures you'll have at minimum 2 extra bonus feats. get whatever you want, I recommend quickdraw and something else

as for your plethora of rage powers:
2 superstitious
4 witch hunter
6 scent, (or, be a race that provides scent .or get an item like the hat of disguise greater that allows you to alter self into anther race, to provide scent. I recommend the sasquatch.) if you pick a race other then human, superstitious isn't really worth it to you. go human it helps you out long run, try scent from power or item. (reason is for the user of pheromone arrows, which grant a+2 bonus to atk/dmg
8 reckless abandon
10 eater of magic
12 come and get me! the reason fur this build. get your AoO off (from this only) first.
14 quick reflexes
... there aren't anymore rage powers that are good for you. some are ok, but not enough to warrant their use, especially since their limited in how they get used. however, the support town line isn't half bad guy you, since you will be in melee range a lot. this build is for efficiency. after here you can either multiclass, or stay barbarian. if you multi class I suggest alchemist, get mutagen str or Dex boosters, and/or go 3 lengths in fighter (weapon master), for gloves of duelinb.c.

the superstitious and witch hunter powers are for bonuses to you for your sacred a will a for pouring the hurt on most enemies, since many creatures have some sort of casting or Spell-like ability.

fyi, the invulnerable rager archetype stacks with urban barbarian, however you life uncanny dodge and the like.

as for equipment,.compare bow up to your highest str, while raging, and a backup, just invade you can't rage. get a str, dex, con belt....greater hat of disguise ( if human, make all your favored class options into the barbarian superstition power. also, take heart of the wild, got bonuses to your con for not dying.

make sure to get durable, smoke, and pheromone arrows (huge part of build, for this first at enemy)

hope this helps.


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Well, my archer fighter two Weeks ago fought uh a wide ooh underground swamp marsh. Where as this week, we entered a large ziggurat, and went into system t sized round as we descended down into it. Had a fight in a 40x40 room, with some overgrowth and stumps in the floor. Where there were 4 baykok in archer nests, in the 4 corners of the room, 30' up.

Depending on the fight tactics change, just a little but less so with archers. The archers main draw (ha), is that they get to do full attacks, more than probably went other martial class. In the room fight we had, I didn't have to move at all. In the swamp fight, I had to do a bit of moving, as will as line up some shots, so I didn't incur a cover penalty. Also, in the swamp fight, since it was wide open, I had to make sure to provide some backup for some of the less beefed up characters (wizard, rogue, bard).

As for the OP, I like the fighter as an archer a lot. Merger played a ranger, but I really like a lot of the synergy they get.

As for help with the fighter. Since you said you wanted to do bow and sword, switch hitter, you probably won't need point blank master (feat), our even the snap shot line. Personally, my archer fighter is dedicated solely to the bow. So in that case, I need snapshot more then you would, as well as getting class feature for pbm.

quickdraw as mentioned is a must. So is: power attack, precise shot, pbs, and possibly deadly aim. Deadly aim, is essentially power attacks archery brother. -1 atk/ +2 dmg, scaling.


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Since your asking for items, feats, what have you... Let me see what else I have for my archer that would work.
.....

Ok, if you get the snap shot feats, (only snap spot & imp. Snap shot, greater isn't worth it), I highly, HIGHLY recommend the feat Pin Down. Now when you threaten, if the enemy tries to 5ft step or withdraw, you get an AoO to prevent there movement, very nice!

All the arrow types I mentioned above, will really come in handy. Smoke arrows will help cover your escape, durable arrows won't break from firing (good idea to make these into adamantine, so you never run out when you want to bypass hardness (or sunde, but only for fighter since htey can sunder), dye arrows to mark a combat survivor(to find him and his horde later), pheromone (when you get scent, I'll explain how) to destroy enemies faster, so on.

As mentioned, deadly aim is one of the best archer feats out there, if you don't have it, you're not an archer worth your weight. Clustered shots is also an excellent feat as well. Now you don't have to rely on as much on specific arrow types to bypass DR, b/c the DR is only calculated once per full attack, hell yes! Improved critical makes your x3 hurt that much more often by 5% (10% is always better for you than 5%), I would get it, but wait a few levels, since it isn't that important, when compared to deadly aim or fluctuated shots, our sometimes even snap shot.

If you plan on crafting your own arrows,which most archers might since they can't always get to a city/village/town to get new ones. It is also easier for you to to spend some skill points into crafting, vs. the fighter who is limited on skill points and thus has to be pickier with their skills, it might be a good idea getting at least one rank in craft (alchemy), besides your normal craft (bows/Fletcher/etc.) Reason is, those special arrows I mentioned, most of them need a craft (alchemy) to make them.

There was a discussion/question thread about this exact thing, craft (alchemy) arrows. not only on how many you can make, but how fast, an dwhat types are needs for which craft. Thread can be found here: http://paizo.com/forums/dmtz5hiu?Craft-Alchemy-arrows#1

Now, onto the good stuff :). First, one of the biggest problems to an archer, besides wind wall, is not being able to see the enemy. Not so much by cover, which your imp. Precise shot will deal with (all but full cover), is fogs/mists/so on. One obscuring must, and your somewhat screwed, since even with the seeking weapon enchantment, you still need to hit the correct square. The solution? The ever popular in my archers book, but not well known, Goz Mask. It's from the inner sea guide, and it allows you to see through smoke, fog, mists, and the sort AS IF IT WASN'T THERE! Now, you can see the enemy and shot at them, no problem. Also, it treats you're projectiles as if one size category larger for purposes of wind effects. I'm not 100% sure on the ruling on that, but regardless the main ability is what you want.

As for scent, ever heard of the hat if disguise? Course you have....but have you meet his older, wiser, better looking brother? No? Well let me introduce to you hat of disguise, greater. Now, when you use the hat it's not under the use of three disguise spell, it's now an Alter Self spell. Why is this good? Because alter self let's you turn into a small our medium sized humanoid creature. When you do, if they have certain abilities, which are listed in the alter self spiel, you get those same abilities. So, if you turn into an orc, hello darkvision. What makes this awesome is threw different types of humanoids there are. after spending some time searching the different types of humanoids, and their ability combinations, I found the best one for each size (small and medium).

For medium: sasquatch
For small: charau-ka

Both of these creatures are identical in their abilities in which you would gain from the alter self spell. They both have 30 ft movement (small besides are normally 20', so this is good), both give low-light vision, darkvision, and scent. You really wasn't three scent ability. when you do your attack, either spend the first round marking a few targets, each with a pheromone arrow, or mark one and finish killing him with your bonuses from the combo of scent and the pheromone arrows. The pheromone arrows will provide +2 to your atk/dmg rolls. Which is a very nice bump in damageg, and effectiveness for hitting your enemies.

Also, to answer your question about abundant ammunition.... You well be using up those initial arrows of yours. The spell REPLACES arrows that were pulled from it the turn before, which means:

Round 1: 4 attacks= 1 pheromone, 2 normal, 1 smoke arrow
Round 2: the spell will now give you 1 pheromone, 2 normal, and 1 smoke. You don't have to use them, but if you don't, they are gone after your round from using different arrows. If on round 3 you want to use 1 durable, 3 silver arrows...on turn 4 the spell will give you the 1 durable and 3 silvered. So, yes those arrows that were physically yours, and not created by the spell, will be used. That's why I mentioned the possibility of you doing the Okefenokee stores all on the first round, so that every turn after that, your not wasting an attack to mark a new target, but instead can user the arrow you need, since combat will typically last longer than a single round.

Hmmm, that send to be most of it. If I notice anything else, I'll let you know. Hope this helps, and if any of this helps you out let me know, would love to hear about it.


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Considering the thread says Ultimate Archer, here's my take on one bad@$$ archer.

Azoth Smolursa:

(BTW, my GM had us use a 32 point buy. However, his atk & dmg output will not change, those scores are the same, his wis core and int score will be different though.) If you want to use 25 pt. I suggest STR: 16 DEX: 18 CON: 10 INT: 10 WIS: 12 CHA: 7

Azoth Smolursa
Male 24 yrs old NG
Human (+2 dex)(all favored class benefits-> HP (20))

32 point buy (Very high magic campaign!)

Str: 26 (+8) [+6 enhance., +4 inherent]
Dex: 36 (+13) [+2 race, +5 levels, +5 inherent, +6 enhance.]
Con: 22 (+6) [+6 enhance., +4 inherent]
Int: 12 (+1)
Wis: 20 (+5) [+6 item] (if you want, get a +4 manual)survival, perception, grit points, and your will save go up +2.
Cha: 7 (-2)

Class and Racial abilities:
Hawkeye: +5 perception, +25 ft with bows
Trickshot: -4 CMB; up to 30ft away/ disarm, trip, sunder,
Expert archer:+4 atk/dmg with bows
Safe shot: do not provoke AoO w/bows
Evasive archer: +4 dodge to AC
Volley: highest atk, roll vs all enemies within 15 ft.
Ranged defense: dr5/- vs ranged atks; snatch arrow AND fire it back
Weapon Mastery (longbow) (x4 crit and auto confirm all crits!)

Hit Dice: 20d10+120 + 20 (favored class-HP)
Hit Points: 250
AC: 35 (+11 Armor, +8 Dexterity, +1 haste, +5 Natural armor, +5 defelction, +4 dodge, +1 insight) [Touch 18, Flat-footed 25] (w/ +5 buckler w/ fortification). AC is 41 when not attacking or using weapon.
Init: +16 (+12 Dex,+2 trait, +1 Competence, +1 Luck)
Speed: 40 (70ft haste) (flight 70, haste/flight= 100ft)

Saves:
Fortitude +25 [+12 base, +6 Con, +5 Resist., +1 Comp., +1 Luck]
Reflex +27 [+6 base, +13 Dex, +5 Resist., +1 Comp., +1 Luck, +1 haste]
Will +20 [+6 base, +5 Wis, +5 Resist., +1 Comp., +1 Luck]

CMB: +46 (with bow for trickshot= bab 20 + 13 dex (works) + 2 GWF + 5 enhancement + 1 luck + 1 comp +2 ioun resonate +6 Expert archer -4 trickshot)= 46
CMD: +65 (cannot be grappled, cannot be disarmed while wielding a longbow, 69 vs sunder while wielding a longbow)= 10 + 20 bab + 8 str + 13 dex + 5 defelection + 4 dodge + 1 luck + 1 comp + 2 ioun resonate +1 insight= 65 (if luck stone doesn't work, its still a +45 cmb/ +64 cmd)

Skills:
Acrobatics +35 (20 ranks, +13 Dex, +1 Competence, +1 luck)
Perception +36 (20 ranks, +5 Wis, +1 Competence, +5 hawkeye +4 alertness ioun stone, +1 luck)
Survival +30 (20 ranks, +5 wis, +1 competence, +1 luck, +3 class)
Stealth= + 30 (15 ranks, +13 dex, +1 competence, +1 luck)
Know: dungeoneering +7(1 rank, +1 int, +1 comp, +1 luck, +3 class)
Know: engineering +7(1 rank, +1 int, +1 comp, +1 luck, +3 class)
craft: bowyer +9 (1 rank, +1 int, +1 comp, +1 luck, +3 class, +2 mw tools)
2 skill points left to put where you want ( I put one in climb, and either ride or fly) if you get flight, fly, if mount, or anything else (hell riding on a friendly's back if they wildshape into a dragon lets say (happened 2 weeks ago for me,--> ride)

Feats:
Rapid Shot(Human bonus)
Point Blank Shot (Fighter bonus)
Precise Shot(1 HD)
Weapon focus: Longbow (Fighter bonus)
Deadly Aim (3 HD)
Weapon Specialization(Fighter bonus)
Combat Reflexes (5 HD)
Many Shot(Fighter bonus)
Clustered Shots(7 HD)
Greater Weapon Focus(Fighter bonus)
snap shot(9 HD)
improved snap shot(Fighter bonus)
Improved Precise Shot (11 HD)
greater weapon specialization(Fighter bonus)
pin down(13 HD)
improved critical(Fighter bonus) (or switch big game hunter, campaign varies)
amateur gunslinger (15 HD)
blind fight (Fighter bonus)
ricochet shot deed (17 HD)
big game hunter (Fighter bonus)
Impact critical shot (not necessarily needed (can use this feat and 20th level to get w/e you want), but even on your worse atttack its a +26 to your roll, so good odds.(19 HD)
Either toughness, quickdraw, farshot, whatever you want also,(Fighter bonus)

Equipment:
2x efficient quivers
+5 celestial armor (flight, 3 times a day, 5 min)
2 or more: +5 composite longbows (mighty +8) w/ Seeking, Holy, Distance... 2nd backup bow, maybe have merciful on it, so no more -4 penalty. (looks like +5 comp. longbow (mighty +8) seeking, merciful, distance... holy not needed)
ring of freedom of movement
manual of quickness in action +5 (already applied)
manual of gainful exercise +4 (already applied)
manual of bodily health +4 (already applied)
belt of physical might +6 (strength and dexterity)
headband of inspired wisdom +6
goz mask
boots of speed/striding springing/flight/ pass without trace = Ultimate archer boots!!
greater bracers of archery
cloak of resistance +5
eyes of the eagle
pale green prism ioun stone
luckstone
20 +1 holy arrows
20 +1 axiomatic arrows
20 +1 anarchic arrows
50 durable arrows
20 smoke arrows
200 broad
10 pheromone
20 bleeding
50 blunt
adamantine blanch
ghost salt blanch
20 rain arrows (get full (with holy water), and empty, 5 gp---> fill with normal water, to put out a fire. good use of roleplay, never seen a gm not reward for thinking of something like that.
20 dye arrows
15 whistling arrows
100 thistle arrows
300 arrows

Also, get an efficient quiver, or two and get them Abundant ammunition casted on, with permanency spell.)
----------------------------
BAB: +20
Ranged Atk: +41*/+41/+41/+36/+31/+26 (1d8+2d6+37/ x4; average 48.5)

(Attack Breakdown: 20 BAB, +13 Dex, +2 Greater Weapon Focus, +6 Weapon Training, +5 Enhancement, +2 Competence, +1 haste, -2 Rapid Shot, -6 Deadly Aim)

(Damage Breakdown: 4.5 average of 1d8, +7 average damage of 2d6, +8 Strength, +5 Enhancement, +4 Greater Weapon Specialization, +6 Expert Archer, +12 Deadly Aim, +2 Competence) Avg. dmg per round if all hit= 339.5

I have not a clue hwo t odo dpr. I found a formula for it, but i still dont know what the "chance to hit" percentages are for my attacks.

BTW, If I use broad arrows 1d10, getting gravity bow casted on me--- 1d10>2d8, so 9 avg dmg for arrows/atk

(heres a little math of the difference of dmg between using normal arrow (with gravity bow -> 2d6) vs. 1d10--> 2d8

2d6-> avg. 7pts vs 2d8 9pts .... 7 arrows across 6 attacks. lets say all hit. 7 x 2 [ 9-7=2] = 14, 14 pts per round, not much, but thats still 14 more points per round just from switching out the arrow. No brainer. BTW, broad arrows according to pfsrd are -10 ft from range increment. Not a problem, considering your shooting at 135ft anywy (thanks Hawkeye ability!). so that makes it 125 ft.... still 15 more ft than any other archer around you.

Btw, if your shooting vs. other archers, if thye use this little tactic, unless they're you, i.e. an fighter archer archetype, their going to be shooting at 110 (100 w/ broad) ft max (110 with hvy crossbow). Also, due to your snapshot feats, that 25 ft cushion will overlap (-5 ft of outer most spots) with your trickshot area of death around you, and you won't be that much hampered by ranged attacks, b/c your 15 ft threatened area will be your litte killing ground.

Just picture it:

Just think of this. You can volley once a round out to 15ft. Your enemies you threaten(15ft) can't move with provoking, can't withdraw without you stopping them, no 5ft step, you can disarm, sunder, trip, bull rush, grapple out to 30 ft. You can shoot off walls or terrain, or other solid objects JUST IN CASE you're not in the right spot or enemies are behind a wall or something. AND you can shoot out to 135 ft. with distance on your bow is 110 x 2= 220 + 25 = 245ft. True, your not a sohei shooting off a machinegun, but, you are the most flexible of any other build, b/c you have the feats. True, zen archers get more, or similar amount of feats. BUt do they get t ochoose those feats? Nope. Their locked in. Paizo could publish the ultimate of all feats, let dex to dmg with your bow, or Soemthign crazy. and guess what, this build will have it, b/c it can. Zen archers, will always be the same. I chose feats for Azoth that will pretty much always will be on and effective. That's why i opted out of using greater snapshot, its too conditional. Hell, imprved critical is only being used b/c it offers only a slim chance more for you to crit. For an arrow to crit at 20th level, to do 4d8 + 2d6 + 144 pts of dmg thats nothing to laugh at. Now, imagine doing that during your volley attack. Remember, its at your highest atk bonus, but you can apply DA, no need for -2 from RS. you have a 10% to crit on upwards of 36 enemies (total squares you threaten, to do potential of [ 144d8 + 72d6 + 5184 dmg total in that round if all attacks hit. Which at 20th lvl is +43 atk (41 from looking at sheet, +2 from not using RS). Your pretty much going to hit each guy, and even if you dont crit, thats still on avg. 48.5 pts of damage per enemy.... All the while, there is an obscuring mist, or thick cloud out in the way. Goz mask---> your fine, and so are your shots, especially with seeking ability and improved precise shot.

Archery is about positioning, discipline, flexibility, and calculation. Taking your time rolls into discipline. Of all other builds, I think the fighter archer wins in the flexibility dept. of what he can do when it deals with archery. Anything else, and your looking more along the lines of a zen archer.


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I'm not sure if this was asked, but is there any info on if there will be any feats or 'abilities" or classes, for that matter, that pertain to an archer build? I know ranger is typically the archer, but I went fighter archer, which is amazing btw, but I was looking for some class abilities maybe from either fighter or a new feat? I know there was the prestige class "order of the bow initiate" in 3.5, anything like that coming out in PFRPG?